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[Serge85]

They are shit

 

[sol_bad]

Rey is one of the dullest, most forgettable protagonists in recent memory. Wanting to find her parents was all she had going for her, across three films. Everything came so easy to her, and was able to achieve power and status right from the get go, without training, learning through failure, or experience beyond “Hurr she’s a scrapper.” Just a terrible and uncompelling character arc.

Luke’s story completely blew Rey’s out of the water. Luke in RoTJ is almost an entirely different man than the Luke in ANH. A proper, well executed arc. Whereas Rey’s was more of a character flatline. The character will have almost no legacy to leave behind.

Luke blew the Death Star up with zero X-Wing training whilst pilots who had years of experience couldn't do so.
eh

 

[Dazrael]

Luke blew the Death Star up with zero X-Wing training whilst pilots who had years of experience couldn't do so.
eh

It wasn’t impossible; he used to bullseye womp rats with his T-16 back home, they weren’t much bigger than 2 metres.

 

[sol_bad]

It wasn’t impossible; he used to bullseye womp rats with his T-16 back home, they weren’t much bigger than 2 metres.

So flying a totally different vehicle with gravity is exactly like flying in space?

 

[Madflavor]

Luke blew the Death Star up with zero X-Wing training whilst pilots who had years of experience couldn't do so.
eh

Pilots with years of experience who weren't force sensitive, didn't have Obi Wan guiding them, or had Han Solo save their asses at the last minute. The film also set up Luke being a naturally gifted pilot, and was taught how to deflect laser blasts while blindfolded in the middle of the film. Plenty of justification had been established for him to pull of this feat. Not to mention the fact that he still would have failed if not for getting help from two different sources. Obi-Wan and Han Solo.

Compare that to Rey pulling the mind trick out of her fucking ass, despite no training or education on the Force. She just knows she can do it, and how to do it. Why? Oh cause da force told her?

Sequel Trilogy was shit and even the actors know it. I promise you there were a lot of people involved in these films who knew things were fucked up by TLJ, and even more so by TRoS. You also don't need to be mind reader to see how mentally checked out the leading cast was during the marketing for the last film.

 

[cryptoadam]

Rey was given no good back story or motivation.

Just compare to Luke who starts out a wide eyed wonderkid who dreams of the stars and is forced into this adventure because his family is killed.

Rey got this lame backstory of she doesnt know her parents. And it gets retconned in the 2nd movie and then retconned and lazily paid off in the 3rd.

The actress was good in her role but her story wasnt interesting and then ruined because two directors were having a pissing match. Mystery parents is just lame

 

[borborygmus]

The actress was good in her role

Maybe if she closed her mouth every once in a while and learned how to swing a sword without looking like a 4 year old.

 

[SpongebobSquaredance]

Upon watching Episode 2 again I have to say, that the movie is full of politics, including this dialogue between Obi-Wan and Anikan.
OBI-WAN
It's been my experience that
Senators are only focused on
pleasing those who fund their
campaigns... and they are more
than willing to forget the
niceties of democracy to get those
funds.

ANAKIN
Not another lecture, Master. Not
on the economics of politics....
It's too early in the morning... and
besides, you're generalising. The
Chancellor doesn't appear to
be corrupt.

OBI-WAN
Palpatine's a politician, I've
observed that he is very clever at
following the passions and
prejudices of the Senators.

ANAKIN
I think he is a good man. My
instincts are very positive
about...

Not to mention strong roles by Samuel L. Jackson(black actor) and Natalie Portman(actress).

by the way, this one is amazing:

 

[Dazrael]

So flying a totally different vehicle with gravity is exactly like flying in space?

It was a plot device to ensure that, while already being a good pilot, he could let go of the physical laws of the universe and trust in the Force. You have to remember that Star Wars is a fairy tale and not a documentary.

Luke followed the hero’s journey absolutely fine in the originals, he endured the highs and lows of progression that Rey’s journey lacked. Luke had tutelage from the first film whereas Rey only started in the final film, some might say tutelage she didn’t even need. It all points to a direct and rushed development, to get to the characters final form in as least steps as possible.

