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[DrFurbs]

A position in which it was subservient to an unaccountable, bloated bureaucracy? Where bailing out weaker members is the norm? The UK will simply have to learn to stand on it's own, and considering that it was the economic power of the world one century ago, it should have no problem landing on it's feet.

I endorse this!!

 

[jakonovski]

The 'Remain' campaign fucked up in large part because instead of presenting tangible positives for the UK public to get behind as to why staying in the EU would be a good thing, they instead concentrated their efforts on fear mongering about the consequences of leaving. That is just not a smart approach to sell an idea in a post-Blair UK.

Well, turns out blatant lying was the thing to do, so...

 

[Kabouter]

I don't think the EU will win a case arguing that the referendum triggered Article 50. Referendums in the UK are not legally binding, this is a very basic principle of the British constitution. So the UK has not decided to leave legally: that can only be done by an act of Parliament.

Yeah, sadly I don't see how that will work. I hope Britons pressure their government to get it over with as soon as possible to end the uncertainty.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

Yeah, sadly I don't see how that will work. I hope Britons pressure their government to get it over with as soon as possible to end the uncertainty.

I hope we pressure them not to go on, personally.

 

[LoveCake]

Spoiler alert: It can't. The referendum was non-binding on the government. The best way to look at it is that it is advisory. The British people have advised their government that they wish to leave the EU. The British government will now act on that advice as they see fit and proper to do. The member state has done nothing yet except ask for the opinion of its citizens on the matter.

I think that once negations start ahead of the Triggering of Article 50 and the UK doesn't look like it is going to get what it wants, some concessions will be made and Parliament will vote to stay as the UK currently is.

 

[LTWheels]

Article 50 actually states the following



Point 1 simply means that any member state may, according to their own conatitutional requirements, decide their future in the Union.
With the referendum (the constitutional requirement) they have already done that.

Now it's a matter of legally trying to prove if it also constitutes a "notification" as stated in point 2.

The referendum isn't the consitutional requirement. That is parliament voting on the decision. Ref is only advisory.

 

[Azih]

You see, thats the issue with this debate, the scare mongering, how do you know it will be worse ?

Cause it's not in the EU's interest to reward breakups of itself.

Also cause there will be less free movement of peoples and services by definition.

 

[RulkezX]

I think that this sums up a lot of the views of the people who voted 'Leave'.

Indeed, but its more fun for our American members and Leftist Brit members to just sling "racist" accusations and be done with it.

There were undoubtedly people who voted leave for bad reasons, but reading GAF you'd think we lived in Putins Russia.

It aims up the whole referendum though, the debate was a race to the simplest insults from day 1.

I voted remain with the rest of Scotland and it was a huge disappointment, but I really don't like this keyboard punditry labeling the majority of the country car right nutjobs, it really shows a huge lack of understanding of the reasons something this dumb could happen.

 

[IvorB]

I still can't believe this is happening. I swear if Boris becomes PM on top of Brexit then I'm done with this country.

 

[thechristoph]

Maybe if this whole deal had a more dignified name than "Brexit" it wouldn't have turned out this way.

 

[Captain AHat]

So what's the British Backup Plan? Re-engage with the Commonwealth? Perhaps get Boris to act as a Commonwealth Union New Trade agreement man or something...

No seriously.. I am heartbroken over this, I was so sure remain would win and when my other half woke me up this morning in shock to tell me leave won.. I couldn't even form a sentence properly. FFS Dodgy Dave, you and your merry band of assclowns dun fucked up good this time..

I just hope we make it through all this with as few cuts, bruises and amputations as possible and the UK survives... If not, fuck it, I'm moving to Scotland when they leave!

 

[Air Zombie Meat]

I don't think it's unfair to say that immigration was the issue that decided this.

 

[Voysa Reezun]

A position in which it was subservient to an unaccountable, bloated bureaucracy? Where bailing out weaker members is the norm? The UK will simply have to learn to stand on it's own, and considering that it was the economic power of the world one century ago, it should have no problem landing on it's feet.

