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The Order 1886 Review Thread

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DavidDesu

Member
Still don't have the game, I need to wait a week, but I ended up watching the first 5-10 minutes of the game and I must say.. it looks pretty damn good. Really immersive and it flows well. I remember reading posts where people were absolutely livid at the QTE prompts and the camera control being taken away as short cut scenes interjected. With no context to judge those comments I thought fair enough. Having now seen that opening section I really don't know quite what some people were so up in arms about. I really don't. It makes that opening act flow really well, it definitely blurs the line between game and movie. I think you need to go in to this game expecting to be told a story, except it's one where you can partake and explore the world, and soak up, 1st hand, the atmosphere. It looks very promising to me so far.

Pointless QTE's and button prompts when you will know them off by heart do sound frustrating but these are small issues that perhaps RAD will address in a sequel or possibly better in a patch. Devs like Evolution have been incredibly responsive to user requests after the Driveclub launch backlash. Perhaps you'll get your wishes with some elements of this game.

Fundamentally though, the way RAD have chosen to tell their story and how they wish the player to take part in it works for me and I hope they carry on with a sequel.
 

AnnSwag

angry @ Blu-Ray's success
Back in November, legendary Nintendo designer Shigeru Miyamoto revealed concerns over the industry's obsession with "cinematic experience."

“These younger game creators, they want to be recognized. They want to tell stories that will touch people’s hearts. And while I understand that desire, the trend worries me. It should be the experience that is touching. What I strive for is to make the person playing the game the director. All I do is help them feel that, by playing, they’re creating something that only they could create.”

Miyamoto then elaborated:

“When you play a game, one moment you're just controlling it and then suddenly you feel you’re in its world,” Miyamoto said. “And that’s something you cannot experience through film or literature. It’s a completely unique experience.”

He continued:

“What the other companies are doing makes business sense. But it’s boring. The same games appear on every system."

That bring me to the statement made by Boss Key Productions' Cliff Bleszinski who said:

“It’s because this industry is fundamentally insecure about Hollywood and wants to be Hollywood.The only way to convince executives to release the money to greenlight productions is to do movie-like productions that impress them. That’s honestly why this stuff happens.”

That brings me to how to GameSpot's Kevin VanOrd's review of The Order: 1886:

"Boring" is the best word to describe The Order in general, actually. That this third-person action game turns a parade of steampunk imagery and Arthurian legends into a dull stew of modern games' most tiresome cliches is quite a feat, though hardly one worth celebrating. It is (as you probably guessed) 1886, and you are Grayson, otherwise known as Galahad, one of the Knights of the Round Table. It is a time of trouble: common citizens have begun to rebel against the gentry, possibly allying with a race of werewolves the game alternately refers to as lycans and half-breeds. It's a brilliant setup, ripe with possibilities. You look to the sky and see zeppelins hovering overhead; you look to the armory, and you find a young Nikola Tesla ready to introduce you to clever armaments. That such a world could be so lifeless is unfathomable.

Boring is the perfect word to describe what's happening in gaming currently; every game is aiming for the same cinematic experiences. Every game today wants you to feel something, but they end with you feeling the wrong things; boredom being one of them.

I was wondering if I was the only one that felt this way?
 

benzy

Member
Boring is the perfect word to describe what's happening in gaming currently; every game is aiming for the same cinematic experiences. Every game today wants you to feel something, but they end with you feeling the wrong things; boredom being one of them.

I was wondering if I was the only one that felt this way?

The Phantom Pain will save us.
 

Booshka

Member
Back in November, legendary Nintendo designer Shigeru Miyamoto revealed concerns over the industry's obsession with "cinematic experience."



Miyamoto then elaborated:



He continued:



That bring me to the statement made by Boss Key Productions' Cliff Bleszinski who said:



That brings me to how to GameSpot's Kevin VanOrd's review of The Order: 1886:



Boring is the perfect word to describe what's happening in gaming currently; every game is aiming for the same cinematic experiences. Every game today wants you to feel something, but they end with you feeling the wrong things; boredom being one of them.

I was wondering if I was the only one that felt this way?

This is a great post, but there are a ton of fantastic games, that focus on the gameplay, and the player "Directing" their gameplay experience. The Order actually seems like an outlier, most games are primarily about play, rather than watch.

