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[Dance Inferno]

HAHAHAHAHA

"Wolverine DNA detected in female mutant. DOES NOT COMPUTE! DOES NOT COMPUTE! DOES NOT COMPUTE!"

 

[Dahbomb]

It's said really low, and he says it after the teleport. Dormammu says "BEWARE!" very loudly and as his teleport starts. It's like Wesker. Yeah, something gets said, but it's background noise. Phoenix and Dr. Strange have the right volume control. I dig that Wesker and Vergil are being more taunting/creepy by whispering it, but it's not loud enough for me to make out.

Turn your volume up? Also Vergil says Here I am BEFORE the Teleport L like Frantic pointed out.

And like mentioned, coupled with the blur lines that mark which type of teleport he is doing Vergil's teleport is one of the more telegraphed teleports out there. If you put together both cues it is definitely possible to react to the teleport mix up. Once you start looking out for it then it becomes much easier to block.

Like FChamp said, Vergil is just going to get easier and easier to block once the player's senses are attuned to it.

 

[Karsticles]

HAHAHAHAHA

"Wolverine DNA detected in female mutant. DOES NOT COMPUTE! DOES NOT COMPUTE! DOES NOT COMPUTE!"

There are some fantastic quotes in this game. I almost want to play Vergil just because Dormammu likes him more than Dante.

I really love Shuma-Gorath's quotes to Hsien-ko. Storm vs. Magneto is great if you take it as a MvC2 throwback.

I'm actually reading through these right now:
http://fenixware.net/fab/fab_gamequote.asp?id=659

I had no idea that Chun-li hits on Thor.

Turn your volume up? Also Vergil says Here I am BEFORE the Teleport L like Frantic pointed out.

And like mentioned, coupled with the blur lines that mark which type of teleport he is doing Vergil's teleport is one of the more telegraphed teleports out there. If you put together both cues it is definitely possible to react to the teleport mix up. Once you start looking out for it then it becomes much easier to block.

Like FChamp said, Vergil is just going to get easier and easier to block once the player's senses are attuned to it.

How does him saying it before the L teleport help me block the M teleport? I'm at superjump height trying to block Vajra here. Ditto for the rest.

Edit:
I thought this was a generic Dante intro; Dante players, confirm one way or the other?
Match Start vs. Dormammu I'm not gonna pull my punches!

 

[Dahbomb]

Ok so now you are talking about trying to block Vajra + Vergil teleport at super jump height....

You can't block that no matter what teleport character is underneath, it's a 50/50. If you get hit Vergil has to burn X factor to convert that into a combo.

Most people don't play Vergil with Strider (I personally don't like it at all), I was mostly referring to the stock beam/arrow teleport mix ups of Vergil as that's the more common application of this.

 

[Frantic]

I thought this was a generic Dante intro; Dante players, confirm one way or the other?
Match Start vs. Dormammu I'm not gonna pull my punches!

It's Dormammu specific.

Also, Dormmammu can hit Strider out of Vajra by using the long active frames of j.M. Not sure if you know, and not sure how useful it would be for you, but I've gotten Strider blown up when trying to hit Dorm with Vajra by him doing j.M, Liberation > Chaotic Flame when I wasn't really expecting it.

 

[Karsticles]

Ok so now you are talking about trying to block Vajra + Vergil teleport at super jump height....

You can't block that no matter what teleport character is underneath, it's a 50/50. If you get hit Vergil has to burn X factor to convert that into a combo.

Unless you just started reading with the last two posts, you shouldn't be confused. I've been talking mostly about Vajra backed by teleports since this conversation began. Besides, do you think I get hit a lot by EMD + teleport? I play Dormammu and Morrigan. I don't spend time on the ground unless I have to, it's a bad place for both of them against the twins.

The issue is that I don't even know a teleport is HAPPENING with some characters. If I hear a teleport with some characters, I at least know "okay, stop charging Dark Spells and block", but I don't get that with others. Or I can try to air dash, but since Vajra never lets me know when it's coming...

It's Dormammu specific.

