31GhostsIV
Banned
On one hand, yes. On the other... what episode did Jade post the Great Northern key again? How many episodes ago?
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Twin Peaks Season 3 OT |25 Years Later...It Is Happening Again
- Thread starter Sumio Mondo
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On one hand, yes. On the other... what episode did Jade post the Great Northern key again? How many episodes ago?
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
The excitement for the episode immediately died down once Diane barks 'Let's Rock.' Sarah Palmer was great in this episode. Audrey... whatever. Her sexy Nancy Drew antics wouldn't have carried over well so her having impotent rage seems about right. Dr. Amp/Nadine's adoration was just there to eat screen time.
May Episode 13 bring us the excitement I had for 12.
May Episode 13 bring us the excitement I had for 12.
I could only give this the show smallest amount of attention this week. The bare minimum. This is Lynch trolling the audience. I've made it to twelve hours, so I might as well stick to the end. But you know what, when I think about it, too much of this season has been just awful with a few moments of greatness.
Same here... well, I kinda get it, but I don't empathize with it at all. I always rewatch the previous part before the new one airs, so this hour of downtime felt appropriate after the honking and howling insanity of Part 11.
Airola
Member
Maybe Audrey actually still is in coma, and that scene was just her coma nightmare :O
What really happened there was that Cooper didn't even try to catch the ball, therefore he didn't fail to catch the ball. You can't fail if you don't even try!
So in one short scene Lynch brilliantly tells the audience that the new Twin Peaks hasn't failed to be new Twin Peaks because it even doesn't try to be new Twin Peaks!
What really happened there was that Cooper didn't even try to catch the ball, therefore he didn't fail to catch the ball. You can't fail if you don't even try!
So in one short scene Lynch brilliantly tells the audience that the new Twin Peaks hasn't failed to be new Twin Peaks because it even doesn't try to be new Twin Peaks!
should I put the /s thing here?
Hands of Stone
Member
All that cooper hype for naught. Think Ima wait till next Sunday to watch this one.
Not if it spends five minutes on someone sweeping a floor and things of that nature. I don't think the pieces are moving much beyond what we've seen. The show is taking its sweet time, and I'm thinking it's because we aren't getting to the usual big finale of a story we are used to. This Twin Peaks is something else entirely.
Latvian Hitman
Member
I've spent much of this season telling myself, "Wow- Lynch has still got it." The second half of last night's episode kinda' had me wondering if he might not be losing it, though. I'll wait to see what, if any, payoffs lie ahead from Audrey's reintroduction scene and the scene at the Roadhouse before going at it too hard, though. Seems awfully late in the game to be introducing new threads with that many characters.
Funny to see people using this episode to complain about the pace of the overall storyline(s), because last night was the first time I thought to myself how all the disparate plots are really starting to come together and are all zeroing in on Twin Peaks.
Seems strange to me that you'd be completely on board for nearly 12 hours, only to completely question it all because of the last 10 minutes, ha.
Seems strange to me that you'd be completely on board for nearly 12 hours, only to completely question it all because of the last 10 minutes, ha.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
That's the thing that's getting me about all of this. It's not the same as the old series, but episodes where nothing really happened or was moved forward much were present in the original series. It's been said multiple times what they wanted to do with the series originally was never reveal the killer and focus on the going ons, and in this series they're doing something akin to this and purposely testing some things.
To quote Kyle a month or so ago:
In an interview with Lynch around the same time he also talked about tempo and how long something can play out, so it's definitely intentional. In fact there's a whole lot of commentary you can take out of this season for our society becoming less patient, more interested in instant gratification, and these sort of things. I'm not all of it was intentiinal as some other things, but they certainly did decide to draw some things out and twist expectations in the way we've been seeing.
The whole season doesn't follow a regular show tempo, they speed things up suddenly with a lot dumped and experienced at once, and then slow things down. This works a lot better in succession I feel rather thank chunks at a time (even though in chunks does benefit dogestion, if you will). I marathoned Parts 1-9 with several others a few weeks back, the others I watched it with had either never seen Season 3, saw the first 4 parts but not the rest yet, one had seen all of the parts (outside of 9 that aired that evening), and a couple had never seen Twin Peaks before. It was interesting watching with all of them and confirmed something for me; the pacing of this show does actually work a lot better not being watched it in chunks, as it speeds up and slows down like a film, and everyone I watched it with actually quite liked it and things felt they went by faster than while watching it weekly. There's build-uo, developments, then ringing it back, etc. When we're in the slower episodes is when people complain the most, it's understandable I think but it sticks out more to me in weekly consuming than when you're marathoning it how slow it feels sometimes.
