Im not naive to believe that hes clean. I believe most fighters are using peds. Although i do admit i like throwing cheap shots to get a rise out of you sensitive fucks.
UFC 143 |OT|: Diaz vs Conduit - The Start of the 209 Era
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Im not naive to believe that hes clean. I believe most fighters are using peds. Although i do admit i like throwing cheap shots to get a rise out of you sensitive fucks.
So, by the time GSP is 38, he'll start having a wicked right hand?
Finally a usage of a denzel gif i can get behind.
Thank God for TRT.
TheKaeptain
Banned
So do I but you seem to point out GSP more than anyone else.
TheNatural
My Member!
Well Aldo fought 4 times in 2009. Silva I have a problem with as well not fighting enough. JDS just got the belt, and Edgar and Maynard was postponed due to injury, and no one seemed to give much of a shit about Frankie until he beat BJ.
GSP and Anderson definitely seem more concerned about protecting their legacy instead of getting off their ass and fighting. With as much stroke as they have, you don't think either could have told Dana "hey I want to fight more than twice this year, put me up against anyone." Doesn't happen though. At least Anderson went outside of his division a couple times to get fights though.
ArisenDragon
Member
This event should be awesome tomorrow, can't wait for the main event should be a great fight.
I remember at one point Nick was complaining that Strikeforce was overworking him. He never fought more than 3 times a year.
Edit: http://www.mmafighting.com/2011/04/10/nick-diaz-thinks-he-will-get-suspended-after-paul-daley-win
Edit: http://www.mmafighting.com/2011/04/10/nick-diaz-thinks-he-will-get-suspended-after-paul-daley-win
TheNatural
My Member!
Don't say "so you're saying" about something I'm not saying. Leave that shit to the political threads, no place in MMA threads mang.
Second, you know what I mean. Listing a bunch of guys who aren't established champions like Anderson and GSP and just recently got to the top, is different than guys who have control over their own destiny. Anderson and GSP are top PPV draws, they dictate what they do and when they do it. When healthy, either guy can go to Dana and say they want to go fight a fucking broom stick on PPV, they'll go fight a broom stick. There's no excuse for either to fight only twice a year.
Shit playboy i got 2 out of the 3 most blatant users in my avatar. Although historically owgp wand was the most obvious case ever.
TheKaeptain
Banned
How is GSP obvious? Do I really have to post a picture of a man that has gotten caught more than once to prove that the body isn't a good indicator of who uses or not?
TheKaeptain
Banned
And most obvious is fucking Rashad 2.0 that guy left Jackson's and got jacked.
TheNatural
My Member!
Time for some Friday Night Fights. Fighting the way it's meant to be, where guys can fight on two weeks notice for a couple hundred bucks and a pack of PBR, and then fight against two more weeks later.
I'm not putting words in your mouth. Look, you were the one in here last year saying 170 sucks, GSP has cleaned it out, Condit isn't a contender, Ellenberger isn't a contender, etc, etc. You can't then turn around and call him a lazy asshole for not having anyone to fight in between May and October of 2011.
Title contenders don't grow on trees and that's a major reason why the champions don't fight more often.
ItAintEasyBeinCheesy
it's 4th of July in my asshole
BAH GAWD is that some definition?
TheNatural
My Member!
Cleaned out means he can't fight? The division had been cleaned out for years, he was fighting bums for 3 years beforehand, why does he need to only do that twice a year? It's not like he had anyone to fight when he was going up against almighty Dan Hardy either.
So now your argument is that GSP cleaned out 170 in 2008 (when he won the damn title) and has been fighting cans since?
TheNatural
My Member!
Dude just stop. The point is, he wasn't fighting anyone that special in that time anyway, while you're arguing he had to wait for a contender to emerge. Who was a real contender though that emerged? No one. He fought who was there, and whether that is twice a year or four times a year, it's not like anyone made for a super fight, be it Hardy, Koscheck, Shields, or whoever.
IMO I think he and Anderson should have been doing a hell of a lot more to help the sport by fighting more, that's all. And I don't think they were hamstrung by being a "product of the system" like you say - waiting for #1 contenders to win qualifying fights. I think either one of them could have called up Dana and said "I want to fight in 3 months, find me someone" and Dana would have more than obliged.