Also, Dormmammu can hit Strider out of Vajra by using the long active frames of j.M. Not sure if you know, and not sure how useful it would be for you, but I've gotten Strider blown up when trying to hit Dorm with Vajra by him doing j.M, Liberation > Chaotic Flame when I wasn't really expecting it.

Do you mean that, as Strider is being called and is about to teleport, jump and j.M to catch him, or that j.M out-prioritizes the actual dive kick? Good to know, either way, but the people I play against tend to be apply Vajra along with either ranged fire or teleports, so I'll get hit by a projectile or sword anyway, yah?

 

[Dahbomb]

Yeah I definitely missed the conversation, I tuned in late into the whole talk about teleports and telegraph sound/cues.

Personally I never tinker around SJ height unless Strider is on cooldown or I have eliminated him, even with IM. Iron Man has a way to shutdown poor Vajra calls by Repulsor Blast into Spread into PC. It doesn't kill Strider but it does enough damage so that the person is wary of calling the assist. Most characters usually have something they can do against a poorly called Vajra assist and it's best to make the most out of it (killing Strider as an assist boosts chances of winning the match immensely).

 

[Karsticles]

Yeah I definitely missed the conversation, I tuned in late into the whole talk about teleports and telegraph sound/cues.

Personally I never tinker around SJ height unless Strider is on cooldown or I have eliminated him, even with IM. Iron Man has a way to shutdown poor Vajra calls by Repulsor Blast into Spread into PC. It doesn't kill Strider but it does enough damage so that the person is wary of calling the assist. Most characters usually have something they can do against a poorly called Vajra assist and it's best to make the most out of it (killing Strider as an assist boosts chances of winning the match immensely).

Oh believe me, if I ever touch Strider, all the necessary meter plus X-Factor gets blown to end him.

Shuma-Gorath to Deadpool:
Win Quote vs. Deadpool I did not appreciate being called calamari. And what is this "dipping sauce" you keep referring to?

 

[Frantic]

Do you mean that, as Strider is being called and is about to teleport, jump and j.M to catch him, or that j.M out-prioritizes the actual dive kick? Good to know, either way, but the people I play against tend to be apply Vajra along with either ranged fire or teleports, so I'll get hit by a projectile or sword anyway, yah?

The latter. The dive kick doesn't actually have a very large hitbox(Strider can actually be thrown out of it when he's on point, but it's usually too fast to reaction and it only gets throw by Nova/Magneto's mashing OS throw), so anything with a large hitbox will beat it. Dorm's j.H and j.S can beat it, but the active frames of j.M make it much easier to hit Strider since you can push the button early and he'll just land on the j.M.

And I'll give you the whole sword and projectile things. Dorm(and most characters, really) doesn't have any real answer to it, but against people who aren't protecting their Vajra calls, it's an option.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

I'm actually reading through these right now:
http://fenixware.net/fab/fab_gamequote.asp?id=659

Nice.

Anyone know of a version of this that's updated with the Ultimate characters?

 

[Karsticles]

Dahbomb, if I wanted to start Vergil on point, and just stall for as long as possible, possibly without performing any mix-ups, just staying safe and keeping my opponent busy and in blockstun, what tactics would you recommend to me? The most I'd be able to do is something like Stinger -> teleport + Dark Hole.

Nice.

Anyone know of a version of this that's updated with the Ultimate characters?

The MvC3 wiki has some updated, but isn't consistent.

Oh yeah, last night I played Ghost Rider for the first time. I landed Penance Stare on another Ghost Rider - felt good, haha. I see the zoning problem. I couldn't touch Magneto/Sentinel. I was also really good at zoning others, though. dp.H is amazing.

 

[Azure J]

Something Strider Vajra players should keep in mind is that the actual divekick comes from somewhere 45 degrees to the top most front from where the opponent it tracks is. I found this out the hard way when "random Helm Splitter" would clip him if my bro got wind of the assist call only to try it out in training and find out that anything with a long enough reach out forward in that direction can swat him.

