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[Kerotan]

This.

No other argument need be made. Magic this, fiction that; the truth is Ubi at least had the protagonist be a local that could be based on accounts of what locals were like then. You know, if only to make it somewhat immersive (the whole bloody main plot device of the series).

Maybe when we wake from the animus we'll find out the modern Day assassin's are blue haired wokies from Reeee and the templars are based gaffers.

Can't wait to bludgeon the moderator who banned me. Revenge!

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

didn't read and i have seen some of those YT thumnails and their titles... it seems the drama from the usual suspects actually became a real thing in Japan?

If Sony is going to TGS just to show Ghost 2 to the Japanese audience with the"respect" and "historic accuracy" that Asscreed lacked... perfect marketing.

 

[tommib]

given the Japanese government has literally intervened in the matter).

Oh god are you telling me culture wars and identity politics have reached the blessed lands of Nippon? Nothing is sacred anymore.

 

[Lokaum D+]

what i wanted from a Assassin Creed Japan

What i got

an African dude and a woman.

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

The main problem is that Ubisoft, like all the historic documentaries made in bad faith, tells people that "this game has been made by a diverse team of..."

BULLSHIT.

This game didn't have local historians on its side, the only ones that matter. So, they shit on Japan's history and feature a non-japanese protagonist. Their "explanations" are in English. The entitlement of these cunts is nauseating.

They should state that their game is FANTASY and that they don't give a fuck about Japanese history. End of the story.

 

[Fahdis]

Assassins Creed - “The Holy Land” modern day Israel - Character: Altaïr Ibn-La’Ahad ( Arabic )

Lol, its Palestine in the modern day, Syria and the Ayyubid Dynasty after the fall of the crusaders and Lionheart was going through Jaffa. Some of this stuff in regards to representation matters. Altair himself became an atheist after finding an Apple of Eden but his master Al-Mualim (Based on Hassan) was an Ismaili Nizari Muslim that still exist today in modern Iran/Pakistan.

Hahaha, you know what's funny? You can watch Kingdom of Heaven and then directly play Assassin's Creed 1 and it would all still fit really well.

 

[Gaiff]

This game and it's choice of characters is a political one. Ubisoft has not hidden this matter.

Sure, they may have gone with Yasuke because they follow the whole more minorities (especially black people) in media. Or maybe because they wanted their game to stand out? Or maybe both.

So whatever you may think, this game is directly connected to modern XXI century US politics.

No, it isn't. This game was made by Ubisoft Montreal where African-American (or black people) violence on Asians isn't especially prevalent. The world doesn't revolve around the United States, nor does this game for that matter. It's a Montreal-based studio owned by a French corporation making a game featuring an African samurai in Japan, yet here you are linking it to US politics, and a very specific issue at that. Furthermore, African-Americans and Africans in the United States are two very distinct groups that don't even always get along (I would daresay, they don't get along at all). You're the one who made a connection to modern American politics by seriously reaching.

I doubt any of us is Asian or Black. I'm latino, so I'm probably half way in the racist ladder.
Still, this does not mean neither of us can be prevented of speaking of current social issues.
And one of the major issues we have currently, is racism and violence against Asians.
Watch that essay I posted about the portrayal of how Asian men are constantly being discriminated against, in western media.
This is an issue that goes back many decades, and unfortunately, Ubisoft decided to continue to continue this trend.

We can speak on societal issues if they have anything to do with the game, but what you're talking about has absolutely nothing to do with it, come on. You were seriously arguing that this game normalizes violence against Asians.

The portrayal of Asian men in western media as weak and effeminate is a discussion that can be had, but this isn't even the case in this game. Yasuke serves a Japanese man. Japan in this game even with the historical inaccuracies is presented in a very positive light. If you're going to fight over the negative depiction of Asian men in western media, this ain't the hill to die on. We're far from The Hungover that made a joke of Asian men with Leslie Chow and his tiny penis.

Now, if your problem is about the erasure of Asian men in western media and the fact that this was a golden opportunity to have an Asian man star in a video game, sure. Then again, Sony already beat them to the punch with Ghost of Tsushima, so I'm unsure how much positive Asian male portrayal this game would add.

