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[Dan Yo]

e) feeling that I look like a guy

Don't even think about it. Men and women are extremely similar-looking creatures. Sure, they've tried to separate themselves through the use of differing styles and deciding on what is acceptable for either sex, but by and large, if you take any woman and tell them no make up, no shaving, no tweezing, no plucking, and no letting her hair grow long .... put them in some baggy clothes, send them out a month later, and everyone will think she's a boy.

The thing that makes women so different-looking from men is largely a social construct.

 

[Alfarif]

Don't even think about it. Men and women are extremely similar-looking creatures. Sure they've tried to separate themselves through the use of differing styles and deciding on what is acceptable for either sex, but by and large, if you take any woman and tell them no make up, no shaving, no tweezing, no plucking, and no letting her hair grow out. Put them in some baggy clothes and send them out a month later and everyone will think she's a boy.

The thing that make women so different-looking from men is largely a social construct.

This is beyond true. One of my best friends used to say that she looked like a boy in the morning... and she did. She looked like a boy who hadn't yet hit puberty, and the only reason she looked that young is because she did tweak and shave and do her hair and what have you.

 

[EatChildren]

The thing that make women so different-looking from men is largely a social construct.

Pretty much this. While there are certain physical traits that do seperate the two, they're nowhere near as impactful as the cultural perception of how each sex should look. And really, that boils down to masculinity vs. femininity, or specifically how society sees each.

I had a conversation with my friend a couple of weeks ago regarding this, and specifically trans gender issues. We came to the conclusion it should be less about feeling secure with the social perception of what is feminine, and more about feeling a personal femininity, specifically feeling you are a woman.

Its silly to try and convince the world you're something, since the world rarely gets it right anyway. Convince yourself and from then on smooth sailing.

 

[Majmun]

I knew I was due for a bad day after my day yesterday.

I went to a salon to get my eyebrows shaped and the girl knew I was trans. While waxing my brows she commented on how tall I was and how that wouldn't help me pass, how frizzy my hair was, how odd my voice was and basically all the confidence I got from yesterday has evaporated.

Further to that, my landlord contacted me and is wanting me out. No job means falling back on the rent.

And I HATE my FUCKING voice and want to see a vocal therapist.

Going to the salon before paying the rent?
You're definitely a woman.

 

[Dan Yo]

And I don't understand why someone would enjoy being pre-op trans

I see nothing wrong with it. The surgery isn't perfect. It will sort of mutilate the crotch area into the doctor's idea of what a vagina should look like. There is nothing wrong with someone wanting to keep what they have, being able to enjoy having sex with what they have, and still being happy in knowing that whether or not they have ovaries or a vagina, that they know who they are either way. Someone shouldn't have to go through a cosmetic surgery to feel like themselves or to feel like they'll be loved. The right person will love you regardless.

 

[NewGamePlus]

Wow lots of new people have posted. Hiiiii everybody. Thanks for your stories and support.

The thing that make women so different-looking from men is largely a social construct.

I agree that lexi and Jamie don't need to worry as much because they are teh hotness. But it is a little harder going in the reverse of what you said. Wearing tighter more revealing clothing can often accentuate one's broad shoulders or nonexistent hips. In line with what you said though, I would definitely say the most important part isn't purely looks but speech and movement (as I'm sure the girls itt are already hyper-aware). Listening to how someone talks (resonance, pitch, word choice) and seeing someone's body language (walking, sitting, flirting ) tends to be what really sends those 'boy or girl' signals to your brain.

We came to the conclusion it should be less about feeling secure with the social perception of what is feminine, and more about feeling a personal femininity, specifically feeling you are a woman.

I totally agree with this. Like I said before, I'm transitioning for me, and to be comfortable with myself. Though it does help when others agree with your perception of yourself.

 

[Dan Yo]

Wearing tighter more revealing clothing can often accentuate one's broad shoulders or nonexistent hips.

I've seen plenty of women with broad shoulders or no hips just as I've seen the opposite with guys. It really is nothing to be ashamed of.