Hell, 2D1C might do it, I wouldn't be surprised. Also, speaking of Dormammu, I feel like I've found my anti-Zero if I can learn proper movement with him soon. Millions of hitboxes on screen is wonderful for keeping him pinned a la 1D2C and 2D1C is like the panic mode button. 3D0C is also fun for keeping him honest when Hadangekis get thrown across the screen.

 

[Professor Beef]

Nice.

Anyone know of a version of this that's updated with the Ultimate characters?

There's a small list with the Ultimate characters on that page in the dropdown menu up top, but it's not fully updated.

 

[Dance Inferno]

GGs DD-11. I really, really, really don't know what I'm doing when I play Morrigan, which is funny because I spend 99% of my time in training mode playing as her. Oh well, I suppose more training is in order!

I also got my WWE Brawl Stick today. First impressions: I LOVE IT. It took a while to get used to doing hadoukens and shoryukens, but it's pretty straightforward all things considered (although the square gate was getting on my nerves when I was trying to Fly Cancel a Soul Fist). It really helps you do combos faster/easier than on a pad. I actually spent a good two hours practicing with the stick, whereas with the pad my hand starts to cramp up after 30-60 minutes. Onward ho!

 

[Karsticles]

Something Strider Vajra players should keep in mind is that the actual divekick comes from somewhere 45 degrees to the top most front from where the opponent it tracks is. I found this out the hard way when "random Helm Splitter" would clip him if my bro got wind of the assist call only to try it out in training and find out that anything with a long enough reach out forward in that direction can swat him.

Hell, 2D1C might do it, I wouldn't be surprised. Also, speaking of Dormammu, I feel like I've found my anti-Zero if I can learn proper movement with him soon. Millions of hitboxes on screen is wonderful for keeping him pinned a la 1D2C and 2D1C is like the panic mode button. 3D0C is also fun for keeping him honest when Hadangekis get thrown across the screen.

Oh, it's the forwardmost copy that's real? I always thought it was the center one (never looked too closely). Interesting.

2D1C would do it, but I like more...universal solutions.

Dormammu against Zero is an alright matchup if you DHC Dormammu in safely. You don't want to start in the neutral against him, it's not pretty. Dormammu just doesn't have the movement speed to get away from him. Zero also has no answer to Stalking Flare spam outside of Genmu Zero, which I happily X-Factor and Chaotic Flame him for unless he X-Factors, which is a trade in my favor because I have more Stalking Flares, and he doesn't have more Genmu Zeros. ;-D

GGs DD-11. I really, really, really don't know what I'm doing when I play Morrigan, which is funny because I spend 99% of my time in training mode playing as her. Oh well, I suppose more training is in order!

I also got my WWE Brawl Stick today. First impressions: I LOVE IT. It took a while to get used to doing hadoukens and shoryukens, but it's pretty straightforward all things considered (although the square gate was getting on my nerves when I was trying to Fly Cancel a Soul Fist). It really helps you do combos faster/easier than on a pad. I actually spent a good two hours practicing with the stick, whereas with the pad my hand starts to cramp up after 30-60 minutes. Onward ho!

Glad you like the fightstick. I think the stick buttons help do combos, too. It's just nice to have multiple fingers doing the work your thumb was doing alone before.

Have you tried watching some competitive Morrigan players to get an idea of what to do with her? I recommend watching JJJ more than anyone.

 

[XxSlasherMcGirkxX]

I tried using a stick for an hour or two and could only land just a handful of fireballs and even less dragon punches. Never again.

 

[Dance Inferno]

Glad you like the fightstick. I think the stick buttons help do combos, too. It's just nice to have multiple fingers doing the work your thumb was doing alone before.

Have you tried watching some competitive Morrigan players to get an idea of what to do with her? I recommend watching JJJ more than anyone.

I have not, I will make sure to do that. I literally just stand around throwing Soul Fists or I try to approach and get murdered. My movement is pretty terrible in general.

 

[Karsticles]

I have not, I will make sure to do that. I literally just stand around throwing Soul Fists or I try to approach and get murdered. My movement is pretty terrible in general.

