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[Azure J]

Nothing more fundamental than learning Magneto

I know this is a joke but a while back when I was just the dedicated stream head of Marvel GAF, I had the weird notion that you don't play Marvel until you know how to Magneto. I guess it's just because no matter where I went o what stream I was watching, Magneto was always well represented and tons of folks would have him waiting in the wings for counterpicks and the like. :lol

Meanwhile, in a strange turn of fate, I've finally found a way to incorporate Amaterasu's Cold Shots into Dante's combos without making hitstun go all NOPE.gif. Calling the assist after Charge Shots (Up Shots) and letting the juggled character fall into the line of fire keeps them there long enough for a Hammer followup, does more damage than going into the Prop Shredder extension and builds more meter. Crazy.

 

[Solune]

PR Rog is top 10 for sure, dude has played some outright crummy teams and slaughtered. He's on dat first 15 episodes of Bleach status Ichigo. When he plays teams with more synergy and unlocks more spiritual pressure, he's a nightmare. Champ is my pick right. Now though. Two teams and a way to fare decently against morridoom.

All that remains is the great unknown, but this is marvel....

My picks for winning:

1)Champ
2)JWong
3)PR Rog
4)ChrisG (if he gets that motivation under control)

Dat analogy :lol

 

[Dahbomb]

First 15 episode Ichigo is low tier.

Man I need to get some gifs ready for CEO. Ran out really quickly at ECT.

 

[Azure J]

Dat analogy :lol

How didn't I see this before? :lol :lol :lol

We need more analogies like this. I need some new material for when shit goes down on stream. Rayray Gohan was some of the best shit I've seen as a forum monster in the past year. :lol

Also on that note, being really honest, I feel like PR Rog's best team overall (even if I personally only saw it once as a counter pick) was his Dante/Tron/Amaterasu team. If Tron had stayed the same from Vanilla to now (invincible assist aside), I could see that setup being really sick.

 

[Dahbomb]

RayRay Gohan was godlike, he went Super Saiyan against Combofiend and FChamp.

 

[shadoclone]

RayRay Gohan was godlike, he went Super Saiyan against Combofiend and FChamp.

But no one was there to stop Cell's suicide attack. In the end it turned out Jwong was Cell and Fanatiq was actually Buu.

 

["God's Beard!"]

I know this is a joke but a while back when I was just the dedicated stream head of Marvel GAF, I had the weird notion that you don't play Marvel until you know how to Magneto. I guess it's just because no matter where I went o what stream I was watching, Magneto was always well represented and tons of folks would have him waiting in the wings for counterpicks and the like. :lol

Ain't no joke. He's the ryu of Marvel. Tridash, flight, zoning, rushdown, beams, projectiles, anti airs, hit confirms. If you're learning Marvel, Magneto has all the tools for developing fundamentals. He's also really, really good at saying NOPE to assists with Disruptor L, which means you get to play 2v1 a lot.

 

[Zissou]

With the rise of moridoom, I wonder how much invincible assist usage we'd see in ultimate, if they were still around.

 

[smurfx]

There is randomness, and it comes in the form of unintended execution. For example, I meant to hit j.M once and got j.H, which got me an air throw and won me the match. That's a kind of randomness, because there's no intention behind it.

Yomi is not random. When my opponent keeps superjumping and tridashing across the screen as Magneto, and then I Chaotic Flame the next time he is at the peak of his superjump, it's because I'm attempting to read him and catch the tridash. It's not random.

We don't get the same group of players in the top 8 every tournament because they're just "better at surviving random". This game is like poker. Bad players think it's all about the random, and good players know that it's a game of many layers, and what cards you hold is just one facet of the game.

Every time I see a player get happy birthday'd, all I hear is "this game is so random!" No. That player made an unsafe assist call and paid for it. It's game where mistakes have severe punishments, and sloppy play like ChrisG showed against F. Champ loses you the match. I'm sure you all know I don't mean that as a slam on ChrisG, he's a fantastic player. A lot of players get into predictable motions that we don't see, and get slammed for it.

The game is no more "random" than any other fighting game where you and your opponent can both make a decision at the same time which wins the game for one because it turned out to be the right decision (but wasn't necessarily based on facts) and the other loses. Yomi is an integral part of fighting games. The only thing that separates Marvel from Street Fighter is that the stakes are much higher.

a lot of the times a player will run into something he is unfamiliar with and might end up losing 2-1 even though he was just started to get through the opponent's plan. going to 3 matches ensures that the better player wins most of the time because a good player will figure somebody out after a few games. obviously this won't be the case all the the times but i'm all for the better player advancing.