 

[Shurs]

If anyone's reading this who hasn't posted yet, would you? Even if you don't have anything to say just write "Hi" or something. It would totally make my day.

Just wanted to throw my support in for Transgaf. I find your courage admirable.

 

[NewGamePlus]

I've seen plenty of women with broad shoulders or no hips just as I've seen the opposite with guys. It really is nothing to be ashamed of.

I knnooooowwww, but, but, it's like, it's like *sigh*… you know? (Thank you)

Just wanted to throw my support in for Transgaf. I find your courage admirable.

Hiiiiiii!

 

[Fox the Sly]

Hi.

 

[lexi]

Hello.

 

[Suairyu]

Hi. (lurking, show my support blah blah blah)

NewGamePlus (and anyone else), here's a question in reference to broad shoulders woes: transgender itself as a concept (rather than, I assume for most, as a reality), in many ways flies in the face of traditional, often incorrect gender stereotypes. As an intellectual exercise (as no amount of thinking will change how you instinctually, actually feel about the topic), do you sometimes feel at odds, or feel like you should be at odds, with trying to be as close to what you perceive to be the genetic average of female physiology?

 

[NewGamePlus]

Hi. (lurking, show my support blah blah blah)

NewGamePlus (and anyone else), here's a question in reference to broad shoulders woes: transgender itself as a concept (rather than, I assume for most, as a reality), in many ways flies in the face of traditional, often incorrect gender stereotypes. As an intellectual exercise (as no amount of thinking will change how you instinctually, actually feel about the topic), do you sometimes feel at odds, or feel like you should be at odds, with trying to be as close to what you perceive to be the genetic average of female physiology?

Not personally. You can tell a genetic girl that she shouldn't be jealous of supermodels, but she's still going to be. And while transgenderism may in some ways fly in the face of the social constructs of gender, it doesn't change the fact that there is normally a difference between sexes (however small they may be ).

 

[Jamie xxoo]

I see nothing wrong with it. The surgery isn't perfect. It will sort of mutilate the crotch area into the doctor's idea of what a vagina should look like. There is nothing wrong with someone wanting to keep what they have, being able to enjoy having sex with what they have, and still being happy in knowing that whether or not they have ovaries or a vagina, that they know who they are either way. Someone shouldn't have to go through a cosmetic surgery to feel like themselves or to feel like they'll be loved. The right person will love you regardless.

Hi Dan. I just wanted to address this. Before I start it *always* seems to be a "Dan" who I end up having this conversation with! There must be something about that name and acceptance of women with male genitalia. I think you're the third I've encountered!

I know there's nothing WRONG with it, that's why I wrote "I fully respect that people have different relationships with sex and with their body to me and that what's right for me may not be right for them." I just don't personally "get" how being in this situation of having the wrong genitals isn't a source of constant anxiety for people who want to live with it permanently, or how sex is good with it. It's outside of and in contrast to my experience. Hell I'm avoiding having a shower and getting ready for my niece to come over and be babysat right now because I don't want to face the shower (I do this every morning). (Edit: wrote this part this morning, it's hours later now).

"Mutilate" is a strong word to use but that's pretty much what all cosmetic surgery and body modification (even ear-piercing) is - controlled mutilation. You could even say removing tonsils is mutilation. The word carries moral connotations though that condemn the practice, and I don't agree with the use of the word for that reason. Current technology for sexual reassignment surgery for women is amazing btw, you'd need to be a gyno and use a speculum to be able to tell the difference with the latest techniques. I don't want to get into that subject though - talking about genitals isn't my thing. Suffice to say that you don't end up with a mutilated-looking crotch (once healing has taken place anyway.)

As for the right person loving you regardless, if that was the only reason to have the surgery - to have a boyfriend - you'd be having it for the wrong reason. It needs to be about how you feel towards your body, not making other people happy.