It's more of the media coverage and budget of this game taking over the conversation. Majority of the gaming audience really care about good game mechanics, level design and replayability.

Seek out more games, less AAA cinematic, safe games. They are also usually cheaper too.
 

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Ch 15 actually contains a lot of action and gunplay with many enemies, where you're given use of most of the weapons found throughout the whole game. It wasn't drawn out, if anything it was just way too short. You sort of make it sound like all you do is run through a bunch of rooms.
It felt a bit drawn on because yet again we're fighting the exact same generic enemies again only in tiny rooms spread apart by a tunnel.
 
Back in November, legendary Nintendo designer Shigeru Miyamoto revealed concerns over the industry's obsession with "cinematic experience."

Miyamoto then elaborated:

He continued:

That bring me to the statement made by Boss Key Productions' Cliff Bleszinski who said:

That brings me to how to GameSpot's Kevin VanOrd's review of The Order: 1886:

Boring is the perfect word to describe what's happening in gaming currently; every game is aiming for the same cinematic experiences. Every game today wants you to feel something, but they end with you feeling the wrong things; boredom being one of them.

I was wondering if I was the only one that felt this way?

Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.
 

Card Boy

Banned
Stole this from the first review thread. Has anyone gotten Bingo yet?

7kPEPQ1.jpg

I think we have hit every square. No need for the free one, we might of missed LOL IGN.
 

DavidDesu

Member
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.

I think there's room for every approach. Of course Nintendo games have always been light hearted and fun, they are true games because to Nintendo their consoles are toys. That's not a put down by the way.

I think the problem with games trying to be like Hollywood is that, apart from ONE game that I can think of - TLOU, most games are on the ScyFy 'made-for-TV-movie' end of the Hollywood spectrum. They're bloody terrible, that's why they're boring etc. When games try to do mature stories they fall on their arse, and most games don't even try that because they still believe that appealing to one core market of immature teenage males is where the money's to be made. They might be right but my god it leads to some awful crap. Games should be leading the way, not just copying what they think one core market wants.

I hope there's always just fun, simple games of the kind Nintendo are experts at making. I hope there is immersive, maturely told, unique interactive stories, like The Last Of Us and beyond. I want it all. No need for one or the other :)
 

Armaros

Member
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.

Ill take Nintendo archaic design over Ubisoft's copy-paste game design with updated graphics, and generic third person cover shooters with a horribly cliche and predictable plot anyday.
 
Just picked it up a few hours ago.

First impressions are that its what I expected: a linear corridor shooter with gorgeous graphics. Hearing that it's only five hours is disappointing, but whatever. From what I've played (about an hour) I think I'll enjoy it.
 

synce

Member
I was hoping for a RE4 clone but I guess this is just an Uncharted clone? Well that's one more year I'll be going without a PS4
 
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.

This is hilarious, does one prefer to be "bored" playing a game? It seems your statement applies in that context as well.
 

Vitor711

Member
Just picked it up a few hours ago.

First impressions are that its what I expected: a linear corridor shooter with gorgeous graphics. Hearing that it's only five hours is disappointing, but whatever. From what I've played (about an hour) I think I'll enjoy it.

It's totally 7 hours on average. I'm already at 5 hours and still not about to wrap things up.

The order has a lot of problems, but length isn't the main one. I really dislike the one that's the thing that's getting the focus. I'd happily pay $60 for a great experience that was 4/5 hours long. The Order isn't that, but it seems like weird shifting goal posts. It's equivalent to Uncharted 1 or many other TPS games released last gen in terms of time to completion. The only thing it lacks is any sort of new game plus/upgrade system/collectables which are all questionable extensions to a game anyway.
 
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.

this makes no sense. of course fun matters
 
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.
Films can be boring too, he never mentioned "fun" just not being boring. But I think Miyamoto's quote is talking more about not taking advantage of the medium's unique features which are not found in film/books. You can use this for story telling an a good video game could use both narrative and gameplay to make something special.
Also, is Locoroco something with a strong narrative now? Or can you not enjoy that anymore?
 

tuna_love

Banned
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.
You are simply terrible.
 