 

[Karsticles]

With the rise of moridoom, I wonder how much invincible assist usage we'd see in ultimate, if they were still around.

Evo 2011 was two teams with invincible assists. They'd still be dominating, and I don't think Morrigan/Doom would affect that either way.

a lot of the times a player will run into something he is unfamiliar with and might end up losing 2-1 even though he was just started to get through the opponent's plan. going to 3 matches ensures that the better player wins most of the time because a good player will figure somebody out after a few games. obviously this won't be the case all the the times but i'm all for the better player advancing.

Lack of familiarity is a personal fault that has nothing to do with randomness. I completely agree that 3/5 is better than 2/3, but it's not because the game is random.

 

[Dahbomb]

Unfamiliarity of characters and tech is 100% the fault of a player. Kusoru running a train at Final Round was fault of the players and the American scene in general, not the game itself or even the format of the tournament. Knowledge is half the battle.

 

[Clipse]

So I want to start taking Marvel a little more seriously. Bought an arcade stick and after about a week with it so far, I'm just not feeling it at all. I can't perform DP motions reliably and reverse DP is nearly impossible.

For people who converted from pad to stick, how long did it take you to get comfortable with it?

 

[Professor Beef]

So I want to start taking Marvel a little more seriously. Bought an arcade stick and after about a week with it so far, I'm just not feeling it at all. I can't perform DP motions reliably and reverse DP is nearly impossible.

For people who converted from pad to stick, how long did it take you to get comfortable with it?

I tried, but I had more problems with button placements than the stick itself. Either way, it'll take a couple months minimum.

 

[DD-11]

So I want to start taking Marvel a little more seriously. Bought an arcade stick and after about a week with it so far, I'm just not feeling it at all. I can't perform DP motions reliably and reverse DP is nearly impossible.

For people who converted from pad to stick, how long did it take you to get comfortable with it?

A month, but I comfortable after a week or two. I had to play with a pad a few weeks ago, and I wondered how I ever managed. It's worth it.

 

[Tirael]

Ain't no joke. He's the ryu of Marvel. Tridash, flight, zoning, rushdown, beams, projectiles, anti airs, hit confirms. If you're learning Marvel, Magneto has all the tools for developing fundamentals. He's also really, really good at saying NOPE to assists with Disruptor L, which means you get to play 2v1 a lot.

Guess there's a reason why it's called DISRUPTOR. It really is amazing.

 

[smurfx]

yo mahvel! i can otg with haggar using hawk's assist the same way i can with tasks. the timing is much stricter but it can definitely be done. if i can get this down then i can add a ton of damage. this is after using up my ground bounce already.

edit: oh damn its easier than i thought!

 

[A Pretty Panda]

yo mahvel! i can otg with hawkeye the same way i can with task. the timing is much stricter but it can definitely be done. if i can get this down then i can add a ton of damage.

Explain pls

 

[smurfx]

Explain pls

oh crap i messed up big time. sorry about that i was talking about haggar.

 

[Karsticles]

So I want to start taking Marvel a little more seriously. Bought an arcade stick and after about a week with it so far, I'm just not feeling it at all. I can't perform DP motions reliably and reverse DP is nearly impossible.

For people who converted from pad to stick, how long did it take you to get comfortable with it?

A month to not suck, three months to be respectable.

Just sit in training mode and practice something that requires whatever motion you suck at over and over.

 

[shaowebb]

So I want to start taking Marvel a little more seriously. Bought an arcade stick and after about a week with it so far, I'm just not feeling it at all. I can't perform DP motions reliably and reverse DP is nearly impossible.

For people who converted from pad to stick, how long did it take you to get comfortable with it?

DP motions are graduation day for you on stick. Legit they take the most practice to readjust to. qcf and qcb and tatus motions are cakewalks, but DP takes getting used to. I push forward ram it to down and qcf and it works out. Just thinking start with forward then quarter circle takes the stress off it. Best dudes to teach you to master it are Spidey and Iron Fist. Spidey for getting good at using it on the fly in combos and Iron Fist to train it up initially in training mode since he can just spam the motion faster than anyone else given it only chi stance changes him. Iron Fist is for training DP what Ryu is for training quarter circles and tatus.

Once you get it down its no big thing anymore and then stick starts feeling reeeeeeeally good and awesome for combos. Way less taxing on some stuff.

 

[SolarKnight]

Heh, having played with keyboard and stick pretty much all my life it feels weird reading stories about having to get used to an arcade stick when it's been pretty much something natural for me for a really long time. Well, except doing those pretzel motions in some SNK games, fuck those.