 

[royox]

The problem is the direct pandering. For each movie I can remember:

Ep VII:
-Rey being the literal avatar of PERFECTION. Flying the Falcon to perfection (althought is the first time she pilots it or a starfighter), Rey repeating several times "I don't need help".

That were the major issues for EpVII. A lot of people will talk about how powerfull she is in the force but they don't remember 2 crucial things:
-Rey and Kylo are force connected and Rey got inside Kylo's mind. Every Force power Kylo knows Rey can also do. Rey is as Powerfull as Kylo is because of their connection.
-Rey's origin, she has to be powerful as fuck knowing the family she comes from.

EpVIII:
This movie itself was the biggest problem with SJW pandering. The whole movie is about showing how guys are useless and brainless and women have to save the day. The way women bully Poe constantly for example, or how Finn ended EpVII being a brave fighter and in ep VIII he's against a pussy that needs Rose's help for every step.

EpIX:

Trully, for me it's the redemption of all the SJW bullshit. Rose disapears from screen, Rey gets her ass beaten in every lightsaber duel and Kylo gets all the protagonism he deserved. The only big SJW pandering moments i remember were Poe screaming out loud to Rey "YOU ARE OUR BEST PILOT" (LOL, everybody knows that's fucking Poe) and the last fucking line of the movie that had absolute no fucking sense and would make the movie a bit better if they skipped it.



Taking out the SJW shit i consider The Last Jedi is overall a better movie than Rise of Skywalker...at least TLJ had a "pacing" (absurd, but still a pacing) and TROS is 3 movies set in 1 all rushed.


Going out of the Trilogy:

-Rogue One is an amazing star wars movie and has the BEST Darth Vader Scene of all times

-The last episode of Clone Wars is GODLIKE.

-The Mandalorian is the best Star Wars TV content we had since the original trilogy.

Luke blew the Death Star up with zero X-Wing training whilst pilots who had years of experience couldn't do so.
eh

From the movie itself:

LEADER: (To Luke) You sure you can handle this ship?

BIGGS: Sir, Luke is the best bush pilot in the Outer Rim Territories.

Luke already had flight experience and he had incredible good aiming (as he can hit a womb-rat from dontremember distance with a blaster). Add The Force to the equation.

What doesn't have explanation is how Rey, a teen that never piloted anything that's not a normal speeder was able to do impossible flying maneuvers with the Falcon even flying inside of the crashed star destroyer.

 

[Stiflers Mom]

That's like stating that someone who died in a horrible car crash also had cancer.
Damn, these movies are so horrible I don't know even where to begin with.

I am so glad we have proper Star Wars in the form of the Mandalorian now.

 

[Madflavor]

Does anyone remember the feeling you had when Star Wars was coming back in 2015? How amazing those trailers were? How exciting it was going to be to see Luke, Han, and Leia again?

I really really really hate these fucking movies. As much problems as the prequels had, they didn't ruin Star Wars for me. And they at least added a lot to the lore, and the setting that gave birth to some pretty damn good content in the franchise, such as The Clone Wars, and KotoR. The Sequels however, added nothing to the franchise. If anything they took things away. It made the OT heroes out to be failures. It undermined their accomplishments, and it replaced them with much less interesting characters.

No self respecting Star Wars fan should ever consider "somehow Palatine returned" as part of Canon.

 

[Dazrael]

The crappy sequel trilogy is fan fiction at the very most; it does, as others say, diminish the OG heroes accomplishments. To carry on their legacy wasn’t a particularly difficult thing to do when you look at the expanded universe. Their struggles continued but they still held their heads high and lived up to their heroic deeds.

The sequel trilogy just made them all look like losers.

 

[QSD]

Rey was given no good back story or motivation.

Just compare to Luke who starts out a wide eyed wonderkid who dreams of the stars and is forced into this adventure because his family is killed.

Rey got this lame backstory of she doesnt know her parents. And it gets retconned in the 2nd movie and then retconned and lazily paid off in the 3rd.