I've playing for about 2 hours and honestly Im enjoying the game. It's definitely the most gorgeous game I've ever played. I'm enjoying the story so far as well. But I can definitely see the criticisms, the attempt to make this as cinematic as possible has a lot of downfalls. Theres just too many times were you feel like the gameplay is not real gameplay as opposed to a more elaborate "play video" button. Legit criticisms but I do not see a bad game here at all.
 
Ill take Nintendo archaic design over Ubisoft's copy-paste game design with updated graphics, and generic third person cover shooters with a horribly cliche and predictable plot anyday.

Uh Ubisoft is shit so wrong studio to compare to. I'm thinking Naughty Dog.

This is hilarious, does one prefer to be "bored" playing a game? It seems your statement applies in that context as well.

Entertainment and fun aren't the same thing. I want to be entertained.

this makes no sense. of course fun matters

I didn't say game shouldn't have fun to be good if you read my post again.

Films can be boring too, he never mentioned "fun" just not being boring. But I think Miyamoto's quote is talking more about not taking advantage of the medium's unique features which are not found in film/books. You can use this for story telling an a good video game could use both narrative and gameplay to make something special.
Also, is Locoroco something with a strong narrative now? Or can you not enjoy that anymore?

I actually found Locoroco to be boring after 5 levels. The only driving factor for me in that game was listening to the music.
 

Surface of Me

I'm not an NPC. And neither are we.
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.


Show me where Miyamoto use the word fun in those quotes? Otherwise nice strawman.
 
What do you mean by this?

It feels like a shooting gallery where you stay at one spot more often than you would in Uncharted 1 where the AI will flush you out with grenades and you'll get rushed by shotgun enemies and get outflanked, Uncharted 1 favored mobility quite a bit, I wish people who haven't fucking played Uncharted 1 would stop comparing every fucking game to it when they don't even know how it actually plays like, no it's not as great as Uncharted 2 but it ain't no Order 1886.
 

ChawlieTheFair

pip pip cheerio you slags!
It feels like a shooting gallery where you stay at one spot more often than you would in Uncharted 1 where the AI will flush you out with grenades and you'll get rushed by shotgun enemies and get outflanked, Uncharted 1 favored mobility quite a bit, I wish people who haven't fucking played Uncharted 1 would stop comparing every fucking game to it when they don't even know how it actually plays like, no it's not as great as Uncharted 2 but it ain't no Order 1886.

Ah ok.

Though I think people were comparing it to Uncharted 1 in the sense that the Order's sequel will be best thing since sliced bread i.e Uncharted 2.
 
Ah ok.

Though I think people were comparing it to Uncharted 1 in the sense that the Order's sequel will be best thing since sliced bread i.e Uncharted 2.
I really, really hope they get a second chance to get it right and actually pull it off, I've lost quite a bit of faith in RAD's gameplay design chops, they've shown they're not ND's tier in terms of gameplay, they don't quite "get it" yet, lots of room to improve.
 
This game got dunked so bad. Hard to say its undeserving of the dunking though, it seems to have all of the symptoms of what could go wrong with AAA games in this age.
 
Hah! I think Miyamoto and Nintendo's games are boring now. "Fun" is no longer the only factor in a player's motivation to play a game.

I can't get through Nintendo games or anything similar without a strong narrative or an established goal to give me a reason to finish. Fun is not enough to make me want to play.

Miyamoto's ideals are archaic. Gaming has evolved past from just being fun. Current game developers are thinking of the total experience, and I love it.

Did you even read Miyamoto's statement?

He never argues "fun is the only thing worth doing in games". He, in fact, says he's aware of and supports developers who genuinely want to deliver a touching experience, and Nintendo themselves have delved into that before. Nobody would ever argue that the end of the first chapter of Mother 3 is "fun".

What he's saying is that a lot of devs these days are churning out story driven games where there's no real story to be told. There's nothing that really impacts a player in the story despite the story being the central part of the game. Game with lots of cutscenes where the cutscenes serve no real purpose.

He's not against cinematic games, he's against them being saturated in the market with way too many games that call themselves "cinematic" yet are still largely about a dude shooting other dudes, in very shallow video-game fashion.

Your "fun" argument has nothing to do with Miyamoto or AnnSwag's post.
 

cheezcake

Member
Aw you're right, man. Miyamoto never thinks of fun in his design philosophy for the past 30 years.