I will find you something good to watch. I was once an asstastic Morrigan, too. JJJ made me see the light. I recommend JJJ over ChrisG just because JJJ's Morrigan is universally applicable, and ChrisG plays a very specific team.

 

[DD-11]

GGs DD-11. I really, really, really don't know what I'm doing when I play Morrigan, which is funny because I spend 99% of my time in training mode playing as her. Oh well, I suppose more training is in order!

I also got my WWE Brawl Stick today. First impressions: I LOVE IT. It took a while to get used to doing hadoukens and shoryukens, but it's pretty straightforward all things considered (although the square gate was getting on my nerves when I was trying to Fly Cancel a Soul Fist). It really helps you do combos faster/easier than on a pad. I actually spent a good two hours practicing with the stick, whereas with the pad my hand starts to cramp up after 30-60 minutes. Onward ho!

Yeah, ggs, sorry I had to run so soon. As you can see, I have no idea how to fight x23. As I was wrapping up my stick, I said out loud: Push block! haha.

Tell her to watch out next time.

 

[Dance Inferno]

Yeah, ggs, sorry I had to run so soon. As you can see, I have no idea how to fight x23. As I was wrapping up my stick, I said out loud: Push block! haha.

Tell her to watch out next time.

LOL! She'll be ready for ya.

I will find you something good to watch. I was once an asstastic Morrigan, too. JJJ made me see the light. I recommend JJJ over ChrisG just because JJJ's Morrigan is universally applicable, and ChrisG plays a very specific team.

Much appreciated, sir.

 

[Karsticles]

I think this is a really good video of high quality Morrigan play:
http://www.twitch.tv/stlbarwarz/b/325594320

His Storm does some neat stuff, too. Feel free to ask questions if you have any.

 

[Dahbomb]

Dahbomb, if I wanted to start Vergil on point, and just stall for as long as possible, possibly without performing any mix-ups, just staying safe and keeping my opponent busy and in blockstun, what tactics would you recommend to me? The most I'd be able to do is something like Stinger -> teleport + Dark Hole.

Helm Breakers... lots of them. You can cancel it on block into Rising Sun or even his teleport but be wary as the teleports can be punished. Only Helm Breaker ground advances to avoid being a victim of chicken guards.

Doing block strings with HSH or Judgment Cut L is also helpful in stalling time as they have to push block you. Couple this with an assist. Use Round Trips too. Although I really don't know what you want to be stalling for... Vergil wants those mix ups, if he doesn't have the opponent blocking or in a mix up then he is out of his comfort zone. Eventually you have to keep burning meter for Spiral Swords to keep them in block stun for long enough.

 

[Karsticles]

Helm Breakers... lots of them. You can cancel it on block into Rising Sun or even his teleport but be wary as the teleports can be punished. Only Helm Breaker ground advances to avoid being a victim of chicken guards.

Doing block strings with HSH or Judgment Cut L is also helpful in stalling time as they have to push block you. Couple this with an assist. Use Round Trips too. Although I really don't know what you want to be stalling for... Vergil wants those mix ups, if he doesn't have the opponent blocking or in a mix up then he is out of his comfort zone. Eventually you have to keep burning meter for Spiral Swords to keep them in block stun for long enough.

I should be more clear:
I'm going to give Vergil/Dormammu/Morrigan a try. I already know Vergil's bnbs aside from the Spiral Swords loop. My goal is to have Spiral Swords up constantly, but that means maintaining pressure without assists for a while. That's what I need advice on.

 

[Dance Inferno]

I think this is a really good video of high quality Morrigan play:
http://www.twitch.tv/stlbarwarz/b/325594320

His Storm does some neat stuff, too. Feel free to ask questions if you have any.

Is he canceling his air dashes and then dashing again? It looks like he superjumps and then dashes like seven times in a row. Is he using Fly to do that?

From what I can tell he throws out a few Soul Fists and then uses Morrigan's air dash and S to close the distance/hit his opponent. Is that the gist of it?

 

[Karsticles]

Is he canceling his air dashes and then dashing again? It looks like he superjumps and then dashes like seven times in a row. Is he using Fly to do that?

