"Fair share" often amounts to limiting/reducing tax loopholes and ensuring that capital gains -- which disproportionately benefit the well off -- are taxed at the normal rates of income. There may be some marginal tax rate at upper ends of the income bracket beyond that (all of which are well within historical norms or comparable rates to other OECD countries), but that's generally what the "fair share" euphemism amounts to.
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The 4th Democratic Primary Debate
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"Fair share" often amounts to limiting/reducing tax loopholes and ensuring that capital gains -- which disproportionately benefit the well off -- are taxed at the normal rates of income. There may be some marginal tax rate at upper ends of the income bracket beyond that (all of which are well within historical norms or comparable rates to other OECD countries), but that's generally what the "fair share" euphemism amounts to.
Your Entertainer
Member
You are parroting Fox News talking points, just so you know.
1. The balance of wealth has shifted dramatically to the rich in the past few decades - this is fact. They make more money, while the poor make less. That is not good, and hurts our economy, in addition to being morally suspect. THIS is what's hurting our economy. A healthier middle class means more spending power, more demand and thus more money flowing through our economy. The policies put in place over that time have lead to this happening. Corporations see record profits year after year.
2. Another disingenuous Fox News talking point that is parroted mindlessly. Policies we have in place right now - tax breaks for corporations, lower taxes on the rich than ever before, a big military budget - are massively expensive. Eliminating these will alone create a huge chunk of revenue. Healthcare expenditure is rising rapidly and occupies a large portion of our GOP compared to other countries - in other words, we are spending more on it than others yet are coming out worse in many health metrics. The ACA is just a step in the right direction. Will these policies require higher taxes? Yes, but again it's only part of it. To focus only on slightly higher taxes (Clinton era, during which we were doing very well) and ignore the corporate subsidies, tax loopholes, etc is extremely dishonest and just blatantly dumb.
TheLaughingStock
Member
Another thing I don't get about Sanders is that fiscally the US gov't is obviously far older than he is. It's approaching 230 years old. A ton of great programs have been introduced over that timeframe helping the poor and middle class that didn't follow his Robin Hood approach.
BoboBrazil
Member
A little over 7% of households watching. That is poor viewership. Republican debates are seeing 50-100% higher viewership on stations available in far fewer homes.
Your Entertainer
Member
Thanks for parroting blatant conservative braindead talking points.
It was the second highest rated debate on the Democratic side, and even that was on CNN vs. NBC versus CNN.
I just don't think there's as much spectacle on the Democratic side this time around. Even the Obama v. Hillary debates weren't getting this much viewership.
BoboBrazil
Member
Going back and looking at the 2008 debates, it's interesting that Obama started taking the lead vs Hilary in February in polls. What caused the huge spike of support around that time for him? I doubt it will happen since Sanders isn't a good speaker, but it I guess it will be interesting to see what happens moving forward if Sanders gets some more support.
He won Iowa and proved to african-americans that white people would vote for him, so they defected.
teruterubozu
Member
Ted Kennedy endorsement and Super Tuesday.
RompinRaider
Neo Member
The Dems need to have a Plan "B"....I think Hillary pulls out late in the game (excuse might be health) and not sure Bernie can do it......simply how the press labels him a socialist w/out listening to what he says. Could this allow Biden in at the last minute? He might look good after all the ridiculous debates. Just thinking out loud.....
bruh
teruterubozu
Member
lol no. Biden would have had to register by November to be on the ballot for the first primaries like New Hampshire, Nevada, etc.
BoboBrazil
Member
Well that definitely won't be happening for Bernie.
If Bernie is going to win he needs endorsement by some high power Democrats then. Super Tuesday is March 1st this year, so he has some time I guess.
ClayKavalier
Banned
Why do you think Clinton will pull out?
RompinRaider
Neo Member
Laws and rules don't seem to matter anymore...I'm not pushing Biden but Hillary will never win.
