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[Karsticles]

My guide says 6/5 startup, with 5 being when in Berserker charge. Are you looking at the active frames? That's the only thing with 3 frames for cr.L.

Whoops! Yep, I glanced at the wrong column.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Ammy's the only 3 frame in the game, right?

 

[Dahbomb]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";71976486]Ammy's the only 3 frame in the game, right?[/QUOTE]
As far as I know. Although just like with Wolverine I could've read the guide wrong because all this time I thought he had 4 and 4 (turns out that was the frame data for st.L and Berserker Charge st.L, not cr.L). There are some 2 frames move though in the game but not normals as far as I know.

THE MORE YOU KNOW!!!

 

[SolarPowered]

Wolverine, Phoenix Wright, Phoenix and She Hulk.

Just read the Wright changes and those are excellent.

 

[Frantic]

I have more or less memorized all the frame data for every character's normals, just because I feel it's a requirement when you play Dante.

Everytime I hear someone say something is faster/slower than it actually is on commentary, I get really annoyed. Heh.

 

[XxSlasherMcGirkxX]

Nah I support bad evidence too but what if we make it predetermined like Teddie's items in Persona 4 Arena? Like....Watch -> Food (10% chance of being bad evidence) -> Photo -> Food (10% or whatever chance of being bad evidence)....last ones being Folder, Vase, Knife, Cell phone. Eliminates randomness of WHEN you get a good piece or not, but you have to do more evidence pulls to get certain ones.

I could get behind this, especially with an increased buff from his evidence attack game.

I agree with all the Ghost Rider changes Karst. I hate how H,H can whiff so that's awesome. A double jump would be interesting but I feel he isn't the type of character who should have one. As long as his normals are buffed I think GR is fine. He should be weak up close, great at mid range and okay at far range. If GR's anti air special grab worked liked Spencer's wire grapple assist and grounded the opponent instead of doing a little damage that would be awesome.

 

[Dahbomb]

Just checked my guide to see X-23's frame data:

St.L: 4 frame start up
Cr.L : 5 frame start up

Amaterasu:

St.L: 3 frame start up
Cr.L: 4 frame start up

Firebrand:

St.L: 5 frame start up
Cr.L: 4 frame start up

Iron Man (just to confirm):

St.L: 5 frame start up
Cr.L: 5 frame start up


Wow.. Iron Man truly has one of the best cr.Ls in the game!

 

[Karsticles]

Just read the Wright changes and those are excellent.

Here are the current changes for all four characters:
Phoenix:
*Dark Phoenix health drain rate reduced.
*Dark Phoenix feathers now travel 15% farther.
*TK Shot (air) no longer makes Phoenix prone until she lands.
*Only one TK Shot H may be performed per jump unless in flight (as with Trish).
*New Hyper: Overload; Phoenix loses all health immediately; requires 5 bars, rdp.AA.
*Flight startup reduced to 14 frames.
*f.M reduced to 19 frames.
*Multiple Dark Phoenix characters are now distinguishable on-screen.

Assists: TK Overdrive H, TK Shot H, TK Trap L

Phoenix Wright:
*Bad evidence removed from the game.
*”M-Maya?!” L appears closer to Wright than before, startup is reduced to 15 frames, and the shield now benefits from damage scaling.
*c.H (Turnabout) now hits low.
*Stance Change reduced to 10 frames (from 20).
*”M-Maya?!” M and H startup reduced to 20 frames.
*”Get em’ Missile!” added as a normal move; charge back for 30 frames, then forward and M; startup is 15 frames, 10 recovery.
*Present Evidence and Paperwork air OK.
*Slip-Up startup reduced to 19 frames.
*Dash distance increased by 20%, total dash time unchanged.
*Hitboxes on normals improved slightly.

Assists: “Get em’ Missile!”, Questioning (becomes Objection when appropriate), Gather/Present Evidence (continues to gather through the L+S, M+S, and H+S inputs until all evidence is gathered; uses L+S if in Trial mode; if all slots are filled and he is called while in Investigation mode, throws away his L+S item).

