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[DeepEnigma]

And the 3 second class years is when the best games are out, some which was the reason they bought the console in the first place.

Games are not going anywhere, lol. They are still PS4 games. You spin me right round baby right round like a broken record player...

and people with the base PS4 can still enjoy those games.

It is hard for me to enjoy a game, knowing someone else is enjoying it 'better' than me.

 

[benny_a]

So they bought the console 3 years too early? How wise

You don't understand it. Buying it early because that's obviously the best time to buy it: You don't have warranty when the games you actually want are out and you pay a higher price for it.

The best argument in favor of buying something before you want it is actually that you admit to being an idiot. You can't argue that.

 

[Moonstone]

What unrealistic expectations? 30 years of console business set us with that expectations especially from Sony who promised and deliver 10 years of this and that.
Many early adopters dive right in first day because they always deliver.
Some expect 6-7 years of best support, not 3 years first class and 3 years second class.

I'm getting PS4K day 1 so it doesn't bother me, but I can understand why people think that way, so I won't just dismiss anything with something like envy or ice cream.

This should extend the support not shorten it.
Rocketleague was a great success. Psionix intially wanted to do a PS3 port - but they scrapped it. There are not many releases for the PS3 anymore - also all the indie stuff could be easily ported - if there was a "platform" and the same architecture

Expect a similar game to be released in Year 2 of the PS5. There wouldn't be much work need to make it run on a PS4 or a PS4k. So as someone who doesn't want to upgrade fast and buys consoles when they have been significantly reduced in price, I get longer support and new games for my console of choice.

 

[Lady Gaia]

what you calling me sis for yo?

Just calling attention to you calling me "bro" for no apparent reason. Yes, I know women aren't all that common here but we do exist.

And explain how it is unrealistic when these expectations are consistent with the reality for the past 20+ years?

Only if you ignore all my prior points about examples where it wasn't true. There have been many improvements along the way in mid-cycle consoles or other upgrades, though it's true that they've taken a variety of different forms. Everything right now points to years of releases to come that are aimed squarely at the PS4. I'd be shocked if there weren't 5+ years where every single new title considers the PS4 to be the primary platform with Neo as an afterthought. After all, we're talking about games that have been under development for a year or more now that will come out five years after the PS4 was introduced.

What's unrealistic is to assume that technology won't march onward in ways that affect you. We're already getting games developed with the PC in mind that have to be scaled down for the PS4, so of course that will continue and only get more noticeable. I'm sure there were people who bought an Xbox One assuming that it wouldn't be overshadowed by a more powerful PS4, despite plenty of evidence that in a new generation all bets are off. People can expect whatever they want but if those expectations prove to be unfounded then they simply have to live with it.

 

[Jimrpg]

It just seems... So silly though, like Sony couldn't bear the thought of every article telling them the PS4 was inferior to PC and that PC had the best version. That's literally all it comes down to in my opinion. Yet the PS4k is yet another middle of the road console that's going to be average graphically in another two years. If it's equivalent to a 380x, that's kind of not really that powerful anymore. 1080/60 for games right now on med/high settings. In 2 years it's going to be really behind. I'd almost rather they make this a high end option like $699 for those who really want something like this. You could have a $400-450 pascal equivalent GPU which would be around 1070/1080 in power and really stay relevant for 3-4 years.

 

[wapplew]

and people with the base PS4 can still enjoy those games.

Doesn't make it less second class thou.
In that 3 years, Sony better have tight police on performance, because anything bad happen, the blame is on them.
That's how they lost customer's trust. 3 generations of hard earn trust will be gone. Good luck convincing them to be early adopter of your next product.

 

[The Artisan]

What unrealistic expectations? 30 years of console business set us with that expectations especially from Sony who promised and deliver 10 years of this and that.
Many early adopters dive right in first day because they always deliver.
Some expect 6-7 years of best support, not 3 years first class and 3 years second class.

I'm getting PS4K day 1 so it doesn't bother me, but I can understand why people think that way, so I won't just dismiss anything with something like envy or ice cream.

Thank you.

If this is the direction that you want the industry to go, then be happy it's headed this way, but it's pretty rude, insensitive and dismissive to disregard and refuse to understand why people aren't okay with it.

 

[benny_a]

That's how they lost customer's trust. 3 generations of hard earn trust will be gone. Good luck convincing them to be early adopter of your next product.

