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[fanboi]

hey are there one of those bread n butter builds wallpaper for zerg going around? :<

Mine!

15 pool
15 hatch
15 OL
15 Queen
17 gas
19 Queen (build after first queen finish in main hatch, move first queen to natural after first injection).

Go!

EDIT:

Oh man, was 6 pooled and lost yesterday on ladder... played my next game, same opponent...

He: I'm 100% zvz today

Went destiny build totally and utterly destroyed him.

 

[Vaporak]

i guess the strategy is much deeper for zerg and can't be reduced to build orders

Uh no. Stuff like the roach ling pressure vs 3 gate expo that Losira popularized has specific build order variations. I'm not a zerg so I can't tell you the timings but just go DL some pro zerg replays and take notes.

 

[Yoshichan]

13 pool
12 gas
queen
15 blingnest
ling
ling
ling

go

 

[MrKnives]

GOM should hire Klazart for the job.

And I do have to say it's very satisfying to make like 15 spines and then just load up the brofestors in the overlords and pretend you are in a spy movie. Then just fly around and snipe shit while hearing the mission impossible song in your head.

 

[fanboi]

GOM should hire Klazart for the job.

And I do have to say it's very satisfying to make like 15 spines and then just load up the brofestors in the overlords and pretend you are in a spy movie. Then just fly around and snipe shit while hearing the mission impossible song in your head.

Hm, as I said yo uou yesterday, I need to learn how to control brofestors in combat.

Damn, I just plain suck with it.

Especially against T since I try to engage, he kites with Vikings, I try to fungal, seigetanks vaporize my infestors :| while broods die to marines + vikings.

 

[Striek]

Any pointers would be appreciated. I think the lack of scouting and poor macro (mechanics maybe?) are what are getting me. Thanks~

Just going to throw out a lot of shit you could be doing better (not saying I can do all this personally ).

Vs. Panda. 9 overlord + extractor trick is less economical than 9 overlord or 10 overlord + extractor trick. 13 Hatch + 13 pool is also not a traditional opening. It doesn't really save much time compared to 15 hatch 15 pool but cuts more drones. Failure to stop the banelings from killing 5 drones despite scouting them. Lack of heavy droning throughout the midgame. Absolute failure to scout Panda out the whole game. No detection at your natural and third (pesky infestors). No aggression all game.

Basically not having detection + not knowing what panda was doing + not droning enough were the major reasons you lost that pretty passive game.

On the plus side, nice inject timing most of the game, also pretty good overlord spread.

Vs. Lucky. Alot the same. Still don't like the opening, lack of scouting, never verifying he had a 3rd and a 4th. You got really greedy getting up to nearly 50 drones vs. a one-base toss lucky Lucky's build made little sense. A well-executed 4gate would've been very difficult to stop. Helps when he doesn't scout what base you are at (+makes only non-blink stalkers and expands behind). Late game that was an interesting uhh...'composition' of his. Probably would've thrown down a hydra den just in case but yeah, corruptor/infestor kind of lol'd against that.

 

[MrKnives]

Hm, as I said yo uou yesterday, I need to learn how to control brofestors in combat.

Damn, I just plain suck with it.

Especially against T since I try to engage, he kites with Vikings, I try to fungal, seigetanks vaporize my infestors :| while broods die to marines + vikings.

Whenever I see IdrA do it he always has corrupters there and when he goes for the fungal on vikings he usually sends lings first to soak up damage.
But it can be hard break that if he was prepared for them. At that point I almost would stop attacking and sacrificing shit, if you feel you are losing more ground than you gain.

Do a ultra switch or a runby or a drop/nydus. Something to make him be somewhere else too.
Forcing your way into a terran entranched position has never been a good idea.
But yea, IdrA just makes more corrupters/mutas. Depends on how many bl's you have and how many vikings he has.

 

[fanboi]

Whenever I see IdrA do it he always has corrupters there and when he goes for the fungal on vikings he usually sends lings first to soak up damage.
But it can be hard break that if he was prepared for them. At that point I almost would stop attacking and sacrificing shit, if you feel you are losing more ground than you gain.

Do a ultra switch or a runby or a drop/nydus. Something to make him be somewhere else too.
Forcing your way into a terran entranched position has never been a good idea.
But yea, IdrA just makes more corrupters/mutas. Depends on how many bl's you have and how many vikings he has.

Yeah... will try something something, maybe it was the A move?

 

[Keikaku]

LOL where is the colossus one? what exactly happened to them for everyone to stop crying? yeaa



i guess the strategy is much deeper for zerg and can't be reduced to build orders

I posted it on the previous page . . . >.>

 

[MrKnives]

I posted it on the previous page . . . >.>

NO.
We don't have build orders. We have eleveted ourselves beyond just following build orders.
We have evolved to a completely new plateu where our enemies can only dream to reach.