If you read it a little more carefully you'd see that he said there's nothing wrong with trying to deliver more emotional experiences in games, the problem lies in game developers forsaking player agency which is the entire reason video games are a unique experience. In the end all you get is an inferior version of a movie.
 

Trace

Banned
I really, really hope they get a second chance to get it right and actually pull it off, I've lost quite a bit of faith in RAD's gameplay design chops, they've shown they're not ND's tier in terms of gameplay, they don't quite "get it" yet, lots of room to improve.

ND took a long long time to get to where they are now though. They had 4 very similar TPS games to refine the formula, Uncharted 1 wasn't exactly a masterclass of TPS design.
 
Having just finished the game I really enjoyed it. I'll be starting my secoond playthrough on hard to wrap up the trophies later today but the following are my takeaways from my roughly 11 hour playthrough one

Positives

  • Stunning art direction especially given the setting.
  • Voice acting is great. Incredibly well done across the board. Right up there with the best I've heard in a game.

  • Really enjoyed the story and it has me excited at the prospect of followup game

  • Sound direction (OST, ambient noise, weapon feedback etc) are all incredibly well done. Hands down among the best I've heard in a game.

  • Lighting and shading is way beyond anything I've ever seen in any other game. When inspecting flyers the ink and contours of said material reflect 100% realistically in realtime when manipulated by the player. The lighting is so good that I found myself gawking and screen caping even the most mundane of things (lantern on a barrel etc) because it blew my mind every single time. I have som 40 odd screenshots from my first playthrough uploaded t my twitter acct (@rexnovis for anyone who wants to look)

  • Gunplay is excellent. The shotgun and the thermite rifle are both an absolute blast to use. Also the secondary fire on the falchion that stuns enemies with a blast of air was quit fun to use on advancing enemies.

  • I really enjoyed the werewolf encounters. It managed to avoid the tendency in these games to make boss fights into bullet sponges and make them feel unique from all other encounters in the game. The half breed fights managed to capitalize on the speed and ferocity of the enemy instead of just being a big bad thing that you shoot until you die. The sort of guerrilla attack from all sides and angles aspect had me panicking to fire back. The Elder lycan fights were absolutely brutal. I do however think that they could relinquished a bit more control of the situation to the player, They still get a positive from me for not being a bullet sponge fight though.


Negatives

  • Depth of Field sometimes causes sighted enemies to appear out of focus causing them to look blurry.

  • Disorienting and seemingly unnecessary loss of camera/character control (descending/climbing ladders, intermittent short scenes that could have easily played out while maintaining control)

  • Immersion breaking button prompts. Some of them really aren't necessary. After you establish the proper button or control element to use in a situation you really dont need to constantly remind the player. Why does it need to display a symbol over ever inspect-able item instead of just a slight glow or something? It immediately reminds you "oh yeah I'm playing a game"

  • Some chapter breaks that make the story feel unnecessarily disjointed. These were especially puzzling because it just felt like the transitions were very sudden or jarring when providing just a smidge more context or a bit more content prior to the transition wouldve eliminated the problem.

  • No gun draw control. Gun may only be drawn when combat scenario starts. This is more of a pet peeve of mine. I'm the sort that likes to shoot the environment to see how it reacts so anytime I couldnt draw my gun to shoot a vase or a painting the arbitrary limitation reminded me that I was playing a game and immediately removed me from whatever immersion I had at that point.

  • Oddly reflective white areas on the eyes and lack of shaders on and around them in some heavily lighted scenes make them stick out like a sore thumb when everything else looks damn near real.


All that said I dig the game a lot. Gunplay is fun albeit hard as I tend to suck at TPSs in general but it's really the atmosphere and the story that steal the show for me. While the story is a bit predictable at parts there are some unexpected twists and the characters themselves make it for me. The use of discover-able items and sound logs to provide insight into certain characters is really well done. I specially liked the flyer where Tesla drew demon horns on Edison.

Overall the game is very indicative of inexperience thanks to some odd design decisions. But given that this is RADs first AAA title it's nothing that really surprised me. It's not likely to be anyone's Game of the Year but at the same time it's not by any means a bad game. I certainly don't think it's deserving of the reaming it's received in reviews especially since it's released with a rock solid Framerate and no glitches that I've seen or heard of outside of a friend reporting a solitary crash to system menu but that was while using the share function.