If you have some source that they did just that and Dana said "no just wait for a #1 contender we don't have an opponent", I'll believe you. Otherwise, I don't for a second believe they were caught up in waiting for contenders to emerge, they always could fight when they wanted, they're way too big of draws for Dana to tell them no if they said that.
We've talked about this before, but I honestly believe the UFC has their champions paced to build title fights and produce contenders. Even at the pace GSP is going you have Koscheck knocking on the door for a 3rd time. I've voiced my disapproval of this bullshit, but from the UFC's perspective, having guys blow the doors off a division is bad business in the long run. I think they're letting JBJ do it because so many of their draws are on ice at the moment. He is the exception not the rule. The last time a champion fought 4 times a year it was Chuck carrying the company on his back.
TheKaeptain
Banned
lol Diaz
What the hell do you think a #1 contender fight is for, Natural? Give me a break with this shit.
The long periods of time between title defenses for GSP are between the Alves and Hardy fight and between the Hardy and Koscheck fight.
Mike Swick and Martin Kampmann were to determine the #1 contender at UFC 103 but Swick got hurt and Kampmann fought and was defeated by Paul Daley instead. Uncle Dana then makes Swick and Hardy to determine a new #1 contender at UFC 105. During this time, GSP was recovering from an injury. What an asshole!
After defeating Hardy, Uncle Dana wanted GSP to do Ultimate Fighter against the winner of Koscheck vs. Daley. Obviously, that process delays a title fight. Fucking scumbag!
After blinding Josh Koscheck in December 2010, Georges fights Shields 4 months later at 129. Nick Diaz comes over from Strikeforce in June and their fight is immediately booked for UFC 137. The rest is history.
Where in all this do you find somewhere to lay blame on GSP?
The long periods of time between title defenses for GSP are between the Alves and Hardy fight and between the Hardy and Koscheck fight.
Mike Swick and Martin Kampmann were to determine the #1 contender at UFC 103 but Swick got hurt and Kampmann fought and was defeated by Paul Daley instead. Uncle Dana then makes Swick and Hardy to determine a new #1 contender at UFC 105. During this time, GSP was recovering from an injury. What an asshole!
After defeating Hardy, Uncle Dana wanted GSP to do Ultimate Fighter against the winner of Koscheck vs. Daley. Obviously, that process delays a title fight. Fucking scumbag!
After blinding Josh Koscheck in December 2010, Georges fights Shields 4 months later at 129. Nick Diaz comes over from Strikeforce in June and their fight is immediately booked for UFC 137. The rest is history.
Where in all this do you find somewhere to lay blame on GSP?
champs should fight 3 times a year.
and in the time that GSP has been shelved a new crop of guys have emerged that could be interesting fights for him. diaz, condit, ellenberger, hendricks, mcdonald, etc. there are plenty of fights for him to take if he wants to be active. or maybe he'll go up to 185 after anderson retires, but there are plenty of guys to fight at 170# that would be good fights imo.
and in the time that GSP has been shelved a new crop of guys have emerged that could be interesting fights for him. diaz, condit, ellenberger, hendricks, mcdonald, etc. there are plenty of fights for him to take if he wants to be active. or maybe he'll go up to 185 after anderson retires, but there are plenty of guys to fight at 170# that would be good fights imo.
I swear, it's like I have to go over this every month with you people.
Post-Hardy, the delay was the UFC's booking, because they put GSP and Kos on TUF.
After that, he fights four months later against Shields. (not an unreasonable gap).
After that, the UFC has no viable challenger, are forced to bring in Diaz from Strikeforce, book him for an October fight against GSP. Again, the booking is entirely in the UFC's court.
Then GSP gets injured and we're in the clusterfuck that we are at the moment.
You have to be consistent, you have to be rational.
Jon Jones' 2011 schedule is the aberration for a top 3 fighter, not the norm.
Let's have a little trivia time then. Besides JBJ, who was the last UFC champion to defend their belt 3 times in a year?
Thank you mother fucker!