 

[RoboFu]

The main problem is that Ubisoft, like all the historic documentaries made in bad faith, tells people that "this game has been made by a diverse team of..."

BULLSHIT.

This game didn't have local historians on its side, the only ones that matter. So, they shit on Japan's history and feature a non-japanese protagonist. Their "explanations" are in English. The entitlement of these cunts is nauseating.

They should state that their game is FANTASY and that they don't give a fuck about Japanese history. End of the story.

This is a big part of the backlash .. plus.. all the AC games you played of someone of that land. When they get to the one place where you have a long cultural history of ninjas doing crazy acrobatics.. it was something many people were waiting for in a game about crazy acrobatics and then we get a non Asian samurai and possibly a ninja girl at times.

That's such a hard fail that there is no way possible it wasn't done knowingly for an agenda.

 

[winjer]

Sure, they may have gone with Yasuke because they follow the whole more minorities (especially black people) in media. Or maybe because they wanted their game to stand out? Or maybe both.

No, it isn't. This game was made by Ubisoft Montreal where African-American (or black people) violence on Asians isn't especially prevalent. The world doesn't revolve around the United States, nor does this game for that matter. It's a Montreal-based studio owned by a French corporation making a game featuring an African samurai in Japan, yet here you are linking it to US politics, and a very specific issue at that. Furthermore, African-Americans and Africans in the United States are two very distinct groups that don't even always get along (I would daresay, they don't get along at all). You're the one who made a connection to modern American politics by seriously reaching.

We can speak on societal issues if they have anything to do with the game, but what you're talking about has absolutely nothing to do with it, come on. You were seriously arguing that this game normalizes violence against Asians.

The portrayal of Asian men in western media as weak and effeminate is a discussion that can be had, but this isn't even the case in this game. Yasuke serves a Japanese man. Japan in this game even with the historical inaccuracies is presented in a very positive light. If you're going to fight over the negative depiction of Asian men in western media, this ain't the hill to die on. We're far from The Hungover that made a joke of Asian men with Leslie Chow and his tiny penis.

Now, if your problem is about the erasure of Asian men in western media and the fact that this was a golden opportunity to have an Asian man star in a video game, sure. Then again, Sony already beat them to the punch with Ghost of Tsushima, so I'm unsure how much positive Asian male portrayal this game would add.

Like it has been shown, in previous games, the ethnicity of the main character always reflected the location of the game.
This game is the exception, and we all know this was a political decision. Not an artistic decision.
Ubisoft went so far as to blatantly lie about historical facts, to justify their decision.
This game took a political stance, based on modern events. Whether you like to admit it or not.
It's made worse, by the still ongoing racism against Asians.
Your argument that Asian men already had one game representing them so they don't have reasons to complain, it's blatantly racist.

 

[Saber]

In other news since i had the chance to watch the seven samurais last sunday at my local cinema, i'll let you in on something i never noticed before.

I don't know about yasuke, but Kanbei, the old ronin that the peasants hire first is an old Nobunaga Oda retainer. The movie happens in 1586, the battle at Honno-ji happened 3 or 4 years before. And when he meets his old brother in arms, he tells him "the roof of the castle fell because of the fire and i thought i was dead but survived" im pretty sure he's talking about Honno-ji castle which famously burned to the ground with Oda not wanting to leave.

So maybe if Ubisoft want to salvage thier game, they just have to add a Kanbei character that could exactly what Yasuke does as Oda's retainer.
Problem solved.

You, me and probably all the smartasses in this thread throwing low effort excuses know pretty well the reason for they to choose basically a nobody that no one ever gave a single fuck until this game was revealed(Ubisoft didn't born yesterday, they knew pretty well what they are doing).
If it was like a real character with a strong backstory, pretty sure even the japanese wouldn't mind. What people are doing is simply calling the japanese stupid for being against the classic Ubisoft doing crap on purpose.
I wish they make games with american historical figures transformed into drag queens or nazis and say "hey its fantasy, so thats ok".

