A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
And get rid of Dormammu too while we're at it.
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Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 |OT2| New Age of Zeroes
- Thread starter enzo_gt
- Start date
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And get rid of Dormammu too while we're at it.
shaowebb
Member
Selecting the images on the side, Cut/pasting the "fix" and "x" images, and finally plopping the copies down on the faces of the cast.
And again its just a scenario thing that is meant to get us thinking about who is dull, or played out in the series really. Between MVC2 and MVC3 a lot of cuts and revisions to old had to be made. I just thought it'd be fun to make us all sit through that scenario and imagine if we had to cut some and tweak others who would we do what to if we had to do a lot of both. We all want everyone and more for sequels, but its an interesting scenario that really gets you thinking when you have to consider cutting to make way for potentially more exciting ideas. Who would you cut if you had to cut some or who do you think is on the verge of being interesting enough to warrant remaining when you have to cut some cast is kind of the point of it.
Karsticles
Member
Easy chops I wouldn't mind:
Chris
Jill
Frank West
The rest are pretty cool. I don't even mind those in the game too much. Chris is a pretty terrible character, though. I generally feel as though these games should focus on characters with superhuman powers and abilities. I.e. Zero is fine, but Haggar? Bleh. It's more about theme than who "deserves" a spot.
I don't have photoshop or anything.
Hahaha, I think you're alone on that one. I think most people agree that Dormammu is one of the best additions to this game among the newcomers. He has style in spades, and is really unique.
crimsonspider89
Banned
TBH my list of who I would cut is huge.
Chris, both DMC twins, Ryu, Chunners, Sent, Shuma. Yeah I like the Marvel roster.
Chris, both DMC twins, Ryu, Chunners, Sent, Shuma. Yeah I like the Marvel roster.
shaowebb
Member
I don't have photoshop or anything.
In that case just open it in paint and type either a red X or a blue F (for fix) onto faces to set it up.
Cool. We're starting to see a lot of recurring names now. Its pretty interesting to imagine choosing who to cut like this if it was our job to do so. I'm seeing a lot of cool answers and opinions on cast. Here I thought I'd be the only one finding Sent to be dull enough by now to toss in favor of making way for new ideas to take his place.
Here's the image again for those that want to get in on this discussion.
Karsticles
Member
I think you just have some series hatred. And Sentinel is a classic character in this series - have some respect.
Eh, I typed the list out already.
Not a lot unless I'm very sure that I want to use the team for a long time. I'd rather be playing.
The only two characters I'd chop off are Jill and Shuma, and even then I'd rather have them get overhauls than being removed.
I do feel that having 4 SF reps and 4 RE reps was a bit much, but they all play pretty differently. I'd say remove Akuma and just buff Ryu a ton since he's the fighting game poster child, though I guess it made sense to Capcom to keep Akuma since he's the first crossover character in Capcom games, and he's a fan favorite. Maybe give Ryu that super from MvC1 where he gets Ken's and Akuma's playstyles again?
Changing up or adding more to the Darkstalkers group would be nice too, I get that those 3 are probably the easier characters to transition over to Marvel, it'd be cool to see others in Marvel 4.
I do feel that having 4 SF reps and 4 RE reps was a bit much, but they all play pretty differently. I'd say remove Akuma and just buff Ryu a ton since he's the fighting game poster child, though I guess it made sense to Capcom to keep Akuma since he's the first crossover character in Capcom games, and he's a fan favorite. Maybe give Ryu that super from MvC1 where he gets Ken's and Akuma's playstyles again?
Changing up or adding more to the Darkstalkers group would be nice too, I get that those 3 are probably the easier characters to transition over to Marvel, it'd be cool to see others in Marvel 4.
For a more serious approach, here are my suggestions (too lazy to do the pic):
*On SF side I have no problem with anyone except Chun Li. Either fix her or replace her. Viper is a quintessential "Marvel" character, Akuma should be in because he is a VS veteran and Ryu because he's the face of SF.
