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[crayman]

The way I think about it is how much of government policy actually affects people in any meaningful way. If you read the news you see all these stories about how terrible everything is - but what has that translated to in my everyday life?

Well, my wage went up a bit due to them fiddling around with Income Tax. That's pretty much it - all my interactions with the NHS have been great and speedy, I don't have kids in schools, I didn't need police, I don't know anyone who has needed a food bank, I don't know anyone effected by disability cuts, etc.

So nothing really bad has happened as a result of tory policies, and I'd bet that's the same for a very large number of people. In order to really get someone to act and vote for change, it has to become personal. Otherwise it's just an appeal to empathy and selflessness, which sadly is not all that effective.

 

[Meadows]

This Abbott stuff is just the worst timing ever. The day before the vote and Labour don't have a Home Sec.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

A lot of people just don't believe that Labour would be better. Sure Labour can offer the moon, but if the economy fails and the country goes bankrupt then the fallout would be a lot worse than a few cuts being offered by the Tories. They might argue it's a choice between not paying nurses enough and not paying them at all!

You also have a lot of selfish people to consider. All they will care about is who offers the lowest taxes, and Tories will always win that fight. A hell of a lot of people in this country are just comfortable. Food banks and disability cuts are things they only see in media, or maybe not at all. Meanwhile their own lives are easy/good enough that they aren't willing to risk voting for massive change.

And tribalism. Their families/friends/media support Tories and they'll do the same, like we're cheering for a football team rather than discussing how best to run the country. (This last point applies to both sides, of course).

I mean that is the answer, its just one that saddens me beyond belief.

I think the saddest part is that it leads you to start thinking "How to do combat these problems?" and then you immediately remember that due to the way the system and MSM are rigged the chances are you arent ever going to get through to them unless things get so bad that they have to acknowledge it but if we reach that point we are probably a couple years away from a Mad Max style life.

 

[*Splinter]

Corbyn should have done this two weeks ago.

Anyway, now's the time for the hard left to put up. All I've heard in the last couple of years is "we shouldn't hold a centrist platform because the people want a genuine alternative, and if there is one, the people will vote overwhelmingly for it". Well after you've finished your six hours of campaigning tonight, you better get out and vote for Corbyn first thing tomorrow. I don't want to hear anything along the lines of: "oh I changed to the Greens because I don't like Corbyn's granola policy" or "I didn't vote because Corbyn's just the same as May", and I expect nothing less than 80% turnout tomorrow.

Remember: anything less than a hung parliament against this woeful Conservative campaign, and there'll never be a hard-left government ever again.

Of course the hard left will vote, but they don't make up 80% of the country.

I know there's a lot of young support for the left and a lot of young people that won't vote, but I don't think those two groups are the same people. The non voters are more going to be those that don't know/care about politics, and there's a hell of a lot of those.

 

[mjontrix]

Real talk: does any country have a worse press than ours? At least in terms of free countries? It's beyond disgraceful and the amount of damage it's caused to our democracy can't be overstated.

Australia.

Murdoch domination.

He literally got a political party elected (Liberals under Tony Abbott and Malcolm Turnbull)

 

[weekev]

The frustration thing is that these red top rags are fuelling the confirmation bias that unfortunately the majority of the country is looking for which will likely have a big impact in tomorrow's results. Like it or not these scandalous headlines are likely going to have enough influence the actually impact the result of the election. The actual sane discussion around how we deal with terror is being lost in the frankly libellous headlines that Corbyn is a terror apologist.

In actual fact Corbyn doesn't believe in detaining people who have done nothing wrong for extended periods of time and would instead refer to have 10000 extra police on the streets.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

Corbyn should have done this two weeks ago.

Yep. A couple of weeks ago I asked my wife if there was anything that would change her vote from Labour, and she basically said "If Dianne Abbot somehow became leader". Clearly her performances in the media have been a concern for many.

 

[mo60]

I don't know if this was posted here yet? The driver of the strong and stable bus is okay which is good.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...onservatives-theresa-may-advert-a7776136.html

 

[deadduck]

This Abbott stuff is just the worst timing ever. The day before the vote and Labour don't have a Home Sec.

Hyperbole - she'd be gone anyway and she's been replaced.

 

[Orbis]

The frustration thing is that these red top rags are fuelling the confirmation bias that unfortunately the majority of the country is looking for which will likely have a big impact in tomorrow's results. Like it or not these scandalous headlines are likely going to have enough influence the actually impact the result of the election. The actual sane discussion around how we deal with terror is being lost in the frankly libellous headlines that Corbyn is a terror apologist.

In actual fact Corbyn doesn't believe in detaining people who have done nothing wrong for extended periods of time and would instead refer to have 10000 extra police on the streets.