Having said all that, I love that there's people who feel I am fine just the way I am though. Feels good man. =P

Re: men and women looking more similar than you'd think - since starting this "journey" (hello cliche) I have discovered just how HAIRY genetic women are and how much maintenance they do. (Not ALL women of course but many.) OMG. And you're right, many women look like boys or men without their hair, makeup, plucked eyebrows, waxed arms and legs etc. The reverse isn't often true though, although there was a guy who posted a pic of himself in drag in the post pics thread who I thought looked better than any of us, and he didn't (I presume) have the benefit of hormones to help him. Jerk. (kidding)

I also find voice and movement or "presence" are really huge indicators so someone who looks very masculine even after hormones can still be very accepted as a woman. I had a problem with a bank teller last month who wouldn't believe my ID and when we had it sorted out he told me it was because my voice sounded like a woman's (he then asked me for tips on how to change from being a bass to a tenor so he could sing high parts in his choir lol). To him it was a stronger indicator than my ID.

Actually, there's more to it. I consider myself to be very tolerant and open-minded, but I've always wondered how would I react if I discovered that the girl I liked or was attracted to was transgendered. To be honest I was afraid that it would dramatically change how I felt. Hopefully my experience from "Post new pics" thread is an indication that I'm man enough to handle such a situation in real life

a/s/l? :lol

it should be less about feeling secure with the social perception of what is feminine, and more about feeling a personal femininity, specifically feeling you are a woman.

I so agree (and wow you're insightful for a cisgender (non-trans) guy who hasn't lived the experience himself).

NewGamePlus (and anyone else), here's a question in reference to broad shoulders woes: transgender itself as a concept (rather than, I assume for most, as a reality), in many ways flies in the face of traditional, often incorrect gender stereotypes. As an intellectual exercise (as no amount of thinking will change how you instinctually, actually feel about the topic), do you sometimes feel at odds, or feel like you should be at odds, with trying to be as close to what you perceive to be the genetic average of female physiology?

I'm not sure I understand the question. Just for myself I feel like I was born a girl with a genetic defect. All I'm doing is trying to overcome the effects of that defect. So it's not at odds with anything for me to try and look like any other woman - I consider my body to be a woman's body that was disfigured by a genetic defect that produced chromosomes which in turn created primary and secondary sexual characteristics that are at odds with my personality/feelings/spirit/brain-wiring/whatever. Does that make sense?

Sometimes it's hard to know where gender dysphoria stops and body dysmorphia starts though (i.e. being within female norms but still not liking a body part).

Phew. It's hard to keep up with this thread when you live in a different time zone and all the action is happening while you sleep!

 

[lexi]

In accordance with my good day / bad day chronology lately, today didn't have the best start. I had to ONCE AGAIN and hopefully for the last time tend to some business from my former job with a client.

So I walk in and one of the guys goes 'Hey *insert old name here*' Like nothing was up at all. I mean this guy couldn't be more aloof if he TRIED. I hate this! HELLO! I have boobs! What the fuck is wrong with you? *sigh*

I am totally failing at being full-time, I look exactly like I used to to the point where somebody doesn't even realize. If I showed my drivers' license you would immediately know it was the same person.

 

[Suairyu]

So I walk in and one of the guys goes 'Hey *insert old name here*' Like nothing was up at all. I mean this guy couldn't be more aloof if he TRIED. I hate this! HELLO! I have boobs! What the fuck is wrong with you? *sigh*

I am totally failing at being full-time, I look exactly like I used to to the point where somebody doesn't even realize. If I showed my drivers' license you would immediately know it was the same person.

Is it possible that they're making an effort to show that the transition doesn't bother them? Because that's probably how I'd be acting, to be honest, terrible jokes depending on how well I knew the person aside.

 

[Jamie xxoo]

A lot of people (when they have always known you as a guy) will pretend it's not happening because they don't know how to deal with it. They figure you can live the way you want and it's none of their business and that they're going to treat you as per usual - it's respectful.