From what I can tell he throws out a few Soul Fists and then uses Morrigan's air dash and S to close the distance/hit his opponent. Is that the gist of it?

If you're in flight mode with any character that has an air dash, you can cancel air dashes into each other. Not the same air dash direction, though. He's often doing ADU (Air Dash Up), ADD (Air Dash Down), j.S. You can cancel the same air dash into itself through what is called plink dashing.

You can see plink dashing here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8vN-lZwQEc

Basically, you do dash via MH, and then do MH again, but you delay the time between M and H just barely, and it comes out as an attack canceled into a dash.

You have the gist of the character correct. Morrigan isn't really complex, she just requires a ton of execution. Basically, she's the opposite of my strengths - I don't know why I use her, hahaha.

 

[Dahbomb]

I should be more clear:
I'm going to give Vergil/Dormammu/Morrigan a try. I already know Vergil's bnbs aside from the Spiral Swords loop. My goal is to have Spiral Swords up constantly, but that means maintaining pressure without assists for a while. That's what I need advice on.

Oh in that case it's much easier.

Basically you want to start the round off with whatever block string into Rapid Slash or Judgment Cut into Devil Trigger. With Devil Trigger up you can maintain immense pressure while calling Morrigan for much longer than you can with Spiral Swords. Basically Stinger cancel into Judgment Cut covers a huge portion of the screen. If Rapid Slash connects however then you are better off cancelling into Spiral Swords as it leads into more damage. You can also go ham with Spiral Swords and then occasionally call Dark Hole to mask the start up time on Round Trip and then maintain pressure. Use Dark Harmonizer to keep pumping you meter. You can even summoned Swords while in DT mode because you still gain meter in DT if you call the assist. With DT + SS you can do mean mix ups one of which is doing a box dash j.H while Swords are active leading into almost unreactable cross ups.

One important thing you would have to learn is that Dark Hole is one of the few assists after which Vergil can combo from his Hightime. You just have to watch the spacing. You can convert ground throws and raw Helm Breakers into real damage. Alternatively, you can normal jump, call Dark Hole + Helm Breaker and even if you hit with the Helm they can land into the hole for a combo. Again, this is timing and spacing dependent but it's worth learning in the long run.

With a meter building assist you don't have to worry about going for many fancy mix ups, just go ham with Spiral Swords. If you don't have the meter just back up and do what I talked about before until you have the meter to start the initiative. Even with one meter you should be the aggressor. I just wouldn't go for teleports without an onscreen Round Trip or Spiral Swords.

 

[enzo_gt]

Joker vs. RayRay FT5 that occured on the PJS_Winning stream (XBL).

 

[Karsticles]

Oh in that case it's much easier.

Basically you want to start the round off with whatever block string into Rapid Slash or Judgment Cut into Devil Trigger. With Devil Trigger up you can maintain immense pressure while calling Morrigan for much longer than you can with Spiral Swords. Basically Stinger cancel into Judgment Cut covers a huge portion of the screen. If Rapid Slash connects however then you are better off cancelling into Spiral Swords as it leads into more damage. You can also go ham with Spiral Swords and then occasionally call Dark Hole to mask the start up time on Round Trip and then maintain pressure. Use Dark Harmonizer to keep pumping you meter. You can even summoned Swords while in DT mode because you still gain meter in DT if you call the assist. With DT + SS you can do mean mix ups one of which is doing a box dash j.H while Swords are active leading into almost unreactable cross ups.

One important thing you would have to learn is that Dark Hole is one of the few assists after which Vergil can combo from his Hightime. You just have to watch the spacing. You can convert ground throws and raw Helm Breakers into real damage. Alternatively, you can normal jump, call Dark Hole + Helm Breaker and even if you hit with the Helm they can land into the hole for a combo. Again, this is timing and spacing dependent but it's worth learning in the long run.

With a meter building assist you don't have to worry about going for many fancy mix ups, just go ham with Spiral Swords. If you don't have the meter just back up and do what I talked about before until you have the meter to start the initiative. Even with one meter you should be the aggressor. I just wouldn't go for teleports without an onscreen Round Trip or Spiral Swords.