I had some hope that the press wouldn't be able to assemble an all out assault at this stage but they have. May's suggestion she'll dismantle human rights will be a massive vote winner too.

Anyway I'll be updating my own projection tonight, it didn't look good at all last time I checked though.

 

[*Splinter]

Hyperbole - she'd be gone anyway and she's been replaced.

Temporarily replaced. I don't know who the next Home Secretary will be if Labour win.

 

[JonathanEx]

Good guidelines for results night viewing from Buzzfeed, what to look out for throughout the night: https://www.buzzfeed.com/jamesball/...-on-uk-general?utm_term=.biy59Dbro#.iiKv5mYOK

 

[Rodelero]

Temporarily replaced. I don't know who the next Home Secretary will be if Labour win.

You don't know who the chancellor will be if the Conservatives win.

 

[deadduck]

Temporarily replaced. I don't know who the next Home Secretary will be if Labour win.

I didn't think we knew that before she went off sick. She was on a "strong and stable" peg.

 

[Jezbollah]

Jesus.. this Abbott stuff. Labour just shot themselves in the foot on the last day of the media blitz. Why now??!

Another thing to remember, when talking about the result of the election - the 2018 Constituency consolidation.

 

[*Splinter]

You don't know who the chancellor will be if the Conservatives win.

Phillip Hammond

Unless he gets the sack, which as far as I understand could happen to any cabinet minister at any time.

I didn't think we knew that before she went off sick. She was on a "strong and stable" peg.

This is true too, but doesn't negate the statement.

 

[mo60]

You don't know who the chancellor will be if the Conservatives win.

Wouldn't it still be hammond unless May moves him from his position.

 

[Cpt Lmao]

Of course the hard left will vote, but they don't make up 80% of the country.

I know there's a lot of young support for the left and a lot of young people that won't vote, but I don't think those two groups are the same people. The non voters are more going to be those that don't know/care about politics, and there's a hell of a lot of those.

Reprsentatives from the hard left told me that the overall electorate have been gagging for someone like Corbyn for years, and that all of the non-voters who are disillusioned with politics will vote overwhelmingly to deliver a stunning Labour majority tomorrow.

Like I said, if this doesn't happen: No left-wing politics ever again.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

Jesus.. this Abbott stuff. Labour just shot themselves in the foot on the last day of the media blitz. Why now??!

Another thing to remember, when talking about the result of the election - the 2018 Constituency consolidation.

Honestly, I think it's played out better than worse? People are just happy Abbott has gone. Had played well on the doorstep so far, from my experience.

 

[BossDarkseid]

Phillip Hammond

Unless he gets the sack, which as far as I understand could happen to any cabinet minister at any time.


This is true too, but doesn't negate the statement.

Isn't there supposed to be a rift between May + Hammond? Or at least the only Cabinet Minister she reportedly has a personal relationship with is David Davis. If they get in I imagine there'll be a slight reshuffle under the guise of Blue Bullshit.

 

[Chinner]

Good guidelines for results night viewing from Buzzfeed, what to look out for throughout the night: https://www.buzzfeed.com/jamesball/...-on-uk-general?utm_term=.biy59Dbro#.iiKv5mYOK

I know the Tories will win big, but it's going to sting regardless.

What do you think, should we start a podcast Jonathan?

 

[Dirtyshubb]

Honestly, I think it's played out better than worse? People are just happy Abbott has gone. Had played well on the doorstep so far, from my experience.

Considering the first thing 99% of Labours detractors say "Yeah but do you want Abbott as Home Sec?!" i would say its likely this could be a good thing with some people and could sway them over.

How many though of course we wont know but i would say it should be a benefit more than a negative.

 

[Mr. Sam]

Phillip Hammond

Unless he gets the sack, which as far as I understand could happen to any cabinet minister at any time.

Wouldn't it still be hammond unless May moves him from his position.

I think the point is Hammond is heavily tipped to be getting the boot in a broad, post-election cabinet reshuffle.

 

[*Splinter]

Reprsentatives from the hard left told me that the overall electorate have been gagging for someone like Corbyn for years, and that all of the non-voters who are disillusioned with politics will vote overwhelmingly to deliver a stunning Labour majority tomorrow.

Like I said, if this doesn't happen: No left-wing politics ever again.

The left have claimed that there is more of an appetite for leftist policies than previously believed / claimed by more centrist Labour members. That much has already been proven to be true with the popularity of Labour's current manifesto.

Disinterested voters (particularly the youth) is an entirely seperate problem.

 

[JonathanEx]

I know the Tories will win big, but it's going to sting regardless.

What do you think, should we start a podcast Jonathan?

The PoliOhShitCast

 

[Rodelero]

Phillip Hammond

Unless he gets the sack, which as far as I understand could happen to any cabinet minister at any time.