He's used your old name because as far as he knows it's the only one you have! In this situation you might say "actually it's Lexi now," and that opens things up for him to ask questions or comment if he wants to - but not everyone will. When I went to work as a girl for the first time 99% of people said nothing and just kept on being normal around me like they always had. I was already known as Jamie at work for a year before I transitioned so I didn't have naming issues but if I had changed my name I'm sure I would have gotten my old name from a few people before I told them my new one. Not everyone is going to treat you like a revelation and make a fuss. You shouldn't expect them to. You also shouldn't expect to be unrecognizable from your old self. It's just physically impossible for there not to be similarities.

And Lexi - please stop freaking out and judging your whole presentation on these isolated incidents. You keep on swinging from knowing you're totally passable when a guy smiles at you to being 100% convinced you're failing at full-time when something like this happens. It's unhealthy and I'm worried that you're going to play up these anxieties to an extent where they cripple you totally. Try to keep it in perspective. People will react differently, people will see you differently, this is totally normal 3 or 4 months into transition. You can't expect to have testosterone in your system for 10 years and to walk around acting and looking like a guy your whole life, to be known by people in that context, and for them to automatically just see you as a woman after 4 months of estrogen with no conversation about what's happening. I think you've gone into this expecting the change to be instant, but that's unrealistic.

 

[lexi]

Cool heads prevail again. Thank you Jamie, I really need to stop having a meltdown every time something totally minor happens. I also let a minor experience like that detract from the much nicer one I neglected to mention at the same place.

While one guy there just didn't react at all, the other much younger guy (19-21ish who looked like a young Nick Frost) was nearly falling over himself and talking in that raised voice guys do when they're trying to be nice to a girl.

 

[Shurs]

the other much younger guy (19-21ish who looked like a young Nick Frost) was nearly falling over himself and talking in that raised voice guys do when they're trying to be nice to a girl.

Tall girls are hot.

Edit: I can't believe I'm dealing in generalizations, even if they're positive. What I could have more eloquently was that tall, thin girls catch my eye immediately. You have that going for you.

 

[lexi]

Thanks Shurs.

 

[Alfarif]

Cool heads prevail again. Thank you Jamie, I really need to stop having a meltdown every time something totally minor happens. I also let a minor experience like that detract from the much nicer one I neglected to mention at the same place.

While one guy there just didn't react at all, the other much younger guy (19-21ish who looked like a young Nick Frost) was nearly falling over himself and talking in that raised voice guys do when they're trying to be nice to a girl.

Yup. We do this because we want the ladies to know that they are special and delicate flowers.

 

[NewGamePlus]

Yup. We do this because we want the ladies to know that they are special and delicate flowers.

Really I thought it was because your voice is forced into your head while your blood is traveling south.

 

[Alfarif]

Really I thought it was because your voice is forced into your head while your blood is traveling south.

There's quite a bit of that too, but I was trying to make it sound good.

 

[Jamie xxoo]

Ugh. Dilemma.

I was just on the phone to the department of Births Deaths and Marriages (BDM). I've been trying to organize my new birth certificate in my girl-name for 8 weeks now. Last week they sent a letter to me saying I forgot to include my original birth cert with the name change paperwork, and that they couldn't issue a new one without it, so I set my original birth certificate back (after spending 2 days looking for it) by registered mail.

I rang the next day to see how long the extra delay caused by this would be - another 7 weeks.

So I've sent them an application to make it urgent with credit card information to pay the additional fee. I just called then to make sure they got it.

No they haven't. There is a delay in receiving the email, forwarding it to the right person and having the application considered. I should call back Thursday. I got a reference number.

So the problem is I'm flying to Thailand on May 17 for facial feminization surgery. The operation is paid for and I can't change the date (and I don't want to move it back anyway I can't wait for it). Right now I have a passport in a male name with a picture from 3 years ago that looks nothing like I do now. Even less after the cosmetic surgery I'm getting, so flying back will be even more awkward with customs. If I try to use that male passport to fly I'm going to have all sorts of issues with people not believing it's my ID at the airport - I have enough problems with the bank using my driver's license as ID.

