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[ArchedThunder]

With the hair as a tail. That'd be nice.



Or Dixie based off DK.....

And make her shoot bubble gum instead of peanuts. The only thing that wouldn't fit would be the up b, but that would be minor unless they actually figured how to work her pony tail into it.

Or make a model for her and stretch it to fit DK's skeleton. :B

 

[MrSaturn99]

I don't think anyone would mind Magicant being in sweet, sweet HD.

just think of the my music selection oh my god

 

[Neiteio]

The more I think about it, the more I really can't fucking believe we got a new, entirely original Mother stage. I would never have put money down on that happening since the series is long retired (and one of the series' only two reps has been cut, to boot).

It's amazing and I love it. I really, really hope Magicant is a shared stage between the two versions because I don't see us getting two all-new Mother stages!

Along with the F-Zero stage, it's like Sakurai is inviting us back into those worlds since they haven't had a new game in awhile.

 

[Wreck-It Ralph]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around Dark Pit.

Like, I don't have a problem with clones when they actually make sense. Make then slower and more powerful, or faster and weaker, that makes sense.

But Dark Pit is literally just Pit. Why? Why is he there?

 

[Red Arremer]

Falcon also didn't spawn fire from his limb when he attacked someone.

It's clear that Sakurai gives no fucks about F-Zero, so I'd accept a half-hearted attempt at fanservice than no attempt.

We never know if he did or didn't. The only official source we've ever had was the SNES booklet, in which Captain Falcon only utilized a gun.
However, in GX and the GBA titles, all of the characters got a lot more characterization. And there's also the anime, which is considered canon, and has actually been making Captain Falcon's flaming abilities official (he does Falcon Punch there).

So why would you pick Black Shadow over Deathborn, who has been shown to be able to use dark magic, and enjoy using it, and even has a very similar build to Ganondorf? Heck, he even has a cape. And he's a silly Saturday Morning cartoon villain.

Also, Black Shadow is quite possibly the least interesting and most dumb looking villain in the entire F-Zero series. I'd rather take Don Genie as a Dedede clone over Black Shadow.

 

[Kyzon]

Out of curiosity, following the rules of Dark Pit, Who would've you wanted to see in his place?

------------------------------------------
The rules being:
1. Not neccessarily a recolor, but must look similar to who it's based on.
2. Clone (basically the same moves)
3. Can have a different voice and taunts and final smash. (He has all of these right?)
------------------------------------------


My vote:
Hmm...Demise I guess. Though he wouldn't use a sword...
Actually, my vote goes to Skyward Sword Zelda. With a harp final smash.
Actually...I need time to think.

I'd like to get Dark Pit doing the same exact thing but with his Staff instead.

 

[Shadow Hog]

Spoiler

PS you forgot that Wolf gets invincibility frames with his Down B, and also can cancel landing lag from neutral falling state.

I kinda assumed Fox did too; at least, given he pushes opponents he overlaps out, Rest-style, I assumed there was SOME kind of invincibility thing going on there. Maybe I was mistaken.

 

[Neiteio]

It's clear that Sakurai gives no fucks about F-Zero, so I'd accept a half-hearted attempt at fanservice than no attempt.

Whaaaaaa? F-Zero got the coolest stage in the game. I'd say that indicates plenty of love.

 

[Benzychenz]

Listening to the Mute City Remix just makes me want a new F-Zero ;~;

 

[KelpPlankton]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around Dark Pit.

Like, I don't have a problem with clones when they actually make sense. Make then slower and more powerful, or faster and weaker, that makes sense.

But Dark Pit is literally just Pit. Why? Why is he there?

He's slower and more powerful, has a different Final Smash, and is a different character in terms of personality and behavior.

Plus he uses different Kid Icarus Uprising weapons than Pit does, even for the moves they share.

He's pretty alright. People are confused now but once you get your hands on the game you'll see he's a cool dude.

 

[ArchedThunder]

I don't think anyone would mind Magicant being in sweet, sweet HD.

just think of the my music selection oh my god

And then when playing as purple Charizard sometimes you see Ridley in the sky.
That's my magicant...

 

[Berordn]

Like, I don't have a problem with clones when they actually make sense. Make then slower and more powerful, or faster and weaker, that makes sense.

But Dark Pit is literally just Pit. Why? Why is he there?

Dark Pit is a slower, more powerful Pit.

He's also a character that's true to his origins by being a clone that's heavily based on his donor character, for what that's worth.

 

[ffdgh]

The "extra" characters are sporadic. There is no real precedence for who and why they got in.