 

[AJUMP23]

I'll have you know that i went to the island of Lesbos and IT IS populated by level 45 dykes irl.

It is the origin of the word Lesbian.

 

[Killer8]

From the first dev diary they said his mystery and the fact little is known about him is what made him a good protagonist they could weave a story around.

First dev diary:

It's clear from that interview that they were operating on the questionable view that he was a samurai to begin with. You can't exactly interpret calling him a samurai, and a historical character - while showing b-roll footage of him in full samurai regalia as they describe his life story - in any other way.

The mystery, to them, would be about the specifics of his exploits... as a samurai. Rather than the mystery of who he was full-stop. It's really just about having enough artistic license to have him high-fiving Oda Nobunaga in a cutscene after razing a peasant village.

Now, I don't have a problem with an interpretation of Yasuke as a samurai. It is common even in Japanese-made media like Nioh (as 'Obsidian Samurai'). But I think it was a mistake to frame his character in a way that was at all historical, when they admit to knowing so little about him.

And they do frame it as historical because this is written on Ubisoft's website right now:

In any case, Ubisoft themselves get only a little bit of my ire. The bulk of it goes towards the people who have turned it into a culture war flashpoint. Specifically, those who insist and ardently believe that he absolutely 100% was a samurai, and if you don't agree with that narrative then you must be a racist.

It's fairly easy to just shrug all of this off and just play the damn game if it's good. But if we're basically being forced to rewrite history here because of some retards' agenda and to not appear as a bad person, that's something much more odious. It's the same scenario as the one Kingdom Come faced years ago but mirrored in a way: Assassin's Creed Shadows is ahistory being defended as history or else you're a bigot, while KC was history needing to be attacked as ahistorical or else you're a bigot.

 

[STARSBarry]

You, me and probably all the smartasses in this thread throwing low effort excuses know pretty well the reason for they to choose basically a nobody that no one ever gave a single fuck until this game was revealed(Ubisoft didn't born yesterday, they knew pretty well what they are doing).
If it was like a real character with a strong backstory, pretty sure even the japanese wouldn't mind. What people are doing is simply calling the japanese stupid for being against the classic Ubisoft doing crap on purpose.
I wish they make games with american historical figures transformed into drag queens or nazis and say "hey its fantasy, so thats ok".

Why imagine?



We already had this remember. Same sort of pushback, remember the "well don't buy our game" is resulted in

 

[Gaiff]

Like it has been shown, in previous games, the ethnicity of the main character always reflected the location of the game.
This game is the exception, and we all know this was a political decision. Not an artistic decision.

Yeah, and there's Naoe in this game who last I checked is a native Japanese? Regardless, adding a black character because you think black people deserve more representation is far from African-Americans on Asian-American violence.

Ubisoft went so far as to blatantly lie about historical facts, to justify their decision.

Pretty sure they didn't lie to justify their decision. They completely fucked up and hired morons as consultants. Their reasoning for choosing him was that Yasuke was relatively unknown and thus malleable, which isn't a lie.

This game took a political stance, based on modern events. Whether you like to admit it or not.
It's made worse, by the still ongoing racism against Asians.

Once again, we go from "they put a black man in a game for representation," to "this game normalizes violence against Asians". How in the world are you coming to this insane conclusion? What kind of person watches the trailer of this game and thinks "I wanna kill Japanese people"? The game is: black dude arrives in Japan. He catches the eye of the most powerful warlord of the time and said warlord hires him as a warrior. Nobunaga then orders Yasuke to destroy his enemies so he can takeover the whole country.

Your argument that Asian men already had one game representing them so they don't have reasons to complain, it's blatantly racist.

Never said that. I said I'm unsure if it would make any difference because it's already been done recently. I absolutely never implied they had no reasons to complain because they frankly do and I noticed this a long time ago.

 

[Topher]

Who gives a shit honestly, it's not going to stop me from enjoying the game.

Just going to echo this because at the end of the day all I really care about is playing another good Assassin's Creed game.

