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Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 |OT3| To infinites... and beyond!
- Thread starter enzo_gt
- Start date
"God's Beard!"
Member
Theory time! Who is the better pair for the 2nd/3rd slots?
- Doom/Ammy
- Vergil/Strider
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";48226812]Theory time! Who is the better pair for the 2nd/3rd slots?
Depends on the first character. Wolverine and Magneto get nothing from the 2nd pair but would beast with the first one. Dante and Wesker would much prefer the 2nd one. Viper would like both.
I say Doom Ammy because Vergil Strider shell is too resource intensive to be a strong combination by itself. Vergil Strider is jus way more preferable against Chris and Fchamp's team though.
- Doom/Ammy
- Vergil/Strider
Depends on the first character. Wolverine and Magneto get nothing from the 2nd pair but would beast with the first one. Dante and Wesker would much prefer the 2nd one. Viper would like both.
I say Doom Ammy because Vergil Strider shell is too resource intensive to be a strong combination by itself. Vergil Strider is jus way more preferable against Chris and Fchamp's team though.
Karsticles
Member
I missed Winter Brawl yesterday, but SRK says ChrisG used Morrigan/Doom/Firebrand in GF. Is it worth seeing, or did he just get stomped and go back to Vergil?
Karsticles
Member
I watched it, and it was not worth seeing. Firebrand did nothing.That team is so top tier, it forces people to stop playing.
WesternHeretic
Member
Pretty much, Justin's strategy of using hail storm to kill Doom kinda of worked. Then of course he random alpha counter game 5 when it was tied 2-2 leaving him with no meter.....
PR Rog's plan of just going after morrigan didn't really pan out too well.
"God's Beard!"
Member
The only thing I learned from Winter Brawl was that there are snap backs in SFxT.
Modok / Dormammu / Strange. I'm telling you, this would work against MorriDoom.
"God's Beard!"
Member
I'm feeling Captain America/Vergil/Strider for us simple folk.
WesternHeretic
Member
Champ been playing hawkeye, dorm, doom.
crimsonspider89
Banned
Firebrand's size causes him to drop out of Vergil's combos and his flight time allows him to run for a long time from Dark Vergil. Which Chris G used .
So in other words a timer eater. The winner's finals was closer but grand finals Chris G downloaded Balrog's mix ups and just stomped him.
So in other words a timer eater. The winner's finals was closer but grand finals Chris G downloaded Balrog's mix ups and just stomped him.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
I should be playing Hawkeye/Doom/Strider like right now.
I haven't played point Hawkeye in a while.
I haven't played point Hawkeye in a while.
"God's Beard!"
Member
Use Hawkeye/Vergil/Strider and learn fullscreen combos ^_^
Karsticles
Member
There are a lot of anti-Morrigan/Doom teams, but no one wants to use them. Too many "low tier" characters involved for American taste.
Yeah, I mean seriously, Dante is so ass. Strider too. Putting them together is too much work for one match up.
I think something like thor/storm/morrigan could do alright against moridoom. Thor would take forever to chip down and he's big enough that he could get off a lot of harmonizer calls and then you could threaten with hailstorm dhc. I'm sure you could substitute other characters for thor too.
Strange and someone with a down angle shot.
Modok works amazingly well because he can fly / go really high while calling assist. Also, if missiles hit him it's a good thing since it seems to reset his fly counter.
Add in his shields + ability to air hyper and DHC out and he's amazing.
Strange is included because his Bolts of Balthakk keeps Doom up for a really long time, allowing your point character to take advantage, essentially allowing your point character to add onto the punishment without meter.
Modok works amazingly well because he can fly / go really high while calling assist. Also, if missiles hit him it's a good thing since it seems to reset his fly counter.
Add in his shields + ability to air hyper and DHC out and he's amazing.
Strange is included because his Bolts of Balthakk keeps Doom up for a really long time, allowing your point character to take advantage, essentially allowing your point character to add onto the punishment without meter.
I thought of something like that but then you are essentially using Morrigan to counter Morrigan. That sort of defeats the purpose. I wish there were better meter generating assists in the game aside from Morrigan's.
Professor Beef
Banned
Frutsy tried this, and in true ChrisG fashion he won once and then never again.
Yeah, I don't know why they made Frank's and Ammy's so comparatively awful. They should have the same frame data as Morrigan's- either that or they should generate more meter or something to compensate for how vulnerable they are. Hell, they should just make Ammy's reflector assist generate meter (maybe only when it reflects a projectile or something).