Wolverine:
*Fatal Claw damage slightly decreased.
*Wavedashing with Wolverine is less likely to activate Berserker Charge.
*Berserker Charge provides slight red health recovery.

Assists: Berserker Barrage H (fully mashed), Swiss Cheese, df.M

She-Hulk:
*Lights Out startup reduced to 25 frames; horizontal hitbox increased.
*c.L chains into itself on block/hit.
*Taking out the Trash hitbox and invincibility slightly increased.
*Emerald Cannon hyper forces a wall bounce.
*Speed increased slightly.
*Emergency Landing (Catapult Cancel) no longer makes She-Hulk prone until landing.
*Canceling Runner’s Start has 0 frames of recovery.
*Slight increase on c.H range/distance.
*j.H hitbox improved slightly.
*Shooting Star assist causes significant knockback on block.
*Torpedo causes less knockback on hit; assist version startup reduced to 35 frames startup.
*Somersault Kick has 1 hit of super armor beginning on frame 5.

Assists: Lights Out, Shooting Star, Torpedo

Does everyone approve of all my assist choices?

I have more or less memorized all the frame data for every character's normals, just because I feel it's a requirement when you play Dante.

Everytime I hear someone say something is faster/slower than it actually is on commentary, I get really annoyed. Heh.

The true Keeper of the Frame Data.

I could get behind this, especially with an increased buff from his evidence attack game.

Buffing the evidence attack game would take a lot of work - with the 10 change limit, I don't think we're in a position to implement something so drastic. Why are you in favor of bad evidence?

I agree with all the Ghost Rider changes Karst. I hate how H,H can whiff so that's awesome. A double jump would be interesting but I feel he isn't the type of character who should have one. As long as his normals are buffed I think GR is fine. He should be weak up close, great at mid range and okay at far range. If GR's anti air special grab worked liked Spencer's wire grapple assist and grounded the opponent instead of doing a little damage that would be awesome.

Good thought on the anti-air grab, but I'm not sure we're in a position to make that kind of change, since it requires animation changes. I think that when we talk about adding "new" moves to characters, the golden standard is whether something has to be reanimated, or a new animation has to be added.

 

[enzo_gt]

damn, y'all are really gonna have that OT4 by the end of this week huh

 

[Dahbomb]

Wow all of Morrigan's jabs are 4 frames. Same for Chun Li too bad none of them hit low for her lol.

Holy crap Arthur's jabs are pretty bad for a pixie character. 7 frame cr.L? Shit is ASS!!!!

 

[SolarPowered]

Those Shulkie changes are even sexier. You guys are gonna get Combofiend to quit his job at Capcom just to play the game again. I can feel it.

Here are the current changes for all four characters:
Phoenix:
*Dark Phoenix health drain rate reduced.
*Dark Phoenix feathers now travel 15% farther.
*TK Shot (air) no longer makes Phoenix prone until she lands.
*Only one TK Shot H may be performed per jump unless in flight (as with Trish).
*New Hyper: Overload; Phoenix loses all health immediately; requires 5 bars, rdp.AA.
*Flight startup reduced to 14 frames.
*f.M reduced to 19 frames.
*Multiple Dark Phoenix characters are now distinguishable on-screen.

Assists: TK Overdrive H, TK Shot H, TK Trap L

What does this do? Does it turn her into a giant Moai head?

 

[Karsticles]

damn, y'all are really gonna have that OT4 by the end of this week huh

OT5 IMO. ;-)

Wow all of Morrigan's jabs are 4 frames. Same for Chun Li too bad none of them hit low for her lol.

Holy crap Arthur's jabs are pretty bad for a pixie character. 7 frame cr.L? Shit is ASS!!!!

Morrigan's should be 3.

