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[The Mango Sentinel]

Well, Zero is more or less in the same boat as Dante when it comes to airthrows, and that doesn't stop him from being the best character in the game!

Solo airthrow conversions are very nice, but not a necessity. I will gladly take a solo conversion with Dante, but I also won't go out of my way to argue for it.

I will, however, argue for a nerf on Nova's airthrow. Because seriously, wtf. 'Let me whiff my launcher and still combo you!' Bullshit.

Nope nope nope nope nope. Unless you're gonna give him some nice shit to make up for it. Nova's air throw is part of what makes him so terrifying. I hate the shit too, but I wouldn't take it away.

 

[Karsticles]

Nova's air throw and Human Rocket are going to get some changes. I'm not sure how I should nerf Human Rocket, though.

 

[Dahbomb]

Is everyone in agreement that this should be the change?

By the way, if Firebrand gets the same nerf I will just drop him. He'll be a piece of shit no matter what you do to him.

She wouldn't be able to follow up against an airborne opponent. Against a grounded opponent it's the same as always.

FB with 2 million damage BnB would not be shit lol.

 

[Frantic]

Nope nope nope nope nope. Unless you're gonna give him some nice shit to make up for it. Nova's air throw is part of what makes him so terrifying. I hate the shit too, but I wouldn't take it away.

He can have his conversions still, but I don't want to sit there watching him whiff normals and still convert off it. It's dumb.

 

[Dahbomb]

Nope nope nope nope nope. Unless you're gonna give him some nice shit to make up for it. Nova's air throw is part of what makes him so terrifying. I hate the shit too, but I wouldn't take it away.

He's still going to get a combo from it. What's changing is that he won't have an hour to confirm it.

All you need is a decrease in untechable time after throw.

 

[Karsticles]

She wouldn't be able to follow up against an airborne opponent. Against a grounded opponent it's the same as always.

FB with 2 million damage BnB would not be shit lol.

Well yeah, but no one's going to give him anything like that. He's not a high damage character. That's not how he is designed.

Tell me a situation where C. Viper could set up the unblockable against a grounded character in a realistic match setting.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

Is everyone in agreement that this should be the change?

By the way, if Firebrand gets the same nerf I will just drop him. He'll be a piece of shit no matter what you do to him.

I personally wouldn't fuck with Firebrand too much since he doesn't get near the amount of damage that Viper gets off of an unblockable.

Nova's air throw and Human Rocket are going to get some changes. I'm not sure how I should nerf Human Rocket, though.

Why human rocket? Maybe I don't see people abuse it enough to know why it needs to be nerfed.

 

[Dahbomb]

Well yeah, but no one's going to give him anything like that. He's not a high damage character. That's not how he is designed.

Tell me a situation where C. Viper could set up the unblockable against a grounded character in a realistic match setting.

MarlinPie does it all the time with Cold Shots assist. KBeast is still able to do it with Jam Session for resets (he catches the roll, forces them to block Jam Session and then unlockables them).

The main thing that's changing is Jam Session and Tenderizer unlockables on incoming.

 

[SolarPowered]

Someone in the Viscant thread said something important that was severely overlooked here.

Please fucking get rid of mashing for damage during supers. That is the WORST idea they could possibly add to Mahvel. I hate it with a passion. I don't care how many stick repairs it causes. It is dumb as hell.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

Maybe the amount of time it takes to get to FA lvl 3 should be reduced so you can create more opportunities on the ground. But yes I use Cold Star and I've seen others use it as well, so yeah....

 

["God's Beard!"]

Is everyone in agreement that this should be the change?

+4 on airborne opponents.

Someone in the Viscant thread said something important that was severely overlooked here.

Please fucking get rid of mashing for damage during supers. That is the WORST idea they could possibly add to Mahvel. I hate it with a passion. I don't care how many stick repairs it causes. It is dumb as hell.

no

 

[GuardianE]

Well, Zero is more or less in the same boat as Dante when it comes to airthrows, and that doesn't stop him from being the best character in the game!