 

[WesternHeretic]

Heh, having played with keyboard and stick pretty much all my life it feels weird reading stories about having to get used to an arcade stick when it's been pretty much something natural for me for a really long time. Well, except doing those pretzel motions in some SNK games, fuck those.

I had to relearn how to use Japanese stick after playing Marvel 2 on MAS for so many years. I also had to learn how to play stick on my lap since no one in their right mind would play with a MAS on their lap.

To this day Tekken is the only fighting game that I can play pad on. Pad just feels so werid to me. I guess it's the shoulder buttons, but that why Tekken works because there is only 4 buttons.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Guess there's a reason why it's called DISRUPTOR. It really is amazing.

Only attack in the game that I know of where I can always blast assists from full screen on reaction for no meter.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

Only attack in the game that I know of where I can always blast assists from full screen on reaction for no meter.

Mighty Spark.

 

[Karsticles]

Only attack in the game that I know of where I can always blast assists from full screen on reaction for no meter.

Sentinel's laser?

 

["God's Beard!"]

Mighty Spark.

That's more than double the startup of EMD, though. Still faster than Plasma Beam, I guess.

Sentinel's laser?

That shit is 20 frames, son.

 

[Karsticles]

That shit is 20 frames, son. I'm talking about slapping tatsu or rapid slash etc.

Fair enough. This comment made me look up EMD's frame data, and holy shit! -24 on block? That means a blocked EMD is punishable by every beam hyper in this game. I'm going to do that from now on. Burn the mutant!

 

[Dahbomb]

Unibeam l is decently fast as are Hawkeyes arrows

 

[Karsticles]

Unibeam l is decently fast as are Hawkeyes arrows

Yeah but Hawkeye doesn't have mobility control like Magneto does.

Maybe Ghostrider? Haha.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

I don't have the guide what's the startup on Mighty Spark L?

 

[Karsticles]

I don't have the guide what's the startup on Mighty Spark L?

15. Disruptor L is 7. However. Mighty Spark is also +5 on block, so it's technically more spammable.

 

[Azure J]

OK, so I'm considering going back in with another team just because I'll learn two more characters I like and because of the recent upswing in Dormammu appearances. I'm theory running Dante (Jam Session)/Dormammu (Dark Hole)/Magneto (Estaka). Just a few questions for those who don't mind answering:

- What kind of game plan should I gravitate more towards with this setup? I always prefer to be the all rounder where I can control space and rush decently without waiting on much of a opportunity should I really need to. At the same time, I also understand that there are some team setups where you really should sit back and play to the majority's strengths, be they zoning or RTSD.

-- Tangentically related, any beginners gimmicks or little things you all would like to suggest with these assists while I try to find my own stuff is most appreciated.

- I'm currently contemplating the team order and synergy between the teammates. I don't know why I feel like it works better with Dorm on point though. What says you Mahvel-GAF?

 

["God's Beard!"]

15. Disruptor L is 7. However. Mighty Spark is also +5 on block, so it's technically more spammable.

DAMN YOU NERFS

Fair enough. This comment made me look up EMD's frame data, and holy shit! -24 on block? That means a blocked EMD is punishable by every beam hyper in this game. I'm going to do that from now on. Burn the mutant!

Don't tell people that :-(

 

[Karsticles]

OK, so I'm considering going back in with another team just because I'll learn two more characters I like and because of the recent upswing in Dormammu appearances. I'm theory running Dante (Jam Session)/Dormammu (Dark Hole)/Magneto (Estaka). Just a few questions for those who don't mind answering:

- What kind of game plan should I gravitate more towards with this setup? I always prefer to be the all rounder where I can control space and rush decently without waiting on much of a opportunity should I really need to. At the same time, I also understand that there are some team setups where you really should sit back and play to the majority's strengths, be they zoning or RTSD.

-- Tangentically related, any beginners gimmicks or little things you all would like to suggest with these assists while I try to find my own stuff is most appreciated.

- I'm currently contemplating the team order and synergy between the teammates. I don't know why I feel like it works better with Dorm on point though. What says you Mahvel-GAF?

You really don't want Dormammu on point. It's just not a fun time if you're facing Wolverine/Akuma or something similar. He benefits a ton from a safe DHC. Every time I see someone back up at the start of the fight with MastaCJ I wonder why players online can't be that stupid.

Calling Jam Session while teleporting with Dormammu against aggressive opponents can be really effective. Jam Session allows for a relaunch from anywhere, and for Dormammu to combo into Stalking Flare solo. DHCing from Stalking Flare to Devil Trigger leads to some TAC-esque follow-ups. Dark Hole combo extends for Dante. Don't always teleport with the Magneto beam with Dormammu, it becomes predictable.

