In case you didn't venture into the thread (I wouldn't blame you if you didn't), I called out that guy for his 'elaborate cosplay' thing. Way offensive.
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Transgaf: 'cause boys will be girls (and vice versa)
- Thread starter lexi
- Start date
In case you didn't venture into the thread (I wouldn't blame you if you didn't), I called out that guy for his 'elaborate cosplay' thing. Way offensive.
It's a little surreal posting in Transgaf after reading it for years without being a member. Some of the information that I've gleamed here has really helped me at various stages in transition.
I wouldn't mind a little advice though. At the moment I'm struggling with my voice. It's something that's been this way for several months and I never feel like I'm getting anywhere. As a last resort I'm considering going to Yeson Voice Centre in South Korea next year. For those of you who've successfully transitioned their voice without surgery, do you have any tips or personal advice? I've already scoured Youtube (starting with CandiFLA, who recommended going into Falsetto immediately and coming down from there... all that did was make my voice painful and hoarse).
It's a matter that's really getting me down, because I think a passable voice is as vital as FFS, if not more so.
I wouldn't mind a little advice though. At the moment I'm struggling with my voice. It's something that's been this way for several months and I never feel like I'm getting anywhere. As a last resort I'm considering going to Yeson Voice Centre in South Korea next year. For those of you who've successfully transitioned their voice without surgery, do you have any tips or personal advice? I've already scoured Youtube (starting with CandiFLA, who recommended going into Falsetto immediately and coming down from there... all that did was make my voice painful and hoarse).
It's a matter that's really getting me down, because I think a passable voice is as vital as FFS, if not more so.
Voice surgery is really not at all recommended! If it was really that good everyone would have it done.
Try to go up an octave at a time or just go up few octaves immediately (without going into falsetto territory) and then stick to it. Don't go back to your old voice at any point or you undo the work you are doing. Your vocal chords will slowly over months and years adapt to the new pitch and it will become normal for you. With your new range you can then go down slightly if need be until you no longer sound hoarse/strained. It seems really daunting now but over time it gets easier.
While feeling your way around your new range what you can before you start to speak (for example before a phone call), make a vibration with your throat like an nnnn, un, mmmm hmmm or an umm to see where your voice is resting at and then adjust your speech accordingly.
Best of luck!
Just keep plugging away at it and it will come.Need some opinions as to whether or not I handled this well.
Met a girl at a friend's party. My girlfriend and I both agreed that she was really attractive. Then we found out she is pre-op transexual. I'm just not sexually attracted to penises so that was that. off the table.
Had a party at my place last night and she was invited. Lots of drinking and talking, everything was going fine. She was flirting with my girlfriend the entire night and when her group of friends were ready to leave she said she would leave later. She stuck around until everyone left and that's when it happened. She kissed my girlfriend. Here's where the night went bad.
I said something like "woah!" simply because I was shocked that she outright did that. I didn't exactly mind but i knew that things could not go further. She turned and said something like "don't worry, you'll get your turn". So we proceeded to explain that we knew she was pre-op and before I could get another word out she became upset. Asked who had told us and started to cry. I explained that i wasn't attracted to penis and my girlfriend let her know that she had never been with someone pre-op and didn't exactly know how she felt about that. She tried to leave but we asked her to wait for us to get her a cab or crash in our guest room. My girlfriend finally convinced her to wait for the cab. I apologized but she seemed angry at me. Cab showed up and she went home.
this morning I wake up to a text from her friend/roommate who was also at the party asking what the hell I had done since the girl showed up at sunrise drunk and upset. i explained what happened and her friend replied apologizing for her and said she knew something like that would happen. I don't know what the means and she has not messaged me since.
I feel like a total asshole for what happened but at the same time i am not sure what i did wrong. Did I fuck up somewhere? Could I have handled the situation differently?
Met a girl at a friend's party. My girlfriend and I both agreed that she was really attractive. Then we found out she is pre-op transexual. I'm just not sexually attracted to penises so that was that. off the table.
Had a party at my place last night and she was invited. Lots of drinking and talking, everything was going fine. She was flirting with my girlfriend the entire night and when her group of friends were ready to leave she said she would leave later. She stuck around until everyone left and that's when it happened. She kissed my girlfriend. Here's where the night went bad.