Solo airthrow conversions are very nice, but not a necessity. I will gladly take a solo conversion with Dante, but I also won't go out of my way to argue for it.

I don't think it's an unreasonable change, personally. I'd be fine with most characters getting something substantial solo after an airthrow. Like I said, every UMvC3 addition has the ability to combo off an airthrow solo. I don't think that's a coicidence. I think that was a very deliberate choice, and I think the only reason why Dante cannot currently do it is because Capcom was terrified of what Vanilla Dante was and were too focused on nerfing to give him anything extra.

Why human rocket? Maybe I don't see people abuse it enough to know why it needs to be nerfed.

Human Rocket is a really really dumb move.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

Someone in the Viscant thread said something important that was severely overlooked here.

Please fucking get rid of mashing for damage during supers. That is the WORST idea they could possibly add to Mahvel. I hate it with a passion. I don't care how many stick repairs it causes. It is dumb as hell.

I think it was actually mentioned in the system changes. I hate it too. Just give me the fucking damage.

 

[Karsticles]

Why human rocket? Maybe I don't see people abuse it enough to know why it needs to be nerfed.

It's an aimable Bionic Lancer that leads to full combos, is projectile invincible, and safe on failure since he can rocket back away. Something has to change about that. If you watched the Nemo vs. FChamp FT20, you'd see a lot of situations where Nemo just threw it out there randomly against Dormammu, Doom, and Magneto because they all use projectiles, so "why not", and it's safe anyway.

MarlinPie does it all the time with Cold Shots assist.

So long as the opponent pushblocks Cold Stars, he/she won't touch the ground. Most people don't do it because it doesn't make a difference. Pushblocking prevents you from descending, so as long as you keep pushblocking any lockdown assist, you won't land during it.

Someone in the Viscant thread said something important that was severely overlooked here.

Please fucking get rid of mashing for damage during supers. That is the WORST idea they could possibly add to Mahvel. I hate it with a passion. I don't care how many stick repairs it causes. It is dumb as hell.

Mmmmm...I'm not sure on this. It's definitely not the worst, though; it's not even notably bad IMO.

 

[Ghazi]

Hey I like the mashing! Granted it broke my right trigger on my controller but nonetheless I think it's fine!

 

[SolarKnight]

I personally wouldn't fuck with Firebrand too much since he doesn't get near the amount of damage that Viper gets off of an unblockable.

That's irrelevant considering he kills the entire team anyways.

 

[Dahbomb]

You are talking about someone landing into Cold Shots after like an incoming. I am talking about Viper doing a corner combo, making them block Cold Shots while rolling than doing FA. Even then I have seen MarlinPie time it so that the FA hits and crumples while Cold Shot is hitting even if they are coming in.

Think of the unblockable like a near impossible to block high low. When on the ground if you are locked down by an assist you are screwed but if you chicken blocked the assist, you are safe from the mix up.

 

[Karsticles]

That's irrelevant considering he kills the entire team anyways.

There's only one assist that he can kill an entire team with, and it's Tenderizer H. Everything else is either situational or costs meter to set up. It makes a lot more sense to make a change to Tenderizer H than to nerf Firebrand because of that one assist. Otherwise you're using the same logic the people who want to nerf Morrigan use when they think she's winning and not Hidden Missiles + Morrigan.

You are talking about someone landing into Cold Shots after like an incoming. I am talking about Viper doing a corner combo, making them block Cold Shots while rolling than doing FA. Even then I have seen MarlinPie time it so that the FA hits and crumples while Cold Shot is hitting even if they are coming in.

But I bet those people aren't pushblocking Cold Stars.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

That's irrelevant considering he kills the entire team anyways.

Haha yeah, but you have to be pretty on point to do it. Plus it's Skrulls fault.

 

[Azure J]

Well yeah, but no one's going to give him anything like that. He's not a high damage character. That's not how he is designed.