We have 8 characters with unique models (and voices?) out of Bowser Jr., a former simple color swap got his own slot in Dark Pit, removed unique clones like Wolf. Removed PKMN Trainer for just one of the PKMN from that group.

Lucina, Doc Mario... Falco, dorf. Alph... I have no idea what the thought process was for the character selection.

Doctor mario has the benifit of being a melee vet, likeable in melee, easy to make, melee down b and down air making him more different than mario, almost being in brawl, cool intro, and last but not least, he's the best dark clone thanks to his black alt!

/bias

 

[Kinsei]

Whaaaaaa? F-Zero got the coolest stage in the game. I'd say that indicates plenty of love.

Nah, that honor goes to Magicant. The F-Zero stage is a close second though.

 

[The Captain]

But Alph doesn't use Rock Pikmin in Smash (even if he should be able to), right? So his move set is literally identical to Olimar's in this case, justifiably (in Sakurai's eyes) making him an alt and not a clone with his own slot.

I brought up the Rock Pikmin as something Alph could use to become a "new" character. Alph functions identically to Olimar in Pikmin 3 (gameplay-wise), but you have to remember that Dark Pit uses the same weapons Pit can in Uprising. Functionally, Dark Pit is just as identical to Pit as Alph is to Olimar, but both are their own characters with their own personalities.

Also, please link me the Dr. Mario intro/taunts/Final Smash. Is he listed as part of his own series, or just the seventh Mario rep?
I can't be the only one that's disappointed that Dark Pit and Doctor Mario got different Final Smashes from their source characters, while Sheik, Falco, Toon Link, and Lucina (not even a cut-in?) all kept theirs.



I think the best thing about Doctor Mario being back is that it means cut characters can return - so in five-six years we'll be seeing old friends like Ice Climbers again.

 

[Cse]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around Dark Pit.

Like, I don't have a problem with clones when they actually make sense. Make then slower and more powerful, or faster and weaker, that makes sense.

But Dark Pit is literally just Pit. Why? Why is he there?

Yeah, I agree.

When watching game footage, I can't even discern whether I'm looking at Pit or Dark Pit. I mean, with Dr. Mario and Lucina, at least they are visually distinct from their progenitors...but as you mentioned, Dark Pit is literally just Pit.

 

[theprodigy]

Out of curiosity, following the rules of Dark Pit, Who would've you wanted to see in his place?

------------------------------------------
The rules being:
1. Not neccessarily a recolor, but must look similar to who it's based on.
2. Clone (basically the same moves)
3. Can have a different voice and taunts and final smash. (He has all of these right?)
------------------------------------------


My vote:
Hmm...Demise I guess. Though he wouldn't use a sword...
Actually, my vote goes to Skyward Sword Zelda. With a harp final smash.
Actually...I need time to think.

Viridi as a Palutena clone
come on Sakurai that was totally more worth it!

 

[Toad.T]

But he even asked whenever Falcon would be getting a new game of his own!

He cares about Falcon, no doubt. But there's at least 30 other characters in the series that aren't Falcon. If he could bring back fucking prince Sable from the dead, at least he could give some trophies for more of the characters, like in Melee.

Dude. The new F-Zero stage.

It's good as a nostalgic throwback, yes. But it just feels like a cop-out to me, personally. Why not have that same concept (Fighting on the cars) but do it with a GX-inspired Sand-Ocean or Silence?

We never know if he did or didn't. The only official source we've ever had was the SNES booklet, in which Captain Falcon only utilized a gun.
However, in GX and the GBA titles, all of the characters got a lot more characterization. And there's also the anime, which is considered canon, and has actually been making Captain Falcon's flaming abilities official (he does Falcon Punch there).

So why would you pick Black Shadow over Deathborn, who has been shown to be able to use dark magic, and enjoy using it, and even has a very similar build to Ganondorf? Heck, he even has a cape. And he's a silly Saturday Morning cartoon villain.



Also, Black Shadow is quite possibly the least interesting and most dumb looking villain in the entire F-Zero series. I'd rather take Don Genie as a Dedede clone over Black Shadow.

Mostly for ease of model concerns. I love the series, but it is not going to get Pokémon-level treatment. So I figured I'd compromise in that regard. Deathborn would fit better though, I'll give you that.

Also, that was all after Smash Bros. Sakurai basically rewrote the character, so it's not as if there isn't precedent for it already.

 

[Roo]

Do we know if both games will have different soundtracks?
I know 3DS only has 2 tracks per stage so it'll be somehow limited compared to the other but it would be sweet if the Wii U version had 3DS' soundtracks plus its own music.

 

[Papercuts]

Yeah, I agree.