Right, this is the problem. A number of UK voters still think it's 1880 and the sun rises and sets on the British Empire.

Unfortunately for the UK, it's 2016 and England has been increasingly more irrelevant since the World Wars destroyed generations of people and ruined the British economy, followed by the shrinking of the empire. The UK's relevance economically and militarily is really via the EU.

But hey, if being a marginalized and isolated group of countries is the UK's plan, Brexit made sense. I'm guessing to a lot of voters, they don't really care about being important on the world's stage. So be it.

 

[Binabik15]

German tv station ZDF has an interview with the president of the European parliament. He basically said "who is out is OUT" and emphasised that the UK would have to start negtiations from scratch. Also called out Cameron for "holding a whole hostage a second time" for his comments about having to wait after the next leader of his party being voted on.

 

[Acorn]

.

Lol tin ear trump

 

[ElTorro]

Maybe if this whole deal had a more dignified name than "Brexit" it wouldn't have turned out this way.

"Bromain"?

 

[Majukun]

I have a potentially ignorant question: how is this going to affect the rest of the EU? Is this mostly just bad for Britain or is it bad all around?

no,it' gonna effect all the europe to some degree,depends on the weight the import and export with the UK had on those economies

 

[Liquid-San]

I didn't seek anything out of the vote personally for myself. At the end of the day I am one of those working class poor people that apparently hate and despise immigrants (I don't). I don't pay much attention to immigration it has very little bearing on my life.

It simply comes down to the fact that the UK wants one thing and the EU wants a completely different thing. The UK just wants to do it's thing, flog shit and be done with it. The EU wants further integration and to be more united. There is nothing wrong with what the UK want and there is nothing wrong with what the EU want. The only way both the UK and the EU can get what they want is for the UK to leave the EU. So I voted to leave the EU.

Now don't get me wrong I didn't vote leave lightly. This is all scaring the every loving shit out of me right now. We have been in the EU for 43 years and we are in uncharted territory and yes part of me really really would like things to be back to how they were the day before the referendum. But I honestly believe the UK leaving the EU is best for both us and them in the long term.

Thanks, and I certainly hope everything will bode well. It was nice to see the train of thought that you exhibited and I hope at least 10% at the very least thought the same way that you voted. I personally believe that change is just exceedingly difficult and for it to happen in one fell swoop is what really placed the icing on the cake. Now the economy is just taking its natural course when the future is uncertain.

It also sucks that GAF, as progressive as it may be, has been childish and hurling insults all throughout this thread. It really detracts from the overall discussion at hand.

 

[kiguel182]

German tv station ZDF has an interview with the president of the European parliament. He basically said "who is out is OUT" and emphasised that the UK would have to start negtiations from scratch. Also called out Cameron for "holding a whole hostage a second time" for his comments about having to wait after the next leader of his party being voted on.

I don't doubt that the EU leaders are pissed at this. The way they deal with this will either end the EU or make the case for anyone leaving weaker.

 

[Xenex]

What's sad is that I was born an EU citizen and now it's being taken from me against my will. Fucking fuming.

 

[Acorn]

I don't think it's unfair to say that immigration was the issue that decided this.

It was the top concern and most used term during the campaigns.

 

[CitizenVectron]

Soon one Bison Dollar will be worth five British pounds and Bison didn't even have to kidnap their Queen.

Hahaha, well played.

 

[Moosichu]

A position in which it was subservient to an unaccountable, bloated bureaucracy? Where bailing out weaker members is the norm? The UK will simply have to learn to stand on it's own, and considering that it was the economic power of the world one century ago, it should have no problem landing on it's feet.

No country in the world can stand on its own.

 

[Alx]

I don't really see the point for UK to wait too long to start the procedure (unless they intend to backtrack on the exit, but that would be suicide). Cameron obviously doesn't want to handle it himself, so there may be three months to wait, but then it should be on.

 

[geordiemp]

Cause it's not in the EU's interest to reward breakups of itself.

Also cause there will be less free movement of peoples and services by definition.

Germany and France are left paying the bills.....Not happening.