Tell me a situation where C. Viper could set up the unblockable against a grounded character in a realistic match setting.

On incoming, if a character has no option but to fall onto the ground (no double jump, no air dash, no air super to stall), Viper doesn't need to do anything more than charge unblockable to catch them the first frame they stand on the ground. Other than that, there's also a more involved setup with Jam Session/Cold Star assist where you feint a normal (while calling one of the two assists) with Thunder Knuckle H - S Feint in the corner then charge an unblockable. It has a much tighter timing but it is real.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";72418321]Why? It's not a great move on its own.[/QUOTE]

I used it for combo extensions! Yeah it's shitty....but I still like it

 

[SolarPowered]

I think it was actually mentioned in the system changes. I hate it too. Just give me the fucking damage.

Pretty much

I'm not going to pour hundreds of hours of mashing into a game beyond move inputs and blocking. I don't want to stop playing fighting games by the age of thirty-five because my fingers are nearly falling off.

Fuck that shit

Mmmmm...I'm not sure on this. It's definitely not the worst, though; it's not even notably bad IMO.

Ask the wife and I bet she'll agree with me.

 

[Karsticles]

On incoming, if a character has no option but to fall onto the ground (no double jump, no air dash, no air super to stall), Viper doesn't need to do anything more than charge unblockable to catch them the first frame they stand on the ground. Other than that, there's also a more involved setup with Jam Session/Cold Star assist where you feint a normal (while calling one of the two assists) with Thunder Knuckle H - S Feint in the corner then charge an unblockable. It has a much tighter timing but it is real.

Can't you just ground throw her out of these?

Ask the wife and I bet she'll agree with me.

Hahaha. Indeed!

I'll add it to the list of debated system changes for later discussion.

 

[Azure J]

The strike would have minimal hit stun, she wouldn't be able to follow up unless she XFs.

And Dante gets full combos from air throws in XF. Stop complaining fanboys!

Dah pls.

Not making it confirmable on anti-air is a pretty powerful nerf you know. I don't agree but I do agree on making it strike with a knockdown that allows for the Thunder Knuckle H followup. Maybe add additional hitstun so she doesn't get wild damage off the confirm.

 

[SolarKnight]

@Karst: I was just saying he can do that, as long as the 300% thing gets fixed I don't really care how it was done.

 

[Karsticles]

Dah pls.

Not making it confirmable on anti-air is a pretty powerful nerf you know. I don't agree but I do agree on making it strike with a knockdown that allows for the Thunder Knuckle H followup. Maybe add additional hitstun so she doesn't get wild damage off the confirm.

Good, there's a disagreement. Battle on.

@Karst: I was just saying he can do that, as long as the 300% thing gets fixed I don't really care how it was done.

It was one of the first changes I made. Tenderizer H has been removed as an assist. He has better assists now.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

What's the Jill change list look like. I suggested something but I think it got overlooked twice.

 

[Dahbomb]

Can't you just ground throw her out of these?

Only if you X factor and even then it's tight. If you mess it up not only do you lose a character but you lose XF.

On the ground you have the option of CC as well. These all require resources so that is completely fair. In addition another escape to this is X factor right as she is about to hit and cancel into an invincible move like Joe's V Dodge.

 

[Azure J]

Can't you just ground throw her out of these?

No. If you do the following for example:

c.M - Thunder Knuckle M - c.M + Cold Star/Jam Session xx Thunder Knuckle H xx Feint - Focus Attack, it's guaranteed with Cold Star. With Jam Session currently, there's a small window where a person can XF cancel, but a grab or jump out of the way is out of the question since the attack animation begins during the time you're pushed out of Jam Session.

Edit: Typed c.L when I mean another c.M in that sequence, sorry guys.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Viper beam assist means Dahbomb's dream of a Trish team with two neutral assists is coming true.

 

[Dahbomb]

Dah pls.