*On RE side I would like to see Nemesis replaced with a heavy character from another Capcom franchise (like PTX) and either Jill or Chris removed. I think Jill should stay but get fixed dramatically and Chris' movelist be changed to a Punisher or Blade character on Marvel. He's basically a guy with guns so there is no shortage of that in the Marvel universe.
*On the DMC side, Trish either has to go or has to be fixed. If she goes, she gets replaced by Nero. I would also fix Vergil to incorporate more of his Nelo Angelo play style to differentiate him further from Dante.
*Tron needs to be replaced with Megaman or Sigma.
*Wright needs fixing. Period.
*One of the Darkstalker characters needs to be replaced with a male Darkstalker character. Either fix or replace Hsien Ko.
The rest of the Capcom side is on point, needs a few more addition and change Spencer to Rad version on default.
Marvel side probably needs even less changes:
*Fix Thor, Iron Fist, Captain America, Super Skrull, Storm, Ghost Rider, Strange and Iron Man. Storm and Thor don't put the elements to great use, their specials aren't that great. Iron Fist needs more air mobility and tools same for Ghost Rider. Captain America needs to be made less boring. Iron Man needs more swag to be authentic and Strange needs fixing of many of his tools/moves. Super Skrull needs to be a better rep of the FF.
*Shuma needs to be replaced. Sorry Shuma lovers but the joke is stale now.
*I don't know what to think of She Hulk, Taskmaster and X-23. Gut instinct says to axe them but they were really well made so it's hard to just simply axe them. Depends on who would replace them, I mean if it's She Hulk vs Ms Marvel I might actually pick the latter... or Scarlet Witch/Psylocke over X-23. Or Moonknight over Taskmaster.
*On SF side I have no problem with anyone except Chun Li. Either fix her or replace her. Viper is a quintessential "Marvel" character, Akuma should be in because he is a VS veteran and Ryu because he's the face of SF.
*On RE side I would like to see Nemesis replaced with a heavy character from another Capcom franchise (like PTX) and either Jill or Chris removed. I think Jill should stay but get fixed dramatically and Chris' movelist be changed to a Punisher or Blade character on Marvel. He's basically a guy with guns so there is no shortage of that in the Marvel universe.
*On the DMC side, Trish either has to go or has to be fixed. If she goes, she gets replaced by Nero. I would also fix Vergil to incorporate more of his Nelo Angelo play style to differentiate him further from Dante.
*Tron needs to be replaced with Megaman or Sigma.
*Wright needs fixing. Period.
*One of the Darkstalker characters needs to be replaced with a male Darkstalker character. Either fix or replace Hsien Ko.
The rest of the Capcom side is on point, needs a few more addition and change Spencer to Rad version on default.
Marvel side probably needs even less changes:
*Fix Thor, Iron Fist, Captain America, Super Skrull, Storm, Ghost Rider, Strange and Iron Man. Storm and Thor don't put the elements to great use, their specials aren't that great. Iron Fist needs more air mobility and tools same for Ghost Rider. Captain America needs to be made less boring. Iron Man needs more swag to be authentic and Strange needs fixing of many of his tools/moves. Super Skrull needs to be a better rep of the FF.
*Shuma needs to be replaced. Sorry Shuma lovers but the joke is stale now.
*I don't know what to think of She Hulk, Taskmaster and X-23. Gut instinct says to axe them but they were really well made so it's hard to just simply axe them. Depends on who would replace them, I mean if it's She Hulk vs Ms Marvel I might actually pick the latter... or Scarlet Witch/Psylocke over X-23. Or Moonknight over Taskmaster.
So basically no DMC rep.
crimsonspider89
Banned
Sent don't care. Magneto and Storm are here for importance.
Yeah I have series hatred.
I would replace Ryu with Ken and Chun with Cammy.
Yeah I have series hatred.
I would replace Ryu with Ken and Chun with Cammy.
