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[Meicyn]

Another game!

Guild Wars 2, in my case. Going to double up on the MMOing.

 

[Gvaz]

You still have to drop $120 on a game that's already possibly costing you like $130

 

[dimb]

Not if you are sending out surveys randomly asking for opinions. It was a hair brain decision to have an old build used from the start. But they did hire Dallas Dickinson sooo.. its not shocking

If they are afraid to show the first couple of levels without major tweaking at this point in the development cycle SWTOR has tumbled into the abyss.

 

[Emitan]

You still have to drop $120 on a game that's already possibly costing you like $130

Is a monthly fee a new concept to you? Are you aware you can buy the game for $60?

 

[Gvaz]

Generally speaking I usually only sub for maybe 6-8 months out of the year, tops.

And no, it's not a new concept, and I preordered the CE.

 

[Meicyn]

You still have to drop $120 on a game that's already possibly costing you like $130

Versus $180 on a game that's already possibly costing me like $130?

I realize this thread presents an opportunity to bitch and moan about this game incessantly, but seriously now? What the hell are you getting at?

 

[FieryBalrog]

But they did hire Dallas Dickinson sooo.. its not shocking

Well they did fold Mythic into Bioware, so they probably wanted that three star talent with five star drive.

 

[Gvaz]

What the hell are you getting at?

Spending $120 at once to save $60 when you don't even know if you'll play more than 3 months one after the other is a waste of money.

For me anyways.

 

[Meicyn]

Generally speaking I usually only sub for maybe 6-8 months out of the year, tops.

And no, it's not a new concept, and I preordered the CE.

Dude. No one was suggesting that discounted yearly subscriptions are a new concept. Billychu asked how much it was to prepay for a year, I answered, and you're all like SO YOU SAVE SIXTY BUX SO WUT

I mean, rock those quarterly subscription discounts instead. We don't mind how you choose to spend your money, I promise.

 

[Jira]

nm

 

[FieryBalrog]

Gamasutra: EA Studies WoW Carefully For The Old Republic's Post-Launch Pipeline

 

[Meicyn]

For whatever it's worth since we're speculating as it is, the beta servers are in Austin, and Texas is kind of in the middle of a serious wildfire problem.

 

[Emitan]

For whatever it's worth since we're speculating as it is, the beta servers are in Austin, and Texas is kind of in the middle of a serious wildfire problem.

Yeah. I'm about an hour away from the fires. Not fun.

 

[maabus1999]

I love how people are thinking the new build is the reason for the delay.

As someone who has been in the Beta for nearly a year and seen numerous builds come and go, I can confidently say you are incorrect in your assumption. When they release a new build, they shut everything down (including login client server) on average for 10 days.

If everyone is lucky, they may be faster this time but I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

[Jarmel]

As someone who has been in the Beta for nearly a year and seen numerous builds come and go, I can confidently say you are incorrect in your assumption. When they release a new build, they shut everything down (including login client server) on average for 10 days.

If everyone is lucky, they may be faster this time but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Again they didn't delay, they essentially cancelled it. There is a signficant difference between saying they're pushing back the September beta for a couple of weeks and another saying it's cancelled till further notice.

 

[maabus1999]

Again they didn't delay, they essentially cancelled it. There is a signficant difference between saying they're pushing back the September beta for a couple of weeks and another saying it's cancelled till further notice.

And if you want to know, there are some criticisms and I would say some people (a minority) do not like how closely the gameplay is like WoW (burn out perhaps) but the vast vast majority of beta testers enjoy the game immensly, especially when the content past a certain level point is not included in the July build (as said by a developer) yet people keep rolling alts up and beyond out of enjoyment.

In pure honesty, there is NO reason to even speculate about any critcisms until we see what they changed/fixed in the next build (and they do substantial changes time to time), and sometimes those changes make a few rough days so he is correct on them getting feedback (which is PR that they didn't break something badly).

Bioware is pretty conservative (too much IMO but that is the way the are going).

 

[Jarmel]

And if you want to know, there are some criticisms and I would say some people (a minority) do not like how closely the gameplay is like WoW (burn out perhaps) but the vast vast majority of beta testers enjoy the game immensly, especially when the content past a certain level point is not included in the July build (as said by a developer) yet people keep rolling alts up and beyond out of enjoyment.