Not making it confirmable on anti-air is a pretty powerful nerf you know. I don't agree but I do agree on making it strike with a knockdown that allows for the Thunder Knuckle H followup. Maybe add additional hitstun so she doesn't get wild damage off the confirm.

That's the whole point. It's a powerful tactic and it's why Viper is top 3. Not having a chance to even guess or formulate a hail Mary strat on incoming is unfair even for this game.

 

[Karsticles]

Ooo, I just thought of some more Skrull buffs...

What's the Jill change list look like. I suggested something but I think it got overlooked twice.

Jill:
*Arrow Kick travels farther; air OK; ground version can now be canceled into Feral Crouch on hit.
*Machine Gun Spray damage increased to 20,000 per bullet (22 bullets fire).
*Mad Beast is now a level 1; Mad Beast no longer allows meter to be built; startup changed to 4+1.
*Double Knee Drop startup reduced by 10 frames across the board.
*Position Change is now +6 on hit.
*Fallen Prey now forced a neutral tech.
*Health increased to 950,000.

Assists: Arrow Kick, Somersault Kick, Sickle Kick

 

[Dahbomb]

Dah pls.

Not making it confirmable on anti-air is a pretty powerful nerf you know. I don't agree but I do agree on making it strike with a knockdown that allows for the Thunder Knuckle H followup. Maybe add additional hitstun so she doesn't get wild damage off the confirm.

That's the whole point. It's a powerful tactic and it's why Viper is top 3. Not having a chance to even guess or formulate a hail Mary strat on incoming is unfair even for this game.

Its not like she even NEEDS it. She has fast high lows, left rights, a standing over head, top throw game and top pressure.... anytime she gets you to block Cold Shots on the ground she is going to open you up. The FA still has utility as ground unlockable and hyper armor into reversal move.

Also God's Beard just reminded me that Trish Round Harvest on roll raw tag into Viper to do unblockable still works.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

Ooo, I just thought of some more Skrull buffs...


Jill:
*Arrow Kick travels farther; air OK; ground version can now be canceled into Feral Crouch on hit.
*Machine Gun Spray damage increased to 20,000 per bullet (22 bullets fire).
*Mad Beast is now a level 1; Mad Beast no longer allows meter to be built; startup changed to 4+1.
*Double Knee Drop startup reduced by 10 frames across the board.
*Position Change is now +6 on hit.
*Fallen Prey now forced a neutral tech.
*Health increased to 950,000.

Assists: Arrow Kick, Somersault Kick, Sickle Kick

Alright so how about she lands closer to the opponent after a throw and Low Sweep otg's (Feral stance L move.) She could now start a combo off of throws.

 

[Karsticles]

Alright so how about she lands closer to the opponent after a throw and Low Sweep otg's (Feral stance L move.) She could now start a combo off of throws.

She can already start combos off of her command grab. She's like Wesker in that you shouldn't be using her normal throw.

 

[Dahbomb]

If she got combos off throws that would make the change on Falley Prey sort of useless. That's a really interesting change because it means she gets a guaranteed and powerful mix up off throws.

 

[Azure J]

That's the whole point. It's a powerful tactic and it's why Viper is top 3. Not having a chance to even guess or formulate a hail Mary strat on incoming is unfair even for this game.

Its not like she even NEEDS it. She has fast high lows, left rights, a standing over head and top pressure.... anytime she gets you to block Cold Shots on the ground she is going to open you up. The FA still has utility as ground unlockable and hyper armor into reversal move.

Hmm, when you put it like that, I see when you're coming from. It's just that there's something about the idea of needing to burn resources through X-Factor to confirm that seems strange to me. If we go with the idea I'm suggesting, she already gets a horrid combo HSD wise (and thus damage wise) and since the character will not be doing damage necessary to kill in current system changes regardless of what kind of confirm from the initial FA, the actual unblockable loses its scariness.