Next product hahahhahaa

 

[The Artisan]

Just calling attention to you calling me "bro" for no apparent reason. Yes, I know women aren't all that common here but we do exist.

Alright my bad. I was in the wrong for doing that.

Only if you ignore all my prior points about examples where it wasn't true. There have been many improvements along the way in mid-cycle consoles or other upgrades, though it's true that they've taken a variety of different forms. Everything right now points to years of releases to come that are aimed squarely at the PS4. I'd be shocked if there weren't 5+ years where every single new title considers the PS4 to be the primary platform with Neo as an afterthought. After all, we're talking about games that have been under development for a year or more now that will come out five years after the PS4 was introduced.

literally every playstation has seen hardware revisions but never one that affected developers, and never one that divided the install base in ANY way, shape, or form. The Ps4K will divide the install base in at least some way shape or form.

What's unrealistic is to assume that technology won't march onward in ways that affect you. We're already getting games developed with the PC in mind that have to be scaled down for the PS4, so of course that will continue and only get more noticeable. I'm sure there were people who bought an Xbox One assuming that it wouldn't be overshadowed by a more powerful PS4, despite plenty of evidence that in a new generation all bets are off. People can expect whatever they want but if those expectations prove to be unfounded then they simply have to live with it.

No one is assuming technology won't march onward in ineffective ways. What was assumed was that after 6-7 years, the Ps5 would be that much more powerful than the Ps4, all the while this generation we get to enjoy games on the same hardware, seeing the developers work with it with each year of experience.

 

[Boke1879]

Doesn't make it not second class thou.
In that 3 years, Sony better have tight police on performance, because anything bad happen, the blame is on them.
That's how they lost customer's trust. 3 generations of hard earn trust will be gone. Good luck convincing them to be early adopter of your next product.

Your average consumer most likely won't even care. Games like Witcher, Fallout etc have some performance hitches on PS4. Still didn't stop people from wildly enjoying those games. Lets say Neo released in the near future. Uncharted 4 comes out very soon. looks absolutely amazing on the base PS4. Lets say they release a neo version that looks a bit better. Would you still feel 2nd class?

 

[Sydle]

He posted quotes from the very same date as the ones you posted. Maybe there wasn't some WHAT CHANGED YOUR MIND REVELATION kind of point, unless you want to search for it 55 days ago.

But good attempt with the quote mining. I fell for it.

Can't know without asking.

His responses in that thread seemed to be in the line of thought that an incremental upgrade model was a good way to transition out of the console business. His line of thought in the OP flies in the face of his line of thought then. I'm just asking what triggered the switch.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I can already see the threads about PS4 vanilla holding back PS4.5, and how the PS4.5 isnt hitting its true potential etc, etc. Sony want to take the console space into a constant state of transition, where it always feels like that time period 1 or 2 years when a new system hits. E3 cant come soon enough to see whats what.

But we already knew that. Why would it be a surprise when Sony specifically wants to hold back PS4K to begin with? This is only largely for resolution and performance, and graphics if devs want to take advantage of that.

They aren't trying to make a brand new console with games that PS4 cant run

 

[benny_a]

Can't know without asking.

What actually happened is that you tried to gotcha the OP by selective choosing quotes to post in this thread while ignoring other posts from the very same day to form a narrative and then innocently trying to play the "what changed your mind, I'm so curious" inquisitive mind.

Turns out you post mined and false represented that poster in this thread and lied by omission and now you don't even have the decency to leave the thread after being caught.

 

[The Artisan]

Your average consumer most likely won't even care. Games like Witcher, Fallout etc have some performance hitches on PS4. Still didn't stop people from wildly enjoying those games. Lets say Neo released in the near future. Uncharted 4 comes out very soon. looks absolutely amazing on the base PS4. Lets say they release a neo version that looks a bit better. Would you still feel 2nd class?

We don't know how the average consumer is going to react. If the hardcore community is any indication, the average consumers will have a mixed reaction.

 

[SwordStruck]

But we already knew that. Why would it be a surprise when Sony specifically wants to hold back PS4K to begin with? This is only largely for resolution and performance, and graphics if devs want to take advantage of that.

They aren't trying to make a brand new console with games that PS4 cant run

To be fair we only know this because of some leaked documentation.