I am not hiding that I loved the original series and I love this new season. The last episode wasn't my favorite either but I did like it still and there was a lot of scenes I enjoyed in it. I think this season is fantastic and is striking chords with me that I can honestly say no other television series ever has. That doesn't mean I don't see why some are so sour over it, my first reaction upon seeing Parts 1-4 initially I even posted in this thread was that while I personally adore it, this series is going to piss some people off and is certainly not going to be for everyone.
We're at the 2/3rd mark officially now, and I'm excited to see where this goes and how it wraps up with 6 more parts to go.
Vyse The Legend
Member
I enjoyed the episode, and still think the entire season is just a brilliant, bizarre and wholly unique experience.
However, I get why people want to see the plot move faster. There are episodes where it moves very quickly, from scene to scene, like Part 11, and then ones like this where progress is very incremental.
Watching this after Game of Thrones is hilarious, though. GoT has people teleporting and months of time being compressed just to speed the plot along. This has a 10 minute scene culminating with someone hearing one side of a phone conversation, haha.
The short scene with Dougie getting hit with the baseball was just the best, though.
Definitely a good call, and at this point, I fully expect the theory about him returning in Part 15 is spot-on.
However, I get why people want to see the plot move faster. There are episodes where it moves very quickly, from scene to scene, like Part 11, and then ones like this where progress is very incremental.
Watching this after Game of Thrones is hilarious, though. GoT has people teleporting and months of time being compressed just to speed the plot along. This has a 10 minute scene culminating with someone hearing one side of a phone conversation, haha.
The short scene with Dougie getting hit with the baseball was just the best, though.
Definitely a good call, and at this point, I fully expect the theory about him returning in Part 15 is spot-on.
Latvian Hitman
Member
Not questioning it all by any stretch. And my concerns stem from the last 25 minutes or so of the episode, not just the last 10.
dead souls
Member
I was literally struggling to stay awake during most of this episode.
InaudibleWhispa
Member
I enjoyed half the episode, and I usually enjoy Lynch's scenes of deliberate slow pacing, but half of this episode was too much of too little. That said, at 18 episodes the hit ratio is still incredibly high for me. There's a reason most shows work with 10-13 episode seasons nowadays, and yet Lynch has only tested my patience a couple of times.
I feel like we say a sentence like that every episode at this point: 'No worries, Lynch has X amount of hours still to wrap this up." The fact that we need another book as an extended 'epilogue' makes it worrisome that it's still gonna end cryptic and unsatisfying with some plot threads never bothered to be explained. But we'll see lol. Honestly I'm convinced Lynch might have the Woodsmen kill the town of TP or something.
plagiarize
Banned
I expect the final dossier to wrap up the first one, not the series itself. Could be wrong though.
Weird to see 12 being divisive. I need to rewatch it in different circumstances to fairly assess it though.
Airola
Member
But does it really matter what people think about whatever 'art' there is?
Is 'art' really some stone idol people should appreciate just because it exists?
What makes 'art' such a special thing? Because you happen to like 'art'?
Should someone be respected just because they happen to make 'art' and be an artist?
Also, these are peoples opinions about things. They can watch what they want and they can say whatever they want about it and they can still continue watching it even if they don't like it. Just like you do with people's negative writings about the show. You don't like them, yet you still read them and want to comment and criticize them.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
There will definitely be more context given, on account the next episode is literally titled, "What story is that, Charlie?", and we now know who Charlie is.
I don't understand all this, "Lynch is intentionally trolling the audience or playing on your expectations" kind of talk with these scenes.
Do you just not think he's capable of producing a genuinely bad scene?
Airola
Member
Airola
Member
It's weird this supposed "18 hour movie" format should be a reason for things to be annoyingly slow.
There are two ways to make a 9-hour thing into an 18-hour thing.