Alright, so question:
I'm worried about Stinger from full screen because I can't cancel it into anything, and plenty of characters run around doing empty tridashes and such. What are your thoughts on those risks?

Is Dark Hole really able to lead off of Hightime? I have to practice that more, then, because I couldn't get it to work. Good to know, though.

What is it about Devil Trigger that makes my pressure so much better? Am I just air dashing into j.H over and over, or is there more to it?

 

[Vice]

Rapid slash assist lets Captain America combo from Charting star anywhere on screen. Neat.

Alright, so question:
I'm worried about Stinger from full screen because I can't cancel it into anything, and plenty of characters run around doing empty tridashes and such. What are your thoughts on those risks?

Is Dark Hole really able to lead off of Hightime? I have to practice that more, then, because I couldn't get it to work. Good to know, though.

What is it about Devil Trigger that makes my pressure so much better? Am I just air dashing into j.H over and over, or is there more to it?

DT lets you cancel whiffed normals. Your judgement orbs get huge. Better movement.

 

[Vice]

.

 

[Karsticles]

I think Cap is really unexplored. Charging Star is such pain to deal with.

DT lets you cancel whiffed normals. Your judgement orbs get huge. Better movement.

Oh reeeeally? I did not know that it let you cancel whiffed normals. Do any of his strings get better, though? Due to the speed increase?

 

[Dahbomb]

Full screen Stinger when not in DT or without an assist is suicide. The only time you would want to throw out a Stinger if you are absolutely certain you will at least get them to block.

Now in DT you can freely throw out Stinger as you can cancel it into any special at anytime. By just doing Stinger xx Judgment Cut you can cover a huge portion of the ground with relative safety. That's his pressure. You can also cancel Helm Breakers that way. What makes DT so much better in terms of pressure is that he can freely throw out his huge normals without worrying about having them being whiff punished as he can cancel them into specials. All his special moves are buffed in DT mode, they are bigger and faster. Rising Sun for example gets insane priority. And of course the air dash j.H is nice to have but by itself its not going to open up people that well.

 

[Azure J]

Dah's post reminded me of the funniest thing I found out recently, Devil Trigger'd Rising Sun has like one hit of armor on the initial start up.

 

[Dance Inferno]

If you're in flight mode with any character that has an air dash, you can cancel air dashes into each other. Not the same air dash direction, though. He's often doing ADU (Air Dash Up), ADD (Air Dash Down), j.S. You can cancel the same air dash into itself through what is called plink dashing.

You can see plink dashing here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8vN-lZwQEc

Basically, you do dash via MH, and then do MH again, but you delay the time between M and H just barely, and it comes out as an attack canceled into a dash.

You have the gist of the character correct. Morrigan isn't really complex, she just requires a ton of execution. Basically, she's the opposite of my strengths - I don't know why I use her, hahaha.

Haha, I think I may be out of my depth as well. Alright I'll give this air dashing thing a shot, as well as using j.S to hit confirm. Maybe that'll help be not be a complete moron with Morrigan.

TBH the only reason I started playing Morrigan was because she was one of the first characters I tried, and I enjoyed playing as her. If I keep having trouble with her I'll probably look around for a more noob-friendly character.

 

[Dahbomb]

Dah's post reminded me of the funniest thing I found out recently, Devil Trigger'd Rising Sun has like one hit of armor on the initial start up.

It does actually, not a lot of people know this and if you pick Vergils rising sun assist you can turn him dt switch out and you have a top aa assist backing you up. Rising sun assist is also a great cc assist.

I don't kid when I say that dt Vergil is the future for the character.

 

[Vice]

I think Cap is really unexplored. Charging Star is such pain to deal with.

He is, a lot of his fancier stuff seems so impractical though. He solo cartwheel mixups are a pain to do but I think they make him a better anchor for example.

 

[Karsticles]

Haha, I think I may be out of my depth as well. Alright I'll give this air dashing thing a shot, as well as using j.S to hit confirm. Maybe that'll help be not be a complete moron with Morrigan.