In pure honesty, there is NO reason to even speculate about any critcisms until we see what they changed/fixed in the next build (and they do substantial changes time to time).

Again you don't cancel when you can delay. Something happened not attached to the new roll out otherwise Bioware would have stated that September betas would continue as planned after a couple of weeks and they would extend it into October to make up for the lost weekends.

I'd bet my dick on it.

 

[Emitan]

I'd bet my dick on it.

Not this again. We still haven't gotten the other one

 

[HarryDemeanor]

For whatever it's worth since we're speculating as it is, the beta servers are in Austin, and Texas is kind of in the middle of a serious wildfire problem.

So that's what Stephen Reid was talking about on Twitter.

Wildfires suck.

 

[Last Hearth]

The weekend test was not extremely buggy, there were bugs but not extremely buggy.

And the feedback was not negative. Of all the people I chatted with during the test I met exactly one person who wasn't extremely enthusiastic about the experience, and even he wasn't totally negative just not blown away, and on the forum for the weekend testers the posts have been overwhelming positive.

Now there was a period of 6 hours of extremely unplayable lag toward the end of the test, we initially speculated it was part a planned stress test, but it is possible that it was actually not planned at all and actually an issue they need to address. Some have now speculated that they need new hardware for their servers, and these weekend stress tests are pointless until they get the new hardware in, and hence the canceling of this weekend's test.

 

[antonz]

They didnt cancel Beta weekends. They cancelled this weeks because the new build isnt ready for deployment and they have a ton of data from the old build to process already. It has already been hinted before weekend tests would go into October so its not a big deal.

The biggest impact is the delay in getting europe into the process. Plenty of NAers are testing around the clock

 

[FieryBalrog]

And if you want to know, there are some criticisms and I would say some people (a minority) do not like how closely the gameplay is like WoW (burn out perhaps) but the vast vast majority of beta testers enjoy the game immensly, especially when the content past a certain level point is not included in the July build (as said by a developer) yet people keep rolling alts up and beyond out of enjoyment.

And the feedback was not negative. Of alll the people I chatted with during the test I met exactly one person who wasn't extremely enthusiastic about the experience, and even he wasn't totally negative just not blown away, and the forum for the weekend testers the posts have been overwhelming positive.

I guess Bioware's PR team should just have consulted you, ditch the surveys and focus groups and data collection.

No but seriously, while that's suggestive, your anecdote is nowhere near definitive.

 

[Jarmel]

They didnt cancel Beta weekends. They cancelled this weeks because the new build isnt ready for deployment and they have a ton of data from the old build to process already. It has already been hinted before weekend tests would go into October so its not a big deal.

"There may be further Beta Testing Weekends during September, but we're not going to guarantee it. "

Kinda like Spring 2011, amirite?

 

[maabus1999]

Again you don't cancel when you can delay. Something happened not attached to the new roll out otherwise Bioware would have stated that September betas would continue as planned after a couple of weeks and they would extend it into October to make up for the lost weekends.

I'd bet my dick on it.

Or I could go with my experience of how long it takes on average for a new build to go live after they shutdown the servers. Knowing that (and maybe when the current "switch" is turned off), it is probable the regular beta testers won't be trying the next build until possibly the last week of september if not early october. Add in the fact they most likely want to make sure the new build is stable for a few days before doing a more public weekend test and you get a longer delay.

So he is right, there will be no more testing in September for the weekend. Mid october would be my earliest guess from experience with bioware and has nothing to do with feedback (this is independent from good and bad feedback btw).

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

So you save $60 a year...okay?

Dude, if "you ONLY SAVE X amount" is the only aggressive bashing you can come up with...

 

[FieryBalrog]

Why on earth would they hype up September weekend beta testing if they knew a fresh build was going to demolish their September weekend betas.

 

[Jarmel]

Or I could go with my experience of how long it takes on average for a new build to go live after they shutdown the servers. Knowing that (and maybe when the current "switch" is turned off), it is probable the regular beta testers won't be trying the next build until possibly the last week of september if not early october. Add in the fact they most likely want to make sure the new build is stable for a few days before doing a more public weekend test and you get a longer delay.