It's a shame when games that release stuffed to the gills with DLC and plans for countless more or patently broken games that don't work as advertised or intended receive stellar scores (9s and higher) while a solid contained game like this one is rated so dismally by so many. I guess maybe I just don't see eye to eye with most reviewers any more. We clearly have different priorities/desires when it comes to games. I really enjoyed the game. I'm looking forward to my second playthrough and am excited and hopeful whatever follow up RAD might have planned.

Thank you for this review. I'm currently about 2 hours into my first play through (I intended to play it all yesterday but unexpectedly had to take a break for work related reasons, so am going to finish it tonight). My feelings so far mirror yours. I'm slack-jawed at the irrational hatred this game seems to be garnering. So far I'm having fun with the game, which is really my primary litmus test as to whether its good or not. I'll report back here sometime tomorrow after I've finished my first run...but just wanted to say I appreciated your rational, positive thoughts.
 

Skux

Member
I think what happened is that reviewers finally caught on that people hated giving games bloated scores, but then overcorrected by giving this pretty good but flawed game scores that were far too harsh.
 

RexNovis

Banned
Thank you for this review. I'm currently about 2 hours into my first play through (I intended to play it all yesterday but unexpectedly had to take a break for work related reasons, so am going to finish it tonight). My feelings so far mirror yours. I'm slack-jawed at the irrational hatred this game seems to be garnering. So far I'm having fun with the game, which is really my primary litmus test as to whether its good or not. I'll report back here sometime tomorrow after I've finished my first run...but just wanted to say I appreciated your rational, positive thoughts.

You're welcome! I really do hope people give this game a go. I think many people might like it more than they thought they would especially if they are judging it solely off Youtube videos. No online media has really captured just how incredible the rendering in this game is. I've never really been one to take screenshots of games as it's never really been my cup of tea but something about the way this game handles lighting had me wanting to screenshot every little detail. Here's to hoping the reviews don't sink the game and we get to see a follow up from RAD.
 
Kinda liking the game so far, I'm taking my time and playing in short spurts, there are some legitimate issues with the game especially the pacing but some of the combat sections have been pretty good.
 
I think what happened is that reviewers finally caught on that people hated giving games bloated scores, but then overcorrected by giving this pretty good but flawed game scores that were far too harsh.
The scores really don't seem too harsh at all. I'm having a tough time thinking of a game that didn't want you to play it as much as this one.
 

Advent1s

Banned
This is the perfect game rationale that describes why graphics can only do so much with a lack of depth in the gameplay department.

I hope they continue the story with far more fleshed out gameplay, as it was just sad.
 

Binabik15

Member
Clearly Sony did NOT pay for reviews to get a lower average for The Order, putting RAD in a weaker position when Sony wants to buy them. The reviewers were played like a fiddle by Shu.

This would actually work with Japanese games and Famitsu
 

Withnail

Member
I really, really hope they get a second chance to get it right and actually pull it off, I've lost quite a bit of faith in RAD's gameplay design chops, they've shown they're not ND's tier in terms of gameplay, they don't quite "get it" yet, lots of room to improve.

Very few developers are ND's tier and it's a pretty rough comparison for a studio on their first console game. If making games like TLOU was easy then we'd be seeing them all the time. The fact is that over the PS3 generation ND went from being a OK studio to one of the best in the business. TLOU was the culmination of everything they'd learned in terms of encounter design, set pieces, pacing, multiplayer, etc etc, all of which were seriously lacking (or absent entirely) in Uncharted DF.

The exciting thing for me is the potential in this IP and the idea that RAD could be on the same trajectory. A sequel is pretty much inevitable IMO.
 

ArcLyte

Member
What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.
 

Nibel

Member
What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.

The Order 1886 has impressive visuals, but nobody will talk about it the next few months. When better looking games come out, it will be nothing more than a litte footnote in video game history, see other good-looking-but-unimpressive-games like Aquanox and bunch of others.
 
What Ready at Dawn have done is raise the bar, from a purely technical perspective, for videogame design, engineering and quality. The Order is a fucking technical marvel, and for that alone the game should have a place in video game history. The Order made nearly all other "next gen" games look like freshman year at Digipen.

I really don't find this that impressive when so much has clearly fallen by the wayside to make it happen.
 
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