 

[Sydle]

What actually happened is that you tried to gotcha the OP by selective choosing quotes to post in this thread while ignoring other posts from the very same day to form a narrative and then innocently trying to play the "what changed your mind, I'm so curious" inquisitive mind.

Turns out you post mined and false represented that poster in this thread and lied by omission and now you don't even have the decency to leave the thread after being caught.

Nope. Read my edit above.

 

[wapplew]

Your average consumer most likely won't even care. Games like Witcher, Fallout etc have some performance hitches on PS4. Still didn't stop people from wildly enjoying those games. Lets say Neo released in the near future. Uncharted 4 comes out very soon. looks absolutely amazing on the base PS4. Lets say they release a neo version that looks a bit better. Would you still feel 2nd class?

Yes, isn't that human nature? Call it envy or "ice cream" all you want, some people do feel 2nd class.
Get treat like first class is an illusion but one illusion that so important no console maker dare to break (except Nintendo on handheld but the owned that space so they can do whatever they want)

 

[gigantor21]

I personally have no problem with the PS4K. I would much rather see hardware makers leverage the x86 architecture to put out backwards compatible upgrades more frequently, rather than being stuck with the same old ass hardware for 7+ years. And given that the hardware is simply being upgraded and devs are going to be able to use the same tools, the fetishized "optimizing around static hardware" argument rings hollow. It's not the PS3.

That said, one legitimate concern is how good the software support for the old model will be in terms of performance. They say that they're going to try and keep things solid across both, but we've seen several games run like shit when they only had the base PS4 to worry about. The focus on the new model isn't going to help much as time goes on.

 

[Jacksinthe]

Of course iterative cycles would be easier for devs, because each new generation would require games that were less technically advanced due to needing to run on older platforms. But that is absolutely not what benefits consumers, at all, who instead want to see considerably improved visuals, major shifts in game design, physics, tech etc, not just incremental ones.

Also, the cross platform example you gave actually works against iterative generational shifts, not for it. Most gamers vehemently dislike the idea of a prolonged period of cross platform games, e.g. games that are designed around both next gen and old gen hardware. These games tend to be obviously less visually impressive and accomplished than next gen only games. Luckily the cross gen period usually only bleeds a year or two in to a new generation. Old gen sales drop off so quickly, there's not really much need to push it beyond that.

Constant iterative generational shifts put us in what is essentially a constant state of cross platform releases. Probably less work for developers sure, as they can recycle more of their shit, and basically release more of the same but only slightly tweaked or improved in terms of graphical advancements, as their games having to also run on older platforms dictates that, but that is absolutely not what I want as a gamer and consumer who wants maximum bang for buck with each of my new gaming console purchases.

To break it down another theoretical way, in terms of how much of a jump the PS5 might offer in being a proper generational leap, versus an iterative one held back by older hardware.

- PS4 > PS4K > PS5 (with PS5 games that do not need to run on on the PS4K as well), offers 6x the improvement in visuals over the PS4, and 4x the visual improvement over the PS4K.

- PS4 > PS4K > PS5 (with PS5 games that do need to run on on the PS4K as well), offers 4x the improvement in visuals over the PS4, and 2.7x the visual improvement over the PS4K.

If the PS5 is held back by the PS4K, not only will there be a smaller jump in performance from the PS4K to the PS5, but also the PS4 to the PS5. That's frankly not something I am interested in or would support, in the same way I don't like cross gen games, but don't mind so much because they usually only happen for the first year or so of a new generational cycle, during the transitional period. I'm just about ok with the PS4K, but if the PS5 is held back by the PS4K (not just during a transitional cross platform period, but permanently), I will not be buying a PS5.

Did you actually not understand a word I wrote?

Legitimately.

You want larger jumps in games every 5-6 years?

Tell me how cross-gen games at 6 year intervals will provide those jumps when the gap in tech is much wider.

You want larger jumps? Would you rather a cross-gen game be made to squeeze on PS4 when PS5 hits or fit the game on a more powerful PS4.5 when PS5 hits?

One provides a greater benefit to both the consumer and developer, the other doesn't. You will see smaller jumps from iteration to iteration but the 6 year jump will be much greater at laucnh.

How is it possible to gloss over this? How? Right after I just talked about it?

Holy fucking shit.