 

[Fess]

I think these games would benefit, much like Star Wars Outlaws, from a character creator. You can still write a character and have a voice actor. But hand over the decision of the appearance to the players.

This.

But then they can’t push our their diversity points so that won’t happen. At best it might be able to use mods.

 

[TheRedRiders]

Just going to echo this because at the end of the day all I really care about is playing another good Assassin's Creed game.

I know they get a lot of criticism from many on here but I've always enjoyed them. Nothing like cruising through Ancient Greece on a giant ship and and slaying mythical creatures like Medusa and the Minotaur.

 

[Lokaum D+]

This.

But then they can’t push our their diversity points so that won’t happen. At best it might be able to use mods.

a mod to change Yasuke looks would be banned in minutes on Nexus.

 

[a multicultural team of v]

This.

But then they can’t push our their diversity points so that won’t happen. At best it might be able to use mods.

Good luck finding a mod site to host any mod that changes the protag to anything other than another black person.

 

[mckmas8808]

Wish they posted a message about how AC made DaVinci a clownish character or exaggerated other historical characters.

Oh wait, nobody cared back then either.

So why are they responding to this? It seems all so weird.

 

[LordCBH]

Jesus people are so ass blasted over this game.

 

[mckmas8808]

No, it isn't. This game was made by Ubisoft Montreal where African-American (or black people) violence on Asians isn't especially prevalent. The world doesn't revolve around the United States, nor does this game for that matter. It's a Montreal-based studio owned by a French corporation making a game featuring an African samurai in Japan, yet here you are linking it to US politics, and a very specific issue at that. Furthermore, African-Americans and Africans in the United States are two very distinct groups that don't even always get along (I would daresay, they don't get along at all). You're the one who made a connection to modern American politics by seriously reaching.

It's a myth that black Americans and Africans don't get along. Most of us do get along. It's just that there isn't 100% love (which people seem to think it should be), which means we hate each other all together.

So one group had 100% love for other.

 

[Filben]

No matter what they say, it's still a video game and not a documentary or a scientific paper made into a video game. They sell an entertainment product and gameplay, not historical facts or history lessons or an educational game.

I see it for what it is: stealth action game with a fictitious story set in something that could be feudal Japan. There is no authenticity here (there's almost always none in this genre; despite the word being overly used in everyday's speech) and the framing is always be judged by the work's author (here, Ubisoft); this not a biographical renovation or processing by some dark-skinned Japanese working at Ubisoft and writing the story and characters, whose lineage goes back to his black father working as a Samurai in feudal Japan. This is not the video game equivalence to 'Roots' by Alex Haley, which is still a work of fiction (or 'faction', how the author liked to call it).

Unless it's a video game made by academic experts in their fields, there's too little incentive by the team for historical accuracy to call it anything else than a fictious video game. And for that it's probably okay. George Washington holding an Apple of Eden that gives him nightmares about a parallel universe should require no more amount of suspending any disbelief than a black Samurai.

 

[Hudo]

He did.

I kinda admire his dedication.

what i wanted from a Assassin Creed Japan

What i got

an African dude and a woman.

Ngl, a Vagabond game would be dope. I'd be interested in how they'd do the battle where he fought the 70 Yoshioka. If it were AssCreed, they'd just let each one come one by one while the others watch, lmao.
That battle was an awesome moment in the manga.

 

[winjer]

Yeah, and there's Naoe in this game who last I checked is a native Japanese? Regardless, adding a black character because you think black people deserve more representation is far from African-Americans on Asian-American violence.

Asian females representation in western media has been bad, but it has been much worse for men.
What Ubisoft is doing is the same racist mistake that has been done so many times, in the past century of western media.
Just because there is still a Japanese women, does make it any less racist.

Pretty sure they didn't lie to justify their decision. They completely fucked up and hired morons as consultants. Their reasoning for choosing him was that Yasuke was relatively unknown and thus malleable, which isn't a lie.

Once again, we go from "they put a black man in a game for representation," to "this game normalizes violence against Asians". How in the world are you coming to this insane conclusion? What kind of person watches the trailer of this game and thinks "I wanna kill Japanese people"? The game is: black dude arrives in Japan. He catches the eye of the most powerful warlord of the time and said warlord hires him as a warrior. Nobunaga then orders Yasuke to destroy his enemies so he can takeover the whole country.