Professor Beef
Banned
Shuma lovers? You mean there's more than one?
Scratch that, there's one at all?
Scratch that, there's one at all?
"God's Beard!"
Member
Replace Chris with Leon and give him a "Hey, it's that dog" hyper.
And give him Phoenix Wright's Maya hyper with him as Maya, saying "Hold on Ashley, I'm comin' for ya!"
And give him Phoenix Wright's Maya hyper with him as Maya, saying "Hold on Ashley, I'm comin' for ya!"
They're fan favorites to comic lovers and they have all unique movesets...so I'd say keep. Remove X-23 maybe if she becomes less relevant over time. I agree with everything else you said, I also feel that PTX would be a nice "heavy" character for the Capcom side instead of Nemesis. In fact, they should just add the rest of the Capcom side from TvC since they all were pretty interesting even if the mechanics in that game were flawed. Roll, Saki, and Soki would fit in perfectly I feel in an updated 3 or a MvC4, and Alex needs some more crossover love.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
There is no way they are getting rid of Ryu. Even for Ken.
I made my list mostly on 2 things. How dumb/boring a character looks and based my decisions around characters that I feel are definite main stays in the eyes of the people that will be making these decisions. You are not getting rid of Captain America I'm pretty sure. So I'm not even going to bother with him.
I think keeping Akuma in just because he was the character first used in the crossover is a pretty lame excuse. Even though I do like Akuma.
I made my list mostly on 2 things. How dumb/boring a character looks and based my decisions around characters that I feel are definite main stays in the eyes of the people that will be making these decisions. You are not getting rid of Captain America I'm pretty sure. So I'm not even going to bother with him.
I think keeping Akuma in just because he was the character first used in the crossover is a pretty lame excuse. Even though I do like Akuma.
"God's Beard!"
Member
I fucking hate Alex.
Killa Sasa
Member
Shuma
Nemmy
Bogus Jill (despite her being a good character I can't stand her design)
Patricia
Vergil
Hsien Ko
Can all go. Gimme Leon for Bogus Jill.
Fix Jill into non-Wesker version. Also fix IF, Stark, Storm, Thor, Johnny Blaze, Phoenix Wright and Arthur.
Shulkie is the only one I'd even think about axing on the Marvel side aside from Shuma (who wants this character). And I still like their concept for her.
Marvel side is far better than Capcom side, despite the influx of X-Men. And control your love for sword guyz next time around, Capcom.
GIVE RYU HIS *#$@ING TRANSFORMATIONS BACK.
Nemmy
Bogus Jill (despite her being a good character I can't stand her design)
Patricia
Vergil
Hsien Ko
Can all go. Gimme Leon for Bogus Jill.
Fix Jill into non-Wesker version. Also fix IF, Stark, Storm, Thor, Johnny Blaze, Phoenix Wright and Arthur.
Shulkie is the only one I'd even think about axing on the Marvel side aside from Shuma (who wants this character). And I still like their concept for her.
Marvel side is far better than Capcom side, despite the influx of X-Men. And control your love for sword guyz next time around, Capcom.
GIVE RYU HIS *#$@ING TRANSFORMATIONS BACK.
shaowebb
Member
Yeah, I axed all the SF guys but I still admitted theres no way Ryu would get tossed. He's their representative. I just feel he's that dull lately though. I dunno...maybe replace with Evil Ryu and completely retool him to be more interesting? Meh...
I like dahbomb's post a lot. And the talk on x-23, Taskmaster, and She-Hulk is spot on since they are good cast, but pretty dull. I'd ax them if I had more interesting cast to fill the roles of well rounded characters with that aren't solely focused on anything specific. Moon Knight replacing Taskmaster is a pretty solid idea.