Arthur isn't a pixie character, he's a pile of crap in an armor-shaped can.

Those Shulkie changes are even sexier. You guys are gonna get Combofiend to quit his job at Capcom just to play the game again. I can feel it.

What does this do? Does it turn her into a giant Moai head?

It does just what it says: it kills Phoenix. Basically, it lets you activate Dark Phoenix on your own terms. Right now, there are too many ways to auto-kill Dark Phoenix. I want to give Phoenix players an option to "detonate". They get Dark Phoenix right away (no more running away from Phoenix for time outs), but they also lose the potential damage regular Phoenix could have put in. It's a fair trade to ensure your investment can't be shut down by an unavoidable set up.

 

[Frantic]

Wow.. Iron Man truly has one of the best cr.Ls in the game!

It's pretty ridiculous, I will admit. Trish also has a really ridiculous cr.L at 5 frame, rapid fire, and +2 on hit and block. Her j.L is also really freaking good at 4 frames. I have punished Spiral Swords by sticking it out as I'm descending on a few occasions.

The true Keeper of the Frame Data.

I consult the Bible regularly for frame data. I once typed out all of Dante's frame data on memory, and was roughly 90% correct. I live and die by the frame data.

 

[Dahbomb]

What does this do? Does it turn her into a giant Moai head?

It's just a manual Dark Phoenix activation. Although I suggested it's only doable on the ground so that I can still get pressure on her on incoming and have her turn on my terms. Wouldn't completely destroy anti Phoenix set ups.

Anyone know the advantage on hit for Air Play?

 

[Karsticles]

It's just a manual Dark Phoenix activation. Although I suggested it's only doable on the ground so that I can still get pressure on her on incoming and have her turn on my terms.

Phoenix activating it in the air isn't necessarily bad. She probably won't be near you, so you'll still get a setup. For example, if you're planning on a Frank West Funny Face Smasher setup, it's not like Phoenix can activate Dark Phoenix on incoming - she's just setting the AA throw up for you.

 

[Dahbomb]

Phoenix activating it in the air isn't necessarily bad. She probably won't be near you, so you'll still get a setup. For example, if you're planning on a Frank West Funny Face Smasher setup, it's not like Phoenix can activate Dark Phoenix on incoming - she's just setting the AA throw up for you.

Nah she can do it on reaction when Frank West is in the air to avoid any chance of getting hit by that hyper. It's a big change to the character and I feel she should at least touch the ground before having accessing to it.

 

[Karsticles]

Nah she can do it on reaction when Frank West is in the air to avoid any chance of getting hit by that hyper. It's a big change to the character and I feel she should at least touch the ground before having accessing to it.

A good Frank West would roll under her + Jam Session.

Or, this works on block (frustratingly):
Snapshot x Funny Face Smasher.

 

[Dahbomb]

I am pretty sure Snapshot into Funny Face with Jam Session is a guard break that would be removed from the game.

 

[Karsticles]

I am pretty sure Snapshot into Funny Face with Jam Session is a guard break that would be removed from the game.

It's not a guard break. You block, now you don't have throw invincibility. It's not 1-frame. It would definitely not be removed from the game with our current changes, and I didn't mention Jam Session with that second setup. Just Snapshot x Funny Face.

 

[Frantic]

Anyone know the advantage on hit for Air Play?

Air to ground or air to air? It's +3 air to ground point blank(which comes out to something like 17-18 frames of hitstun), but air to air I'm not entirely sure. I'd say it's about +20 on hit, since it's a few frames away from Helm Breaker connecting on a raw one. It's probably about 30 frames of hitstun or so.

That's all just based on my calculations.

 

[XxSlasherMcGirkxX]

Buffing the evidence attack game would take a lot of work - with the 10 change limit, I don't think we're in a position to implement something so drastic. Why are you in favor of bad evidence?