So I need a new passport, but I can't apply for one until I get my birth certificate, and I can't book my tickets without the passport I am going to use with the right name on it.

So I don't know how long to wait to see if BDM gets their act together and sends me a certificate before making a decision about whether to get a new passport and then to book the tickets, or whether I should just get a ticket now with my old passport and just deal with using this male passport. Maybe I could take a letter from my psych about being trans and some other ID to back me up at customs. A friend of mine did this and was held up in customs for ages in Australia both going out and in (Thailand gave her no problems). She ended up having to use a male voice to convince them.

How much time should you give it before you book airline tickets to go overseas? I was going to ring a travel agent on Thursday after I speak to BDM and have a better idea of time frames, but what do you guys think?

Being trans sucks. Oh and don't even get me started about fears of body-scanners at the airport. I know they were trialing them for a month in Feb/March in Bangkok. I don't think I could take the humiliation.

 

[NewGamePlus]

Eek, I'm probably not the best person to listen to with this type of thing, but you could probably wait till Thursday at least right? That way you might know if it's even feasible or not to get the new birth certificate in time. Do you know how long it would take to get a new passport after that?

 

[wRATH2x]

Why the surgery? I don't think you really need it.

 

[Jangaroo]

Why the surgery? I don't think you really need it.

Yeah I agree, I seriously don't think you need that kind of surgery. If you really feel like you need it, than go for it, it's only our opinions, but I'm sure I'm not the only one here who feels that that'd be unnecessary.

 

[NewGamePlus]

Haven't we had this conversation before? I think we should be supportive Jamie's decision. I don't want to speak on her behalf (or like she's not here, sorry), but based on her posts, FFS could bring a much wanted and needed peace of mind.

 

[lexi]

Jamie, if you take supporting documentation and a letter from your therapist you will be fine, aside from the indignity associated from the customs monkeys.

 

[thescience]

Holy shit. Let me just start by saying, I moseyed into this thread because my GF is reading a book about a transgender male made female at birth, then turned back to male later. This all made me really curious, and I stumbled in here and have read a bit. The amount of shit some of you put up with everyday is crazy, hopefully all of this sort of fades away in the coming years, and remember you are helping pave the way for the future treatment of transgendered individuals. You have my full support, and I applaud you for jumping so many hurdles, you have accomplished so much just by being here talking about it, posting pictures of yourselves, etc., it's all very admirable, and takes a lot of courage.

K, now that that's out of the way. It also happens to be that I saw this thread after having browsed through that "post pictures now" thread. I'm gonna tell you honestly, as a straight male, I was totally fooled, and totally surprised when I hopped into this thread. Lexi, I'm gonna tell you just what I naturally thought when I saw your photo (in the other thread) in my head was "Woah, I didn't know there were hot gamer moms on neogaf" :lol . Jamie, well, like everyone else, I thought you were just a regular, average, run-of-the-mill babe like I see on the streets. This is probably the highest compliment I can pay you two, you both surprised me. Just wanted to share this experience with you, as a relatively new neogafer, I don't know what's going on behind the scenes anywhere.

 

[lexi]

Mom!? I'm 26! :lol

Thank you though! *hugs*

 

[thescience]

Mom!? I'm 26! :lol

Thank you though! *hugs*

Well, young mom of course!

Back story: I have a friend that is a mom that looks like you. Totally subconscious thing. Just wanted to tell you my completely candid thought.

 

[NewGamePlus]

I moseyed into this thread because my GF is reading a book about a transgender male made female at birth, then turned back to male later.

Would that book be Middlesex?

 

[Jamie xxoo]

Eek, I'm probably not the best person to listen to with this type of thing, but you could probably wait till Thursday at least right? That way you might know if it's even feasible or not to get the new birth certificate in time. Do you know how long it would take to get a new passport after that?

I'm definitely waiting until Thursday. I just have a feeling they're going to tell me to ring back again the next week. I'm wondering how long I should let this go on before I give up and go buy a ticket.