Wouldn't it still be hammond unless May moves him from his position.

There is a lot of speculation that Hammond will lose the job after the election. I used the example for this precise reason - it's hard to complain about the Abbott situation when the same may well happen for the Conservatives. Obviously, if Hammond does move, there may end up being a series of cabinet changes for the Tories. Hell, if the Tories don't gain significant numbers of seats, we may end up with a Conservative government and no Theresa May. This is the reality of British politics.

 

[Elaugaufein]

Australia.

Murdoch domination.

He literally got a political party elected (Liberals under Tony Abbott and Malcolm Turnbull)

Yup. Murdoch Media is about 70% of our Print Media, a 50% stake in our Pay TV and a good stake in one of our free to air TV channels (though one that is imploding but that just makes it easier for it to get bought out by the Murdochs).

Though I don't think you could give him Abbott that win was too large. Turnbull though ? Maybe but it's debatable since half the Murdoch press are pretty sure he's actually a deep cover Homosexual Watermelon.

 

[*Splinter]

There is a lot of speculation that Hammond will lose the job after the election. I used the example for this precise reason - it's hard to complain about the Abbott situation when the same may well happen for the Conservatives. Obviously, if Hammond does move, there may end up being a series of cabinet changes for the Tories. Hell, if the Tories don't gain significant numbers of seats, we may end up with a Conservative government and no Theresa May. This is the reality of British politics.

You can complain about both!

I've somehow ended up playing Devil's advocate here. I think it's good that Abbott is gone. Good for Labour (she was a liability) and presumably good for her (I'm going to take the health concerns at face value). I also think it's "the worst possible timing" for this to have happened. She should have gone either weeks ago or (as Labour must've hoped) after the election.

"Worst possible" sounds bad, but means "least good" in this case.

 

[Goodlife]

Any last minute polling data out today?

 

[Cpt Lmao]

The left have claimed that there is more of an appetite for leftist policies than previously believed / claimed by more centrist Labour members. That much has already been proven to be true with the popularity of Labour's current manifesto.

Disinterested voters (particularly the youth) is an entirely seperate problem.

If the manifesto is really that popular, then we will see the foretold stunning Labour victory tomorrow and neither of us will have anything to worry about.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow, and the very concept of left-wing politics will no longer exist.

 

[*Splinter]

If the manifesto is really that popular, then we will see the foretold stunning Labour victory tomorrow and neither of us will have anything to worry about.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow, and the very concept of left-wing politics will no longer exist.

This is rubbish, and sounding more and more like what you are hoping will happen.

 

[slider]

Poor old Hammond. I think at times he's been reasonable with his "business" head on. Perhaps there's no room for that sort of thing.

 

[BrokenIcarus]

If the manifesto is really that popular, then we will see the foretold stunning Labour victory tomorrow and neither of us will have anything to worry about.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow, and the very concept of left-wing politics will no longer exist.

What does this even mean?

 

[itsbenoclock]

https://twitter.com/hrtbps/status/872360051289325568

I don't have much to contribute beyond links to tweets now

 

[Cpt Lmao]

This is rubbish, and sounding more and more like what you are hoping will happen.

Nope, I firmly support the party. Just last week I was in Ergon House, phonebanking alongside Mayor Sadiq Khan and London Young Labour for Tooting candidate Rosena Allin-Khan. I disagree with the direction the party has taken, but I still very much want us to win.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow; left, politics, gone.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

If the manifesto is really that popular, then we will see the foretold stunning Labour victory tomorrow and neither of us will have anything to worry about.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow, and the very concept of left-wing politics will no longer exist.

You could have a minfesto that promised to pay you £1m, all fully costed and it wouldnt be enough to suddenly switch everyone over to the left.

The facts are, Labours vote share is looking to be its highest in years and that is because of Corbyn and the Labour manifesto and the growth in the polls is nothing short of historic.

You also have to consider that its not just about getting your message out, you are also fighting around 30 years of right wing medias influence on a populace who are often not engaged in politics other than whats on the news.

The facts have shown that the more people see Corbyn, the more they like him and his position. Breaking through those years of propaganda isnt done with the flick of a switch, it takes years and measure to prevent the press from continuing to do it and we dont have that right now.

Corbyn and Labour potentially could do less well on gaining seats but chances are they have managed to energise and the base more than anyone could have imagined a couple of months ago. The real issue he faces is the inevitable back stabbing he will get from the Blair-ites, we cant afford to lose the progress Corbyn has given to the left. Keep him on and work with whatever mess the Tories cause with Brexit and hopefully come back even stronger.

 

[Mr. Sam]

The most alarmist take I'd read until this point is that it would take Labour at least a decade to rebuild. "Left wing politics extinguished forever" is a tad further.