It's just something that I feel should be part of the character. I know Capcom won't get rid of something like that. A nice detail I like is when you present bad evidence in trial mode, Wright does his sad pitiful animation. I know people say that Wright doesn't have bad evidence in his games why does he here. He is still investigating, looking for clues. Finding three correct clues leads to a correct line of thinking so when he objects it has merit. Having incorrect info or evidence and objecting leads to a penalty. I can see what Capcom was trying to do and I think for the most part created a great representation of how Wright would behave in a fighting game. However, it's clear they where deeply worried on if he was balanced or not. Removing bad evidence completely would go against the mechanics they created for him.

Good thought on the anti-air grab, but I'm not sure we're in a position to make that kind of change, since it requires animation changes. I think that when we talk about adding "new" moves to characters, the golden standard is whether something has to be reanimated, or a new animation has to be added.

Your right, we can't be changing move animations if we want this to be realistic.

 

[Dahbomb]

I need to find that set up because it's guaranteed if you block or even push block, making it a true guard break set up.

Air to ground or air to air? It's +3 air to ground point blank(which comes out to something like 17-18 frames of hitstun), but air to air I'm not entirely sure. I'd say it's about +20 on hit, since it's a few frames away from Helm Breaker connecting on a raw one. It's probably about 30 frames of hitstun or so.

The comparison of Storm's Lightning Sphere to Air Play is hysterical. Capcom really went out of their way to make sure this character doesn't get too good.

 

[Karsticles]

She-Hulk:
*Lights Out startup reduced to 25 frames; horizontal hitbox increased.
*c.L chains into itself on block/hit.
*Taking out the Trash hitbox and invincibility slightly increased.
*Emerald Cannon hyper forces a wall bounce.
*Speed increased slightly.
*Emergency Landing (Catapult Cancel) no longer makes She-Hulk prone until landing.
*Canceling Runner’s Start has 0 frames of recovery.
*Slight increase on c.H range/distance.
*j.H hitbox improved slightly.
*Shooting Star assist causes significant knockback on block.
*Torpedo causes less knockback on hit; assist version startup reduced to 35 frames startup.
*Somersault Kick has 1 hit of super armor beginning on frame 5.

Assists: Lights Out, Shooting Star, Torpedo

We need to remove two of these changes. Let's figure them out so we can wrap up She-Hulk.

It's just something that I feel should be part of the character. I know Capcom won't get rid of something like that. A nice detail I like is when you present bad evidence in trial mode, Wright does his sad pitiful animation. I know people say that Wright doesn't have bad evidence in his games why does he here. He is still investigating, looking for clues. Finding three correct clues leads to a correct line of thinking so when he objects it has merit. Having incorrect info or evidence and objecting leads to a penalty. I can see what Capcom was trying to do and I think for the most part created a great representation of how Wright would behave in a fighting game. However, it's clear they where deeply worried on if he was balanced or not. Removing bad evidence completely would go against the mechanics they created for him.

Write your detailed changes to Wright's evidence collection, please. I do see where you are coming from.

 

[Dahbomb]

Take out hitbox/invulnerability changes on She Hulk's AA hyper. The hyper is fully functional as it is, you have to make a solid read on it and that's fine. Although anything else I wouldn't change, she needs all the rest of that stuff.

I still think Phoenix should only have access to that hyper on the ground. Even if I don't have an anti Phoenix set up, I would want to have her activate on my terms and with her being able to use it in the air it's damn near impossible for that to happen.

 

[Frantic]

The comparison of Storm's Lightning Sphere to Air Play is hysterical. Capcom really went out of their way to make sure this character doesn't get too good.

You could cut the recovery(40 frames) in half and it'd be infinitely better.

All of her specials either have a shit ton of startup or a shit ton of recovery. Or both. It's kinda dumb.

 

[Karsticles]

Take out hitbox/invulnerability changes on She Hulk's AA hyper. The hyper is fully functional as it is, you have to make a solid read on it and that's fine. Although anything else I wouldn't change, she needs all the rest of that stuff.