Your average time between a title fight is roughly 4-6 months and GSP held to that schedule unless either injured or doing TUF. He fought Fitch 4 months after Serra, fought Fatboy 5 months after that, Alves 6 months after that and Shields 4 months after Koscheck.
Don't talk to me about Jones when that dude is 24 with far less wear and tear on his body than Anderson and Georges.
Cruz...oh shit, only fought twice in 2011.
Frankie Edg---oh shit, only fought twice in 2011.
GSP ---oh shit, once in 2011.
Anderson SIlva -- fuck, only fought twice in 2011.
Jon Jones -- four times.
Cain (former champ) --- fuck, only fought once in 2011.
JDS --- fuck, fought twice in 2011.
In conclusion, end yourself, yacobod.
Chuck, Anderson, Cruz I'm not sure who else. The problem is we don't get a lot of long title reigns in MMA.
Either way I'm still down for champs fighting 3 times a year. Obviously injuries can fuck up the best plans, but lack of "contenders" isn't really a good excuse. The premiere mma organization in the world should have a lot of guys in the mix at any time. The other thing that fucked up the title pictures in the past 5 years is that stupid Ultimate Fighter TV show. Nothing like holding a division hostage for 6 to 8 months for white trash reality television.
You'd be surprised.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UFC_champions
Enjoy.
1. def. Nate Marquardt at UFC 73 on Jul 7, 2007
2. def. Rich Franklin at UFC 77 on Oct 20, 2007
3. def. Dan Henderson at UFC 82 on Mar 1, 2008
4. def. Patrick Côté at UFC 90 on Oct 25, 2008
5. def. Thales Leites at UFC 97 on Apr 18, 2009
6. def. Demian Maia at UFC 112 on Apr 10, 2010
7. lost to Chael Sonnen at UFC 117 on Aug 7, 2010
8. def. Vitor Belfort at UFC 126 on Feb 5, 2011
9. def. Yushin Okami at UFC 134 on Aug 27, 2011
TheNatural
My Member!
Alright, whatever dude. Agree to disagree I guess. I guess it's technically impossible for GSP or Silva to fight more than twice a year, UFC is holding them back, etc. I just refuse to believe that, and that *if* they wanted they could fight more often and there wouldn't be a strict contender system. No one is going to oppose these guys fighting more regardless of who it is because they're such big draws.
Jones told Dana he wanted to fight again, that's why he got Machida instead of waiting for Evans. He took the initiative to do that. Rampage took the initiative to get on the Japan card. I don't think for those with the stroke to do so (Anderson and GSP), they would ever be turned down to fight more.
If we went division by division and listed all the guys "in the mix", how many could we actually name?
Bitch please. Chamber, Capt, and you should get a room and have a glorious GSP circle jerk and get it out of your system.
Heel, honestly its disingenuous to not count Anderson Silva. you should count the Travis Lutter fight in 2007. It's not Anderson's fault that he couldn't make weight. He essentially defended the belt 3 times that year. And in 2008 he fought 3 times, one time at 205 against Irvin.
No, Jones signed up for 140 because he was told Rashad would be ready. After Rashad pulled out, he decided to stay and do the UFC a solid because the card had no main event. That's Jon's own explanation.
Come on. You know damn well how the UFC determines title matches and it's certainly not as simple as the champ going, "Give me some random guy to fight."
are you saying that fights with Diaz, Condit, Ellenberger, Hendricks, McDonald, Kampmann are not interesting fights?
There are plenty of good fights at 170# now that Fitch has been eliminated from contention, and the old guard guys like Alves and Kos are lower on the rung.
So I suppose 170# is in better shape then most weight classes, but 155# is a shark tank so I'm not going to bother listing guys there.
155 and 170 are the two best divisions in MMA. What about the rest of them? How many guys at 145 do you think actually deserve a shot at Aldo? After Cruz creams Faber again, who's next at 135? Heavyweight right now is Junior, Alistair and Mir on the outside.
135 and 145 are the worst division no doubt. It's hard to even come up with guys who will credibly challenge Cruz or Aldo. No argument there.