 

[Jeff-DSA]

NO.
We don't have build orders. We have eleveted ourselves beyond just following build orders.
We have evolved to a completely new plateu where our enemies can only dream to reach.

Double fungals?

 

[Corran Horn]

NO.
We don't have build orders. We have eleveted ourselves beyond just following build orders.
We have evolved to a completely new plateu where our enemies can only dream to reach.

 

[MrKnives]

StarTale changes their log

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252478

Oh wow. It's ... different.

 

[fanboi]

StarTale changes their log

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252478

Oh wow. It's ... different.

From our discussion yesterday as well, this is a team Sheth should join, and idras anti team ^^

EDIT: Why you not on MSN... I'm so bloody bored.

 

[Mairu]

StarTale changes their log

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252478

Oh wow. It's ... different.

CarlsJr_July
CarlsJr_Bomber

 

[pieatorium]

reminds me of

 

[jersoc]

CarlsJr_July
CarlsJr_Bomber

haha, that's the first thing I thought of too.

No wonder July is so fat.

 

[Awesome Animals]

Cross your fingers that I can start playing again this week!

 

[Haunted]

StafyTale

 

[HolyCheck]

RiStarTale

 

[Mairu]

haha, that's the first thing I thought of too.

No wonder July is so fat.

 

[TheThunder]

I'm more worried about that hitler stache tbh

 

[hamchan]

Does that star have a tongue or a pink coloured tooth? YOU DECIDE!

 

[Jeff-DSA]

So I'm still struggling with Zerg, but here's what I've been doing that's been finding me some success. Feel free to criticize anything that seems out of place, outdated, or in need of improvement.

- 1rax on 11
- SCV scout on 11
- Gas on 12
- Marine on 13
- Orbital on 14
- Depending on scouting info

If I see early pool
- Finish wall immediately
- Hide SCV scout nearby or if it's already being followed, keep it in an evade pattern
- Start Factory
- Run SCV back in to see if a Roach Warren is present
- If Roach Warren is there, go to 1-1-1 build and Banshee harass
- If no Roach Warren, drop second Factory and go into Hellion play

If I see Hatch first
- Go to 2rax and pressure
- If pressure is met with Roach reaction, go to 2-1-1 and Banshee follow up
- If pressure is met with lots of Zerglings, put a 2nd Factory and go to Hellion
- Expand behind pressure
- Get Starport up to begin drop play with Marines/Hellions depending on composition

From there everything is dictated by how the Zerg player handles the original pressure. At times I've been able to follow up with tanks and contain the Zerg while pressing with drops. Other times the Zerg manages to break contain, and I just try to keep their Muta count down with aggressive Marine and Thor play while I get Ghosts out to keep from letting Infestors get massed up and building energy.

In the late game, it's all EMP and snipe, snipe, snipe.

 

[Pandaman]

rax on 10? wow.

 

[Yoshichan]

Wait, that must be a mistake. How does one even make a rax at 10?

 

[Jeff-DSA]

rax on 10? wow.

Typo, I mean rax on 11.

 

[Q8D3vil]

Typo, I mean rax on 11.

what is your league ?

 

[Jeff-DSA]

Gold. Last season I had stretches where I won 13 of 15, 11 of 13, and 8 of 10 towards the end of the season. I was thinking I was due for a promotion come season 3, but during the lock I completely fell apart against Zerg. I probably fell to around a 10% win rate against Zerg, and I was seeing probably 80% of my matches being Zerg opponents. I'm still seeing mostly Zergs on the ladder (which infuriates me to no end, I want to play all three races equally), so I've had to really try different things to fix my issues.

My win rate has been so bad lately due to the Zerg heavy ladder that I'm afraid I'll slip out of Gold if I don't get either some balance in the matchmaking between the races or vastly improve my Zerg play. I'm ranked around 28 or so in my division, but I spend most of S2 in the top 3.

 

[Yoshichan]

Give us two or three replays from your TvZ's

 

[Jeff-DSA]

Give us two or three replays from your TvZ's

Ok, I can from home. More than anything, when I lose, it's during the follow up after a successful harass. I can go and roast 20 drones, but I still end up behind for some dumb reason. That's really the hole I've been working on most is keeping aggression on while still expanding.

 

[Q8D3vil]

Gold. Last season I had stretches where I won 13 of 15, 11 of 13, and 8 of 10 towards the end of the season. I was thinking I was due for a promotion come season 3, but during the lock I completely fell apart against Zerg. I probably fell to around a 10% win rate against Zerg, and I was seeing probably 80% of my matches being Zerg opponents. I'm still seeing mostly Zergs on the ladder (which infuriates me to no end, I want to play all three races equally), so I've had to really try different things to fix my issues.