TBH the only reason I started playing Morrigan was because she was one of the first characters I tried, and I enjoyed playing as her. If I keep having trouble with her I'll probably look around for a more noob-friendly character.

It might be a good idea to drop her and come back. Being a bit of a Morrigan fanboy, I tried her out very early on and realized I simply couldn't pull off her fly cancels at all. There's no reason to play the character if you can't do them - it's basically her whole game. So I picked other teams. About 6 months later I gave them a try and found them doable, but difficult. Now, on the left side I can create walls of fireballs like nobody's business. She's not a beginner-friendly character, though, for sure.

Dah's post reminded me of the funniest thing I found out recently, Devil Trigger'd Rising Sun has like one hit of armor on the initial start up.

:-O

Also, is Rising Sun -> teleport, s.L a safe blockstring?

It does actually, not a lot of people know this and if you pick Vergils rising sun assist you can turn him dt switch out and you have a top aa assist backing you up. Rising sun assist is also a great cc assist.

That's a really sexy idea. I'll think on it.

He is, a lot of his fancier stuff seems so impractical though. He solo cartwheel mixups are a pain to do but I think they make him a better anchor for example.

what's the solo mix-up?

 

[Killa Sasa]

I think Cap is really unexplored. Charging Star is such pain to deal with.

Captain Unibeam is so much fun. Stupid hitconfirms and safe charging star = loooooooooooool. Makes some combos easier, and Cap's combos are already pretty "baby's first".

Most worthy thing I've seen IM do consistently is make Cap that much better. Iron Fist is in the same boat.

 

[biosnake20]

Dah's post reminded me of the funniest thing I found out recently, Devil Trigger'd Rising Sun has like one hit of armor on the initial start up.

It does actually, not a lot of people know this and if you pick Vergils rising sun assist you can turn him dt switch out and you have a top aa assist backing you up. Rising sun assist is also a great cc assist.

 

[Vice]

what's the solo mix-up?

It's pretty basic. Aerial shield slash, the version depends on screen position, when performed at the right height, usually super jump, will return to you right after you land. You can cartwheel to the other side,go for a throw or play a high-low game (Cap's isn't the best though) It's nothing fancy but it leads to death for the majority of the cast if you pop x-factor. Meterless if you pop XF3 and go into his charging star loop.

If you mess it up you can just hit a safe block string and try again.

 

[Solune]

Man, I've finally come to a crossroads with this game where I love ALOT, like more than any recent gen FG by far. But I don't know if I want to continue anymore.

Dropping BnBs due to online and having no local competition just really kills it for me, and losing to basic stuff where I should KNOW how to defend just made me hit my limit.

I think this will be my last day of Marvel, at least until I get bored of P4A and start craving Marvel down the road. It's been good Marvel-GAF.

 

[Karsticles]

It's pretty basic. Aerial shield slash, the version depends on screen position, when performed at the right height, usually super jump, will return to you right after you land. You can cartwheel to the other side,go for a throw or play a high-low game (Cap's isn't the best though) It's nothing fancy but it leads to death for the majority of the cast if you pop x-factor. Meterless if you pop XF3 and go into his charging star loop.

If you mess it up you can just hit a safe block string and try again.

I'm not seeing it.

1) Superjump.
2) Shield Slash.
3) Land.
4) Shield returns to you.
5) Cartwheel.
6) Attack?

Is that right? That's not a mix-up in my book.

Man, I've finally come to a crossroads with this game where I love ALOT, like more than any recent gen FG by far. But I don't know if I want to continue anymore.

Dropping BnBs due to online and having no local competition just really kills it for me, and losing to basic stuff where I should KNOW how to defend just made me hit my limit.

I think this will be my last day of Marvel, at least until I get bored of P4A and start craving Marvel down the road. It's been good Marvel-GAF.

See you around sir. Enjoy P4A.

 

[Azure J]

Man, I've finally come to a crossroads with this game where I love ALOT, like more than any recent gen FG by far. But I don't know if I want to continue anymore.

Dropping BnBs due to online and having no local competition just really kills it for me, and losing to basic stuff where I should KNOW how to defend just made me hit my limit.

