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UK PoliGAF |OT2| - We Blue Ourselves

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T

travisbickle

Member
ferrasvansen said:
I feel ashamed to be Scottish, after everything Thatcher and Co. did to my country I never thought I'd see results like this in my lifetime, how quickly folk forget.
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People are worried about a second referendum.

So what do Labour do now if there's no Corbyn backlash? I bet some are wondering if these results are because they shat on him too much or not enough.
 
W

Walshicus

Member
Would be interesting to know what the breakdown of votes by party and voter nationality were in Scotland. E.g what percentage of Tory voters are English expats.


Regardless, a thoroughly boring voting period...
 
F

ferrasvansen

Member
travisbickle said:
People are worried about a second referendum.

So what do Labour do now if there's no Corbyn backlash? I bet some are wondering if these results are because they shat on him too much or not enough.
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I think Labour are finished here in Scotland, at least for the short to medium term. However i think they shoud change to pro independence, otherwise i see no future for them. The funny thing is Labour did better in England and Wales than expected last night, maybe Corbyn is not the disaster everyone made him out to be.
 
M

Maledict

Member
ferrasvansen said:
I think Labour are finished here in Scotland, at least for the short to medium term. However i think they shoud change to pro independence, otherwise i see no future for them. The funny thing is Labour did better in England and Wales than expected last night, maybe Corbyn is not the disaster everyone made him out to be.
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Labour aren't going to switch to pro-independence. They are already the most left wing part at Holyrood after the Greens, they need to bed down and start winning voters back - and be given complete autonomy from Westminster. The lib Dem results show that a recovery is possible, they just need to stop panicking and just work at it. It's a long term project.
 
M

Mr. Sam

Member
I feel like the political divide in Scotland is no longer left/right, or at least to a much lesser extent, but unionist/nationalist - hence the result.

What time can we expect the results of the mayoral elections? I'm out of the loop.

Edit: Don't worry - saw the schedule further up the page. This is going to feel like an eternity.
 
F

ferrasvansen

Member
Maledict said:
Labour aren't going to switch to pro-independence. They are already the most left wing part at Holyrood after the Greens, they need to bed down and start winning voters back - and be given complete autonomy from Westminster. The lib Dem results show that a recovery is possible, they just need to stop panicking and just work at it. It's a long term project.
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The thing is as the countries demographics change in the coming years and the older voters who kept Scotland in the UK die away, then it will become very difficult to remain pro UK.
 
M

Maledict

Member
ferrasvansen said:
The thing is as the countries demographics change in the coming years and the older voters who kept Scotland in the UK die away, then it will become very difficult to remain pro UK.
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The youth vote was not hugely in support of independence. The bulk of independence voters came from the generation in their 30s and 40s. I.e. Those who were in Scotland and suffered under Thatcher.
 
K

kharma45

Member
A fella I work with came second for the conservatives in his area, seemed to do quite well. He thought it'd be a success if he got 3rd.
 
F

ferrasvansen

Member
Maledict said:
The youth vote was not hugely in support of independence. The bulk of independence voters came from the generation in their 30s and 40s. I.e. Those who were in Scotland and suffered under Thatcher.
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True, but if you consider the huge amount of anti independence feeling amongst the over 55 group it would have been a pretty big win for independence otherwise, and i voted to stay in but i saw that was clearly the case.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
ferrasvansen said:
I think Labour are finished here in Scotland, at least for the short to medium term. However i think they shoud change to pro independence, otherwise i see no future for them. The funny thing is Labour did better in England and Wales than expected last night, maybe Corbyn is not the disaster everyone made him out to be.
Click to expand...

Labour can't go pro-independence, not if they have any ambition to form a UK government. If they do, then they would end up severing their own majority in Westminster and triggering a confidence motion.
 
K

kharma45

Member
Mr. Sam said:
I feel like the political divide in Scotland is no longer left/right, or at least to a much lesser extent, but unionist/nationalist - hence the result.

What time can we expect the results of the mayoral elections? I'm out of the loop.

Edit: Don't worry - saw the schedule further up the page. This is going to feel like an eternity.
Click to expand...

Yay Scotland will have the same shitty elections as us then.
 
M

Maledict

Member
It's also not what they believe in, fundamentally, as a party. Independence would go against a lot of bedrock Labour principles - nationalism is not a key feature of left wing politics in this country.

Got to remember until Alex Salmond the SNP was a right wing party who were nicknamed the Tartan Tories. The SNP have repositioned themselves amazingly well - along with the failure of the opposition to point out how Centrist they are in a number of key areas. They cut the NHS more than the Tori's at Westminster!
 
K

kmag

Member
Maledict said:
Labour aren't going to switch to pro-independence. They are already the most left wing part at Holyrood after the Greens, they need to bed down and start winning voters back - and be given complete autonomy from Westminster. The lib Dem results show that a recovery is possible, they just need to stop panicking and just work at it. It's a long term project.
Click to expand...

Scottish Labour needs to become a separate party from the English Labour party. The Scottish Tories basically ran as the Ruth Davidson party brought to you by the <tiny font> Conservatives </tiny font> and essentially disavowed or ignored pretty much every policy position of their English brethren.

Unfortunately for Scottish Labour, they can't afford to do that.

The system basically worked as intended. The Parliament will generally reflect the votes

SNP...46% of the vote in the constituency votes (and 41% of list votes) got 48% of the seats

Tories got 22% of first votes and 24% of second votes...got 23% of the seats

Labour got 22% and 19% of votes and got just under 20% of the seats

LibDems..7.8% and 4%....5.7 % of seats

Greens...4.6 of list votes..just over 6% of seats
 
F

ferrasvansen

Member
Maledict said:
It's also not what they believe in, fundamentally, as a party. Independence would go against a lot of bedrock Labour principles - nationalism is not a key feature of left wing politics in this country.