I honestly think Anderson has been ducking a rematch with Chael Sonnen. Styles make fights and I think Sonnen is as close to kryptonite for Silva. Let's say Anderson finally relinquishes the belt at 185#, then I think that division is wide open with Sonnen as champ. I think several guys could give him a good fight. Fuck we just seen Bisping give him a really close fight.
I don't see any viable contenders at 205# for JBJ. SO Dana and Joe Silva are going to have to build some talent there.
I think HW is pretty healthy. JDS vs Reem. Then you have Cain on the outside. Perennial contenders like Zombie Nog and Frank Mir. Guys like Barnett and Cormierr are coming over from Strikeforce. The romanticized signing of Fedor if it ever happens. fringe guys like Werdum, Country, Carwin, Kongo. They can always make something happen for a title fight at HW.
Either way they can make fights happen. Squash matches make the champs look good and build their brand too if there isn't a legit guy to fight, see Dan Hardy, Patrick Cote, etc etc etc.
I honestly think Anderson has been ducking a rematch with Chael Sonnen. Styles make fights and I think Sonnen is as close to kryptonite for Silva. Let's say Anderson finally relinquishes the belt at 185#, then I think that division is wide open with Sonnen as champ. I think several guys could give him a good fight. Fuck we just seen Bisping give him a really close fight.
I don't see any viable contenders at 205# for JBJ. SO Dana and Joe Silva are going to have to build some talent there.
I think HW is pretty healthy. JDS vs Reem. Then you have Cain on the outside. Perennial contenders like Zombie Nog and Frank Mir. Guys like Barnett and Cormierr are coming over from Strikeforce. The romanticized signing of Fedor if it ever happens. fringe guys like Werdum, Country, Carwin, Kongo. They can always make something happen for a title fight at HW.
Either way they can make fights happen. Squash matches make the champs look good and build their brand too if there isn't a legit guy to fight, see Dan Hardy, Patrick Cote, etc etc etc.
TheNatural
My Member!
He fought less than three months after his last fight. You're telling me Dana made that match on purpose? GSP or Silva would balk at anything less than three months.
And with GSP and Silva it realy is as simple as requesting fights. You list all these other champs, but you know that these guys are completely different than other guys. They're the UFC's biggest draws. Maybe if it is Edgar, Cruz, JDS, or Aldo I could see it, because they're all mostly interchangeable. Aldo PPV did what, around a couple hundred thousand PPV buys? I doubt Edgar-Bendo does much more. Of course with those numbers it really doesn't matter if you get two headliners apiece from each all year because they're all about the same. Maybe with those guys, it is different, but it's not with the two biggest draws in the UFC.
I don't buy for a second if Dana could get GSP or Anderson to fight a Jon Jones schedule he would take it in a second. I don't think either want that schedule though and they want a part time schedule as champion, and I think that's completely lame considering the more they fight, the better it is for the sport.
Hahaha a shocking moment in MMA-GAF history right here.
How could you not include Hunto, friend?
The question is, in a time of over saturation, does it make sense for the UFC's bottom line and future to sell squash matches? Will people pay to see champions fight guys who have no build or the perception of a real chance of winning? Sounds like a bad idea to me.
CONTEXT FOOL.
There are no worthy contenders to either champ in those divisions.
Unless you want to see pathetic mighty mouse throw head kicks that don't elevate above Cruz's torso 10 times in a fight. or see Cruz/Faber 3 or 4.
And I'd love to get a hearty laugh if somehow Hioki gets past Bartimus so we can get a new hightlight reel KO for 2012.
Yeah, I don't like the squash match idea. That didn't do anything to sell Strikeforce to viewers and quite frankly, the idea of Anderson Silva fighting the likes of Brian Stann on a $60 PPV disturbs me greatly.
me leaving out top 10 HW mark hunt was a shameful mistake.
i don't think it really matters. guys like GSP, anderson, or JBJ will draw. I believe GSP vs Hardy did like 800k ppv buys, and that was probably one of the biggest squash matches the UFC ever put on in a title fight, but they sold us that it was "GSPs biggest challenge to date."
the machine will sell us shit and tell us it's prime rib. and we will fucking eat it up.
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