Personally, I think Phoenix is too broke to fix as an idea given theres no doing her without Dark Phoenix since its pretty much the only thing anyone remembers about her. Replace her with "Hope" and give Hope specials that work similar. Besides Hope can use any mutant's powers so she could cover missing specials from cut cast while keeping the jack of all trades combo potential of pre-Dark Phoenix. No Dark Phoenix though, but a good replacement character for Jean who is far more prominent in comics these days IMO. Maybe replace X-23 with Black Panther...
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
Yeah I was going to say fix Phoenix by getting rid of DP but that makes no sense.
I'd be like what they did to Jill from MVC2->3
I'd be like what they did to Jill from MVC2->3
shaowebb
Member
Pretty much, but her playstyle is soooo good if it wasn't for the whole DP gimmick. So pick someone who could do all that and still appeal to her fanbase without having to incorporate DP mode as a part of her character. Thats Hope. Her being around and DP are the main reasons I'd ax Jean.
Shuma I'd ax and not even bother to replace with someone similar though. The only thing exciting about him is that assist. RR doesn't exactly bring the crowds in terms of cool choices either, but at least that guy has a really fun and unique set of moves to mess with. I'd say cut him because the jokes over, but I'd really try hard to find a character to replace him with that could use his trap based tools and mobility stylings to fill his role. Same for MODOK.
Ryu should have Ken/Sakura/Gouken/Evil Ryu transformations. Akuma should have an Oni transformation.
Akuma was the ORIGINAL broke fighting character, it only makes sense that he ends up in a VS game.
Yeah but Akuma goes in with your second criteria. Akuma is definitely a "main stay" way more than people may give him credit for. The only reason why some people would have a problem against Akuma would be his similarities with Ryu even though he is way more varied and interesting in play style.
Akuma was the ORIGINAL broke fighting character, it only makes sense that he ends up in a VS game.
Karsticles
Member
I'm a Shuma-Gorath fan. If he weren't a charge character and had a goddamn consistent bnb, I would use him more.
I think there's something to be said for aesthetic diversity. I really like "creature" characters, as Niitsuma calls them. Not everyone can be a white guy in tights or a trenchcoat.
I'd rather Akuma just start out as Oni. Ken just needs the Evil transformation - that's a lot of work to put into one character that wouldn't ever get utilized otherwise.
Some of you definitely aren't taking playstyle diversity into account, either. I think Trish offers something pretty unique in this game.
Yep, in fact, this entire cast is pretty good at making every character unique. Though I do say that for MvC4, the characters to look at for cutting out first would probably be characters like Shuma Gorath or Nemesis. And there's just no way they're ever cutting out Chun-Li and Akuma though guys.
Karsticles
Member
I think Chun-li could be replaced with Cammy if they need another SF girl. Cammy is far more Marvel than Chun-li. I think Chris is still a pretty boring character design in terms of gameplay. Superjump gunshots! I think I just summarized the character and what he offers. Deadpool is much more interesting and has a similar motif going for him.
I've already said my piece on creature characters.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
Creature characters are great but on the totem pole of creature characters Shuma should be on the bottom.
I know he's supposed to be the king of some dimension or something, which is great and all but when it comes to a moveset that's not helping him at all. His moveset is that he hits you with tentacles, turns into a spike ball, and shoots a laser on occasion. He plays how he looks for the most part, a squid with an eye in the middle.
Meanwhile we have Ammy and RR who go beyond their appearance. Ammy has a crazy solar plate on her back, she can shoot ice, she's got a sword, etc. Definitely not just some dog. RR has crazy rocket jets, traps, and guns. Definitely not just some raccoon.
Half of the moves that trish uses aren't even canon to her character, the rest are moves she inherited from the twins like round trip, killer bee, high time and flight. The traps can be given to any number of characters over her... because she isn't some trap master or anything like that.
I also forgot to mention that nova needs to be fixed as well. He needs more cosmic tools.