Then again, anti-air unblockable equalling a simple first contact that allows her to reset/re-adjust herself to neutral thanks to the Strike style of hitstun on it is already a lot more than what should happen to a move like Focus Attack so maybe I'm just being greedy. :lol

 

[Dahbomb]

The damage scaling is irrelevant as proven by Firebrand. If she doesn't kill she will snap back and do it again. The whole point of this patch was to tone down the 1 player stuff.

 

[Azure J]

Actually yeah, I agree with Dah's change to Focus Attack.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

She can already start combos off of her command grab. She's like Wesker in that you shouldn't be using her normal throw.

Ehhhhhh alright....well if Low Sweep did otg then she could combo off of her air throw without the need of an assist.

Also what would the command be for the air Arrow Kick? Unless you're taking out H knee drop.

 

[Karsticles]

Are we done?

Jill:
*Arrow Kick travels farther; air OK; ground version can now be canceled into Feral Crouch on hit.
*Machine Gun Spray damage increased to 20,000 per bullet (22 bullets fire).
*Mad Beast is now a level 1; Mad Beast no longer allows meter to be built; startup changed to 4+1.
*Double Knee Drop startup reduced by 10 frames across the board.
*Position Change is now +6 on hit.
*Fallen Prey now forced a neutral tech.
*Health increased to 950,000.

Assists: Arrow Kick, Somersault Kick, Sickle Kick

Nemesis:
*Fatal Mutation now has full invincibility and grabs in a 360 degree circle; places opponent in a crumple state; startup time reduced to 10 frames.
*Biohazard Rush now has hyper armor on frame 1 until recovery; startup reduced to 8+1; vertical hitbox increased; recovers sooner to allow for post-hyper combos.
*Bioweapon Assault now better at predicting where rockets should fire; recovers sooner, allowing for post-hyper combos.
*c.H super armor changed to frames 8-27.
*s.H super armor changed to frames 7-24.
*Minimum damage scaling for hypers changed to 60%.
*qcb.S now fires a downward-angled rocket that hits the ground at half a screen away.
*Clothesline Rocket L: 26 frame start up, +2 on block(no rocket, soft knockdown); previous L and M versions moved to M and H, respectively.
*c.L now chains to s.L.
*Launcher Slam M now has armor from frames 8-29; carries over to the assist version.

Assists: Launcher Slam M, Clothesline Rocket M, qcb.S

Deadpool:
*4th Wall Crisis is now 5+0 on startup; 1 bar; damage reduced to 220,000; throw scaling on follow-up.
*Happy-Happy Trigger damage increased slightly.
*Ninja Gift (all versions) no longer leaves Deadpool prone until landing.
*Teleport Malfunction now causes a soft knockdown.
*Taunt Bubble stays out for full animation when canceled.
*Quick Work into Chimichanga is now easier to perform.
*Katana-rama! hitstun significantly increased; now -3 on block.
*j.L changed to +10/9 on hit/block.

C. Viper:
*C. Viper now flashes yellow when performing an EX attack.
*EX moves can no longer be canceled into one another.
*Minimum damage scaling on specials reduced to 20%.
*Optic Laser vertical hitbox decreased slightly.
*Focus Attack Level 3 now causes a significantly less hitstun on airborne opponents, preventing follow-ups.

Assists: Thunder Knuckle H, Optic Laser, Burning Kick L.

Ehhhhhh alright....well if Low Sweep did otg then she could combo off of her air throw without the need of an assist.

Also what would the command be for the air Arrow Kick? Unless you're taking out H knee drop.

IDK, would anyone miss H knee drop?

 

[Frantic]

Oh yeah, the startup of Knee Drop... does it really need a 10 frame reduction? I mean, the light version would become 8 frames. Considering how much frame advantage it gets, that seems kinda nuts to me. 5 seems more reasonable.

Also, isn't Arrow Kick already cancelable into Feral Crouch on hit? I swear I've seen it when I've gotten hit with it. >_>

 

[Azure J]

So that means the Viper list looks like:

+ Optic Laser replaces Seismic Hammer L assist*
- Focus Attack Lvl 3 on anti-air puts opponents into air techable "Strike" or spin state
- EX moves are no longer cancellable into one another
- EX Seismo causes Viper to flash yellow on startup

Correct?