 

[Darryl]

I like how it destroys the novelty of consoles. So many people chose to primarily make a PS4 gaming setup thinking that it was the one and done, definitive way of playing games. No future changes no more setup needed, the best games always available. It wasn't true, obviously. The old console model is backwards and dead, and it's anti-consuner at this point.

 

[Alienous]

But we already knew that. Why would it be a surprise when Sony specifically wants to hold back PS4K to begin with? This is only largely for resolution and performance, and graphics if devs want to take advantage of that.

They aren't trying to make a brand new console with games that PS4 cant run

They might as well.

The PS4 is too popular to think that PS4K exclusive games would make a dent in the PS4's game library. It would just be a cool additional 'perk' of buying new hardware; having a small selection of titles (VR titles among them) that utilize the hardware more fully than PS4 ports will.

 

[Boke1879]

Yes, isn't that human nature? Call it envy or "ice cream" all you want, some people do feel 2nd class.
Get treat like first class it's an illusion but one illusion that so important no console maker dare to break (except Nintendo on handheld but the owned that space so they can do whatever they want)

Then that's a personal issue. and to be quite honest. At least early on. I only see Neo games being a higher framerate and resolution for the most part.Simply because the audience won't be there right away. The base PS4 model will still be the target.

 

[Neuromancer]

Depends on what you mean by "last" but that isn't even what I said.

EDIT: oh yeah I did say that. then yes, if the Ps4K launches this year then that means that Ps4 only "lasted" for 3 years.

So the iPad Air I bought in 2013 only lasted one year before Apple put out a slightly better one? I would disagree with that. Its now 2016 and I'm using it to type this message, play games and watch videos. It didn't stop being a good device just because a better one became available.

 

[xaosslug]

Can't know without asking.

His responses in that thread seemed to be in the line of thought that an incremental upgrade model was a good way to transition out of the console business. His line of thought in the OP flies in the face of his line of thought then. I'm just asking what triggered the switch.

but if OP 'changed his mind' on that very same day in that same thread, if you really wanted to know what 'changed his mind' why not read through the thread you plucked his posts from and see what's what? >_>

 

[DeepEnigma]

So the iPad Air I bought in 2013 only lasted one year before Apple put out a slightly better one? I would disagree with that. Its now 2016 and I'm using it to type this message, play games and watch videos. It didn't stop being a good device just because a better one became available.

Still using the iPad 3 (2012) here myself. Who would have thunk!?

Spoiler

And my PS4,

Then that's a personal issue. and to be quite honest. At least early on. I only see Neo games being a higher framerate and resolution for the most part.Simply because the audience won't be there right away. The base PS4 model will still be the target.

100% agreed.

There will be a few first party outliers showcasing what can be done (GoW4 and maybe a patched UC4 for framerate and 1080p multi), but adoption will eventually grow as the tools make it so.

 

[Lady Gaia]

Alright my bad. I was in the wrong for doing that.

Much appreciated. I'm not trying to be difficult, either, though it may not be obvious. ;-)

literally every playstation has seen hardware revisions but never one that affected developers, and never one that divided the install base in ANY way, shape, or form. The Ps4K will divide the install base in at least some way shape or form.

Sony seems to be going out of their way to avoid dividing developers, but the absolutely have made revisions that have affected developers. Sometimes on the hardware front as when they replaced SixAxis controllers with DualShock (and yes, it was an easier pill to swallow that you could buy a new controller but just as now you could choose not to.) Sometimes on the operating system side of things, as when support for trophies became mandatory.

Developers can choose to put very little effort into Neo mode. It's possible than 1080p games will run as-is without a single line of code changed, though it's obviously important to validate that assumption which is why existing games will run in Base mode on the new hardware. They can also choose to put in a lot of effort, just like they could with past accessories like the Move or Camera. Or the forthcoming PSVR.

Very little has changed, though I appreciate that it might not feel like it.

 

[jdmonmou]

I don't think we'll have ongoing future compatibility. Support for PS4 will be cut off at some point. My prediction is Sony will always support at least two platforms, and support every platform for at least 6 years after release. So for lack of a better term. When PS5 comes out, games of the day will play on PS4.5 and PS5. When the PS5.5 comes out, games of the day will play on PS5 and PS5.5.

It is now clearer to me what you are getting at, but I don't understand how this will remove the concept of console generations. From what you described, we will still have generations but they will be modified to "rolling generations." In this scenario, I would just buy every other PlayStation which is why I predict these mid-lifecycle releases won't sell well - especially if they sell the older model alongside it at a lower price. I still don't see the point of this.

