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Trump risks major diplomatic dispute with China after speaking with Taiwan's prez
- Thread starter chadskin
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Unknown Soldier
Member
Well he could start by selecting his Secretary of State. But yes you are correct, the President of the United States has the right to pick up the phone and talk with anyone he likes. China can't tell our President who he is allowed to talk to.
Calamari41
41 > 38
The fact that our President is supposed to defer to the Chinese government before being allowed to take a phone call from Taiwan is pretty pathetic.
China is propping up North Korea, who threatens to nuke us every Tuesday. But we can't so much as talk to an island full of people who fled the mainland.
China is propping up North Korea, who threatens to nuke us every Tuesday. But we can't so much as talk to an island full of people who fled the mainland.
Diplomacy is a subtle game. In the US, a simple phone call isn't seen as a faux-pas. But did you know that in China, grabbing a woman by the pussy can be considered insulting? It's important to learn of these cultural differences. Mexico accidentally stirred the ire of Trump when they sent an envoy of rapists to the US.
RPGCrazied
Member
Ugh. Come on electors, choose someone else. Anyone else.
I think we all learned a little bit today.
Chittagong
Gold Member
Sorry, why are supporting talking to Chinese overloards instead of Taiwan again?
beelulzebub
Banned
This is a funny post and I really want to laugh. But I just don't think I have it in me anymore.
It's not a radical move, backing democratically elected governments should be the normal move of American governments. Previous governments were the radical ones.
BluePigGanon
Member
You can't make a crazy declaration like that without sources!
Tensions in Asia are extremely high right now. This is a de-stabilizing opening bid in an already uncertain relationship with China.
Xi Jinping is so unsure of what the new president is going to do that he's trying to use Henry Kissinger as a go between. This is a tense moment.
Trump just ratcheted up that tension significantly, and did so whilst he is not yet in control of the government, and hasn't even selected a secretary of state.
It IS a radical act, for practical as well as ideological reasons.
No, Xi Jinping is the one ramping up tensions, building huge artificial islands on atolls (which has never been recognised as appropriate under international law), ignoring the one country two systems laws agreed between the UK, HK, and China, and directly interfering in HK issues. Cracking right down on personal rights in China. Xi Jinping is the one out of control, and about time that someone stood up to him.
Lucky Forward
Member
First thing I thought of.
Those of us who aren't nostalgic for the height of the cold war would argue that we need to be stronger with China, but not in a way that recklessly creates the kind of panicky uncertainty that terrifies allies and provides fuel for the most anti-American elements in the Chinese government.
Also, the major point is that international policy is being set by someone who isn't yet in control of the government. This leaves both the US and Chinese governments in a bizarre position of not being able to properly respond to each other. This is a strange kind of limbo that I'm trying to think of a precedent for.
Trump needs to be creating an atmosphere of stability rather than leaving the world to believe he is improvising. He needs to appoint a secretary of state NOW, and clarify his foreign policy stances if he's going to start making moves like this.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
There are a lot of areas the US could stand firmer with China on, but I'm not sure what the benefit is of choosing direct official talks with Taiwan as the starting point. Maybe it's good for Trump's business opportunities, but it doesn't serve to do much else beyond antagonize China.
NervousXtian
Thought Emoji Movie was good. Take that as you will.
Many people in this thread celebrating this do NOT understand what the One-China policy is actually about... this is not about recognizing Taiwan as independent state, Taiwan itself overwhelming wants to remain the status quo going forward.. not just full independence, while there is still a strong % who would prefer reunification.
Taiwan's view for many years, and still held by some is that THEY should be the government that rules of Mainland China, and not the PRC over them.
It's a complicated, very complicated dispute.
Trump jumping into this and opening it up, before he takes office is a bad move.
See, this is a very naive understanding of what Taiwan is, and what the history of it is.
Taiwan's view for many years, and still held by some is that THEY should be the government that rules of Mainland China, and not the PRC over them.
It's a complicated, very complicated dispute.
Trump jumping into this and opening it up, before he takes office is a bad move.
See, this is a very naive understanding of what Taiwan is, and what the history of it is.
CoffeeJanitor
Member
same thoughts for Hong Kong
Honestly this is probably on purpose tbh, we need to stop thinking everything he does is on accident
KISS, etc.
Fair criticism of Trump (I'm not a fan), but let's not let Xi Jinping get away without being the one who has ramped up all of these tensions, even against traditional allies such as Vietnam.