When watching game footage, I can't even discern whether I'm looking at Pit or Dark Pit. I mean, with Dr. Mario and Lucina, at least they are visually distinct from their progenitors...but as you mentioned, Dark Pit is literally just Pit.

Get hype for Pit using the black color scheme with white wings vs. Dark Pit using alt color schemes.

 

[MannyToons]

They do. Makes Bowser's Smash voice all the more a head scratcher

Goddammit, I've been thinking the same thing. Especially watching a stream with Bowser fighting Bowser Jr. to unlock him and hearing him just roaring like some insentient beast. It just doesn't go so well with the other Mario characters' personas, and definitely not his kids'.

 

[I'M FINISHED!]

Yes they do!

They do. Makes Bowser's Smash voice all the more a head scratcher

Oh boy! Does this also mean that the announcer announces their names individually? Does the percentage icon change depending on what Koopa you picked, too?

 

[SoulUnison]

Out of curiosity, following the rules of Dark Pit, Who would've you wanted to see in his place?

------------------------------------------
The rules being:
1. Not neccessarily a recolor, but must look similar to who it's based on.
2. Clone (basically the same moves)
3. Can have a different voice and taunts and final smash. (He has all of these right?)
------------------------------------------

Tails or Knuckles as a Sonic clone. -or- Ridley as a Charizard clone.

 

[Sponge]

And make her shoot bubble gum instead of peanuts. The only thing that wouldn't fit would be the up b, but that would be minor unless they actually figured how to work her pony tail into it.

Or make a model for her and stretch it to fit DK's skeleton. :B

Dixie can also ground-pound with her hair in Tropical Freeze.

 

[jnWake]

I don't think anyone would mind Magicant being in sweet, sweet HD.

just think of the my music selection oh my god

I hope we get Magicant in HD. It just looks so good.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Along with the F-Zero stage, it's like Sakurai is inviting us back into those worlds since they haven't had a new game in awhile.

Yea its kinda crazy, the feelings I get hearing and seeing this stuff is some straight up bliss. I know we knew about DHD before but when he came on the screen as a new challenger I was getting overjoyed.. everyone here was. Watching his moves, final smash. Feels good and reminds me of the days I first started gaming playing nes.

 

[Red Arremer]

I kinda assumed Fox did too; at least, given he pushes opponents he overlaps out, Rest-style, I assumed there was SOME kind of invincibility thing going on there. Maybe I was mistaken.

If Fox has invul frames during his reflector, they're nowhere near as ample and utilizable as Wolf's. Wolf has like, half a year of invincibility.

 

[JediLink]

So I just checked at the Ridley thread on Smashboards.

That was a mistake.

 

[zroid]

Smash Bros. Miiverse

Edit: Sorry, you meant conditions. Forget that link

 

[Seven Force]

The F-Zero stage is badass, but I wish they would have used another F-Zero SNES stage like Red Canyon or Sand Ocean. That, and it's a little disheartening to see potential F-Zero music get passed up in favor of yet another Mute City arrangement. Doubly so since F-Zero got shafted in Brawl in terms of new arrangements, too.

 

[MrSaturn99]

So I just checked at the Ridley thread on Smashboards.

That was a mistake.

My friend and I got a great laugh out of that.

"No amount of Rosalina, Villager, Megaman, Robin, Lucina, Palutena, DHD, Little Mac or anyone else can make up for the fact that there's no Ridley, and YOU should rethink your life priorities and get over yourself if Ridley not being in has such a small impact on you."

 

[Roo]

What D:

 

[Red Arremer]

Oh boy! Does this also mean that the announcer announces their names individually? Does the percentage icon change depending on what Koopa you picked, too?

Yes.

The F-Zero stage is badass, but I wish they would have used another F-Zero SNES stage like Red Canyon or Sand Ocean. That, and it's a little disheartening to see potential F-Zero music get passed up in favor of yet another Mute City arrangement. Doubly so since F-Zero got shafted in Brawl in terms of new arrangements, too.

While I agree generally speaking, Mute City is easily the most recognizable of them all, and if only 1 F-Zero stage can be in Smash, it should be Mute City.

 

[Moonlight]

Out of curiosity, following the rules of Dark Pit, Who would've you wanted to see in his place?

------------------------------------------
The rules being:
1. Not neccessarily a recolor, but must look similar to who it's based on.
2. Clone (basically the same moves)
3. Can have a different voice and taunts and final smash. (He has all of these right?)
------------------------------------------

Viridi as a Palutena clone. Easy. I'd have gladly traded the whole nine Specials thing if we gave three of them to Viridi.