I said something like "woah!" simply because I was shocked that she outright did that. I didn't exactly mind but i knew that things could not go further. She turned and said something like "don't worry, you'll get your turn". So we proceeded to explain that we knew she was pre-op and before I could get another word out she became upset. Asked who had told us and started to cry. I explained that i wasn't attracted to penis and my girlfriend let her know that she had never been with someone pre-op and didn't exactly know how she felt about that. She tried to leave but we asked her to wait for us to get her a cab or crash in our guest room. My girlfriend finally convinced her to wait for the cab. I apologized but she seemed angry at me. Cab showed up and she went home.
this morning I wake up to a text from her friend/roommate who was also at the party asking what the hell I had done since the girl showed up at sunrise drunk and upset. i explained what happened and her friend replied apologizing for her and said she knew something like that would happen. I don't know what the means and she has not messaged me since.
I feel like a total asshole for what happened but at the same time i am not sure what i did wrong. Did I fuck up somewhere? Could I have handled the situation differently?
rocketknight
Member
NoRéN;65527751 said:
She was sad and frustrated and mortified and terrified to learn that someone had outed her without her knowledge and consent and that everybody at the party knew she was trans.
I figured as much. Unfortunately, we weren't given a chance to explain that she had nothing to worry about and we didn't tell anyone as it's not anyone's business.
Shit, that thread was something else.
Princess Viola
Member
Makes me glad I generally avoid most gaming-side topics.NoRéN;65589526 said:
Princess Viola
Member
How so?
I'm still posting in topics about the PA fallout. >_<
Princess Viola
Member
Oh.
Heheh, that's why I'm glad I avoid most of those things, I tend to blow up when I'm surrounded by those types.
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
It just makes me extremely sad so I try to avoid at all costs if possible.
DJ Crimson
Banned
Yea
Princess Viola
Member
You know what they say: curiosity killed the cat.
I may just start doing that as well.
Sounds like you are getting worked up and didn't really pay attention to my post.
Why did I say that?
-because I'm not attracted to penis so things could not go any further as was clear she wanted them to.
Do you have an open relationship or something ?
-Yes
The problem wasn't simply the fact that she was kissing your girlfriend ?
-No. it's right there in the post.
Why her genitals have ANYTHING to do with that ?- because, the whole penis thing? Not into that myself.
Finally got a hold of her on the phone. Well, got a hold of her friend who convinced her to take the call. Seems like she was mostly embarrassed. I explained that she had nothing to be embarrassed about. We were just taken by surprise. Anyway, i said this was something we should clear up in person and i invited her over for dinner. She said ok and she's coming over to hang out tonight. let my girlfriend know and she seems relieved we cleared this up.
now I have to figure out what to cook(gender roles be damned) but there's plenty of time for that.
She was kissing... unless explicity said, there was nothing clear to that she wanted anything more than kisses... and if you don't kiss a pretty girl because her genitals than I can say that you are transphobic.
Unless she asks you to kiss her penis =P
DON'T do surgery.
I went to a voice therapist and she gave me lots of ways to work out my voice ... "hmmmMmmmMmmMmMmmM" and going from normal to high pitched is a good way to start ... and bizarrely, reading poetry in the hugest amounts of wrong ways is also a good exercise (like reading a sentence as a question, then the next as an exclamation than the next as a question ...)
Also, trying to focus on ending sentences going in a higher note than the rest
Unless she asks you to kiss her penis =P
DON'T do surgery.
I went to a voice therapist and she gave me lots of ways to work out my voice ... "hmmmMmmmMmmMmMmmM" and going from normal to high pitched is a good way to start ... and bizarrely, reading poetry in the hugest amounts of wrong ways is also a good exercise (like reading a sentence as a question, then the next as an exclamation than the next as a question ...)
Also, trying to focus on ending sentences going in a higher note than the rest
Instigator
Banned
NoRéN;65527751 said:
I'm under the impression that had you not known she was pre-op, this situation would have led to a threesome, right?
At some point, an unexpected penis would appear and the situation would have gotten a lot more awkward.
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
I think this is pushing it since he was just trying to avoid things building up to an even more awkward situation.
Princess Viola
Member
Okay is it bad that I laughed at these three words?
She just wanted to kiss.