Got to remember until Alex Salmond the SNP was a right wing party who were nicknamed the Tartan Tories. The SNP have repositioned themselves amazingly well - along with the failure of the opposition to point out how Centrist they are in a number of key areas. They cut the NHS more than the Tori's at Westminster!
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Yeah i remember how much i viewed the Snp with total disgust as being very much like the Tories, however times change i guess. They have done an amazing job of turning things around, as for the NHS, i think a lot of people realised what was happening but did not care, pretty sad reflection on the current Scottish electorate.
 
F

ferrasvansen

Member
Nicktendo86 said:
Snp failure to get a majority will also put indyref2 on the back burner for a while.
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I think that will change when the UK votes to leave Europe, and the real implications of that happening come to fruition, i will need to stock up on the popcorn for the weeks after that referendum.
 
M

Maledict

Member
Nicktendo86 said:
London rave close apparently with Khan ahead on first prefs.
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It is far too early to be judging the mayoral result - we don't know the breakdown of votes in individual areas to be able to see who is hitting their targets or not. E.g. Only 4% of Croydon and Sutton results are in yet and that's a big chunk of votes in a battleground area.
 
M

Maledict

Member
I am honest to god anxious about the EU referendum. I live and work in central London, and there's no question it would have a hugely negative effect on my area and job. At the same time, I'm in a legally politically restricted post so can't actually campaign on the issue... :-(
 
Z

Zutroy

Member
Poor Kezia, I liked her as well.

From what I heard and seen, it was pretty much a pro/anti independence campaign part two which explains why the tories did so well.

The only thing other than that I remember them talking about is kids.

Still hard to believe the Tories are second in my country, smh.
 
Audioboxer

Audioboxer

Member
George Osborne is happy for Scotland

Congrats to @Ruth_E_Davidson, @David_Cameron & all party activists on extraordinary result in Scotland. We've deprived @theSNP of a majority
Click to expand...

@Ruth_E_Davidson will provide what Scotland has lacked for too long as a strong leader of the new opposition, fighting @theSNP
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Clear that whoever leads Labour, they cannot govern the UK in the future without being propped up by @theSNP
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https://twitter.com/George_Osborne/
 
C

CCS

Banned
Find it very hard to be too happy about Sadiq Khan winning given his determination to fuck my football club (AFC Wimbledon) over.
 
A

Anth1888

Member
phisheep said:
SNP failed to get a majority. How's that going to work? Ally with Greens maybe?
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The SNP and the Tories share the same stance on tax, budget and fracking which the Greens differ in (increased income tax etc). Will be a lot of bartering between parties dependent on issue I would think, plus what they get in return.
 
M

Mr. Sam

Member
CCS said:
Find it very hard to be too happy about Sadiq Khan winning given his determination to fuck my football club (AFC Wimbledon) over.
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What's the story here? I've a friend who's a diehard Wimbledon fan and was enthusiastically doorstepping for Khan over the last few days.
 
C

cabot

Member
It's an improvement over 2011 which was around 50% i believe, but yeah it's pretty poor.


My constituency (Glasgow Kelvin) had a 45% turnout and it was a nice sunny day and quite warm. I was pretty surprised.
 
C

CCS

Banned
Mr. Sam said:
What's the story here? I've a friend who's a diehard Wimbledon fan and was enthusiastically doorstepping for Khan over the last few days.
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So Merton council approved our planning application for our new stadium, but it got called in by Boris recently, so the next mayor will decide on it.

Last year, Khan wrote a letter to the club, calling for the club to review their application. You can read his letter here and the response from Wimbledon here.

The main problem is that Khan's letter is dishonest in the extreme. He mentions that Wandsworth council are against the stadium, and so Wimbledon should review their application. However, as Wimbledon point out, the council's objection was in contradiction to the professional advice of their officers. He fails to mention this, which puts a rather different spin on things. Reading both letters in full, it seems to me like Khan is pandering to a small number of NIMBYs over the majority of local residents (as Wimbledon point out, over 80% of responses from Merton and Wandsworth residents to the statutory consultation were in favour of the new stadium.)

I am deeply disappointed in him for jeopardising the future of the club in an attempt to score cheap political points with a small group of voters.
 
M

Mr Git

Member
Two Labour wins for the city council here and one for Lancs county. The latter is a friend of mine so quite pleased.
 
I

It's Reyn Time!

Member
Beefy said:
Just need Cunt to ditch the NHS crap now...
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And Theresa May to stop trying to get permission to look at photos of your junk, and George Osborbe to learn about numbers, and the DWP to stop treating disabled people like rats and the culture secretary to stop abusing his position to cover up his indiscretions and the prime minister to stop being a tax-dodging, pig-fucking piece of shit. Get that under control, and the elitism, fear mongering, racism, snobbery and general prickishness which are rampant through every level of that party, and we'll be alright!
 
B

Beefy

Member
It's Reyn Time! said:
And Theresa May to stop trying to get permission to look at photos of your junk, and George Osborbe to learn about numbers, and the DWP to stop treating disabled people like rats and the culture secretary to stop abusing his position to cover up his indiscretions and the prime minister to stop being a tax-dodging, pig-fucking piece of shit. Get that under control, and the elitism, fear mongering, racism, snobbery and general prickishness which are rampant through every level of that party, and we'll be alright!
Click to expand...

I was trying to be semi realistic. But yeah all that would be even better.
 
Jezbollah

Jezbollah

Member
So Labour holds Barnet & Camden, after yesterday's voting mess. Majority was 15,000+ so it's unlikely that a recount will happen.
 
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