My win rate has been so bad lately due to the Zerg heavy ladder that I'm afraid I'll slip out of Gold if I don't get either some balance in the matchmaking between the races or vastly improve my Zerg play. I'm ranked around 28 or so in my division, but I spend most of S2 in the top 3.

i too get zergs opponent most of the time (damn infestors buff )

i can help you practice if you want on NA but we need a gold/platinum zerg opponent while i guide you through builds and what to do in certain situations and timings.

 

[Jeff-DSA]

Another thing that I've been playing with that's done well is producing a handful of late Reapers. While massing up, I'll put 3-4 Reapers in the back of my main and send them out to attack mineral lines when engaging. It's nice because if you've forced them to go Spore Crawlers early with Banshee play, they're totally unprepared for the Reapers late. At best you can take down a key tech structure or two, at worst you pick up some drone kills and snipe the Queen. Either way it makes them put up more stationary defenses or leave a few units home when they push.

Reapers can be good units still, they're just garbage in the early game, I feel. I would like to see some high level players use them in the mid to late games a bit more.

 

[zoukka]

Reapers are good. But they require way too much micro for us mortals to handle them and macro at the same time.

 

[Q8D3vil]

Reapers are good. But they require way too much micro for us mortals to handle them and macro at the same time.

getting them end game cost too much gas and a lot of rax's with techlabs.
dunno, i personally rather get factory/air instead of rax units endgame.

 

[Yoshichan]

Simple solution to fix Reapers.

2 Armor
80 Health
Can be built without tech lab
Adding a reactor allows you to build two reapers a time
No gas cost
Reaper speed can be upgraded from tech lab

Yeah.


Yeah.

 

[Q8D3vil]

Simple solution to fix Reapers.

2 Armor
80 Health
Can be built without tech lab
Adding a reactor allows you to build two reapers a time
No gas cost
Reaper speed can be upgraded from tech lab
stim
Yeah.


Yeah.

fixed
yeah.

 

[Yoshichan]

fixed
yeah.

Shit, completely forgot about that! God I love the alpha &#9829;

 

[perryfarrell]

So I'm still struggling with Zerg, but here's what I've been doing that's been finding me some success.... At times I've been able to follow up with tanks and contain the Zerg while pressing with drops.... In the late game, it's all EMP and snipe, snipe, snipe.

I think you're being too fancy for your own good.

Just learn a number of build orders. 3 rax, fast banshee, blue flame hellion drop, one rax FE, etc. Practice the build orders against the easy AI until you've got them down.

(What I personally like vs zerg is a 2-base marine tank push. Pretty basic stuff. And it counters most of what they can throw at you: banes, mutas, roaches. With a bit of marine spread it's even OK vs infestor.)

Then focus on macro macro macro. As I said earlier in this thread, as long as you make workers at all times, add the right # of production buildings (3.5 per base), crank out units constantly and keep money low, you should be able to advance to high plat with no problem.

 

[HerbertFish]

i am PRO toss MASTER of nw.pl

 

[Jeff-DSA]

getting them end game cost too much gas and a lot of rax's with techlabs.
dunno, i personally rather get factory/air instead of rax units endgame.

That's why I just slowly add 1 here and there while macroing up until I have those 3-4 ready to go. I can't center my build around them because they're too fragile and not cost effective unless you surprise your opponent.

 

[Q8D3vil]

i am PRO toss MASTER of nw.pl

i don't understand what you mean but gratz.

 

[Keikaku]

i don't understand what you mean but gratz.

.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Lost to a 4 gate yesterday; first time I've lost to one since the warpgate patch. It was an all Zealot 4 gate too. The funny thing is I was about to blindly get banelings but decided against it. Few minutes later I was dead

 

[Jeff-DSA]

I rarely lose to a 4gate anymore, but when I do, it makes me salty.

 

[Yoshichan]

I rarely lose to a 4gate anymore, but when I do, it makes me salty.

.

edit: I have a hard time figuring out when they're containing me (and expoing behind it) or if they they keep massing units to break my wall.

 

[zoukka]

.

edit: I have a hard time figuring out when they're containing me (and expoing behind it) or if they they keep massing units to break my wall.

Float a building?

 

[Yoshichan]

Float a building?

Yep, definitely situational depending on map, positions and if the guy is controlling Xel'naga. I just scan.

 

[Q8D3vil]

.

edit: I have a hard time figuring out when they're containing me (and expoing behind it) or if they they keep massing units to break my wall.

do what every other terran is doing now.
111 marines banshee tanks.
thats what i will do if i ever got tvp (only tvt's and tvz lately).

 

[Yoshichan]

do what every other terran is doing now.
111 marines banshee tanks.
thats what i will do if i ever got tvp (only tvt's and tvz lately).

Will definitely try that out someday. Got a build order link?

Marines with stim or +10?
Banshee with cloak?
Tank with siege?