Thanks to those who say that I don't "need" it, and thank YOU thescience. I know strangers see me as female in day-to-day life, or near enough female that they'll treat me as such. I know I don't need the surgery for other people to accept me. I just want it to help me accept myself, really.

 

[thescience]

Would that book be Middlesex?

She was explaining to me the premise of the book, and I honestly didn't even bother to ask the title. She is not here right now, so I can't verify the name. That is definitely not the book though, since that book, middlesex, is (sort of) fiction, and he was born a female. The book my GF is reading is non-fiction, about a man who was born a male twin, his circumcision was botched though, and they just castrated him and transformed his genitals. The family raised him as a female though, and brought in some experts to help raise him as a female, and it is horrible what he went through with the "therapist", and was a troublesome child. He later grew up and came into himself and decided he was male, so he then had surgery to change back to male, even though he grew up female. Really interesting story, will have to get back to you on that name.

 

[NewGamePlus]

I'm definitely waiting until Thursday. I just have a feeling they're going to tell me to ring back again the next week.

Well I hope it actually works out.

She was explaining to me the premise of the book, and I honestly didn't even bother to ask the title. She is not here right now, so I can't verify the name. That is definitely not the book though, since that book, middlesex, is (sort of) fiction, and he was born a female. The book my GF is reading is non-fiction, about a man who was born a male twin, his circumcision was botched though, and they just castrated him and transformed his genitals. The family raised him as a female though, and brought in some experts to help raise him as a female, and it is horrible what he went through with the "therapist", and was a troublesome child. He later grew up and came into himself and decided he was male, so he then had surgery to change back to male, even though he grew up female. Really interesting story, will have to get back to you on that name.

Ah, I see. It sounds like David Reimer. I remember seeing him as part of some tv special years ago. Looking now, Wikipedia says he committed suicide in 2004, that's really unfortunate.

 

[thescience]

Ah, I see. It sounds like David Reimer. I remember seeing him as part of some tv special years ago. Looking now, Wikipedia says he committed suicide in 2004, that's really unfortunate.

That's exactly it: "As Nature Made Him: The Boy Who Was Raised As A Girl" is the title of the book. Did not know he committed suicide though, that is very sad to hear.

 

[Cetra]

The BBC did a documentary about David Reimer called "Dr. Money and the Boy With No Penis". If you can find it's definitely worth watching. It's heart-wrenching in places, but a very good doc none the less.

 

[Danoss]

The BBC did a documentary about David Reimer called "Dr. Money and the Boy With No Penis". If you can find it's definitely worth watching. It's heart-wrenching in places, but a very good doc none the less.

In full length on Google Video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3767337480016853964#

Oh and hi everyone!

 

[lexi]

Hi! So many different people. The days of a whole page being just Jamie and Ainsley seem so far away.

 

[Cetra]

In full length on Google Video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3767337480016853964#

Oh and hi everyone!

Hay thanks for the link! Gives me something to watch to kill time at work. And HERRO to you too!


@Lexi: haha, Don't tempt me! :lol :lol

 

[Roquentin]

a/s/l? :lol

26/M/Poland

And good luck with all that paper work and the trip to Thailand.

In full length on Google Video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3767337480016853964#

Thanks for the link.

 

[Jamie xxoo]

Awwww Poland. =(

Thanks for the luck I need some!

 

[JayDub]

A lot of people (when they have always known you as a guy) will pretend it's not happening because they don't know how to deal with it. They figure you can live the way you want and it's none of their business and that they're going to treat you as per usual - it's respectful.

I would've done the same thing, and totally thought I was respecting them. There's this girl I know who stammers a lot. She cannot finish one sentence without noticeably struggling. I talk to her normally, never correct her, never finish her sentence for her, and try to act normal around her. I think its respectful, but I know I have a crapload of questions. I figured its the best way to handle things. Who wants to be called out when they're trying to act as normal as possible.