Don't tell people that :-(

Too late! It has been learned!

Does Vergil get a Flight mode in Devil Trigger?

 

[smurfx]

i think i might have 100 more games to win before i make it to cosmic lord. i'm wondering if i should reset my record and do it again. today was a good day. i've been dominating this one guy on ranked who always gave me problems. not just with one character but i've been running a train on him with all 3 of my characters. although with that said my lack of execution is definitely holding me back a lot. so many times i will know what i have to do and then when i try to execute it i fall flat on my face. kinda wish i was an 09'er so i would have an extra couple of years working on my execution.

 

[Karsticles]

If I weren't devoted to Dormammu, I think I would have the sickest Skrull on the planet. Such a great character. Especially his unstoppable Elastic Slam setups that no one uses...

 

[devastatorprime]

Was this rumor ever posted?
http://www.hadoken.net/?p=5098

Regarding UMvC3:
- A balance patch is in the works, but that’s it. UMvC3 is also finished.

Buff dat Phoenix Wright, Iron Fist and Hsien-ko please! That Darkstalkers 4 character sound pretty cool too.

 

[Karsticles]

Was this rumor ever posted?
http://www.hadoken.net/?p=5098

Regarding UMvC3:
- A balance patch is in the works, but that’s it. UMvC3 is also finished.

Buff dat Phoenix Wright, Iron Fist and Hsien-ko please! That Darkstalkers 4 character sound pretty cool too.

Yeah, it's posted. Seems obviously false to me.

I was just randomly youtubing Firebrand videos and came across this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5kKqt-9RZ0

~15 seconds in, is that a new Wesker combo? I've never seen that before.

 

[scytheavatar]

Yeah, it's posted. Seems obviously false to me.

Don't see anything within the list of rumors that screams "obviously false" to me, save maybe them giving Evil Ryu and Devil Jin out for free which would be out of character from Capcom (but then they have been desperately trying to damage control SFxT).

 

[WesternHeretic]

Shady K has been playing on the FGTV stream for hours now and he's running Magneto, Vergil, Doom.

Shit looks scary... oh and he actually hits his Vergil combos unlike OMG Itz Andre. Scary that he just recently picked up this character too.

Edit: Shady K's Vergil looking like Richard Nguyen's Vergil but can block. OH LORD!

 

[Zissou]

I was messing around with Morrigan+Doom in training mode just seeing how much stuff I could jam on the screen for a prolonged period of time. This shit DESTROYS your hands. I have no idea how ChrisG can do this for the length of a tournament. Hats off to him.

 

[vg260]

Don't see anything within the list of rumors that screams "obviously false" to me, save maybe them giving Evil Ryu and Devil Jin out for free which would be out of character from Capcom (but then they have been desperately trying to damage control SFxT).

Those rumors are fairly believable in general, but I don't believe them. I do believe UMvC3 is done though. I would love a balance patch with minor tweaks though. (make Spidey's OTG a little more usable, Wesker glasses etc).

 

["God's Beard!"]

~15 seconds in, is that a new Wesker combo? I've never seen that before.

I used to do that in vanilla for fun, but it's not an amazing combo by any means. You can do a lot of cool gunshot tricks, especially once he takes the glasses off.

 

[Dahbomb]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IrIeGQBXHc&feature=g-all-u

Maximillian comments on EC vs WC.

I just read those Capcom FG rumors and most of them don't sound that off to be honest. The new DS4 character... yeah they want THAT DMC reference in there. I would laugh if he has some sort of trenchcoat.

 

[Anth0ny]

I was messing around with Morrigan+Doom in training mode just seeing how much stuff I could jam on the screen for a prolonged period of time. This shit DESTROYS your hands. I have no idea how ChrisG can do this for the length of a tournament. Hats off to him.

I don't know how he does it.

 

[Karsticles]

I was messing around with Morrigan+Doom in training mode just seeing how much stuff I could jam on the screen for a prolonged period of time. This shit DESTROYS your hands. I have no idea how ChrisG can do this for the length of a tournament. Hats off to him.

Morrigan in general makes my hands really tired, haha. I generally don't do the Soul Fist walls just because my hands get exhausted.

I used to do that in vanilla for fun, but it's not an amazing combo by any means. You can do a lot of cool gunshot tricks, especially once he takes the glasses off.

Ah, okay.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IrIeGQBXHc&feature=g-all-u

Maximillian comments on EC vs WC.

I just read those Capcom FG rumors and most of them don't sound that off to be honest. The new DS4 character... yeah they want THAT DMC reference in there. I would laugh if he has some sort of trenchcoat.