To think that she wanted more than that without explicitly confirmation from the person is the same kinda of idea that leads to rape
She KNOWS that people don't take in a light way when they see the "unexpected penis", so you can't be sure if she didn't just wanted some playfull kisses
If she wanted to go for a more intimate situation you can be pretty sure that she would say this
And lets not even talk about the hipocrisy of "I can have a treesome with a person with a vagina but you can't have one with a person with a penis, even if she is a pretty girl"
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
It's just trying to prevent things from escalating, so I really don't see the problem with what he did considering he even apologized for what went on and invited her for dinner. There is no ill will here at all.
This is really needlessly antagonistic since he knows what he was uncomfortable with and just tried to avoid a situation he'd be uncomfortable with. I don't expect everyone to be comfortable with my anatomy and I wouldn't call them transphobic for putting a stop to things. I don't like males so me putting a stop to anything progressing there doesn't make me Misandrist either.
Princess Viola
Member
Because it's not hypocrisy.
Instigator
Banned
It's not hypocrisy, just a deal breaker.
No more than talking to a pretty girl and realizing she's your cousin or flirting with this hottie who later reveals she was convicted for triple homicide. These two girls didn't stop being pretty, but later revelations were too much to overlook.
It's a normal reaction.
It's not hypocrisy. Don't go there.
You did nothing wrong in this Noren, you knew what you were comfortable with and thought things might have been escalating. The faulty party is the one outing her without her knowledge.
It's not hypocritical in the least to gel with the parts you do and be put off by those you don't. Take hair on the face or legs, it's not something very many men at this present time are really conditioned to find attractive in women. Contrariwise, I've known very few women that find back hair attractive on men. Or very bushy genitals going both ways in recent times.
It's not hypocritical in the least to gel with the parts you do and be put off by those you don't. Take hair on the face or legs, it's not something very many men at this present time are really conditioned to find attractive in women. Contrariwise, I've known very few women that find back hair attractive on men. Or very bushy genitals going both ways in recent times.
He asked if he did bad.
I said he did bad because he assumed LOTS of things about her, from the fact that she wanted sex to the fact that she would not tell about her op status if this happened.
He apologized for outing her without her consent ... and that is more of a problem of the person who told she was trans than his.
He is allowed to have treesome with every genital he is happy with.
His girlfriend is NOT allowed to have a treesome with every genital she is happy with.
I think it is hypocrisy since it is a clear case of "one rule for me and other rule for you"
This has nothing to do with the fact that there is a trans girl involved ...
edit : Talking more of how wrong I think it is the "dude likes to have treesome with another girl but girl can't have a treesome with another guy" kind of idea
I said he did bad because he assumed LOTS of things about her, from the fact that she wanted sex to the fact that she would not tell about her op status if this happened.
He apologized for outing her without her consent ... and that is more of a problem of the person who told she was trans than his.
He is allowed to have treesome with every genital he is happy with.
His girlfriend is NOT allowed to have a treesome with every genital she is happy with.
I think it is hypocrisy since it is a clear case of "one rule for me and other rule for you"
This has nothing to do with the fact that there is a trans girl involved ...
edit : Talking more of how wrong I think it is the "dude likes to have treesome with another girl but girl can't have a treesome with another guy" kind of idea
rocketknight
Member
Just want to say that this is really super cool of you. You and your girlfriend seem like terrific people.NoRéN;65613331 said:
(The girl you invited over might want to know who outed her so that she can make it clear to that person that that is not at all an okay thing to do.)
Don't do this.
She's welcome to argue her position and you are welcome to disagree with it and explain why, but you aren't welcome to dictate to the other person what positions they are allowed to express.
Princess Viola
Member
Also, not trying to sound rude Platy, but it's threesomes, not treesomes.
Treesomes sound like you're having sex with a tree.
Treesomes sound like you're having sex with a tree.
Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Okay I apologise, I just feel it's wrong to try to police other folks' relationships or try to impose something that somebody else feels uncomfortable with. It happens too often to us, we shouldn't do it to others.
Princess Viola
Member
I find them to be the perfect scapegoats.
Agreed with this.
Noren is going above and beyond the call of duty here. He's good people.
Cramps are very much a side effect of spiro. I've gotten these same cramps in both legs while walking the stupid long walks i take, and I get hand cramps occasionally too which totally suck >_< Most people will need to watch there potassium intake, *BUT* also keep in mind that spiro is a (potassium-sparing) diuretic, and if you're literally pissing all the time, you're losing a lot of other electrolytes too. My sodium levels have just been below the normal range the past three times I got blood work, and I think that's been causing my hand cramps.