The actress was good in her role but her story wasnt interesting and then ruined because two directors were having a pissing match. Mystery parents is just lame

First (real) post here so might as well get Star Wars out of the way first, LOL. The backstory of the main characters is really where the sequels floundered almost immediately. Both Rey and Finn's back stories are not at all reflected in their characters. I.e. Rey was abandoned and basically lived a horrible life, yet she seems to have no attachment or trust issues, and is also impeccably groomed and well mannered. Would have been much more entertaining and relatable if she'd been boorish and filthy at first (i.e. takes a shit in the hallway of the millenium falcon because she's never used a toilet) Finn, same problem, he's been raised in an ultra-totalitarian military dictatorship as a soldier, but he asks Rey whether she has a boyfriend? What, do they do dating on an imperial star destroyer? It would have been more believable if he had been overly rigid and formal in his behaviour, and learned to loosen up by hanging with those bohemian rebels.

 

[Cutty Flam]

TLJ has the worst script of all time, especially for such a major blockbuster film

 

[sol_bad]

Pilots with years of experience who weren't force sensitive, didn't have Obi Wan guiding them, or had Han Solo save their asses at the last minute. The film also set up Luke being a naturally gifted pilot, and was taught how to deflect laser blasts while blindfolded in the middle of the film. Plenty of justification had been established for him to pull of this feat. Not to mention the fact that he still would have failed if not for getting help from two different sources. Obi-Wan and Han Solo.

Compare that to Rey pulling the mind trick out of her fucking ass, despite no training or education on the Force. She just knows she can do it, and how to do it. Why? Oh cause da force told her?

Sequel Trilogy was shit and even the actors know it. I promise you there were a lot of people involved in these films who knew things were fucked up by TLJ, and even more so by TRoS. You also don't need to be mind reader to see how mentally checked out the leading cast was during the marketing for the last film.

So you can accept Luke blowing up the Death Star due to force sensitivity but you can't accept Rey accomplishing things due to her force sensivity? Luke sat in his pilot seat without even concentrating and hit an easy bullseye, didn't fail once.
In fact, it's funny that you can accept Luke easily deflecting 3 laser blasts while blindfolded. And what was Obi-Wan's training?
"Stretch out with your feelings"
What the eff does that even mean? How does that teach him to deflect while blind folded? I mean if you are happy to accept a couple of hours of talking about the force as training ........ ok.

It took Rey 3 or 4 attempts to pull off her mind trick on the stormtroopers. And she had read about the Jedi before, she knew about them, she knew just as much as Luke did at the start of A New Hope or more.
And don't forget that she was captured by Kylo so she didn't easily surpass all her challenges in the film. Also, Chewie and Finn helped Rey in the final battle. If they hadn't injured Kylo, Rey may have lost.
The film also sets up Rey's potential with the force very early when she is very surprised at how well she flew the Falcon.

One thing people also complain about is that Rey can use a light saber really well and that it is also bullshit. Yet no one complains about how well Finn can use the light saber himself. Never have we ever seen a Stormtrooper wield a melee weapon prior to this film. All we have seen of Stormtroopers is how shit they are with guns and rifles, yet people can accept he could hold his own for a while against Kylo.
meanwhile, Force Awakens shows that Rey has looked after herself for years, including holding off would be attackers with her staff, yet it's a problem that she can use another firm of melee weapon? You can even see that she is struggling in that final fight with the way she moves.

It was a plot device to ensure that, while already being a good pilot, he could let go of the physical laws of the universe and trust in the Force. You have to remember that Star Wars is a fairy tale and not a documentary.

You said it, it is a fairy tale.
But people only like to think that about the "perfect" original film and not the sequels. Whenever the sequels are mentioned there is endless talk about things not being realistic.

 

[Madflavor]

So you can accept Luke blowing up the Death Star due to force sensitivity but you can't accept Rey accomplishing things due to her force sensivity? Luke sat in his pilot seat without even concentrating and hit an easy bullseye, didn't fail once.

Alright I'm not even gonna bother reading the rest of your post man. I gave you reasons why Luke accomplishing things through his force sensitivity in ANH was more believable than Rey's in TFA. Yet you're acting like I didn't it. I'd be happy to respond to all your points one by one, but if you're going to ignore what I have to say, then there's no point. Glad you liked the Sequel Trilogy, you do you.