1. You stretch the whole thing in a way that slows down everything until the existing thing is twice as long.
2. You leave the 9-hour thing as it is and make other 9 hours of completely new stuff and then add them together.
It feels like Twin Peaks: The Return was made more like 1 than 2.
EDIT:
I don't have anything against slowness. Slowness can be interesting. It's just when the slowness happens to be also boring, then I have an issue with it.
Unless it's Audrey asking that and Charlie just giving the quiet stare again
Knowing this show it could go this way ><
I think I'll probably scream if it's just Charlie watching someone sweep the floor for 5 minutes.
Perhaps this has been considered but...
I think Audrey is still in a coma...I believe that her husband is actually a construct...her connection to the outside world. Her "husband" just found out about Richard and was keeping it from her to protect her.
Audrey in the scene doesn't even move...she is locked in place in fact. She has to rely on him to relay information that she would (in any previous incarnation of herself) get alone. She wouldn't never worry about going anywhere alone...Her "husband" in fact talks her out of going tot he Roadhouse and instead makes a phone call to get the info she wants.
On an aside, I'm pretty certain that somehow the conversation on the phone is in regards to Richard, the truck, and the guy Andy was trying to question several episodes ago. Thoughts?
I think Audrey is still in a coma...I believe that her husband is actually a construct...her connection to the outside world. Her "husband" just found out about Richard and was keeping it from her to protect her.
Audrey in the scene doesn't even move...she is locked in place in fact. She has to rely on him to relay information that she would (in any previous incarnation of herself) get alone. She wouldn't never worry about going anywhere alone...Her "husband" in fact talks her out of going tot he Roadhouse and instead makes a phone call to get the info she wants.
On an aside, I'm pretty certain that somehow the conversation on the phone is in regards to Richard, the truck, and the guy Andy was trying to question several episodes ago. Thoughts?
The Elite
BOSS
That's a bold theory. I kind of like it. I'm not sure how well it holds up to scrutiny. I would have to watch the scene again.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
Unless it's Audrey asking that and Charlie just giving the quiet stare again
I more meant we know Charlie will be in the next episode at least, and most likely Audrey too, so we'll st least get more context in the sense we'll be seeing more of them.
Buttonbasher
Member
Watching this makes me really excited to rewatch the original series after this. Just seeing Bobby and Shelly together, knowing where their lives end up, feels vastly different than even my recent rewatch did. Curious to see how that applies to all the characters, after this series is done.
Don Draper's Hat
Member
I like this theory. I doubt it's right, but it's fucking fantastic.
It would mean though, assuming Richard is hers, that she gave birth during her coma. Is that possible?
Not saying it's an excuse to be unnecessarily slow. I'm just saying that with 18 hours it's very likely that there will be a few episodes with about 20/30 minutes of material that's not as exciting in isolation so they feel even slower.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
I think at the very least Bobby in the original series will become a lot more likable for many knowing how he eventually ends up. In the original series he mellows out and grows as the series goes on and he has a few oddly touching scenes with his father, which I'm very happy Season 3 built upon and will contextualize the first two seasons a lot more.
I've also always liked Albert and Hawk, but this season has made me like them more than ever.
I also feel like one weird thing to think about are the Truman brothers, there's no indication Harry has a brother in the original series (though also no indication he doesn't have a brother), so it'll be weird picturing what Frank must be doing originally.
He's most likely the man that Andy interviewed, who later failed to show up at their meeting spot.
Airola
Member
Yeah sorry, I didn't mean you thought it was like that. What you wrote just made me think about it in general.
Bobby at the end seems to have the best character arc in both the old and new seasons. Even more than Cooper. Sure he was a shithead, but his backstory in FWWM and how he is now struggling to continue being the good guy as he deals with both his daughter's and Shelley's relationships has really stuck me.
Sebastian Suola
Member
Bravo! You are a genius. That would explain why that scene felt so out of place, like I was watching a different show.
Let's see what happens. I hope you are right
Buttonbasher
Member
Interesting notion, but I feel like if this were the case, Ben Horne would have said '[Richard] grew up without parents' rather than fixating on just the father.
plagiarize
Banned
Billy owned the truck Richard ran over the kid with. The person Andy was waiting for who never showed. He is the guy someone ran into the RR looking for.
I have been presuming that Richard killed him too, but maybe there is more to it than that.