All in all, don't consume too much potassium, and make sure your other electrolytes are within their normal levels too (and honestly, you can (maybe should?) splurge on salt a little. you're gonna pee out the sodium anyway, assuming your blood pressure is under control).
... on checking the nutritional information for pistachios, jesus christ, they have 1042 mg of potassium per 100g serving (22% of the RDA). Yeah, totally cut back on the pistachios. Jesus.
(can I suggest sunflower seeds, in shell instead? they take tons longer to eat because of unshelling, and they've got a tons of fiber)
Thanks for the laugh, Platy. not sure if it was just white-knight type stuff or maybe english isn't your forte and it led to misinterpretations but your posts put a smile on my face.
Finally, an update.
So, she showed up yesterday. We had dinner first before getting to the subject of the other night. When we did start talking about it, my girlfriend and I both apologized if we made her feel embarrassed, upset, or uncomfortable in any way. i explained that it was a difficult situation we were in and if it wasn't for the fact that we knew about her being post-op, the situation could have possibly continued and led to an even more compromising and awkward situation for all of us.
She's shown interest in the past as she knows about our open relationship but she has never been been forward with advances. So i asked why she had been that night and she teared up a bit and proceeded to explain.
See, everyone we hang out with, our friends and acquaintances, all know each other previously. Most graduated for the same college so they all known each other for at least 8 years, her included. We only entered the group a couple of years ago after running into a one of them who I knew from high school. So, we are definitely new to the group. She said that us meeting her and not judging in any way meant very much to her. We met her as the person she is now, someone who's outer appearance finally matches who she has always been all along. Us seeing her as a woman and not suspecting a thing was a sort of victory for her. While hanging out more and more and getting to know each other she said that she started to develop a crush for me. She said we made her feel attractive and confident and she enjoyed that. Unfortunately, her judgment was not the best while drinking and she apologized for what happened. She understood that she had placed herself in a possibly dangerous situation as had I not been such an understanding person who knows what could have happened or how I would have reacted.
Once again i reiterated that she had nothing to apologize for and my main concern was that previous to that night, her and my girlfriend had been getting along great. At bars they would spend most of the night talking and dancing. it would be a shame to lose someone whose company my girlfriend enjoys so much.
Then came the obvious question: who told us?
It happened about a month ago at a bar. Her and I were in the patio area talking. She left with my girlfriend to dance and that's when this guy, a coworker and former roommate of one of the guy's there, approached me. This guy has always seemed like an asshole to me and this night was no different. he said something like "So, you two seem to be getting along REALLY well, huh". As i replied with "yeah, she's really great" he snickered. I looked at him a bit confused when he approached me close and said "She's got a cock, dude. Not much of a 'she' if you ask me"
turns out this guy was their roommate for a while. They became really close but he started developing feelings for her. They were so close in fact that eventually she confided in him about her being transgender. How did he react? He stopped talking to her and moved out the following month. Real great person that guy!
we got all that out of the way and reassured her that we had told no one about her or what happened the other night as it's no one's business. She was happy and thanked us. Once everything was good we called up some of our friends and had ourselves a little get together. Later that night when when everyone started to leave her car wouldn't start. i jumped it and it died shortly after. Turns out her alternator was bad. My girlfriend offered her the guest room and I would fix her car in the morning. She accepted and we all spent the entire night talking. it was great. Around 7am I cooked us up some breakfast and then headed over to a local car parts shop. Bought the alternator and installed it. She tried to pay me but I declined and just asked her to not be a stranger. She left a little while ago and sent my girlfriend a text when she was home.
Definitely a first for us with that type of situation. But, we got to know an amazing person and made a good friend. Now if you will excuse me, my dogs demand they be walked.
Finally, an update.
So, she showed up yesterday. We had dinner first before getting to the subject of the other night. When we did start talking about it, my girlfriend and I both apologized if we made her feel embarrassed, upset, or uncomfortable in any way. i explained that it was a difficult situation we were in and if it wasn't for the fact that we knew about her being post-op, the situation could have possibly continued and led to an even more compromising and awkward situation for all of us.
She's shown interest in the past as she knows about our open relationship but she has never been been forward with advances. So i asked why she had been that night and she teared up a bit and proceeded to explain.