 

[ricardo_sousa11]

Pandering?

That shit has been an SJW shitshow ever since they started doing these new films and series.

 

[SpongebobSquaredance]

-The Mandalorian is the best Star Wars TV content we had since the original trilogy.

yeah, great show. Can't wait for the new episodes.

 

[sol_bad]

Alright I'm not even gonna bother reading the rest of your post man. I gave you reasons why Luke accomplishing things through his force sensitivity in ANH was more believable than Rey's in TFA. Yet you're acting like I didn't it. I'd be happy to respond to all your points one by one, but if you're going to ignore what I have to say, then there's no point. Glad you liked the Sequel Trilogy, you do you.

And you're ignoring what I say about Rey......

 

[Dazrael]

You said it, it is a fairy tale.
But people only like to think that about the "perfect" original film and not the sequels. Whenever the sequels are mentioned there is endless talk about things not being realistic.

I think what people didn’t like was that happy ending from ROTJ was taken away. It made the whole of the heroes struggle redundant and left them broken. That doesn’t feel like a fairy tale at all.

The sequels also seemingly broke in-universe lore that I think you might be referring to, not realism per se. The Holdo Manoeuvre even had to be retconned to appear plausible in the last film.

 

[Madflavor]

I think what people didn’t like was that happy ending from ROTJ was taken away. It made the whole of the heroes struggle redundant and left them broken. That doesn’t feel like a fairy tale at all.

The sequels also seemingly broke in-universe lore that I think you might be referring to, not realism per se. The Holdo maneuvers even had to be retconned to appear plausible in the last film.

And I loved how they retconned it.

"We need to pull some Holdo Maneuvers. Do some real damage."
"Come on, that shot was one in a million."

Fucking how? You just point your ship in the direction of those huge ass capital size ships and go. And there's thousands of them. You're guaranteed to hit a lot of them.

 

[sol_bad]

I think what people didn’t like was that happy ending from ROTJ was taken away. It made the whole of the heroes struggle redundant and left them broken. That doesn’t feel like a fairy tale at all.

The sequels also seemingly broke in-universe lore that I think you might be referring to, not realism per se. The Holdo Manoeuvre even had to be retconned to appear plausible in the last film.

I've said this before but, yeah ROTJ has a happy ending. But on a realistic level and in terms of the EU/Legends and what happened with the current cannon. Blowing up the 2nd Death Star was just the start.
Saying the sequels ruin the ending of ROTJ is like saying Empire Strikes Back ruins ANH because that had a happy ending and it makes the first film pointless. It doesn't.

 

[EverythingsOverrated]

The pandering in the sequels wouldn't really matter at all if they were good movies, but they're not.

 

[cryptoadam]

First (real) post here so might as well get Star Wars out of the way first, LOL. The backstory of the main characters is really where the sequels floundered almost immediately. Both Rey and Finn's back stories are not at all reflected in their characters. I.e. Rey was abandoned and basically lived a horrible life, yet she seems to have no attachment or trust issues, and is also impeccably groomed and well mannered. Would have been much more entertaining and relatable if she'd been boorish and filthy at first (i.e. takes a shit in the hallway of the millenium falcon because she's never used a toilet) Finn, same problem, he's been raised in an ultra-totalitarian military dictatorship as a soldier, but he asks Rey whether she has a boyfriend? What, do they do dating on an imperial star destroyer? It would have been more believable if he had been overly rigid and formal in his behaviour, and learned to loosen up by hanging with those bohemian rebels.

I always thought Finn should of been a more fish out of water character. A mix of Arnold from Twins and the Terminator. Or maybe like a Draxs as a modern day interpretation. Like you said a military guy, but because he is out of his element there could be some comedy there. Also he should be a kick ass warior not a janitor.

Rey, having a I don't know my parents mystery backstory is just lazy and lame. Luke was wide eyed kid whose family was killed. Classic but actually interesting motivation. You can't really get anyworse then don't know who my missing parents are abandoned orphan.