So he is right, there will be no more testing in September for the weekend. Mid october would be my earliest guess from experience with bioware and has nothing to do with feedback (this is independent from good and bad feedback btw).

Then you state that you're delaying the beta testing for a month. You don't just cancel something and not give a new date or even estimate of a new date unless something went off the reservation.

 

[Last Hearth]

More definitive than the factless speculation that because of this weekend test cancellation "must mean that the feedback from the weekend test was negative". While I do not have comprehensive knowledge, I am reading the forums set up for the weekend testers, and if there were strong negativity I'm sure some of it would have simmered up there.

 

[Jarmel]

More definitive than the factless speculation that because of this weekend test cancellation "must mean that the feedback from the weekend test was negative". While I do not have comprehensive knowledge, I am reading the forums set up for the weekend testers, and if there were strong negativity I'm sure some of it would have simmered up there.

Unless they didn't care enough to post in the forums. Forums almost always represent a small portion of the population.

 

[Meicyn]

Why on earth would they hype up September weekend beta testing if they knew a fresh build was going to demolish their September weekend betas.

Like I said in a previous post, it's entirely possible that teams aren't communicating internally as well as they should and the newer build intended for the September weekend beta tests ended up missing the deadline, but no one stopped the whole process for starting up the beta weekend, rolling out with an existing build instead.

I'm just speculating of course, but it's definitely in the realm of possibility, especially when it's crunch time. Lord knows, there's communication issues where I work, and I'm in a fairly small work center.

 

[maabus1999]

Then you state that you're delaying the beta testing for a month. You don't just cancel something and not give a new date or even estimate of a new date unless something went off the reservation.

I can say that their PR have used confusing statements like this for a long, long time. They like being careful and vague. Just to point out they didn't say they were cancelling it either so don't assume that from this statement. You shouldn't assume anything other then that it will be several weeks before you hear more info.

 

[Last Hearth]

Then you state that you're delaying the beta testing for a month. You don't just cancel something and not give a new date or even estimate of a new date unless something went off the reservation.

That is what they said, they said it will still happen, just not now, which to me means a delay.

"That does not mean, however, that as soon as our new build is available we'll be rolling out a Beta Testing Weekend immediately. As with any new build of the game, we need to get feedback from internal testing and our ongoing Game Testing program before rolling it out to a massive audience. That process takes a while, and that time varies depending on how testing goes.

We rolled out this previous weekend as a relatively small scale event; from now we will do bigger and bigger events, but that doesn't mean it happens every weekend. When we do resume, we'll be inviting many more people in."

 

[antonz]

Why on earth would they hype up September weekend beta testing if they knew a fresh build was going to demolish their September weekend betas.

As someone said left hand had no idea what right hand was doing. It was hairbrain for sure to do all this with a new build on the horizon. Especially when as with prior builds the servers go down for sometime.

People like to think its a simple process but its not and an important rule of beta is everything is subject to change.

Beta process for MMOs needs to be totally revamped and broughtmore in line how they used to be. Far too many betas are treated as demo periods now and as such people have its a demo mentality. There were times in Betas in the past a server could go down 2 or 3 times a day and each time a new patch to get.

 

[maabus1999]

Unless they didn't care enough to post in the forums. Forums almost always represent a small portion of the population.

And normally forums will have more complaints then praises (which are also normally just fanboys attacking the whiners, both of which are just noise). I can say that also from my experience with over a dozen MMO's

All I can say is that they are on the right track but they are being fairly close to the chest the past several months externally and semi-internally, so it is very hard to judge the end product.

Which brings me to a post earlier someone said was from a leak about the endgame: no one outside of bioware has real experience with it so ignore anything good or bad you read for now.

 

[Won]

Sounds like Bioware got hit pretty hard by reality. It's not easy to get an MMO out there.

 

[FieryBalrog]

And normally forums will have more complaints then praises

It's the complete opposite during beta, especially for MMOs. We've all (or at least some of us have) done this tango more than enough times to know how it goes.