 

[Protome]

Nope, I firmly support the party. Just last week I was in Ergon House, phonebanking alongside Mayor Sadiq Khan and London Young Labour for Tooting candidate Rosena Allin-Khan. I disagree with the direction the party has taken, but I still very much want us to win.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow; left, politics, gone.

It's true, and because of the failure in the last election of centrist politics all parties will now go right/far right.

Because logic.

 

[liquidtmd]

Nope, I firmly support the party. Just last week I was in Ergon House, phonebanking alongside Mayor Sadiq Khan and London Young Labour for Tooting candidate Rosena Allin-Khan. I disagree with the direction the party has taken, but I still very much want us to win.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow; left, politics, gone.

Respectfully, I tend to agree with earlier sentiments in the thread.

Conservative without or with small majority tomorrow = they get to own Brexit. Whilst damaging to the country, Tories get destroyed and Left / Labour resurge in 2022

 

[PJV3]

Respectfully, I tend to agree with earlier sentiments in the thread.

Conservative without or with small majority tomorrow = they get to own Brexit. Whilst damaging to the country, Tories get destroyed and Left / Labour resurge in 2022

Especially after this election where the Tories have really looked terrible and will get support from people through gritted teeth.

I don't think there's much love for this government out there.

 

[Brat-Sampson]

Yeah, even in the face of a loss tomorrow it's highly disingenuous to discard the incredible campaign that's been fought and how much the gap has narrowed over the last few weeks.

The folks claiming anything less than outright victory means Obviously a return to New Labour is the only way to go are embarrassing and clearly can't wait to see their party lose so they can (they hope) get back to business as usual. This does not need to happen and indeed shouldn't happen.

 

[deadduck]

I don't think the left-wing is dead after this, it has a great opportunity after Bregsit goes horribly wrong.

 

[TimmmV]

The Sun has an interview with May in today's paper, dominated by terrorism discussion as you'd expect. But it's the editors comment at the end that's the most insane aspect. They don't think May's actions in trying to get Google and Facebook to take down extremist content goes far enough. Instead:

It's mental how "the nuclear option" appears to have suddenly become "the first thing we should do"

Nope, I firmly support the party. Just last week I was in Ergon House, phonebanking alongside Mayor Sadiq Khan and London Young Labour for Tooting candidate Rosena Allin-Khan. I disagree with the direction the party has taken, but I still very much want us to win.

But be warned: no victory tomorrow; left, politics, gone.

What? Why does the left only get one chance to fail at an election? This makes no sense unless you actually want them to fail

 

[SlipperyFishes]

Especially after this election where the Tories have really looked terrible and will get support from people through gritted teeth.

I don't think there's much love for this government out there.

As long as the checks keep coming from News International then the media and the Tories will continue fuckkng people over until you can't get news from the Internet due to censorship, only the media.

You won't be able to afford healthcare because the NHS is now private. "Everyone must pay their share. If you need more care then you pay more"

Public transport is also private because "fuel is expensive and seats are in demand"

If you can't cycle somewhere you're screwed. Oh wait, you don't own a bike?

Fuck you, got mine. Love, Theresa May.

 

[Little Old Man]

I don't think the left-wing is dead after this, it has a great opportunity after Bregsit goes horribly wrong.

I still say that for whoever wins this election it's a poisoned chalice.

 

[Real Hero]

If labour actually throw away Corbyns manifesto out of spite and are too stupid to realise they just need someone without Corbyns past to sell it then there's no hope for them

 

[SlipperyFishes]

If labour actually throw away Corbyns manifesto out of spite and are too stupid to realise they just need someone without Corbyns past to sell it then there's no hope for them

Corbyn isn't actually the problem. He's shown leadership qualities.

The problem is that he hasn't been given a fair shake at all.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

Corbyn isn't actually the problem. He's shown leadership qualities.

The problem is that he hasn't been given a fair shake at all.

This!

I also think that after this election the right no longer have any ammunition for Corbyn. What are they going to do, repeat this whole election again?

He weathered the storm and has grown his stock in the public eye and will have a great base to work from regardless.

 

[SlipperyFishes]

This!

I also think that after this election the right no longer have any ammunition for Corbyn. What are they going to do, repeat this whole election again?

He weathered the storm and has grown his stock in the public eye and will have a great base to work from regardless.

How many papers called out Theresa May by name regarding police cuts?

None. They were too busy calling Corbyn a terrorist lover and a friend to Jihadi everywhere.

Motherfuckers.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

How many papers called out Theresa May by name regarding police cuts?

None. They were too busy calling Corbyn a terrorist lover and a friend to Jihadi everywhere.

Motherfuckers.

Its so infuriating.

Just so much double standards and bullshit that we have to deal with.