I feel sorry for the poor bastards that run that duo. How could they ever win anything?Yeah, I mean seriously, Dante is so ass. Strider too. Putting them together is too much work for one match up.
WesternHeretic
Member
Destined to only be top 8. q_q
But still, watching Dantes on stream raises my blood pressure sometimes. So much "do x option in x situation and-WHY DID YOU DO THAT!?"
Destined to only be top 8. q_q
But still, watching Dantes on stream raises my blood pressure sometimes. So much "do x option in x situation and-WHY DID YOU DO THAT!?"
There's a bizarre double standard where any time a Vergil player doesn't sword loop, the commentators give them shit, but when a Dante player does terrible day one unoptimized combos, no one care/notices.
I think it has to do with the fact tons of people play Vergil, but very few people play Dante, so optimized combos are seen more often for Vergil than with Dante.
But for me, it's more that there's always some little matchup thing, or a less used option that would work in a certain situation, but they default to something typical. I remember getting pissed when Flux was trying to zone full screen solo Wesker with Crystal and kept getting bopped in the face with a gunshot, and then Wesker was in due to teleport. In that situation, you can throw out Drive and on frame 1 it will duck under the gunshot, and then Wesker teleports right into the projectile for free pressure.
Needless to say, Flux lost that round when he really shouldn't have.
On another note, down-forward > forward plink dashing. Every dash is a throw OS, woooo! Shame it's a pain in the ass to execute.
It's so weird to me too. Like even Yipes makes me double take from time to time when I see the OD amount of Cold Showers/Prop Shredders that aren't setting up Acid Rain loops in his combos. He's a offense god though so I guess it balances out since he'll always get the hit before most other Dantes get started, but imagine someone with his offensive pressure and Dante's most optimized tricks and combos...
Edit: I'll throw another example your way regarding the matchup quirks Frantic. Check this video out, it's Marvelo vs. JRosa in a FT7 from NEC. The entirety of the video I was there like "why does no one use Twister during projectile floods?"
WesternHeretic
Member
If Yipes went for optimize combo 100% of the time he would be downgrade to Shady K / Richard N status. AKA I'm drop this combo at the worst possible time status.
Professor Beef
Banned
What else is Vergil going to do? It's not like he's Dante who has what, 500 moves?
Reliability is number one, but there are much more damaging options than OTGing after a hammer or jump S confirm with cold shower that even I can execute, and I have garbage execution.
Dante has more room than mosy for variety and individuality as far as combo choice goes, but combos you see sometimes are outright terrible damage/meter-wise. I forget the dude's name, but there was a Dante player who was otherwise really solid at Battle Circuit a couple weeks back who used cold shower to OTG after everything- really weird.
I'll have to check it out when I get home.
As Dahbomb insinuated, Frutsy's team was a different makeup. And it's not close like the two Marvel themes
.Frutsy didn't stay back enough and just trade shots, he tried to rush for some reason. And Cap second there...bleh..
You know, optimization for me also means optimized so I'll do it 100% of the time. I like pushing things to the limit but it's also good to know the general frame of the optimized stuff so you can omit things and still get 80% effectiveness with 100% accuracy.
Side note: Frantic, something I want you to test out or share info on sometime: Using Bold Move to respond to Guard Canceled moves. I was screwing around with a Viper dummy set to XFC my standing series and punish with Thunder Knuckle H only to get hype as shit to see Dante block it. I hope this has some legit practicality to it.
If I can confirm off Hammer into shot loops online, by god can Yipes do it in tournament!
There are only four frames that Dante can block during bold move, so it needs to be a at least a four frame move in XF. It can work, but it's still a risk to do. It can jump over low attacks, and it'll avoid command throws/throws, but it's still risky.
Now, Wall-Cling or Formation B(Shot) with Strider are legit ways to beat XFC.
WesternHeretic
Member
My execution better than Yipes CONFIRMED!
I won't blame him for doing basic shit in tournament, but he doesn't even do optimal Dante combos in casuals. Considering how good he is, it just strikes me as odd.
So I'm recording some footage for a new video (mostly about little things to take advantage of when playing any one of my team's characters or the team itself) and I think I stumbled upon some hilarious things. Did you know:
- Charging and releasing Multi-Lock then hard tagging is amazing? Multi-lock ignores everything when Dante's removed from play and can be used to stuff people punishing the tag in.