TheLaughingStock
Member
I've never heard conservative talking points about what the US has done over time to help the poor and middle class, but ok. It's too late for Sanders, but maybe the next archliberal should move away from FDR the balanced budget nut paying for x, y, and z with high taxes to FDR the Keynesian committed to running deficits and issuing treasury securities to promote economic prosperity. It would help too if that person was committed to helping labor and our most vulnerable as much as possible all the time vs. just in crisis mode.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Do you actually have anything to back this up, or are we just making random unsubstantiated claims?
teruterubozu
Member
Well that would be Obama or Bill Clinton. Ted Kennedy was the supreme overlord of the Democratic Party.
BoboBrazil
Member
Well Bill Clinton definitely won't lol. Hilary is cozied up next to Obama so he won't endorse Sanders either.
The Lamonster
Member
Obama isn't going to endorse anyone until they get the nomination.
teruterubozu
Member
Yup, that's why I don't see any impactful endorsement for Bernie in the future.
Yeah, cuz democrats also watch the republican debate. That debate has multiple questions of who will say crazy shit, will trump finally get knocked down a peg, etc. Democratic debates aren't nearly as entertaining, and none change the rhetoric of Hillary being safe but kinda shady and not liked, while Bernie is ultra liberal but unelectable.
Aaronology
Member
And would you like to elaborate on why you believe that, Raider?
The Lamonster
Member
teruterubozu
Member
Oddly he sounded like he was endorsing Bernie during the State of the Union - get special interests out of elections and politics, etc.
He's not the only one that's pledged to overturn Citizen's United dude
BoboBrazil
Member
Yet, he didn't do any of this during his tenure as President.
The Lamonster
Member
I think all he did in terms of primary politics was denounce Trump.
teruterubozu
Member
lol just kidding dudes. So touchy around here. Of course he didn't endorse anyone. lol
Obama not endorsing anyone has nothing to do with him possibly preferring Clinton. Sitting Presidents don't endorse anyone in primaries. It would take something on the level of the Trump disaster currently happening to the GOP to get a sitting President to wade into a primary fight.
Obama has talked about money and politics for a long time now. Don't forget that super pacs only came into existence after Citizens United and virtually every democrat opposes that decision. One of Obama's first legislative victories as president was about reducing lobbying and closing the revolving door from K street to congress (it didn't). So these are hardly new themes for Obama or him endorsign Bernie's ideas. I mean, these aren't even Bernie's ideas to begin with.
BoboBrazil
Member
Ahh, makes sense.
The only reason anybody is tuning into the Republican debate is to watch how Trump will outdo himself this time around. When you have two candidates saying more or less the same thing as the other, and doing so in a generally cordial way, it doesn't make for compelling television. However, I'd rather have boring, plain debates than whatever crazy shit the other side is doing.
excelsiorlef
Member
He's not a fan of Wall Street. Agreed. My point was that he and most of his supported don't hate all rich people simply because they are rich. It's how they got there that's the issue.
I also don't interpret calling the business model of Wall Street a fraud as the same as calling everybody who works there guilty of a felony. Individuals are only liable for misdeeds of their employer in a a few very limited ways in which they directly and generally willingly commit a criminal act.
malingenie
Member
I love Bern's look when Hillary tries slander.
https://vine.co/v/iOU3TAQut33
https://vine.co/v/iOU3TAQut33
UltimaPooh
Member
The market crash of 2008 would show you it was and most likely still is a corrupt and fruadulant system.
That doesn't mean everyone is in cahoots to make it a fraudulent system but they certainly went along with it.
Has NBC said anything about YouTube combined numbers?
Whats this about? I don't understand what we are looking at here.
I've been looking at it for a whole minute trying to discern what's up
shadowsdarknes
Member
By what metric?
The media? Twitter? Style vs. Substance?
Ask anyone and you'll get different opinions.
That's Debbie Wasserman-Schultz in the green, receiving a very un-heartfelt handshake from Bernie. She's the head of the DNC, the one who came up with the Dem's horrible debate schedule among other shitty things. Probably the most hated DNC chair in recent memory, if not ever.
Doc Holliday
SPOILER: Columbus finds America
She sucks so bad! What happened to her?? I didn't think she was terrible when she first became chair.
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