I grew up during the cold war, China largely kept themselves out of that. The aggresive stance of China under Xi Jinping is unprecedented. UK government and Obama have been massively weak on this, it's about time that somebody stood up to him. He's completely destroying any domestic opposition to himself.
wumster3000
Member
Hmmmm...gonna have read more on the inter workings of the relationships of all three countries. Don't know if this is right or wrong.
http://www.goarmy.com/learn/apply.html
Here you go, buddy! Have fun standing up to the People's Republic of China!
David H Wong
Banned
Yeah I'm very confused by this. China forbids US presidents from speaking to Taiwan? And we obey? This is bizarre.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
Also, what people do not realize is that the CCP perceives any threat to "One China" doctrine as existential.
They will wildly overreact to this because they have to.
As someone who has avoided taking part in Trump hysteria, people who don't understand this situation should realize this is the most genuinely extreme thing he has done by far.
I have always been very concerned about his comments on Asia. Provoking China whilst also failing to strongly backup our Asian allies (Japan and South Korea) is behavior I find extremely worrying.
Our policy towards Asia is our most important long term strategic concern, more important than the Middle East. Blunders in this area will have severe long term consequences.
A credible US stance towards Asia from the new administration must be established quickly and coherently. Failure to do so will sow the seeds of crisis.
I have always been very concerned about his comments on Asia. Provoking China whilst also failing to strongly backup our Asian allies (Japan and South Korea) is behavior I find extremely worrying.
Our policy towards Asia is our most important long term strategic concern, more important than the Middle East. Blunders in this area will have severe long term consequences.
A credible US stance towards Asia from the new administration must be established quickly and coherently. Failure to do so will sow the seeds of crisis.
RPGCrazied
Member
And have since the fucking 80's. You just don't go do this all the sudden.
David H Wong
Banned
Right a phone call congratulating the president of Taiwan for winning an election is absolutely the same as launching a ground war against China. The left definitely isn't getting ridiculous with their Trump panic at all.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
Yes but there's the right way to go about it, and the wrong way.
This act shows that he's utterly and fundamentally a reckless commander-in-chief. Something that every single ally of the United States will take note, and they will behave accordingly.
No but let's say that North Korea loses its collective minds and seizes a Japanese vessel by force. What recourse does the U.S. have without bringing China to the negotiation table?
Yeah, I don't think pissing off China is a concern for him guys.
It's not just the left freaking out about this today.
It's hundreds of very smart and established foreign policy officials that have worked in multiple Republican and Democrat Administrations. Sometimes both. These are people with a direct pulse on foriegn policy in the South Pacific since the Nixon administration.
But dont let that get in the way of blaming the left. It's always a good excuse. I look forward to this reasoning for four years as terrible blunders come home to roost.
North Korea no longer pay any attention to what China says, they have no control over them whatsoever.
You do realise that US law is that the US must protect Taiwan by supplying them with arms? China is always pissed at US for supplying Taiwan with missiles, Trump chatting to the Taiwanese President first should be expected.
Of course, I'm aware of the complicated situation. The old Chinese offer was have domestic control like Hong Kong and Macau ... we won't interfere .... look how we haven't interfered there. They've obviously given up on that strategy, they interfere left right and centre in Hong Kong and Macau, and changed the domestic Chinese law to be able to invade Taiwan in the case of a declaration of independence.
Yes, I'm sure that many posting here are not aware of the full consequences of any actions, I'm not one of them.
Calamari41
41 > 38
And if our troops aren't forced to fight on mainland Chinese soil because of this phone call?
Oops. There's bound to be a couple mistakes when you're a new employee.
It's funny, cause forgetting to use the new cover page for TPS reports is one thing. Pissing off the second largest economy in the world is another.
Gold star America!
NervousXtian
Thought Emoji Movie was good. Take that as you will.
Not just the US, the list of people with diplomatic ties to Taiwan is quite small. The PRC forbids direct contact with Taiwan's government.
Yeah, from here in the US on a laptop on a gaming forum.. we can say that's some petty ass shit. Yet this is the real world and there's more to it than just a simple phone call.
Yup, though honestly it'll be interesting to see how it plays out, and what effect's it will have long term for relations. It's not just that China needs us economically, they do.. but they would be willing to fuck it all to piss us off.
It could be argued, that as things stand, that the US needs China as much as China needs the US.
LMFAOOOOOOOOO
NervousXtian
Thought Emoji Movie was good. Take that as you will.
Oh, and he just called them Taiwan.
Keep on keepin' Donald.
Keep on keepin' Donald.
Basketball
Member
TRUMP Makes the Best decisions
THE BEST
THE BEST
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