Done, but that leaves 11.

You could cut the recovery(40 frames) in half and it'd be infinitely better.

All of her specials either have a shit ton of startup or a shit ton of recovery. Or both. It's kinda dumb.

I already got you covered in my Storm changes:

Storm:
*Lightning Sphere hitbox increased.
*Double Typhoon now reaches to superjump height.
*Double Typhoon startup reduced from 63 frames to 38 frames.
*Assists can be called after a superjump canceled into Float.
*Lightning Storm damage increased slightly.
*Flight startup reduced to 15 frames.
*Storm is now able to air dash twice after jumping, without Flight..
*Fair/Foul Wind active frames reduced to 15, total opposing character movement unchanged.
*Lightning Sphere H now tracks slightly.
*Lightning Sphere hitstun increased significantly; recovery reduced significantly.

Assists: Whirlwind H, Typhoon (Tracking), Lightning Sphere H.

 

["God's Beard!"]

*Only one TK Shot H may be performed per jump unless in flight (as with Trish).

Trish can fire as many fireballs as she wants per jump.

 

[Karsticles]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";71983306]Trish can fire as many fireballs as she wants per jump.[/QUOTE]
I was referring to her traps, clearly.

 

["God's Beard!"]

It's pretty ridiculous, I will admit. Trish also has a really ridiculous cr.L at 5 frame, rapid fire, and +2 on hit and block. Her j.L is also really freaking good at 4 frames. I have punished Spiral Swords by sticking it out as I'm descending on a few occasions.

Too bad she can't confirm against airborne opponents for shit. Definitely gonna be a focus.

 

[Karsticles]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";71983481]Too bad she can't confirm against airborne opponents for shit. Definitely gonna be a focus.[/QUOTE]
Agreed.

 

[Dahbomb]

God damn it Karst STOPPED DOING THAT!!!! Now we have to start discussing Storm...

Whirlwind still sucks and L version still doesn't go full screen. Needs start up reduced across the board, 25 frame start up on H version is shit. All versions should go full screen, difference is in damage, durability and start up.

You can't reduce the start up of Typhoons that much because otherwise she would have infinites/loops with it as the advantage on hit/block on it is very good. She already had loops with it in XF. You have to reduce the start up and also reduce the recovery... but just enough so she can still pick up OTG after throws and combos. Sort of like how they changed Smart Bombs for Iron Man.

Lightning Storm should have soft knockdown property if cancelled before the final hit (like most hypers that are like it).

Please do not give her assist calls after super jump float. There's a reason why they removed that shit and it's because you can't build 5 bars while floating at the top of the screen and spamming Morrigan. I do not want that in the game please especially when you are going to have more tracking assists in the game.

On the topic of Lightning Sphere... just give it a charged and uncharged version (like Air Play). Uncharged version is the same as now only it has better recovery than what it does now. Charged version bigger hit box, more hit stun, more damage etc. H version tracks better.


The rest are the same as mine.

 

[XxSlasherMcGirkxX]

Write your detailed changes to Wright's evidence collection, please. I do see where you are coming from.

I don't any drastic changes are really needed. Just making the bad percent change go down and having meat buns only appear when damaged would go a long way.

Even the idea FSlink said of having a preset load out with a low chance of an item turning into a bad evidence would be fine. This doesn't contradict the mechanic created for him and he still has the idea of searching for clues and it's not always the same.

The worst would be if Wright never needed to be in Investigation or Trial mode. If he collected stuff during an assist or could get a full optimal set on the first try everytime, why bother even attempting to fight during Investigation or Trial mode. It would eliminate a large portion of his attacks. Getting three evidence and switching modes only takes like two Marvel seconds. TB mode should be the goal, but he should still be usable in his other modes. Things shouldn't flow perfectly 100% of the time. Every match should be different. He just doesn't need to be beyond crippled if things don't go his way. Evidence collecting should be his biggest hurdle not landing Objection. You can land Objection off any hit confirm.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

We need to remove two of these changes. Let's figure them out so we can wrap up She-Hulk.