Never said that. I said I'm unsure if it would make any difference because it's already been done recently. I absolutely never implied they had no reasons to complain because they frankly do and I noticed this a long time ago.

Ubisoft didn't just get unlucky with the people they hired to do historical research. They picked them because they were saying whet Ubisoft wanted them to.
And yes, this game normalizes racism against Asian men. It's so blatantly obvious.

 

[Gaiff]

It's a myth that black Americans and Africans don't get along. Most of us do get along. It's just that there isn't 100% love (which people seem to think it should be), which means we hate each other all together.

So one group had 100% love for other.

Could be. In my experience, they really don't.

Asian females representation in western media has been bad, but it has been much worse for men.
What Ubisoft is doing is the same racist mistake that has been done so many times, in the past century of western media.
Just because there is still a Japanese women, does make it any less racist.

So games set in Japan or East Asian countries made by western devs aren't allowed to star non-Asian people. If they do, they are racist?

Ubisoft didn't just get unlucky with the people they hired to do historical research. They picked them because they were saying whet Ubisoft wanted them to.

Changes nothing to my point. They picked Yasuke because he was a historical figure with just enough information to make a game with, but not enough so that they couldn't take a lot of liberties. They didn't lie about their reasons. Their reason was simply: We picked Yasuke because he was real but much of his life was shrouded in mystery, we can thus make up a lot of the stuff because it's not known anyway.

And yes, this game normalizes racism against Asian men. It's so blatantly obvious.

I don't know what to say to that. Would it have been alright if it were a white man? A Latino? We can't make a game with a foreigner fighting in a foreign land because them killing the locals implies racism? Or is that strictly restricted to black people and Asians because the United States have a race relations problem?

 

[LordCBH]

And yes, this game normalizes racism against Asian men. It's so blatantly obvious.

You typed a long ass word salad just to get to this and yet didn’t explain anything about how it’s 1) racist and 2) blatantly obvious.

 

[Toots]

It is the origin of the word Lesbian.

Not sure, maybe we should ask an Ubisoft historian ??

 

[geary]

And yes, this game normalizes racism against Asian men. It's so blatantly obvious.

Then Ezio must answer for murdering Muslims in Constantinople. right?

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Their official response, which can be read in full below, has been shared via the Assassin's Creed Twitter account half an hour ago:

That letter in itself is dishonorable to the Japanese.

 

[Skifi28]

That letter in itself is dishonorable to the Japanese.

Ubisoft just shot themselves in the foot. I don't know how much the rest of you know about Japanese culture (I'm an expert), but honor and shame are huge parts of it. It's not like it is in America where you can become successful by being an asshole. If you screw someone over in Japan, you bring shame to yourself, and the only way to get rid of that shame is repentance.

 

[FoxMcChief]

Unless it’s, “Go fuck yourself, it’s just a game,” I’m not interested.

 

[winjer]

Then Ezio must answer for murdering Muslims in Constantinople. right?

You do realize that Constantinople had been captured and pillaged by the Ottoman Empire half a century earlier.
Are you really going to try to pretend that the Ottoman empire were the good guys, in their brutal conquest of North Africa and South Eastern Europe?

 

[Dynasty8]

Ubisoft just shot themselves in the foot. I don't know how much the rest of you know about Japanese culture (I'm an expert), but honor and shame are huge parts of it. It's not like it is in America where you can become successful by being an asshole. If you screw someone over in Japan, you bring shame to yourself, and the only way to get rid of that shame is repentance.

Damn, I feel old now. Good times...

 

[LordCBH]

Unless it’s, “Go fuck yourself, it’s just a game,” I’m not interested.

Literally should’ve been the only sentence in ubisoft’s tweet lol

 

[geary]

So is not racist if is against the bad guys? Did the definition of racism changed?