See, everyone we hang out with, our friends and acquaintances, all know each other previously. Most graduated for the same college so they all known each other for at least 8 years, her included. We only entered the group a couple of years ago after running into a one of them who I knew from high school. So, we are definitely new to the group. She said that us meeting her and not judging in any way meant very much to her. We met her as the person she is now, someone who's outer appearance finally matches who she has always been all along. Us seeing her as a woman and not suspecting a thing was a sort of victory for her. While hanging out more and more and getting to know each other she said that she started to develop a crush for me. She said we made her feel attractive and confident and she enjoyed that. Unfortunately, her judgment was not the best while drinking and she apologized for what happened. She understood that she had placed herself in a possibly dangerous situation as had I not been such an understanding person who knows what could have happened or how I would have reacted.
Once again i reiterated that she had nothing to apologize for and my main concern was that previous to that night, her and my girlfriend had been getting along great. At bars they would spend most of the night talking and dancing. it would be a shame to lose someone whose company my girlfriend enjoys so much.
Then came the obvious question: who told us?
It happened about a month ago at a bar. Her and I were in the patio area talking. She left with my girlfriend to dance and that's when this guy, a coworker and former roommate of one of the guy's there, approached me. This guy has always seemed like an asshole to me and this night was no different. he said something like "So, you two seem to be getting along REALLY well, huh". As i replied with "yeah, she's really great" he snickered. I looked at him a bit confused when he approached me close and said "She's got a cock, dude. Not much of a 'she' if you ask me"
turns out this guy was their roommate for a while. They became really close but he started developing feelings for her. They were so close in fact that eventually she confided in him about her being transgender. How did he react? He stopped talking to her and moved out the following month. Real great person that guy!
we got all that out of the way and reassured her that we had told no one about her or what happened the other night as it's no one's business. She was happy and thanked us. Once everything was good we called up some of our friends and had ourselves a little get together. Later that night when when everyone started to leave her car wouldn't start. i jumped it and it died shortly after. Turns out her alternator was bad. My girlfriend offered her the guest room and I would fix her car in the morning. She accepted and we all spent the entire night talking. it was great. Around 7am I cooked us up some breakfast and then headed over to a local car parts shop. Bought the alternator and installed it. She tried to pay me but I declined and just asked her to not be a stranger. She left a little while ago and sent my girlfriend a text when she was home.
Definitely a first for us with that type of situation. But, we got to know an amazing person and made a good friend. Now if you will excuse me, my dogs demand they be walked.
NewGamePlus
Member
That's sort of the great thing about insecure people isn't it? They'll try to justify their opinions by talking to others. So if coming out to someone goes poorly, you've usually just inadvertently come out to like four people whom you probably don't even know.
Oh and by great I meant terrible.
Oh and by great I meant terrible.
Voice surgery is really not at all recommended! If it was really that good everyone would have it done.
Try to go up an octave at a time or just go up few octaves immediately (without going into falsetto territory) and then stick to it. Don't go back to your old voice at any point or you undo the work you are doing. Your vocal chords will slowly over months and years adapt to the new pitch and it will become normal for you. With your new range you can then go down slightly if need be until you no longer sound hoarse/strained. It seems really daunting now but over time it gets easier.
While feeling your way around your new range what you can before you start to speak (for example before a phone call), make a vibration with your throat like an nnnn, un, mmmm hmmm or an umm to see where your voice is resting at and then adjust your speech accordingly.
Best of luck!
Thanks both of you for the advice. I've seen a voice therapist a couple of times (Ibeen practicing for months before I'd seen her). I know I shouldn't be focusing on pitch as much as resonance, but I find it really difficult squeezing my throat and developing my head voice. Even when it feels like it's there, I still sound male. I'll keep practicing and take on board what you've said. : )
Princess Viola
Member
hold on should i start working on my voice?
i mean, what's a good time to really start working on that?
i mean, what's a good time to really start working on that?
Like everything trans, as soon as you feel confortable with it
Princess Viola
Member
i ain't in college
Princess Viola
Member
well yeah i'm only 16 and probably won't ever start therapy for awhile
Viola of the Abyss
Member
This is exactly the same things my parents said when I told them.
To which I mentally replied "Yeah, like I'd be ever get caught by you".
I can only speak about my personal (and fairly recent) experience, but I always felt as my womanly side was something I'd need to hide, due to both fear of what my parents would think/react and social pressure. So I guess it's pretty normal, things should get better with time.
Also... um... as this is my first post here... Hello TransGAF!
And just so you know it this is all your fault,
thank