Why no Clothesline assist. I think it could be great if it had a hit or two of armor and she recovered and got the fuck out quickly. Would allow for some hard tag shenanigans. I do like the sound of a Shooting Star assist for some unblockables though.

Done, but that leaves 11.


I already got you covered in my Storm changes:

Storm:
*Lightning Sphere hitbox increased.
*Double Typhoon now reaches to superjump height.
*Double Typhoon startup reduced from 63 frames to 38 frames.
*Assists can be called after a superjump canceled into Float.
*Lightning Storm damage increased slightly.
*Flight startup reduced to 15 frames.
*Storm is now able to air dash twice after jumping, without Flight..
*Fair/Foul Wind active frames reduced to 15, total opposing character movement unchanged.
*Lightning Sphere H now tracks slightly.
*Lightning Sphere hitstun increased significantly; recovery reduced significantly.

Assists: Whirlwind H, Typhoon (Tracking), Lightning Sphere H.

I'd like to be able to attack and block after Lighting Attack plz, not just fall to my fucking death. Soft knockdown on Lightning Storm so I can DHC into Hyper Sentinel Force.

 

[Frantic]

*Lightning Sphere hitstun increased significantly; recovery reduced significantly.

There's no real need to increase the hitstun any more if you're going to reduce the recovery. It already has plenty of hitstun(you can combo off it air-to-air already) so adding more hitstun + reducing recovery would just be too much.

 

[Professor Beef]

Does Snapshot > Funny Face as a guard break actually work? I swear I can never get it to work.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

There's no real need to increase the hitstun any more if you're going to reduce the recovery. It already has plenty of hitstun(you can combo off it air-to-air already) so adding more hitstun + reducing recovery would just be too much.

Shhhh....I wasn't gonna say anything.

 

[Dahbomb]

I am trying to figure out what I can take away from She Hulk but she truly NEEDS all of that. Like even with all of that she would be Mid tier at best I feel.

Shhhh....I wasn't gonna say anything.

LOL I was gonna say too. The problem with the move isn't the hit stun... you can still use it in combos and stuff. The problem is the awful 40 frame recovery.

 

[SolarPowered]

It does just what it says: it kills Phoenix. Basically, it lets you activate Dark Phoenix on your own terms. Right now, there are too many ways to auto-kill Dark Phoenix. I want to give Phoenix players an option to "detonate". They get Dark Phoenix right away (no more running away from Phoenix for time outs), but they also lose the potential damage regular Phoenix could have put in. It's a fair trade to ensure your investment can't be shut down by an unavoidable set up.

It's just a manual Dark Phoenix activation. Although I suggested it's only doable on the ground so that I can still get pressure on her on incoming and have her turn on my terms. Wouldn't completely destroy anti Phoenix set ups.

Gotcha

We need to remove two of these changes. Let's figure them out so we can wrap up She-Hulk.

Why does it need to be just ten changes?

 

[Dahbomb]

Why does it need to be just ten changes?

So that people don't go over board with changes. I have like 20 changes I would like to make to Iron Man but we need to keep things consolidated when we are submitting this stuff. I also see that when you limit the changes like that you get more fruitful changes that people actually think about rather than putting in changes for the sake of changes.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

I am trying to figure out what I can take away from She Hulk but she truly NEEDS all of that. Like even with all of that she would be Mid tier at best I feel.

I keep forgetting about the whole no more than 10 changes thing. Cause there's definitely some ones that I'd like to see on top of that stuff. f+H (Greeting Punch) starting up faster. It's one of the easiest overheads to react to in the game.

Being able to cancel Lights Out earlier would be nice

 

[SolarPowered]

So that people don't go over board with changes. I have like 20 changes I would like to make to Iron Man but we need to keep things consolidated when we are submitting this stuff. I also see that when you limit the changes like that you get more fruitful changes that people actually think about rather than putting in changes for the sake of changes.