All this reward and punish, my god, at the end of the day people either want to free trade or they want tariffs. And Germany will veto tarrifs as we are their best customer. The end.

 

[BahamutPT]

The referendum isn't the consitutional requirement. That is parliament voting on the decision. Ref is only advisory.

I know it was advisory, but at the same time doesn't the constitution say it MUST be used (regardless of it being advisory or final)? Meaning the Parliament couldn't just decide it without polling the nation.

 

[Daemul]

So what's the British Backup Plan? Re-engage with the Commonwealth? Perhaps get Boris to act as a Commonwealth Union New Trade agreement man or something...

No seriously.. I am heartbroken over this, I was so sure remain would win and when my other half woke me up this morning in shock to tell me leave won.. I couldn't even form a sentence properly. FFS Dodgy Dave, you and your merry band of assclowns dun fucked up good this time..

I just hope we make it through all this with as few cuts, bruises and amputations as possible and the UK survives... If not, fuck it, I'm moving to Scotland when they leave!

The one time I'm in Dodgy Dave's corner is the time his luck runs out and he actually falls flat on his face, pretty much everything has gone his way up until now. Seriously of all of the fucking times....

 

[Acorn]

What's sad is that I was born an EU citizen and now it's being taken from me against my will. Fucking fuming.

Wonder if we can potentiality leave and get some sort of eu citizenship as opposed to country.

Save my generation eu.

 

[theaface]

You see, thats the issue with this debate, the scare mongering, how do you know it will be worse ? You dont.

Uk has to pay into a club where UK, France and germany are the major contributors. Most take out.

We import from EU more than we export, so what exactly will get worse ? If there are tarriffs, then EU will pay more. Germany will make sure that does not happen as it affects them the most, and lets face it, Germany runs EU.

So how will it be worse ? If anything, being 5 th largest world wide economy, EU needs UK as much as UK needs EU.

It will find a balance when both sides want good trade, and be real, all UK ever wanted was a free trade agreements and friendships, not united states of federal Europe (but as usual nobody fuckin listens)

There are those that are vindictive, want revenge, want blood, luckily Merkel et al will be smart and not hurt everybody.

Ok, flip it around. How do you, or anyone for that matter, know that we'll get a better deal we had yesterday? Why on earth would we? If the terms of trade became more favourable upon leaving the EU, you may as well call the whole thing off and have all 28 members leave.

It's pie in the sky, and I'm still in utter disbelief that so many people were sold on an empty promise. No, actually, not even a promise. Just some bluster and hand-waving that it'd get sorted out, honest. It's the most irresponsible and unnecessary gamble I've seen in my lifetime.

Incidentally, the EU represents 57% of our trade and we represent 9% of theirs. That alone should tell you that we are not the ones in the position of strength come negotiation time.

 

[Fantastapotamus]

It's still blowing my mind what David Cameron did. He gambled away the future of thousands of people. Think about that.

 

[funkystudent]

My UK facebook pals are shockingly quiet today.

Granted 1 is a immigrant working in banking in London and the other is Scottish so they are probably pissed for very different reasons.

 

[Bold One]

It's still blowing my mind what David Cameron did. He gambled away the future of thousands of people. Think about that.

millions

 

[ISWThunder]

I have a potentially ignorant question: how is this going to affect the rest of the EU? Is this mostly just bad for Britain or is it bad all around?

Not great for the EU as a whole, especially short term, but certain members will likely benefit in the long run.

Losing the UK is a blow to the EU's negotiating ability. They are a large economy and a major target for trading partners, plus instability is always unwelcome.

The EU will likely have to take a hard line stance to preserve the union as it is. This will disrupt trade between the UK and the EU and slow economic growth, but the larger EU could insulate them from this better than the UK.

If the UK does well on its own and can work out strong trade deals, other countries are likely to follow their lead and exit the EU for economic gain. If the UK struggles, they may be forced to make bad trade deals, which will give the EU more power than before.

 

[RK9039]

It's still blowing my mind what David Cameron did. He gambled away the future of thousands of people. Think about that.