- There's a way to cancel j.S into a standing state immediately on contact with the floor. Practice j.S - Air Play as low to the ground as you can get it. (I got this by accident randomly practicing the j.S-Air Play-Rain Storm-Volcano or Twister knockdown extension in the corner) and re-created it at least 4 times in a row wondering what was up.
- Charging and releasing Multi-Lock then hard tagging is amazing? Multi-lock ignores everything when Dante's removed from play and can be used to stuff people punishing the tag in.
- There's a way to cancel j.S into a standing state immediately on contact with the floor. Practice j.S - Air Play as low to the ground as you can get it. (I got this by accident randomly practicing the j.S-Air Play-Rain Storm-Volcano or Twister knockdown extension in the corner) and re-created it at least 4 times in a row wondering what was up.
Both this and Acid Rain are great ways to tag out. You have to respect them.
This is semi old. I remember seeing it mentioned when it was found out that Dante could dash cancel his j.S. Both are pretty tight, so nothing much came from either. Still a neat little trick that hasn't really been shown off. Both are up there in my "Theory Dante Tech" that could be game changers but are too hard to pull off consistently.
You aren't kidding about how high level theory that link is. Funny thing is, I got it more when I buffered the Air Play but when I landed, I'd get a superjump up forward since my QCFs always go upforward nowadays. :lol
It also seems easier to do (or see actually) on hit rather than raw. I get the feeling j.S's landing frames have some serious exploitation potential.
It also seems easier to do (or see actually) on hit rather than raw. I get the feeling j.S's landing frames have some serious exploitation potential.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
I was testing a few Felicia things myself recently. Mostly stuff that I've known or suspected for a while but haven't bothered to see to what extent they work until now.
1) She bounces upward when air-guarding more than any other character in the game, making her virtually immune to trip guard setups. If she gets caught blocking Million Dollars at low heights, she still won't drop to the ground until she's out of blockstun. If she jumps into Flame Carpet while blocking, she'll bounce off of it instead of falling into it (and thus does not have to block low). Some other characters can bounce off of Flame Carpet like this, but none as consistently.
2) s.L is a pseudo-sword normal. It has no hurtbox on the tail. I've been seeing what I can poke people out of and the list is pretty hilarious (includes Berserker Barrage X and Darkness Illusion).
3) b.H is (inexplicably) a godlike anti-air. I've successfully beaten Foot Dive cleanly with it once (out of about 100 attempts >_> but whatever). Also beaten Wolverine's divekick and Haggar's body press super. Her boobs have a hitbox or something.
EDIT: LOL
Dem hit globes.
1) She bounces upward when air-guarding more than any other character in the game, making her virtually immune to trip guard setups. If she gets caught blocking Million Dollars at low heights, she still won't drop to the ground until she's out of blockstun. If she jumps into Flame Carpet while blocking, she'll bounce off of it instead of falling into it (and thus does not have to block low). Some other characters can bounce off of Flame Carpet like this, but none as consistently.
2) s.L is a pseudo-sword normal. It has no hurtbox on the tail. I've been seeing what I can poke people out of and the list is pretty hilarious (includes Berserker Barrage X and Darkness Illusion).
3) b.H is (inexplicably) a godlike anti-air. I've successfully beaten Foot Dive cleanly with it once (out of about 100 attempts >_> but whatever). Also beaten Wolverine's divekick and Haggar's body press super. Her boobs have a hitbox or something.
EDIT: LOL
Dem hit globes.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
biosnake20
Member
So what do you guys think of the Schmidt Select? Personally I can think it has potential to change up the tier lists a significant amount.
What is it?
biosnake20
Member
It's sort of a plink dash that you can only do with the one button dash button that makes dashing and air dashing much faster for certain characters. It also at the same time option selects in a throw when it's done or something like that. Characters like Magneto, Storm, Doom, Dormammu, Trish, Morrigan, etc. have much faster air movement and characters on the ground like Spencer and Dante have faster ground dash movement. Not that good of an explanation but someone else might be able to elaborate further.
Gonna try to use Firebrand again, planning to play him point and I'm looking for good DHC's and assists. I like Doctor Doom for 2nd. Gonna use missiles but dunno if plasma would be better for FB. Third character I have for now is Strider. Vajra's awesome but the DHC sucks...