They sound off enough. Particularly Darkstalkers 4 being Sony exclusive. Capcom is just not that stupid to lock out half of its competitive community from the game.

 

[Dahbomb]

There is no real confirmation on it being Sony exclusive. I remember DMC4 was being developed exclusively for PS3 at first and then they added 360 development too. From the comments it seems the game is still fairly early in development and could possibly mean that they are just making PS3 the main development console just like Platinum games is doing nowadays.

 

[kirblar]

There is no real confirmation on it being Sony exclusive. I remember DMC4 was being developed exclusively for PS3 at first and then they added 360 development too. From the comments it seems the game is still fairly early in development and could possibly mean that they are just making PS3 the main development console just like Platinum games is doing nowadays.

Isn't it easier to do the PS3 version first, then convert to 360, rather than vice versa?

 

[Dahbomb]

Isn't it easier to do the PS3 version first, then convert to 360, rather than vice versa?

I'm no dev and I always stay away from console tech discussions but that's basically what most devs say. PS3 has a more complex structure to dev but once you make a game built for the PS3 it's easier to make it on the 360 rather than the other way around.

 

[Karsticles]

Alright everyone, a mega post about how I think I may have just broken Firebrand.

Everyone here knows that sometimes when I get a combo with Firebrand, I TAC to Dormammu, do his TAC combo, and then DHC Stalking Flare to Luminous Body for the unblockable setup. I have found very little that beats this setup, especially after I remembered that I can call Dark Hole right before I go into Demon Missile H for extra chip and lockdown to ensure the unblockable. Dark Hole basically just gives me time to mess with my positioning.

Unfortunately, TACs are not reliable, so I usually did Bennet's setup of Dark Fire -> Stalking Flare, and then I would XFC into 1D2C for over 1 million damage total, charge 2D1C, liberate it, cancel into Stalking Flare, and DHC into Luminous Body for a 200% kill on my opponent's team.

I want to say, frankly, that this setup is yesterday's technology.

Last night I was on SRK and saw this thread:
http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?threads/bon-voyage-frequent-flyer-miles-glitch.154937/

Unnoticed and unloved. Who, in a post-Vanilla would, could care about a "DHC glitch" setup for Firebrand (since that's what it is, but the OP doesn't seem to know that)? Certainly, we haven't seen anything from it.

But I had an idea: right now I feel like my team is lacking when Dormammu is dead, and it's just down to Firebrand/Morrigan. They're both pretty low damage characters, so I feel like I need to find some synergy between them. I'm sure it's there, and I thought this was a perfect opportunity. DHC glitch into Astral Vision, and maybe I'd have time to land Soul Drain - cool huh? I still haven't gotten it to work, but I haven't given up either, especially since the glitch puts my opponent into hard knockdown and I have Firebrand's OTG assist. There must be something there damn it!

I became frustrated for a while, but then had another thought: sometimes I want to DHC Firebrand out with Luminous Body, and I didn't have a great way to do that yet. So maybe I could use this to do Luminous Body -> Chaotic Flame? I tried it, and it worked. Cool!

Then another thought came to me: why Chaotic Flame? Why not...Stalking Flare?

So I gave it a shot, and it turns out that Stalking Flare is too slow to catch my opponent before he falls to the ground. And that's why this is so beautiful. See, I've never had a way to set this up before. Doing Firebrand's bnb into Luminous Body -> Stalking Flare doesn't give me enough time to raw tag Firebrand back in. But this does. Firebrand recovers well before my opponent gets up and roll recovers thanks to the spinning knockdown, meaning I can set up his full unblockable this way.

Here's the full setup, starting with Firebrand:
c.LMHS, sj.MMHS, qcf.S, s.H, qcf.S, Luminous Body, Stalking Flare, raw tag Firebrand, call Dark Hole, dp.H (hold), j.S, c.LMHS, sj.MMH, d.H, qcb.L, c.HS, sj.MMHS, qcf.S, s.S, sj.MMHS

Two bars, and it does over 1 million damage. Firebrand builds ~2 bars of meter during all of this, and I also get 2 Dark Harmonizer calls due to the reset, making this generate heavy positive meter. I can end the whole thing into Dark Fire to kill anyone short of Thor, thanks to this.

You might have noticed that the beginning combo is a bit short, and this is because s.H into qcf.S drops if the combo has gone on too long. I'm certain there's a way to make the opening setup longer and stronger, but I'll figure that out later.

So, whether I touch someone with Firebrand or Dormammu, it's a dead character for 2 bars. BFFs? Only an alpha counter into something like Hard Drive can survive it, AFAIK, but nothing really stops that, so I can't complain.