 

[The God]

Next product hahahhahaa

You don't think there'll be another box called "PlayStation"?

 

[Sydle]

but if OP 'changed his mind' on that very same day in that same thread, if you really wanted to know what 'changed his mind' why not read through the thread you plucked his posts from and see what's what? >_>

Because it's not in there. The context was different, where he seemed to believe it was a good way to deemphasize the console business for MS. Now his line of thought is that it's a necessary change for the console industry.

I've always liked reading his opinion on things and I remember his line of thought then. It's different now (and I'll confess I've not been following every little thing he posts the last month or so) and I'm just looking for the link to connect the dots, because I'm really curious what leading factor got him to reconsider. It's way more innocent than you guys are making it out to be.

I'll just wait for chubs to help out. Thanks.

 

[wapplew]

Then that's a personal issue. and to be quite honest. At least early on. I only see Neo games being a higher framerate and resolution for the most part.Simply because the audience won't be there right away. The base PS4 model will still be the target.

I always stated I don't like this business model because Its bad for my personal preference.
Not because of second class feeling, it's the opposite, I don't want my first class games held back by second class hardware.
Back to expectation, I'm ok with PS4K only enhance a little because I expect no more. At the same time, if there is a PS5, I expect it to be real jump and have exclusive that can't be play on both PS4.

 

[the1npc]

I like how it destroys the novelty of consoles. So many people chose to primarily make a PS4 gaming setup thinking that it was the one and done, definitive way of playing games. No future changes no more setup needed, the best games always available. It wasn't true, obviously. The old console model is backwards and dead, and it's anti-consuner at this point.

what the fuck?

 

[BigWeather]

I will be disappointed if the end result of this is two (or more) versions of every game. I shouldn't be faced with buying a PS4 vs. NEO version, rather just a Playstation version that happens to run better on a NEO. You know, like in the PC space.

 

[Alienous]

I will be disappointed if the end result of this is two (or more) versions of every game. I shouldn't be faced with buying a PS4 vs. NEO version, rather just a Playstation version that happens to run better on a NEO. You know, like in the PC space.

They use the same software, I believe. So that should be the same disc.

 

[DeepEnigma]

what the fuck?

The paradigm where more options are anti-consumer, lol.

I will be disappointed if the end result of this is two (or more) versions of every game. I shouldn't be faced with buying a PS4 vs. NEO version, rather just a Playstation version that happens to run better on a NEO. You know, like in the PC space.

They use the same software, I believe. So that should be the same disc.

It is the same disc, yes. No separate discs.

You will never know 'Neo" mode inserting into your PS4, unless you browse the web to see videos and pics of 'Neo mode".

 

[Inuhanyou]

To be fair we only know this because of some leaked documentation.

That's true, but that's the only reason we know about PS4K anyway...so people who know about PS4K probably know Sony has explicit rules about not taking the PS4K's ability too far

 

[Boke1879]

I will be disappointed if the end result of this is two (or more) versions of every game. I shouldn't be faced with buying a PS4 vs. NEO version, rather just a Playstation version that happens to run better on a NEO. You know, like in the PC space.

Based on the rumors it'll be the same disc. Just a neo mode and a base mode I'm sure. All PS4 games will be playable on NEO. If anything this destroys the idea of HD remasters going forward.

 

[The Artisan]

So the iPad Air I bought in 2013 only lasted one year before Apple put out a slightly better one? I would disagree with that. Its now 2016 and I'm using it to type this message, play games and watch videos. It didn't stop being a good device just because a better one became available.

Is the iPad Air you bought in 2013 a video game console?

Much appreciated. I'm not trying to be difficult, either, though it may not be obvious. ;-)

Na you're not being difficult, you were right to call me out.

Sony seems to be going out of their way to avoid dividing developers, but the absolutely have made revisions that have affected developers. Sometimes on the hardware front as when they replaced SixAxis controllers with DualShock (and yes, it was an easier pill to swallow that you could buy a new controller but just as now you could choose not to.) Sometimes on the operating system side of things, as when support for trophies became mandatory.