What a dodgy bastard.

 

[Acorn]

I know it was advisory, but at the same time doesn't the constitution say it MUST be used (regardless of it being advisory or final)?

No and we don't have a constitution.

 

[AndyD]

You're America and Little America like it's always been mate

Haha, this is great.

 

[Uzzy]

I think that once negations start ahead of the Triggering of Article 50 and the UK doesn't look like it is going to get what it wants, some concessions will be made and Parliament will vote to stay as the UK currently is.

Parliament overturning the expressed will of the people will certainly lead to interesting reactions.

 

[Kingpin Rogers]

Fairly proud to hear that although my grandma wanted to leave the EU she didn't vote as she felt she was too old and didn't want to vote on a decision that would affect the younger generation mostly. If only more had thought like her the outcome could have been different.

 

[Hasney]

It's still blowing my mind what David Cameron did. He gambled away the future of thousands of people. Think about that.

The funny thing is that he bet on the UK people voting for the right thing for their own situation and finances, forgetting some of the poorest people had just voted his party in that were about to cut their benefits. It was a dumb bet.

 

[Arksy]

No and we don't have a constitution.

This is false.

Edit: The UK has a constitution, it's not written down in a single document called "The Constitution" but it doesn't stop it from existing. It's just a bit more complicated than that.

 

[IvorB]

I'm hoping there will be protests, violence in the streets maybe. I'd join a riot right now. If people want to be small-minded, xenophobic, nationalist, destructive douche-bags that's one thing but when they drag me down their road to hell with them I get pretty pissed off.

 

[Joni]

What? This was a non-binding referendum.

They would be holding the UK politicians to their word about the referendum.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Excellent.

We French need to do the same : No more uncontrolled borders, no more fuarked up currency, no more dictatorship.

La France avant tout.

Like Victoria Nuland said : "Fuck the EU".

 

[sflufan]

In a speech, President Obama just emphasized that the EU remains a valuable partner to the US. It is important to note what he did not say.

Under a presumed Clinton administration, it is safe to assume that any trade negotiations between the US and whatever is left of the UK will take a backseat to US-EU agreements.

So any dreams the Leave side might have had that their trans-Atlantic cousins would naturally jump in and give this a big hug should die right now. The American foreign policy establishment is very displeased with this and will act accordingly.

 

[geordiemp]

German tv station ZDF has an interview with the president of the European parliament. He basically said "who is out is OUT" and emphasised that the UK would have to start negtiations from scratch. Also called out Cameron for "holding a whole hostage a second time" for his comments about having to wait after the next leader of his party being voted on.

Does not matter what this unelected president says, I did not vote for him and dont even know who he is.

For our way forward, Its what Merkel wants and what France wants that matters. The rest is just huffing and puffing.

 

[aliengmr]

Yeah, sadly I don't see how that will work. I hope Britons pressure their government to get it over with as soon as possible to end the uncertainty.

I mean if the uncertainty is going to be there anyway, it might be better to have a few months to let it sink in before the UK has to commit.

 

[Hasney]

Excellent.

We French need to do the same : No more uncontrolled borders, no more fuarked up currency, no more dictatorship.

La France avant tout.

Like Victoria Nuland said : "Fuck the EU".

Aw, you want us to be the 5th biggest economy again. That's sweet, <3 you France.

 

[jelly]

It's still blowing my mind what David Cameron did. He gambled away the future of thousands of people. Think about that.

Why didn't he just lie for 5 years and not do it. Nobody would care like all the other times promises are never kept. Surely he could have fought the party in fighting. What a fucking joke, pissed it all away for that.

I hope there is an eleventh hour change of heart when we find out how royally fucked we are. Do you really want to do this, no we do not. Phew.

 

[Valhelm]

What is the expected effect on the British left?

This would probably embolden Labour, correct?

 

[Acorn]

The funny thing is that he bet on the UK people voting for the right thing for their own situation and finances, forgetting some of the poorest people had just voted his party in that were about to cut their benefits. It was a dumb bet.

You're 100% on the money with this.