Am I doing it wrong? Would it be better if I just broke the ice and asked questions? You think its possible people want you to ask questions? I mean, reading Lexi's reaction puts my whole behavior into question. I want to act like I dont notice it at all.

Come to think of it, I act like that with people Im not close with all the time. If someone has spinach in their teeth, I dont say anything. I figure they dont want to be embarrassed.

And Lexi - please stop freaking out and judging your whole presentation on these isolated incidents. You keep on swinging from knowing you're totally passable when a guy smiles at you to being 100% convinced you're failing at full-time when something like this happens. It's unhealthy and I'm worried that you're going to play up these anxieties to an extent where they cripple you totally. Try to keep it in perspective. People will react differently, people will see you differently, this is totally normal 3 or 4 months into transition. You can't expect to have testosterone in your system for 10 years and to walk around acting and looking like a guy your whole life, to be known by people in that context, and for them to automatically just see you as a woman after 4 months of estrogen with no conversation about what's happening. I think you've gone into this expecting the change to be instant, but that's unrealistic.

I dont know how long its been since you transitioned, but this paragraph right here defines the term "maturity." Regardless of age, young or old, this kind of thought process and philosophy is the kind you have when you "grow up." I only bring this up because my daughter's mother acts like shes 14-15 with the way she handles everything. I told her that her age means little if she acts as if shes a teenager when she's already 23. All it really means is that she hasn't yet grown up.

It frustrates me more because we have a kid. I just want her to get her head straight, especially since she gets to take care of Emily for half the week.

Keep in mind, by maturity I dont mean acting childish. I'm ALWAYS childish, my daughter loves it, and I look like a fool in public. What I mean is how you handle yourself when you feel like the world is against you. With my daughter's mom, she prioritizes going out with friends rather then making she our daughter has a mom to wake up next to.

Also, this paragraph in particular really hit home with me. When I do get upset, I get real upset. I don't show it, I don't act it out, but inside I feel like Im crumbling. I want to learn to "put things into perspective" and not freak out so much. I'd work on it, but I dont know where to start. :lol

 

[Dan Yo]

I would've done the same thing, and totally thought I was respecting them. There's this girl I know who stammers a lot. She cannot finish one sentence without noticeably struggling. I talk to her normally, never correct her, never finish her sentence for her, and try to act normal around her. I think its respectful, but I know I have a crapload of questions. I figured its the best way to handle things. Who wants to be called out when they're trying to act as normal as possible.

Am I doing it wrong? Would it be better if I just broke the ice and asked questions? You think its possible people want you to ask questions? I mean, reading Lexi's reaction puts my whole behavior into question. I want to act like I dont notice it at all.

Come to think of it, I act like that with people Im not close with all the time. If someone has spinach in their teeth, I dont say anything. I figure they dont want to be embarrassed.

Hmm. Usually I try to be honest with them or make light of the situation. If someone told you in a joking way that there is something in your teeth or if you are in a group, told you privately, then you would most likely be relieved that someone was a little more upfront with you rather than discovering that you had something in your teeth the entire night when you get back home and now have your head swimming with thoughts about everyone talking about it as soon as you had left the group. At least now you feel "in" on the joke rather than the subject of it.

I've had it happen several times ranging from when I was in high school until now when going out, where I have seen a girl who has obviously had her period but is terribly unaware. In this situation, she'd probably be devastated if someone did not tell her as soon as possible (privately of course). When this has happened, I have always sought out another female or a waitress to tell them as discreetly as possible. Coming from me, she would probably want to run out of the building sobbing and never return within a block of that area again.

There are tactful ways to go about each situation.

 

[EatChildren]

I so agree (and wow you're insightful for a cisgender (non-trans) guy who hasn't lived the experience himself).

Danke, but its really an attitude that should be applied to all self discovery. Social views and society in general can be pretty binary. Human emotions and complexity are not. Whether you're struggling with gender, sexuality, or simply what you want to do in life, its important to understand yourself as an individual before you want others to understand you.