I also forgot to mention that nova needs to be fixed as well. He needs more cosmic tools.
shaowebb
Member
I'd actually be down with letting Trish stay if I didn't feel she brought the DMC representation a bit too high. Her moveset of invisible traps, zoning, and great air control is really good. However, she just seems redundant with the brothers Sparda doing a better job of representing the series (though Vergil could use the Nelo angelo stuff). If you could toss her for another flight heavy trap/zoner I doubt she'd be missed very much. She's like MODOK and RR. Good playstyle but fairly dull in their power to draw in players.
If we were to replace Trish's playstyle I'd use D.A.N.G.E.R from Marvel to cover it. If not a Marvel character then some sort of Mega Man/ X series robot using tools to replace her purpose as a character on the roster to represent Capcom. Ooh...or better yet a BoF character. Just use "magic" to explain the traps and flight.
If we were to replace Trish's playstyle I'd use D.A.N.G.E.R from Marvel to cover it. If not a Marvel character then some sort of Mega Man/ X series robot using tools to replace her purpose as a character on the roster to represent Capcom. Ooh...or better yet a BoF character. Just use "magic" to explain the traps and flight.
Karsticles
Member
Shuma-Gorath is the poster boy for a remake. Every Shuma-Gorath fan was hoping he would get one. He's far more like Dormammu or Dr. Strange in the comics. He basically has the ability to make his will into reality in his own dimension, and then has weaker versions of that outside of his dimension. That he just turns into some goofy ball and shoots out eyes is pretty sad.
It seems like your argument is against Capcom, not against Shuma-Gorath.
I thought she did a lot of this stuff in DMC2 or something.
Agreed, let's remove Vergil.
Oh don't get me wrong, I feel the same way, I just think Capcom would be more likely to just keep Chun-Li and ADD Cammy, they wouldn't replace the iconic SF female with her though.
And I personally always felt that Sakura was the most Marvel of any of the females, but there's already enough shotos in the VS series as is with Ryu and Akuma.
shaowebb
Member
Oh don't get me wrong, I feel the same way, I just think Capcom would be more likely to just keep Chun-Li and ADD Cammy, they wouldn't replace the iconic SF female with her though.
And I personally always felt that Sakura was the most Marvel of any of the females, but there's already enough shotos in the VS series as is with Ryu and Akuma.
Currently I'd say Juri would be the most Marvel character of any of the SF females. Juri or Poison if you count SF x Tekken. Fast, good normals, projectiles, anti air, and good hypers. Too bad Elena would die in Marvel. I always like playing her.
I definitely feel that the Chun Li role of representing female SF though can be done by a whole handful of other cast so I'd cut her and make way for another. Cammy would be a good character to replace X-23 playstyle with if they played around with air dashes. Fast moving low character with good anti air and fast combos. Including her would let you ax both Chun and X-23 and would free up Marvel side to experiment with different ideas for movesets other than trying to replace certain styles you cut out. Put Cammy in, tool her to cover some of X-23's tricks and cut Chun and X-23 out to make way for some stuff to get tried.
crimsonspider89
Banned
No, I think X-23 and Cammy should play differently. Make Cammy a fast rusher who can has a six way airdash with great speed. I honestly think if X-23 is dropped, they should pick another young Marvel female to replace her just to let people know about said females.
I think She Hulk could be fixed with some buffs to be a unique character who serves as a hybrid of rusher/heavy.
I think She Hulk could be fixed with some buffs to be a unique character who serves as a hybrid of rusher/heavy.
"God's Beard!"
Member
I thought you were my friend :-(
shaowebb
Member
Hmm...young Marvel female to replace X-23...Finesse from Avengers Academy could likely do it. She's got Taskmaster's photographic reflexes and packs escrima sticks. Fights a lot like a female variation of DC's Nightwing. Other than her the only young female in Marvel who I can think of who isn't based around projectiles or something is Vampire Jubilee, Tigra (not young though.), and Ilyana (Magik)if she only goes full sword and no way is that gonna happen given shes a magic user and a known teleporter. Finesse from Avengers Academy is probably your most likely candidate to build from the ground up for X-23's role of Young Marvel Female that would even remotely play like her.