You do realize that Constantinople had been captured and pillaged by the Ottoman Empire half a century earlier.
Are you really going to try to pretend that the Ottoman empire were the good guys, in their brutal conquest of North Africa and South Eastern Europe?

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

Thomas Lockley, Ubisoft and the rest of their ilk are retarded for conjuring up some mythical black samurai and pushing it as some historical fact.

The japanese are retarded for crying about some black guy in a stupid fantasy game. No I don't feel sorry for them. They live in a secluded bubble.

Whoever decided to give Yasuke that hiphop track is the most retarded of all.

 

[Doom85]

It's reinforcing a modern stereotype of violence against Asians by slaughtering Japanese people as the (probably?) only famous black character from that time period to Hip-Hop beats, no less. How can you not see that to be, at the very least, in poor taste?

The same way I didn’t see Resident Evil 5 in poor taste even though you’re playing a white dude gunning down a ton of black people in Africa. Chris did that because they were zombies in this instance and therefore enemies, likewise it’s a safe assumption that in this AC game you can only kill specifically Japanese people who are enemies due to the story and not just whoever you want since that causes an instant game over when done repeatedly (unless that feature has been removed in recent AC games).

 

[Toots]

You, me and probably all the smartasses in this thread throwing low effort excuses know pretty well the reason for they to choose basically a nobody that no one ever gave a single fuck until this game was revealed(Ubisoft didn't born yesterday, they knew pretty well what they are doing).
If it was like a real character with a strong backstory, pretty sure even the japanese wouldn't mind. What people are doing is simply calling the japanese stupid for being against the classic Ubisoft doing crap on purpose.
I wish they make games with american historical figures transformed into drag queens or nazis and say "hey its fantasy, so thats ok".

Not entirely sure i get your point, but you're right about the selected outrage.

One thing i think we as westerners tend to forget is how racist japanese are towards black people, or more generally dark skinned people. A lot of the uproar might come from bad old racism.
I bet if Ubisoft reveal a possibility of romance between yasuke and naoe, the japanese gvt will bring back the Shinpū Tokubetsu Kōgekitai.

 

[LordCBH]

Whoever decided to put give Yasuke that hiphop track is the most retarded of all.

This I can actually agree with lol

 

[winjer]

So is not racist if is against the bad guys? Did the definition of racism changed?

I'm saying the Ottomans were not the natives to the region.
The Ottoman empire killed millions of christians in their conquest. During the period when Ezio adventures occur, they are the invading army.
So at a time when a Muslim empire is waging war in Europe, it fits the narrative.

 

[geary]

I'm saying the Ottomans were not the natives to the region.
The Ottoman empire killed millions of christians in their conquest. During the period when Ezio adventures occur, they are the invading army.
So at a time when a Muslim empire is waging war in Europe, it fits the narrative.

Racism disappear in time of war?

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

Racism disappear in time of war?

I'm even more racist and sexist when I go to war

 

[winjer]

Racism disappear in time of war?

Neither Christianity, nor Islam are races. They are religions.
And yes, there was a major war during the period, between Christians and Muslims.
So the game's narrative is perfectly justified by historical events.

 

[Gaiff]

I'm saying the Ottomans were not the natives to the region.
The Ottoman empire killed millions of christians in their conquest. During the period when Ezio adventures occur, they are the invading army.
So at a time when a Muslim empire is waging war in Europe, it fits the narrative.

So it wouldn't be okay for any non-Asian to star in this game because this would normalize violence against Asians? Or is it specifically problematic because it's a black man?

 

[Fess]

a mod to change Yasuke looks would be banned in minutes on Nexus.

Maybe but if it happens it’ll circulate on the net anyway, and the Star Wars gal won’t stay untouched for long if the game is easy to mod.

 

[Topher]

I'm even more racist and sexist when I go to war

Next AC.....

 

[Hudo]

Whoever decided to give Yasuke that hiphop track is the most retarded of all.

This sums up the situation quite well, I think.

 

[Hypnotoad]

The Yasuke Song has almost 2 million views already and provides an insight into the issue that Japanese themselves have with this new, soulless corporate product.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

Next AC.....

Can't wait to commit cultural genocide