I feel like someone in a submarine who just broke the valve for the only escape hatch. I tried my best to condense my changes down to ten, but shit is gonna get real.

Makes sense, but I'm still salty lol.

 

[Frantic]

I feel like ten changes is a bit too little for some characters, because even with ten positive changes, Hsien-Ko is still probably gonna be ass.

 

[Dahbomb]

Fuck it man, if Karst agrees we can up the limit to 15. This is a community thing so if people agree to keep things reasonable we can up the limit.

Right now I say people can add stuff to She Hulk and PW... So concentrate discussion on low tiers.

And I forgot the biggest change! Berserker Rage (Swiss Cheese) advantage on block reduced to -3. Because it's fucking ridiculous that move is so positive on block!

 

[Ghazi]

So umm, are there any good places I can use to read up on a lot of the terminology you guys, and everyone else, use? I've read through both the SFIV and MvC3 SRK wikis but they don't seem to have covered everything. Generally if there's a term I don't understand I google it, but then I either get more confused by user descriptions in forums or they use more terminology I don't know, which leads to the same steps I did before and it loops. I do have the UMvC3 Bradygames (I think) guide but I've yet to read through it.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

I'm still a firm supporter that Wolverine should not be changed besides Fatal Claw damage. He's such a fucking one dimensional character.

I think most of the Wright changes that I would've suggested were covered. Not sure though.

j.H having a bigger hitbox and being active all the way until he hits the ground (Thor style) would be quite nice.

 

[Dahbomb]

What terms do you want cleared up?

Mango: The only nerf on Wolverine we have is Fatal Claw damage, the rest are all buffs. Well that and my Swiss Cheese nerf. I would say we are being considerably generous on the character.

 

[SolarPowered]

I feel like ten changes is a bit too little for some characters, because even with ten positive changes, Hsien-Ko is still probably gonna be ass.

You'd be surprised what some sugar, spice and Skullgirls can do to Hsien-Ko.

Fuck it man, if Karst agrees we can up the limit to 15. This is a community thing so if people agree to keep things reasonable we can up the limit

We'll cross that road when a good list of changes appears and convinces everyone that an extension is a good idea.

 

[Dahbomb]

We kinda already have with She Hulk. She's at 11 right now and I still feel it's insufficient. Like give her a double jump or something. Make Butt Slam faster. I don't know man.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

So umm, are there any good places I can use to read up on a lot of the terminology you guys, and everyone else, use? I've read through both the SFIV and MvC3 SRK wikis but they don't seem to have covered everything. Generally if there's a term I don't understand I google it, but then I either get more confused by user descriptions in forums or they use more terminology I don't know, which leads to the same steps I did before and it loops. I do have the UMvC3 Bradygames (I think) guide but I've yet to read through it.

Yeah you should probably take a look at the guide. I usually link folks to these two.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Glossary_of_fighting_games

http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/200...minology-acronyms-lexicon-and-glossary-guide/

What terms do you want cleared up?

Mango: The only nerf on Wolverine we have is Fatal Claw damage, the rest are all buffs. Well that and my Swiss Cheese nerf. I would say we are being considerably generous on the character.

Really? I guess I'd have to see the list again.

 

[Azure J]

I feel like ten changes is a bit too little for some characters, because even with ten positive changes, Hsien-Ko is still probably gonna be ass.

+ Increased walk speed
+ Increased dash speed
+ Increased momentum out of all dashes
+ c.H OTGs and Jump Cancellable
+ Bombs removed from Anki Hou inputs and remapped to QCF+S
+ Anki Hou items follow a set logic to determine stun items (2 normal, 1 warning, next item stuns)
+ Senpu Bu are all cancellable with S input
- Rinmukon mode active time decreased on point version

I'm wondering if I forgot something now. :lol