Ax X-23 and I could easily see Finesse filling her role.
"God's Beard!"
Member
Phylla Vell Quasar.
crimsonspider89
Banned
I would rather just keep her than transfer her moveset to someone else. If I had to pick a young female: Magik, Hazmat(come on, let's throw all the negative effects on one character), Surge.
shaowebb
Member
Restricting Quasar to merely filling X-23's style would be selling her short. She can do all that and a ton of other tricks. She's pretty much Green Lantern and I'd hate to see her potential wasted on a pure rushdown moveset given all the constructs, beams, and flight I'd like to see her do.
Hmm...I'd forgotten about Surge. She could do the speedy rushdown for certain since her electric powers tend to be used primarily to make her a speedster character. She has lightning blasts too though so its hard to predict how she'd feel to play. I could see her being done up like X-23 pretty easily, but I could also see her getting a normal moveset with a few beams and dashes and a "Mad beast" hyper like Jill instead just as easily.
Its really a toss up on how to cover X-23 if she were to be axed. Lately though she's been in less prominence as shes been shove to avengers academy and sidelined from the big show stuff. Guess they feared over exposure for a bit, but she may be making a resurgence after AvsX ends so it might be a case that she's too marvel just like Ryu is too capcom to guess them getting to cut her if that pans out.
Hope not...I'd like to see her cut and replaced with a more interesting character who could fill her role. Maybe Surge would work considering she's a young female mutant and it'd be another speedster character. Storm needs to take a hike though. I say replace her with Ms Marvel.
crimsonspider89
Banned
X-23 is a great character.
Good angsty character who is getting focus in Academy now.
I want to see her stay.
Honestly, I would take Hazmat over any of them.
And Storm is iconic to X-Men and the series.
Also I want Phoenix to stay. She brings a lot of team dynamics and fun to the game with Dph.
And is a popular character among all crowds.
Good angsty character who is getting focus in Academy now.
I want to see her stay.
Honestly, I would take Hazmat over any of them.
And Storm is iconic to X-Men and the series.
Also I want Phoenix to stay. She brings a lot of team dynamics and fun to the game with Dph.
And is a popular character among all crowds.
Karsticles
Member
If I could backhand you through this screen, I would. Storm is an S Tier character and badass. Her only problem is the man Marvel wed her to.
shaowebb
Member
I know Storm is a good character to play as I just feel she's played out by now and if cuts were made I see her being one of the oldest faces in the game and needing to go. She's not making waves, shes just as good as ever and everyone is no longer excited to play her after this long given all the other new and exciting cast they can use. New cast with different tricks filling in for her role of massive air combos queen and damaging hypers that are good for DHC would be a big thing. I say ax her and see how hype people would get for a new character coming in to cover her role with different options to play with. Now theres a role for Phylla Vell Quasar to fill.
Black Panther is actually rising in prominence recently thanks to the cartoon and the comics are supposed to make a move with him soon as well.
Karsticles
Member
This is how you just made me feel:
Edit: Ironic that Storm is one of the three getting crushed...
shaowebb
Member
This is how you just made me feel:
Edit: Ironic that Storm is one of the three getting crushed...
Sorry, but its kind of how things look. How many teams use Storm these days even though she's good? Everyone is always experimenting with someone else in whatever her slot would have been on their team. Out of the big 3 of MVC2 most folks dropped Sentinel, then Storm. Magneto remained the most used out of the three. Its why I put on my list to chop both Storm and Sent. They're played out with the players and Sent doesn't really work as well as he used to anyways. Time to create newer more exciting movesets for new cast in these roles is my opinion.