Like how some people struggling with sexuality freak out when they think they might be gay or bi, previously thinking they were straight. They dont really think about what these feelings mean but instead how the world will percieve them, the social connontations applied to these lables, and so on.

So yeah, I might not struggle with the same issues as you lot, but I think its important to really believe and develop yourself as the woman you want to be, rather than the woman society wants you to be. As I said, society tends to get things wrong anyway. Just like some physically born women get mistaken as men, and some men get mistaken as women, not everybody you meet in life will be convinced you are who you want to be.

And its important to remember that in the end its you that needs to be convinced above all.

 

[Jamie xxoo]

Am I doing it wrong? Would it be better if I just broke the ice and asked questions? You think its possible people want you to ask questions? I mean, reading Lexi's reaction puts my whole behavior into question. I want to act like I dont notice it at all.

Come to think of it, I act like that with people Im not close with all the time. If someone has spinach in their teeth, I dont say anything. I figure they dont want to be embarrassed.

Well I think when you go through transition you would *like* people who've met you before to acknowledge when they see you as your true gender for the first time that you are going through something. It's supportive. Even a joking "trying out a new look are we?" would be fine (actually that would be perfect, speaking for myself.) It's a relief to know that someone has noticed and has acknowledged by their attitude that they're OK with you, and if people ask you questions you get a chance to explain yourself and settle in your own mind that the other person doesn't assume you're nuts or are dressing up for a fetish or whatever.

At the end of the day there's no malice in your intentions in ignoring an issue like this and I know I wouldn't hold it against you. I wouldn't expect a layman to understand the paranoia and anxieties involved in being a transwoman.

It might be a bit different for a stutterer. That's more of an annoying disability that they've always had to cope with, not this massively frightening undertaking to assert their identity over their body and society's gaze. A stutterer might want you to ignore the issue. I really don't know.

I dont know how long its been since you transitioned, but this paragraph right here defines the term "maturity." Regardless of age, young or old, this kind of thought process and philosophy is the kind you have when you "grow up." {snip} Keep in mind, by maturity I dont mean acting childish... {snip}

Also, this paragraph in particular really hit home with me. When I do get upset, I get real upset. I don't show it, I don't act it out, but inside I feel like Im crumbling. I want to learn to "put things into perspective" and not freak out so much. I'd work on it, but I dont know where to start. :lol

Well, I'd love to take the compliment but to be fair to Lexi and to yourself, it's so much easier to approach *other* people's problems with perspective than it is to approach your own when you're directly hit by the emotions of the situation.

I've had it happen several times ranging from when I was in high school until now when going out, where I have seen a girl who has obviously had her period but is terribly unaware.

OMG I've never seen that happen. Awkward.

but I think its important to really believe and develop yourself as the woman you want to be... And its important to remember that in the end its you that needs to be convinced above all.

I swear the way you're writing it's like you're taking this stuff directly off a trans message-board. Couldn't agree with everything you've said more. I wish I could add something useful, but you said it all.

 

[Jamie xxoo]

Update on my situation with the passport - BDM called back and said they wanted faxed evidence of my surgery. I told them, like I said in the original email, that all I have is email correspondence from the surgery and that I've already provided it. The woman on the phone said she'd refer it back to the department that's processing it. Not sure what will happen next, but I'm thinking this isn't going to go anywhere.

Meanwhile to cover my bases I called my gender psych today and asked him to give me a letter from his clinic explaining I'm in transition, in case I have to travel with my male passport. I'm not *as* worried about it now. I guess I've kind of resigned myself to the humiliation. I have a friend who did this and she said she had a lot of hassle with customs, but at the end of the day she got out and back in to the country. I'm probably not as passable as her anyway. I might just go straight through.

Why don't they put fingerprints in passports? It'd make all this a total non-issue.

 

[lexi]

I'm probably not as passable as her anyway. I might just go straight through.

Yeah, whatever Lexi... Hey, wait.

 

[Jamie xxoo]

Well this girl had been on hormones for 3 times the amount of time I have now.