At any rate, no one really knows how the weekend beta was received but Bioware themselves. I'm pretty sure "I talked to some dudes" doesn't cut it as definitive knowledge.

 

[maabus1999]

It's the complete opposite during beta, especially for MMOs. We've all (or at least some of us have) done this tango more than enough times to know how it goes.

At any rate, no one really knows how the weekend beta was received but Bioware themselves. I'm pretty sure "I talked to some dudes" doesn't cut it as definitive knowledge.

I know exactly what is being said for the past half dozen months. Again there are some critcisms (mainly either it is not SWG or it is too much like WoW. Some other more valid ones but won't cover those as I'm pushing a gray area on what I can say) but the vast majority enjoy the game.

 

[Jarmel]

Either way the reasoning doesn't matter. Title needs to be changed.

People should drop by SWTOR forums, tearing themselves apart now.

 

[Morn]

I decided to read between the lines of this post and I kept seeing the same thing come up...2012....2012....2012. They clearly state that they did not want to roll out the new build without internal testers and the testing group to try it first...unless this build is close to a release canidate, I think that it will be 2012 (Feb..2012) before we see it.

If they release in February, EA will have another WAR situation on their hands where they release a hyped MMO a month or two before a new WoW expansion. It'll kill the game the same way it killed WAR.

 

[Yasae]

Hate to say I told you so.
(But I did. During E3)

I was saying that before E3. Get in line!

 

[antonz]

EA just confirmed again today its launching this year

 

[Kintaro]

Meh, I'm not going to freak out if it slips into next year. There will be other games to play in the meantime.

As for the quality of the MMO itself, I tend to take everything with a grain of salt. The naysayers turn to hyperbole as much as the praisers while the truth lays in the middle. Of course, the naysayers come out enforce more often so one needs to run everything through a filter.

The game will turn out fine whenever it comes out.

 

[markot]

If they release in February, EA will have another WAR situation on their hands where they release a hyped MMO a month or two before a new WoW expansion. It'll kill the game the same way it killed WAR.

No, Mythic killed Warhammer, not a wow expansion.

They had million+ buy the game, they didnt stick around because the game was poor and lacking in so many areas.

 

[Morn]

No, Mythic killed Warhammer, not a wow expansion.

They had million+ buy the game, they didnt stick around because the game was poor and lacking in so many areas.

They didn't stick around because Lich King came out right when their free 30 days were up.

 

[Morn]

EA just confirmed again today its launching this year

No they didn't.

The company still expects the MMO to launch this calender year, but EA’s fiscal guidance takes into account a possible slip into first calendar quarter of 2012 (fiscal Q4) if needed, Brown said. “We have a date set internally [for calendar Q4], with a lot of assumptions around it,” he said.

 

[antonz]

Lich King was important in the grand scheme of things yes but thats the problem WoW has now. The story the fans give a shit about is done. WoW has basically moved into fanfic territory as far as fans of the universe are concerned and the million+ who have quit since cataclysm arent coming back

 

[markot]

They didn't stick around because Lich King came out right when their free 30 days were up.

Most people who I knew who played warhammer quit along time before their 30 days was up

 

[FieryBalrog]

I know exactly what is being said for the past half dozen months.

I doubt that.

Again there are some critcisms (mainly either it is not SWG or it is too much like WoW. Some other more valid ones but won't cover those as I'm pushing a gray area on what I can say) but the vast majority enjoy the game.

Sorry, it's not that I don't believe you, it's that you have no real way of knowing regardless of how many times you repeat yourself.

 

[Kintaro]

They didn't stick around because Lich King came out right when their free 30 days were up.

Odd. Lich King came out two months after Warhammer. =P

The Old Republic will be fine no matter what comes out. Next WoW Expansion, Guild Wars 2, etc. Its not like TOR needs 6 million subscribers to be a success and continue on. 500k+ will do them just fine and I think they can get that easily.

 

[Last Hearth]

I doubt that.

Sorry, it's not that I don't believe you, it's that you have no real way of knowing regardless of how many times you repeat yourself.

Nor do you. At least I have some evidence to support my claim, it may not be conclusive evidence, but it's better than none.