Developers can choose to put very little effort into Neo mode. It's possible than 1080p games will run as-is without a single line of code changed, though it's obviously important to validate that assumption which is why existing games will run in Base mode on the new hardware. They can also choose to put in a lot of effort, just like they could with past accessories like the Move or Camera. Or the forthcoming PSVR.

Very little has changed, though I appreciate that it might not feel like it.

Sixaxis getting a Dualshock improvement didn't affect developers aside from adding rumble. It wasn't anything new, it was just something Ps3 lacked for a little while. We have at least 1 developer (some dude from Bioware) who stated for the record he ain't happy that this is happening. What we're talking about right now all is in theory though because this has never happened before.

 

[...Scatter...]

Who would want to play Knack in 2023?

Apparently more people than SFV in the UK last month :|

 

[Inuhanyou]

They might as well.

The PS4 is too popular to think that PS4K exclusive games would make a dent in the PS4's game library. It would just be a cool additional 'perk' of buying new hardware; having a small selection of titles (VR titles among them) that utilize the hardware more fully than PS4 ports will.

Again, this isn't supposed to be "new hardware", its an extension of PS4 with all of its components upgraded from all that we know, hence all the rules.

People keep ignoring that, and are acting like Sony suddenly put out what would have been the PS5 2 years into the PS4's life, that's not the case.

They are not trying to split the userbase, or have people feel like they are compelled to upgrade if they don't want performance upgrades.

Nintendo gonna Nintendo, nobody else has to follow that particular pattern

 

[Azerare]

It's still just a weird thing. I'm feel like 3 year upgrade cycles isn't enough to even draw the max potential out of consoles. In my eyes this is just sony going the apple route and trying to rake in more cash.

Though i'll have to wait and see how they truly approach and handle this. If they are reasonable with it i may invest in one at some point. If it goes down a route I do not like I'll probably go back to PC gaming.

 

[Alienous]

Again, this isn't supposed to be "new hardware", its an extension of PS4 with all of its components upgraded from all that we know, hence all the rules.

People keep ignoring that, and are acting like Sony suddenly put out what would have been the PS5 2 years into the PS4's life, that's not the case.

They are not trying to split the userbase, or have people feel like they are compelled to upgrade if they don't want performance upgrades.

I'll wait and see on that. I'd be surprised if Sony kill a selling point of expensive new hardware.

 

[the1npc]

The paradigm where more options are anti-consumer, lol.

alot of ps4 games already have bad frame rates, I feel like they are going to run horrible once "neo" is out.

If I wanted upgrades id buy a pc (and get access to mods, open market,, etc)
I bought a ps4 last summer (fucking came to $500 in canada) and now a new slight upgrade is already coming in the fall? Fuck that, sony used to be all about the 10 years of support.
Maybe if I was rich id feel different but I'm shocked how alot of GAF is stoked to drop 400-500 on a console so early into the ps4s life cycle.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Again, this isn't supposed to be "new hardware", its an extension of PS4 with all of its components upgraded from all that we know, hence all the rules.

People keep ignoring that, and are acting like Sony suddenly put out what would have been the PS5 2 years into the PS4's life, that's not the case.

They are not trying to split the userbase, or have people feel like they are compelled to upgrade if they don't want performance upgrades.

Nintendo gonna Nintendo, nobody else has to follow that particular pattern

Yep.

I'll wait and see on that. I'd be surprised if Sony kill a selling point of expensive new hardware.

They have the only selling point they need, and what is seemingly their marketing intent with the first 'rumbles of rumor'...

4K abilities for your 4K sets.

 

[hesido]

We don't know how the average consumer is going to react. If the hardcore community is any indication, the average consumers will have a mixed reaction.

I'm in the group that hates this approach, my sentiments are similar to yours (I was expecting I'd have the best possible PS until the next big thing. and some other things people are mentioning..)

But I fear that average consumer will lap this up like they do with the phones. Luckily iterative phone business have close to 0 effect on my phoning life, unlike iterative Consoles affecting my gaming life.

I do wonder how well PS4 would sell if people knew PS4 NEO was coming though.

 

[Vol5]

I am starting to warm to the idea (although I've no idea if I actually want a PS4K).

It's actually a good idea to keep the hardcore interest piqued and to keep the library fully BC for a cut down version of the same game on what will likely be a cheaper PS4. I mean if Sony can reduce the cost of PS4 to 199 and introduce the PS4K at 300 (or 350 maybe) Sony and the consumer don't really lose anything. If the PS4K flops the PS4 is still available and killing it sales wise. Sony it seems have the balls to do it and I agree with the OP that this whole thing is simply inevitable.