 

[MrSaturn99]

I say save the potential GX stage for the Wii U version. Imagine what that could be like in HD!

 

[Mr. Smiley]

Oh boy! Does this also mean that the announcer announces their names individually? Does the percentage icon change depending on what Koopa you picked, too?

Yes. Gema showed Morton and Larry last night and the announcer called their names too. Icons, not so sure if I remember.

 

[cabletime]

I've been watching this thread grow since I got home from work last night. This is my first post to a thread, and may I say it was pretty epic reading and watching the streams!

Watching DHD get unlocked last night was probably the coolest thing ever.

Just thought I would share this with you guys

 

[MiguelMexMIstery]

Oh man, I finally found my Uprising cardridge after like, two years! Time to play to get prepared for Dark Pit goodness.

 

[Starphoenix]

I don't think anyone would mind Magicant being in sweet, sweet HD.

just think of the my music selection oh my god

Smile and Tears
Magicant (3DS)
Onett (EarthBound)
Battle Against an Otherworldly Foe
Mother 3 Love Theme (Brawl)
Snowman (Brawl)
Fourside (Melee)

 

[?oe?oe]

It would be funny if Dark Pit was top tier.

 

[ArchedThunder]

Dixie can also ground-pound with her hair in Tropical Freeze.

DK! DIXIE KONG!
Someone needs to do a brawl mod of Dixie over DK.

 

[MrSaturn99]

Smile and Tears
Magicant (3DS)
Onett (EarthBound)
Battle Against an Otherworldly Foe
Mother 3 Love Theme (Brawl)
Snowman (Brawl)
Fourside (Melee)

I'd personally want a couple more arrangements, but that's a great start!

Oh, and don't forget Mother 2 (Melee)! By far and away the greatest Smash arrangement ever made.

 

[SUPERJEM94]

I JUST SAW ROB'S NEW FINAL SMASH! HOLY SHIT!

 

[Chase17]

It would be funny if Dark Pit was top tier.

that would be hilarious

 

[Makai]

Cutting down the tree ain't so great, but growing the tree under an enemy is a good finisher. If your enemy is between you and the seed, you can use your watering can to push them onto the seed and water it, growing the tree underneath them.

 

[Mik317]

It would be funny if Dark Pit was top tier.

New Metaknight...only now with more salt.

 

[Starphoenix]

I'd personally want a couple more arrangements, but that's a great start!

Oh, and don't forget Mother 2 (Melee)! By far and away the greatest Smash arrangement ever made.

Isn't that already Smile and Tears? Or is that the other one?

 

[BY2K]

Oh so Ganondorf has his scar, huh?

 

[Revven]

The "extra" characters are sporadic. There is no real precedence for who and why they got in.

We have 8 characters with unique models (and voices?) out of Bowser Jr., a former simple color swap got his own slot in Dark Pit, removed unique clones like Wolf. Removed PKMN Trainer for just one of the PKMN from that group.

Lucina, Doc Mario... Falco, dorf. Alph... I have no idea what the thought process was for the character selection.

Development and time restrictions are quite the cruel mistresses, I'm told.

No, really, development and how things progress can greatly impact how the roster is formed. What they plan at the beginning isn't likely to be the end result unless they had another year of development. Certain things change in priority, members get shifted around, things are chopped completely in favor of getting the more complete stuff done, etc. etc.

I'm sure that's why we didn't get more alts. I'm sure that's why alts turned into full characters. I'm sure that's why certain characters didn't change at all from Brawl. At some point, you have to straighten your priorities out and it seems things like Bowser Jr's Koopaling alts took priority, likely because some of the work could have already been done and they were running out of time to get other things done.

There is no rhyme or reason for these things other than how things from the conceptualization/pre-planning phase can be completely altered and changed mid-development because of the shifting tides in how things get done relative to progress, time, manhours, the amount of people working on such and such content, etc etc.

Who knows how much time was spent on characters that didn't make it. For all we know, Ice Climbers could have had a whole month of work done on them only to find that they made the game nigh unplayable if there was more than one pair of them in a match only to scrap them completely and move on to someone else. For all we know, their number 1 priority was Smash Run for most of last year and characters were worked on on the side or stages were worked on much later in development.

That's why some of these things happen and why it appears "illogical". We only have to look back at Melee to see roughly the exact same thing. Smash 4 is essentially a repeat of Melee, except it's probably for different reasons or logistics behind the scenes we'll never know or have the privy of finding out (unless someone datamines the 3DS version lol). I mean, Brawl tells an interesting story with what was found on its disc with its leftover data.

 

[Feltrol]

What D: