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[xelios]

Population in the city proper is a quarter million, but the overall metro area is over a million.

That doesn't sound too bad. Do you not go out much? Surely somewhere of that size there are some trans-friendly hangouts. Where'd you meet your last bf?

The area of the university I went to has roughly the same population and I know people were pretty cool with it. There were a few "out" transwomen I knew of anyway, unfortunately I was so busy and had problems of my own at the time I never got to make friends with any of them. The only interaction I've really had is here on GAF...

 

[Hop]

That doesn't sound too bad. Do you not go out much? Surely somewhere of that size there are some trans-friendly hangouts. Where'd you meet your last bf?

That's an understatement. I'm sure there are, but I can't seem to find any real directory of events and places and such for this town, nevermind GLBT ones. Last boyfriend, I met online, not too sure I'll find someone else the same way.

 

[xelios]

Last boyfriend, I met online, not too sure I'll find someone else the same way.

Met mine online too. I don't go out much anymore these days either so I understand. I've got my fingers crossed for you though. I would think the hardest part of being trans wouldn't be finding someone but finding someone that "respects" you? Not really sure how else to word that...but there seem to be a lot of people interested in trans for the wrong reasons (degradation kinda thing). Is that true? It's just a vibe I got from some creeps, not sure how representative it is.

 

[Hop]

Met mine online too. I don't go out much anymore these days either so I understand. I've got my fingers crossed for you though. I would think the hardest part of being trans wouldn't be finding someone but finding someone that "respects" you? Not really sure how else to word that...but there seem to be a lot of people interested in trans for the wrong reasons (degradation kinda thing). Is that true?

Yea, you're pretty close. I get some.... uncouth messages from people on OK Cupid. And trans-focused dating sites seem to be exclusively that demographic. :/

 

[Master Milk]

Yea, you're pretty close. I get some.... uncouth messages from people on OK Cupid. And trans-focused dating sites seem to be exclusively that demographic. :/

From people looking to get involved or from people just hating?

 

[Hop]

From people looking to get involved or from people just hating?

Both. Some folks seem to honestly think that blunt personal questions phrased with poor grammar are actually something a woman wants to hear from a man.

 

[Master Milk]

Both. Some folks seem to honestly think that blunt personal questions phrased with poor grammar are actually something a woman wants to hear from a man.

When you phrase it like that, I can't help but think of the guys just being socially awkward which seems par for the course on the internet, even more so for a dating site I would guess.

Of course, you're not going to want to put up with that, but I don't find it surprising, sadly.

 

[Nishastra]

Both. Some folks seem to honestly think that blunt personal questions phrased with poor grammar are actually something a woman wants to hear from a man.

Hahahaha. The joys of the internet.


I generally prefer to be a non-entity online these days, putting out pretty much no personal information at all anywhere.
I had enough of random creeps and weird stalkery people previously

Obviously that wouldn't work so well on dating sites, but luckily I'm okay with being alone, too.

 

[Master Milk]

Hahahaha. The joys of the internet.


I generally prefer to be a non-entity online these days, putting out pretty much no personal information at all anywhere.
I had enough of random creeps and weird stalkery people previously

Obviously that wouldn't work so well on dating sites, but luckily I'm okay with being alone, too.

I'm really surprised that more people don't think like this. I'm not paranoid about the dangers of the internet, but it's still surprising the things people put online about themselves sometimes.

 

[SpacedCadette]

Nvm.

 

[Jintor]

It's just so tempting!

 

[Master Milk]

It's just so tempting!

What is? Gonna start freezing yourself to get a new tag?

 

[Zozobra]

So the girl I mentioned on the previous page isn't aware that I know she's transgender.

I've kept this information about her a complete secret as I respect her privacy, but I've been feeling particularly compelled to say something to her about it. I can only imagine how difficult this lifestyle must be, but I want her to know that I know and that I'm totally supportive of her.

I know she's getting FFS in the near future, so I want to tell her I thought she was a beautiful girl even before I knew she was transgender (which is very much the truth) - I want to say something to her that will make her feel good about herself, but I don't want to come across as a creep, y'know? For you MtF Gaffers, what would you want to hear someone say to you in this situation? Or maybe I should just keep my mouth shut?

 

[beje]

So the girl I mentioned on the previous page isn't aware that I know she's transgender.

I've kept this information about her a complete secret as I respect her privacy, but I've been feeling particularly compelled to say something to her about it. I can only imagine how difficult this lifestyle must be, but I want her to know that I know and that I'm totally supportive of her.

I know she's getting FFS in the near future, so I want to tell her I thought she was a beautiful girl even before I knew she was transgender (which is very much the truth) - I want to say something to her that will make her feel good about herself, but I don't want to come across as a creep, y'know? For you MtF Gaffers, what would you want to hear someone say to you in this situation? Or maybe I should just keep my mouth shut?

Common sense tells you should keep your mouth shut. Mention it only if she decides she wants to talk about it with you (something like "well, I already suspected it"), otherwise she could think you're a creep, a stalker or a "trans chaser" (I'm so sorry for this word, I don't really know how to say it) that has gotten that piece of information god knows from where.

Really, if you want to tell her she's pretty, just do it. Don't mention the transgendered part. That's the best ego boost and support you can give her.

 

[fireside]

I've kept this information about her a complete secret as I respect her privacy,

If you respect her privacy I wouldn’t broach the subject with her, unless you feel that learning about her was caused by somebody else not respecting her privacy. If you feel that is the case I think most people would want to know who is talking behind their back, but even with the best intentions this is certainly a difficult subject to bring up.

 

[alysonwheel]

Really, if you want to tell her she's pretty, just do it. Don't mention the transgendered part. That's the best ego boost and support you can give her.

This. A billion times this.

Like 95% of my confidence comes from knowing (or at least believing) that I interact with cis people without them knowing I'm trans. I then have the option to disclose and if it's someone I become friendly with I probably will. But if someone were to tell me, in a neutral context (i.e. not at a trans rights rally or somewhere you might expect to find a lot of trans people), that they'd spotted I'm trans, I'd be devastated. It'd have a really awful effect on me. Like nuclear bad.

But if she's beautiful, tell her so! Leave off the trans. If it's from a friend and not some creeper, being told you're pretty is lovely. Whereas being told "you're pretty for a tranny" (which, whether you mean it that way or not, you have a danger of coming across) can be anything from annoying to upsetting to hurtful.

 

[Zozobra]

Ok, thanks for the replies everyone.

 

[mollipen]

Well, here's how I'm coming with my voice. What do you all thing of my progress?

 

[Nesotenso]

Well, here's how I'm coming with my voice. What do you all thing of my progress?

If you don't mind me asking, I assume you are transitioning from female to male ?

 

[Brian Griffin]

I'm wondering that too. Your voice sounds like that of a mid 20s guy so I hope that's what you are going for. If not then I hope you don't take offense at my bluntness.

Also, what is you podcast about and where can I get it? I need something new to listen to at work.

 

[Platy]

They already told you all you need to hear .... but my curiosity is killing me ...

So the girl I mentioned on the previous page isn't aware that I know she's transgender.

so .... how did you knew ?

 

[mollipen]

Actually, no, I was just joking in terms of that voice sample being "progress". That's just me being sick. Making my voice more manly is exactly the opposite of what I want to do.

If you want to actually hear my "trying to sound like a guy for the time being" voice, the podcast is WARNING! A Huge Podcast. There you'll hear me doing my best attempt at sounding male. *laughs*

 

[Zozobra]

They already told you all you need to hear .... but my curiosity is killing me ...




so .... how did you knew ?

A friend of mine told me, otherwise it probably never would have occurred to me. Didn't believe it at first so I was directed to an instructional video she had done on YouTube that confirmed it.

 

[Femmeworth]

Did anyone else order the first English volume of Wandering Son? My copy came unexpectedly today. :O I can't wait to read it. It's bigger than I thought it would be.

 

[InfiniteNine]

Did anyone else order the first English volume of Wandering Son? My copy came unexpectedly today. :O I can't wait to read it. It's bigger than I thought it would be.

I'd buy it right now but my paycheck still hasn't come in the mail. ):

 

[Stellares]

A friend of mine told me, otherwise it probably never would have occurred to me. Didn't believe it at first so I was directed to an instructional video she had done on YouTube that confirmed it.

Is it ok if you post the link?

 

[mollipen]

Did anyone else order the first English volume of Wandering Son? My copy came unexpectedly today. :O I can't wait to read it. It's bigger than I thought it would be.

Wow, that much time has passed already?! I'll have to pick it up.

 

[shintoki]

Did anyone else order the first English volume of Wandering Son? My copy came unexpectedly today. :O I can't wait to read it. It's bigger than I thought it would be.

<----

It's Hardcover too :O. I've read it already while playing Eve

 

[lexi]

Is it ok if you post the link?

I'd rather he didn't. She is entitled to what remains of her privacy. Being outed by someone without consent is just wrong in my opinion.

 

[Stellares]

I'd rather he didn't. She is entitled to what remains of her privacy. Being outed by someone without consent is just wrong in my opinion.

Sorry, I just assumed since she had a youtube account with vids about being trans I thought she was pretty open

 

[mollipen]

Yeah, I guess I'd be of the opinion that if she's posted a video on YouTube that is public where she states that she's trans, I'm not sure there's any harm in posting a link.

 

[Zozobra]

Sorry, but I won't be posting a link. I just came here to have a couple of my own questions answered, so I don't feel it would be right.

 

[lexi]

I think people have a reasonable expectation of some sort of privacy in some instances where there is very little actual privacy.

For instance, I'm very openly trans on this forum, but I wouldn't appreciate someone using this forum as the source to out me in public.

 

[xelios]

Sorry, but I won't be posting a link. I just came here to have a couple of my own questions answered, so I don't feel it would be right.

Yeah, good on you man.

 

[iirate]

I think people have a reasonable expectation of some sort of privacy in some instances where there is very little actual privacy.

For instance, I'm very openly trans on this forum, but I wouldn't appreciate someone using this forum as the source to out me in public.

I'm probably alone in this, but I sort of wish someone else would out discover and out me. I'm terrified to tell my family, but I also hate hiding the truth from so many. I imagine that if someone decided to out me, it would be like yanking off a band-aid. Momentary pain, but there would also be a great relief.

 

[lexi]

I'm probably alone in this, but I sort of wish someone else would out discover and out me. I'm terrified to tell my family, but I also hate hiding the truth from so many. I imagine that if someone decided to out me, it would be like yanking off a band-aid. Momentary pain, but there would also be a great relief.

The one person in my life I was terrified of coming out to was my dad. I just kept it from him for months. And then he found out somehow through the grapevine, and he was actually fine with it. Talk about a total surprise. So in adding to your sentiment, sometimes that way can be better.

 

[iirate]

The one person in my life I was terrified of coming out to was my dad. I just kept it from him for months. And then he found out somehow through the grapevine, and he was actually fine with it. Talk about a total surprise. So in adding to your sentiment, sometimes that way can be better.

Out of the 7 people I've told now (8 counting the therapist I've started to see), only two have been people that I've known for a long time, and none have been family. Even though I suspect most of my family will be really accepting, it's hard to tell them that someone they've known for 25 years has been carrying something around like this. I guess I'm afraid of being judged.

 

[OttomanScribe]

So I have a hobby. I play a game called Warhammer, which some of you might be familiar with. It is a tabletop game, and is probably the most male dominated hobby that exists. People sometime go into the stores and sit around and paint. I did this today and I got told a story that made me feel freaking awful.

There is a woman who I had seen around but didn't really know. Apparently she is trans. The people at the city store (where I was) know her and are not inappropriate about it... well not as inappropriate as I expected.

She started going there after she had taken on fully her real identity, so they knew her like that. Her local store however had only ever known her as 'Tim'. She spent like 4 months getting up the courage to go in there.

One of the dudes at the city store ran up and told the staff to be sensitive and stuff, trying to get across how difficult it might be for her. (I felt kind of weird hearing this, on the one hand his intentions were good, on the other hand I don't know if it was his place to tell them, but moving along).

Anyway so she finally went in, and they fucking made fun of her. The whole scumbag lot of them. After four damn months of getting ready for it. These pathetic people mocked her. He described it to me like every word was a physical blow (in terms of her reaction).

I heard it and it made me feel physically ill. I don't know why I felt the need to post in the thread and I apologise for my profanity. I just wanted to say that it must freaking suck, and people are jerks, and I feel sorry, even though I don't know why. I hope any people who have had to experience that get all the justice returned to them tenfold. A hundredfold. I personally believe that at the end of everything, every harsh word someone said to you will be paid back in kind. I hope justice is served for any crap any of you suffer, in this life or the next. I hope saying that isn't patronising or something, and this post isn't a weird thing to say. I'd say it to her but I don't know her, and internet courage is easy to come by.

 

[AceBandage]

Holy shit. How did I end up with that post in this topic.
Sorry!

 

[xelios]

So I have a hobby. I play a game called Warhammer, which some of you might be familiar with. It is a tabletop game, and is probably the most male dominated hobby that exists. People sometime go into the stores and sit around and paint. I did this today and I got told a story that made me feel freaking awful.

There is a woman who I had seen around but didn't really know. Apparently she is trans. The people at the city store (where I was) know her and are not inappropriate about it... well not as inappropriate as I expected.

She started going there after she had taken on fully her real identity, so they knew her like that. Her local store however had only ever known her as 'Tim'. She spent like 4 months getting up the courage to go in there.

One of the dudes at the city store ran up and told the staff to be sensitive and stuff, trying to get across how difficult it might be for her. (I felt kind of weird hearing this, on the one hand his intentions were good, on the other hand I don't know if it was his place to tell them, but moving along).

Anyway so she finally went in, and they fucking made fun of her. The whole scumbag lot of them. After four damn months of getting ready for it. These pathetic people mocked her. He described it to me like every word was a physical blow (in terms of her reaction).

I heard it and it made me feel physically ill. I don't know why I felt the need to post in the thread and I apologise for my profanity. I just wanted to say that it must freaking suck, and people are jerks, and I feel sorry, even though I don't know why. I hope any people who have had to experience that get all the justice returned to them tenfold. A hundredfold. I personally believe that at the end of everything, every harsh word someone said to you will be paid back in kind. I hope justice is served for any crap any of you suffer, in this life or the next. I hope saying that isn't patronising or something, and this post isn't a weird thing to say. I'd say it to her but I don't know her, and internet courage is easy to come by.

That's awful. I felt bad for her just reading it. Though I'm not trans, I know the process of building up courage to do trivial things all too well. Also this post and your reaction makes me see (and respect) you differently and perhaps how ignorant I can be myself at times. GAF never fails to amaze me.

 

[Dead Man]

I've been getting a few people on facebook flagging a petition to get transgenderism removed from the DSM.

http://www.change.org/petitions/remove-transgender-from-the-dsm-5

I've been wondering what views on that are. I don't think it is a mental illness that needs curing, but if it is not a recognised condition I think it might make getting real treatment more difficult. I was mainly wondering if any of the trans members of GAF had an opinion, but interested in everyones opinion too.

So I have a hobby. I play a game called Warhammer, which some of you might be familiar with. It is a tabletop game, and is probably the most male dominated hobby that exists. People sometime go into the stores and sit around and paint. I did this today and I got told a story that made me feel freaking awful.

There is a woman who I had seen around but didn't really know. Apparently she is trans. The people at the city store (where I was) know her and are not inappropriate about it... well not as inappropriate as I expected.

She started going there after she had taken on fully her real identity, so they knew her like that. Her local store however had only ever known her as 'Tim'. She spent like 4 months getting up the courage to go in there.

One of the dudes at the city store ran up and told the staff to be sensitive and stuff, trying to get across how difficult it might be for her. (I felt kind of weird hearing this, on the one hand his intentions were good, on the other hand I don't know if it was his place to tell them, but moving along).

Anyway so she finally went in, and they fucking made fun of her. The whole scumbag lot of them. After four damn months of getting ready for it. These pathetic people mocked her. He described it to me like every word was a physical blow (in terms of her reaction).

I heard it and it made me feel physically ill. I don't know why I felt the need to post in the thread and I apologise for my profanity. I just wanted to say that it must freaking suck, and people are jerks, and I feel sorry, even though I don't know why. I hope any people who have had to experience that get all the justice returned to them tenfold. A hundredfold. I personally believe that at the end of everything, every harsh word someone said to you will be paid back in kind. I hope justice is served for any crap any of you suffer, in this life or the next. I hope saying that isn't patronising or something, and this post isn't a weird thing to say. I'd say it to her but I don't know her, and internet courage is easy to come by.

I knew you were a decent person underneath all the rhetoric you let fly Sucks so much for her though, getting up all that courage and then having to deal with that shit. Fuckers. Don't suppose it was in Adelaide, was it? I'd like to beat some sense into their head!

 

[Jintor]

Urgh. I feel pretty ill just reading that post.

 

[alysonwheel]

I've been getting a few people on facebook flagging a petition to get transgenderism removed from the DSM.

http://www.change.org/petitions/remove-transgender-from-the-dsm-5

I've been wondering what views on that are. I don't think it is a mental illness that needs curing, but if it is not a recognised condition I think it might make getting real treatment more difficult. I was mainly wondering if any of the trans members of GAF had an opinion, but interested in everyones opinion too.

What's good about transsexualism being in the DSM is, like you say, it gives people a route to treatment. Even in countries like the UK, with long-established, centralised gender clinics like the one at Charing Cross Hospital in London and doctors on staff who champion our needs (Stuart Lorimer is amazing), actual treatment has to be funded by the local PCTs (essentially per-county funding boards), some of which have been known to use any and all excuses to avoid paying up; removing a medicalised definition of transsexuality, whilst a good thing ideologically imo, gives them another excuse to turn people down.

What's bad about it is the definitions used are truly fucked up. The people in charge of the spec for gender identity disorder are champions of weird and outmoded models of transsexuality. Stuff like "primary transsexual" and "secondary transsexual" get thrown around, and the artificial dichotomy between the "homosexual transsexual" (in their eyes, a gay man who's gone too far; after transition she will fuck men) and the "autogynephilic transsexual" (in their eyes, a straight man who is so in love with the idea of himself as a woman that he has surgery so he can, essentially, fuck himself silly; after transition she will date women but primarily will love herself) is (I hope) self-evidently ridiculous for a number of reasons, two important ones being a) bisexuals exist, duh, and b) actual people don't conform to these bizarre narratives.

The new DSM is apparently planning to extend this fuckery to trans guys as well; they don't get to carry on without a stigmatised "autoandrophilia" or somesuch nonsense any more.

So, to sum up: yes, transsexuality should be in the DSM, but the definitions and care plans should be taken out of the hands of the bizarre fetishists who write them now and handed over to someone like Stuart Lorimer, or any other doctor who works daily with dozens of trans people and actually knows what makes us tick.

Um, sorry for the rant?

 

[gerg]

Actually, just nevermind.

 

[alysonwheel]

I saw that you responded to me on my phone but didn't read it, and now you've edited. If you disagree with me but don't want to get into an argument here, don't worry about it -- I'm not going to get all GRAR WHY DON'T YOU RESPECT MY OPINIONSSSS

Also, things are now a little less fucked-up than I remembered them being. Shows me up for going on a rant without checking up first...

 

[gerg]

I saw that you responded to me on my phone but didn't read it, and now you've edited. If you disagree with me but don't want to get into an argument here, don't worry about it -- I'm not going to get all GRAR WHY DON'T YOU RESPECT MY OPINIONSSSS

Also, things are now a little less fucked-up than I remembered them being. Shows me up for going on a rant without checking up first...

No, I was very tired and decided that I didn't really feel knowledgeable enough to make a comment, and as I didn't want to risk offending anyone I thought it best just to delete the comment.

One thing that I wasn't sure about, for example, was the extent of the "homosexual transsexual" and "autogynephilic transsexual" - do they exist alongside an entry for "normal" transsexuality, as it were, or do they represent the entirety of the DSM's entry on MTF transsexuality? If it's the latter then I the terminology should be inadequate on that basis alone.

 

[Maklershed]

Transgaf I have a question that has been on my mind for awhile. Forgive me if this has already been asked. But I was wondering, lets say two men are in a committed relationship when one decides to go through with a sex change operation. I'm curious, generally in a case like that does the other person lose interest because as a gay man they're not attracted to the female form? Or is it more often the case that they can look past that? My apologies if this is a stupid or naive question.

 

[iirate]

Transgaf I have a question that has been on my mind for awhile. Forgive me if this has already been asked. But I was wondering, lets say two men are in a committed relationship when one decides to go through with a sex change operation. I'm curious, generally in a case like that does the other person lose interest because as a gay man they're not attracted to the female form? Or is it more often the case that they can look past that? My apologies if this is a stupid or naive question.

It's really hard to make a blanket statement about a situation like that; it would be different for everyone. I know that if a girl I was dating wanted to transition, I imagine that I'd remain a close friend, but that I would certainly no longer be interested in anything sexual with that person. The attraction just wouldn't be there. You can ask yourself the same question if you're interested in one sex; I can't imagine being gay or straight having anything to do with it.

 

[OttomanScribe]

I knew you were a decent person underneath all the rhetoric you let fly Sucks so much for her though, getting up all that courage and then having to deal with that shit. Fuckers. Don't suppose it was in Adelaide, was it? I'd like to beat some sense into their head!

Nah, in Sydney.

Yeah.. it freaking sucks. It ruined my day just hearing it, let alone what it was like for her. Especially considering how apparently central the hobby is to her life.

Empathy is hardly only the province of non-Muslims lol. My aunty's closest friend, and a woman who has been around my whole life is trans. Every harsh word, abuse and discrimination suffered by one is jihad(struggle) for them, and a shield from the fire. Every religious person that tells someone they are going to hell, is making it more likely that they won't. Anyway, it is my understanding is that there is nothing haraam (impermissible) about feeling that you are physically one sex, but that your gender is different. There should be more avenues for such people to change their sex to align with their gender if that is their wish.

 

[mollipen]

Transgaf I have a question that has been on my mind for awhile. Forgive me if this has already been asked. But I was wondering, lets say two men are in a committed relationship when one decides to go through with a sex change operation. I'm curious, generally in a case like that does the other person lose interest because as a gay man they're not attracted to the female form? Or is it more often the case that they can look past that? My apologies if this is a stupid or naive question.

Really, I think it's the same question you would ask if you have a man who is married to a woman, and either one of them changes their physical sex. What you went into the relationship as is what the other person is attracted to, unless you specifically went into that relationship being trans and with them knowing your plans for transition.

Of course, yeah, it's a case by case situation, but I'd guess a gay man would feel just as "betrayed" if his significant other announced the wish to transition into being a woman as a wife would feel.