They do need to introduce a PS5 somewhere though. Maybe 4-5 years. Apple style. HBM10, billion transistors, etc. Product launches are a stable of any electronic outfit and is needed to keep interest and hype at maximum levels. Having a PS4K+ for example would kill the brand pretty quick imo. Plus you can't split the user base obviously. There's only so much a developer can develop for.

So yeah, was utterly against the idea at first but I guess that's just the way it is and it's kind of a win-win for Sony and the consumer. NX could rock the boat pretty hard as well, but that's a different conversation.

 

[Azerare]

Yep.



They have the only selling point they need, and what is seemingly their marketing intent with the first 'rumbles of rumor'...

4K abilities for your 4K sets.

True, sony did do that with blu-rays breaking into the scene. Though what is the current adoption rate of 4k T.Vs?

 

[Sydle]

alot of ps4 games already have bad frame rates, I feel like they are going to run horrible once "neo" is out.

If I wanted upgrades id buy a pc (and get access to mods, open market,, etc)
I bought a ps4 last summer (fucking came to $500 in canada) and now a new slight upgrade is already coming in the fall? Fuck that, sony used to be all about the 10 years of support.
Maybe if I was rich id feel different but I'm shocked how alot of GAF is stoked to drop 400-500 on a console so early into the ps4s life cycle.

They can still do that with this new model.

 

[DeepEnigma]

alot of ps4 games already have bad frame rates, I feel like they are going to run horrible once "neo" is out.

If I wanted upgrades id buy a pc (and get access to mods, open market,, etc)
I bought a ps4 last summer (fucking came to $500 in canada) and now a new slight upgrade is already coming in the fall? Fuck that, sony used to be all about the 10 years of support.
Maybe if I was rich id feel different but I'm shocked how alot of GAF is stoked to drop 400-500 on a console so early into the ps4s life cycle.

This generation has been far better on framerate than last gen... it is not even a competition. The games will perform the same, even if Neo was not coming out. PC is still going to widen the gap, and multiplats develop on PC still as well as there is another little box called, Xbox One you know.

Then don't upgrade?

Maybe some comments are also not the 'rich' people, but those who do no care, because they still have a PS4 they bought, and the software discs and games coming out are still playable on it, thus they do not let it effect them.

All other 'fears' are just unfounded yet, until Sony officially releases info, however, the documents should quell most of those, but it is all coming back to personal reasons clinging onto a unproven technical ones to justify the 'ice cream' argument.

True, sony did do that with blu-rays breaking into the scene. Though what is the current adoption rate of 4k T.Vs?

By far faster than it was with 1080p. Reason being, 1080p are now considered budget sets, and entry 4K is every bit affordable more so than 1080p was this early in it's cycle. Pretty soon they will not be making 720p anymore, and some may just drop 1080p all together as well in the next couple of years.

The choices for 1080p sets are very thin compared to their myriad of 4K choices.

 

[The Artisan]

I'm in the group that hates this approach, my sentiments are similar to yours (I was expecting I'd have the best possible PS until the next big thing. and some other things people are mentioning..)

But I fear that average consumer will lap this up like they do with the phones. Luckily iterative phone business have close to 0 effect on my phoning life, unlike iterative Consoles affecting my gaming life.

don't be so sure. i have a close friend who's a casual gamer, and last week or something when we were on the phone as I was helping him with the PC remote play (which he didn't even know about until I told him), one of us mentioned the Ps4K and he said it pisses him off.

 

[Boke1879]

alot of ps4 games already have bad frame rates, I feel like they are going to run horrible once "neo" is out.

If I wanted upgrades id buy a pc (and get access to mods, open market,, etc)
I bought a ps4 last summer (fucking came to $500 in canada) and now a new slight upgrade is already coming in the fall? Fuck that, sony used to be all about the 10 years of support.
Maybe if I was rich id feel different but I'm shocked how alot of GAF is stoked to drop 400-500 on a console so early into the ps4s life cycle.

Please tell me these games that have bad framerates outside of the GAF bubble. Because I can assure most people either don't care or barely notice them. I'd be shocked if we get games running at 15fps as some sort of norm on the base PS4. IF anything it'll be the same as it is right now.