In a scenario of ax some and fix the rest I see Storm and Sent needing axed because no one really seemed to care when they tried to fix up Storm, and Sent just doesn't pose as big of a threat these days given chip properties and assist punishing changing. Pop in Phobos to cover the Sent playstyle interest IMO unless you want to use a Marvel slot for that. New titles could change Sent's viability, but I see just axing the two rather than redesigning the two as better. Especially Storm, given they tweaked her once already and no one bothered to care about it. Pretty good sign folks have lost interest in her on the roster in spite of her playability. Ax her.
Also Hurray! I got a topic rolling around in here thats gotten a lot of discussion going tonight. Its a tricky thing trying to figure out who to ax and why if you had to ax some cast to make way for a new face filled roster.
Karsticles
Member
Storm is probably worse from Vanilla. She had an amazing thing going with the Float -> Assist call. She can't do that anymore, and that was what pretty much separated her from Magneto. Storm had a delay game that he didn't. Now she has these two shitty wind moves that are inferior to Magneto's attraction/repulsion/gravitation. Give her back the float and she'll be used more. Capcom also nerfed her air throw launches and her ground float. Basically, all she got in this were the shitty wind moves and mashable hypers, which everyone else got too. And neither of those are as good as what she lost. Overall, she's a worse character.
People tier whore in this game. Don't confuse tier whoring for a lack of love for the character. Unless a character kills on a touch, and can touch often, people don't use that character. Storm has low damage, and her mix-ups aren't particularly strong compared to Magneto. Sentinel still gets a lot of use, so I don't know what you're talking about there.
crimsonspider89
Banned
Umm, Fanatiq/Jwong both complained about her being worse.
She is still loved and I say keep.
Sent only sees play due to his assist as it stands.
You have to keep so many old characters. I would rather keep all of them.
And add additional characters. The game has a good balance of hardcore, cult and casual favs.
She is still loved and I say keep.
Sent only sees play due to his assist as it stands.
You have to keep so many old characters. I would rather keep all of them.
And add additional characters. The game has a good balance of hardcore, cult and casual favs.
shaowebb
Member
I just think with Sentinel that replacing him with a guy like Phobos who has good anti teleport stuff like Upward lasers and a smaller hitbox would go over well. Dude can still do all that vicious stuff Sent does, but with fewer problems IMO. Sent's fun, but he's risky and easy to read. He's too easy to punish as an assist character too even if you don't convert. Since Vanilla hit his drones have been way easier to deal with than MVC2 and that punishability and predictableness makes me really eager to see if perhaps they can redesign a new face into his role with fewer weaknesses. Phobos fits IMO, but hey if they want to try with another character thats cool too. I suppose at worst I'd label Sentinel as "fix" instead of "ax", but I like the idea of axing him if they have a good idea in mind for what to fill his role of armored long range normals power house with zoning character is.
Karsticles
Member
It really doesn't make sense to complain about the current state of a character for a future title that could change him, especially when you're setting him against another theoretical character that he could incorporate moves from. Not that Phobos has any chance in the world. There are a lot of Sentinel fans out there. It's not their fault that Capcom nerfed him to assist tier. I tried to use him on point for months before giving up after Magneto took me from 100 to 0 using EMD spam in Vanilla. Sentinel is a unique character in terms of gameplay, and it would be stupid to get rid of that. It would be even more stupid to "gift" his moveset to a new character. Sentinel is Sentinel, and there are a lot of things that can be done to make him better.
"God's Beard!"
Member
You can't replace Sentinel with a character with a normal hitbox. That's not replacing Sentinel. You have to stick someone in like Rathalos or the fucking Living Tribunal. Silhouettes and size diversity are as important as anything else to deciding characters. Besides, Sentinel is too unusual playstyle-wise to replace. That said, I like Phobos more than the current VS characters. Hsien-Ko is the only one that I think has potential to be interesting and unusual.
shaowebb
Member
Kind of hard to shake things up if you dont cut out anything noticeable.
Captain Commando and Cable were cut, but similar sorts of moves made it in on new cast to try and cover a lot of their roles on teams. While these similar moves made it into movesets those movesets had a lot of new things to them that made them distinct from those they derived inspired moves from.