Don Draper's Hat
Member
I wonder if that "Albert, sometimes I really worry about you" line was in the script. It looks like Miguel is very close to breaking character.
"...she'll turnip eventually."
"...she'll turnip eventually."
I assume the doctors would have delivered the baby in a c-section.
If we line up Doc Hayward's remark about thinking Cooper might have visited Audrey in the hospital with Ben's line about Richard never having a father and being wrong from the beginning, maybe Coop's doppelganger really did rape and impregnate Audrey in the hospital? Being the son of the doppelganger/BOB would certainly explain why Richard is such a fundamentally despicable person (and his first scene at the Roadhouse really did feel very BOB-ish to me at the time).
Airola
Member
Unless it's like the Dr. Amp scenes;
We'll see the same Audrey vs. Charlie scene played over and over again with slight changes. It in fact will be the final scene of the show but this time Audrey ominously asks "who did you talk with on the phone? Was it..... Laura Palmer...?" Charlie gives the silent stare at the camera. End credits.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
I kind of doubt the Audrey coma theory will hold any water, it's interesting but even in this episode Ben Horne says Richard didn't have a father, he doesn't say Richard grew up without a mother. Though I will say it's odd for all Richard is being discussed how none of them mention Audrey. Like when Sylvia gets attacked by Richard she contacts Ben and not Audrey, and then it seems like Audrey and Charlie have some contract that's not further explained. There's definitely something going on there, at least.
stuminus3
Member
Seriously! I can't wait to go through the whole thing (including FWWM & Missing Pieces) with the context of this new season.
I rewatched Episode 29 just recently, I think some people might be surprised to find some of the "Lynch-isms" that people are complaining at the moment are quite prominent in that legendary 50 minutes of TV... the scene were Andy is going on to Harry about breakfast, or having to watch that old guy in the bank shuffle across the room when obviously more important things are happening. The Lodge part that everyone remembers it for is actually pretty brief.
"King Arthur is buried in England! Last I heard anyway..."
Airola
Member
Audrey is in coma. BadCoop raped her while in coma. She gave birth to Richard while in coma. She is still in coma. Some other woman took care of Richard. The woman who took care of Richard is played by.............. Sheryl Lee :O
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
Also random thought, I know Muholland Drive is it's own thing even though it was originally conceived as a Twin Peaks spin-off starring Audrey, but I almost want to think the 'truth' of the main character in MD oddly reflects what we see of who Audrey is now. IE, the main character of MD is a selfish bitch using others for her own pleasure who has a dreamier side. There was a lot of shades of that to me in Audrey here, which is amusing as Audrey was originally supposed to be the main character of MD.
I don't think episode 12 was truly bad or anything, I like the first half just fine, but yeah, it very much was a test of patience through most of it, and I'm pretty sure 11 is my favourite episode yet so far so it does sting more after that. Though it also bothers me less in a way because I just got spoiled with a really good episode the week before? I wonder how I would've felt about 10 - 12 -11 (mostly) being the order.
Regarding Audrey, that scene really didn't work for me but I'm not as down on her as a character as some of you appear to be. Like, in terms of how she ended up it makes enough sense of me unless you assumed Billy Zane and her did end up together somehow, and I didn't think she was that unlikable? I mean, her husband seemed like just as much of an asshole, I assume it's more of a dysfunctional marriage thing rather than something to judge her on.
I wasn't particularly looking forward to her return in the first place though, so that might help. I mean, I really like her but it's not something I'd get extra hyped for? There are plenty of returning Twin Peaks characters I love.
Also, I didn't pay attention to any Twitter hype out of fear of getting spoiled somehow. Yeah... that can't have helped.
Regarding Audrey, that scene really didn't work for me but I'm not as down on her as a character as some of you appear to be. Like, in terms of how she ended up it makes enough sense of me unless you assumed Billy Zane and her did end up together somehow, and I didn't think she was that unlikable? I mean, her husband seemed like just as much of an asshole, I assume it's more of a dysfunctional marriage thing rather than something to judge her on.
I wasn't particularly looking forward to her return in the first place though, so that might help. I mean, I really like her but it's not something I'd get extra hyped for? There are plenty of returning Twin Peaks characters I love.
Also, I didn't pay attention to any Twitter hype out of fear of getting spoiled somehow. Yeah... that can't have helped.
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