I think this will be my last day of Marvel, at least until I get bored of P4A and start craving Marvel down the road. It's been good Marvel-GAF.

I'm technically near the same situation myself. I just want to work up some courage and a bit of money so I can go and attend a Big Two or just hang around Next Level sometime, but until then, all I can do is training mode, report back here and try to apply what I see others doing. I feel ya Solu-bro but I'm sad to see ya go.

 

[Dahbomb]

Rising sun into teleport on block is roughly -3 so you can't really stick a button out after it although in dt it's usable. Judgment cut on block is completely safe and plus on block so you can pressure with cr.l after it. There is however a 3 frame gap in between a normal on block and judment cut which means some characters can punish Vergil by just going through the judgment cut with a fast invincible attack or reversal. Most people don't know this and most of the time if you have trained them with rapid slash they might block judgment cut wrong because the animations look similar.

 

[Vice]

I'm not seeing it.

1) Superjump.
2) Shield Slash.
3) Land.
4) Shield returns to you.
5) Cartwheel.
6) Attack?

Is that right? That's not a mix-up in my book.

After you land you have enough time for a throw or his "instant" overhead. You can't get anything off of the throw without an assist or xf though,except HCS, and comboing from the overhead requires strict timing.

 

[Karsticles]

Rising sun into teleport on block is roughly -3 so you can't really stick a button out after it although in dt it's usable. Judgment cut on block is completely safe and plus on block so you can pressure with cr.l after it. There is however a 3 frame gap in between a normal on block and judment cut which means some characters can punish Vergil by just going through the judgment cut with a fast invincible attack or reversal. Most people don't know this and most of the time if you have trained them with rapid slash they might block judgment cut wrong because the animations look similar.

Hmm. Then what IS Vergil's assistless, safe attack string?

HSHS, etc. is problematic because if I get pushblocked at the right time I'm whiffing a s.S, and that is dangerous.

Rising Sun is negative on block.

Rapid Slash is clearly not safe.

Helm Breaker is funky.

Judgment Cut has a hole in the blockstring.

What am I overlooking?

After you land you have enough time for a throw or his "instant" overhead. You can't get anything off of the throw without an assist or xf though,except HCS, and comboing from the overhead requires strict timing.

Oh okay. Doesn't seem very strong.

 

[Vice]

Oh okay. Doesn't seem very strong.

It isn't but it makes Cap a little bit strong when he isn't backed by assists so they're useful to learn. When you have assists though it's very annoying when paired with drones or missiles.

 

[Solune]

I'm technically near the same situation myself. I just want to work up some courage and a bit of money so I can go and attend a Big Two or just hang around Next Level sometime, but until then, all I can do is training mode, report back here and try to apply what I see others doing. I feel ya Solu-bro but I'm sad to see ya go.

If you do end up going hit me up with a PM, I'll definitely take the time to watch. And I'll be back sometime, don't know how it will pan out after P4 but we'll see how much time it soaks up. I expect hype to die down after the initial rush.

See you around sir. Enjoy P4A.

And you too sir

Hmm. Then what IS Vergil's assistless, safe attack string?

HSHS, etc. is problematic because if I get pushblocked at the right time I'm whiffing a s.S, and that is dangerous.

Rising Sun is negative on block.

Rapid Slash is clearly not safe.

Helm Breaker is funky.

Judgment Cut has a hole in the blockstring.

What am I overlooking?

Oh okay. Doesn't seem very strong.

Unfortunately Vergil doesn't have a air tight block string, you'll have to adjust depending on the character. Example, Captain America, Do not attempt Judgement Cut or Round Trip strings because a Charging Star happy Cap will eat you up instantly. Rising Sun into Trick Down is suitable since it's hard to punish.

I think in general, you want to use Round Trip or Judgement Cut on people who like to pushblock after a Stinger, and Rising Sun for characters who have fast normals.

 

[Dahbomb]

Rising sun into trick is Vergils only true safe block string. In dt he has a bunch of safe strings.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

...yeah Vergil