 

[Hoya Destroyer]

I only saw the first two movies in the latest trilogy, but for me the SJW elements were...

1. All the central female characters were plain in appearance. You could also add an overly capable/overpowered argument to Rey and Admiral Gender Studies.

2. Finn was black. That never felt organic to me. It felt like Hollywood promoting black people as benevolent and heroic, in order to get woke points. This impression was largely inspired by his "reveal" in the first movie trailer. "LOOK, HE"S BLACK! TELL US HOW AWESOME WE ARE!"

3. No white male heroes. When I look at the real world, I see white guys disproportionately responsible for making it a better place. I expect to see that reflected in a fictional SW universe too, just because it seems more realistic and relatable to me (like it was with Luke and Han in the OT). Again, it feels like Hollywood went out of their way to exclude white men, to chase woke points and appease SJW's.

 

[Dazrael]

I've said this before but, yeah ROTJ has a happy ending. But on a realistic level and in terms of the EU/Legends and what happened with the current cannon. Blowing up the 2nd Death Star was just the start.
Saying the sequels ruin the ending of ROTJ is like saying Empire Strikes Back ruins ANH because that had a happy ending and it makes the first film pointless. It doesn't.

I see what you are saying and you have a point, but also not. ANH was, at the time, the first major victory the Rebels had on screen so it had to end in a celebration. It didn’t really change their characters though, in ESB it was just their struggle against the Empire that continued. You could make an argument that Han decided to bug out on Hoth but that thread was started in the first film.

In the sequels you have Han who abandoned his family to go back to his old ways, Luke who ran away from responsibility when the going got tough and Leia who had to pick up the pieces of abandonment and head back into the only life left for her...war. You could make the argument that anything could happen in the passage of time but none of these personality traits manifested in the original films, they go against the core ideals of the people who we were left with. And I think a lot of people have issue with that.

The difficulty is that the OG characters were so overpowering from a storyline perspective that the writers had to keep them out of the script to allow the new characters to breathe. This was confirmed with Luke who was deemed to have too much of a presence so they kept him out of TFA until the end of the film. Understandable if you want your new characters to shine but a bit of a blow to the OG characters. In the end putting the old and new together just proved a messy experience.

 

[SpongebobSquaredance]

Finished Solo now. Better than I expected to be honest. I am not happy how Qi'ra's character is ending though. Oh well, maybe it will be answered later why she did what she did.

 

[SpongebobSquaredance]

2. Finn was black. That never felt organic to me. It felt like Hollywood promoting black people as benevolent and heroic, in order to get woke points. This impression was largely inspired by his "reveal" in the first movie trailer. "LOOK, HE"S BLACK! TELL US HOW AWESOME WE ARE!"

3. No white male heroes. When I look at the real world, I see white guys disproportionately responsible for making it a better place. I expect to see that reflected in a fictional SW universe too, just because it seems more realistic and relatable to me (like it was with Luke and Han in the OT). Again, it feels like Hollywood went out of their way to exclude white men, to chase woke points and appease SJW's.

And that is why I don't take none of this shit seriously. We are at a point right now where we criticize movies for having black actors because of some "white pride". Not the performance or the plethora of problems those movies have is getting criticized, no, the fact that a black actor is playing a role in a space opera. And we are okay with this?
Anti-SJW or SJW, you both suck ass.

 

[QSD]

And that is why I don't take none of this shit seriously. We are at a point right now where we criticize movies for having black actors because of some "white pride". Not the performance or the plethora of problems those movies have is getting criticized, no, the fact that a black actor is playing a role in a space opera. And we are okay with this?
Anti-SJW or SJW, you both suck ass.

Agree completely, it's cringe. It's easily possible to imagine the original trilogy working just as well with a black Han and a white Lando (for example). Conversely, the Finn character would have been just as boring and forgettable if a white actor had played him.

 

[Tschumi]

i think an ugly asian was allowed to kiss one of the protagonists

My problem with the films was that they just weren't so good.. They were a huge hodgepodge... seemed to be a symptom of the whole team being very aware that they only had 3 films to get the formula just right and please everyone... so they tweaked... they should have stuck with the original ideas, I'm guessing.