Sure we liked those old cast, but if they hadn't cut out as many big things as they did I wonder if people would have taken as much notice of the game's roster. Game was long overdue so the hype was insurmountably high, but if you want to get notice make changes big enough to spot. It gets people thinking about just how the new game will play without certain cast around to pull the same old tactics.
Yeah sent is pretty unique and fixable but hey I say pop off the two of the big 3 that fell the furthest from grace and replace them with different cast using similar styles with a lot of different moves. You don't have to kill off everyone, but as those two aren't the biggest things in comics, and they fell from teams pretty hard compared to Magneto I say chop em off, make some waves, draw attention, and show cast to fill the roles to intrigue their old fans into seeing what the new faces can do that appeals to them that their predecessors couldn't.
If it wasn't for Avengers and certain comic book prominence I'd like to see a few other cast swapped too, but you can only get by with so much. I doubt I'll ever get a replacement for Ryu/Akuma. I still think you could get away with axing Sent/Storm though and come up with suitable new cast to fill the role. This way it starts to feel like a new game to draw them back and not just an expansion.
Captain Commando and Cable were cut, but similar sorts of moves made it in on new cast to try and cover a lot of their roles on teams. While these similar moves made it into movesets those movesets had a lot of new things to them that made them distinct from those they derived inspired moves from.
Sure we liked those old cast, but if they hadn't cut out as many big things as they did I wonder if people would have taken as much notice of the game's roster. Game was long overdue so the hype was insurmountably high, but if you want to get notice make changes big enough to spot. It gets people thinking about just how the new game will play without certain cast around to pull the same old tactics.
Yeah sent is pretty unique and fixable but hey I say pop off the two of the big 3 that fell the furthest from grace and replace them with different cast using similar styles with a lot of different moves. You don't have to kill off everyone, but as those two aren't the biggest things in comics, and they fell from teams pretty hard compared to Magneto I say chop em off, make some waves, draw attention, and show cast to fill the roles to intrigue their old fans into seeing what the new faces can do that appeals to them that their predecessors couldn't.
If it wasn't for Avengers and certain comic book prominence I'd like to see a few other cast swapped too, but you can only get by with so much. I doubt I'll ever get a replacement for Ryu/Akuma. I still think you could get away with axing Sent/Storm though and come up with suitable new cast to fill the role. This way it starts to feel like a new game to draw them back and not just an expansion.
crimsonspider89
Banned
You have to keep a core cast though or none of the old players will play. Magneto, Storm, Logan, Cap, Spidey, IM, Hulk, Dr. Doom are those characters for the Marvel side. I would rather just use the models again after improving them if needed by running the base through a higher graphics engine.
And add more characters. Only reason MvC3 didn't do this is going from sprites to models.
And add more characters. Only reason MvC3 didn't do this is going from sprites to models.
shaowebb
Member
MVC3 cut 38 characters from MVC2. I only proposed 21. Considering the roster size to roster cut ratio of that I could have cut a couple of more but I don't like that idea. Lots of core was lost including Captain Commando, and Mega Man who had been around quite awhile between MVC2 to MVC3. They cut because it brought attention and made the entire dynamic of the game different from its predecessor. It distinguished it quite clearly by its roster that it was a new fighter and not just new mechanics and this made it perceived fully as a sequel and not an expansion. It drew attention.
I kept some core cast on each side. I doubt I'd lose Ryu/Akuma though I'd like to.
Its part of why I felt this would be an interesting topic to bring up. In making something that feels like a sequel where you are required to make cuts to cast how do you go about planning who to cut? Its kind of cool seeing everyone's reactions to this scenario. Feels like the old hype speculation threads really. Angry at certain losses and excited for the potential gains it could signify, and curious about those kept. Its fun is all.
Still say ax Storm and Sent though, but Sent may need kept if you can't cover his role decently.Kept and tweaked.
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