* Personally, I feel like it'd be better replacing Thunder Knuckle H assist since there's still a place for single hit OTG assists.

Edit: Oh the lists are up. Good job Karst. I still like doing my lists with the + or - to suggest buff or nerf easier.
Edit 2: What's with the vertical hitbox nerf on Optic Laser? The move follows its animation well enough, or is there something I'm not seeing?

 

[Karsticles]

Oh yeah, the startup of Knee Drop... does it really need a 10 frame reduction? I mean, the light version would become 8 frames. Considering how much frame advantage it gets, that seems kinda nuts to me. 5 seems more reasonable.

Also, isn't Arrow Kick already cancelable into Feral Crouch on hit? I swear I've seen it when I've gotten hit with it. >_>

Arrow kick is cancelable on block, but not on whiff, according to the guide. Someone is welcome to verify that.

Knee Drop is really bad right now. It's not like it's a dive kick, since it goes straight down. Wolverine's dive kick is 8 frames startup, IIRC. I don't think giving an inferior version of that the same startup is a problem.

So that means the Viper list looks like:

+ Optic Laser replaces Seismic Hammer L assist*
- Focus Attack Lvl 3 on anti-air puts opponents into air techable "Strike" or spin state
- EX moves are no longer cancellable into one another
- EX Seismo causes Viper to flash yellow on startup

Correct?

* Personally, I feel like it'd be better replacing Thunder Knuckle H assist since there's still a place for single hit OTG assists.

I've added OTG assists to a few other characters. Thunder Knuckle H is a great crossover counter, so I left it in. Basically, when going through assists, I asked:
1) Does this character have a great projectile? - if so, put it in.
1) Does this character have an OTG with other uses? - if so, put it in.
2) Does this character have a great crossover counter that can lead to full combos? - if so, put it in

After that, I just had to figure out whatever from what was left over.

Also, all EX moves now flash yellow. Not just Seismo.

 

[The Mango Sentinel]

IDK, would anyone miss H knee drop?

I personally will not. I will miss that opportunity for more combos off of otg Low Sweep though. Currently I think the only character she can combo off of her air throw is Sentinel....and that's only in the corner.......and it's hard as fuck.

I guess I could've mentioned that I played Jill a bit in vanilla and I still mess with her from time to time, but I still don't feel like I know enough about her to make decent suggestions other than the Low Sweep otg.

Does this all of a sudden make her too strong or something? I mean since you made the Wesker comparison, he does get to combo off of his air grab, and he gets to extend his combos by himself.

 

[Dahbomb]

Karst you should specify on Viper that against grounded opponents its identical to what it is now. Otherwise a lot of Viper players would be up in arms over it.

Also Viper more people use her OTG assist than her CC assist. Would kill some team compositions. I would put that to a vote at least.

 

[Karsticles]

I personally will not. I will miss that opportunity for more combos off of otg Low Sweep though. Currently I think the only character she can combo off of her air throw is Sentinel....and that's only in the corner.......and it's hard as fuck.

I guess I could've mentioned that I played Jill a bit in vanilla and I still mess with her from time to time, but I still don't feel like I know enough about her to make decent suggestions other than the Low Sweep otg.

Does this all of a sudden make her too strong or something? I mean since you made the Wesker comparison, he does get to combo off of his air grab, and he gets to extend his combos by himself.

Jill is a different character, and she has much better mix-ups than Wesker does. I also buffed her health by 150,000, which is a big deal for her.

Karst you should specify on Viper that against grounded opponents its identical to what it is now. Otherwise a lot of Viper players would be up in arms over it.

C. Viper:
*C. Viper now flashes yellow when performing an EX attack.
*EX moves can no longer be canceled into one another.
*Minimum damage scaling on specials reduced to 20%.
*Optic Laser vertical hitbox decreased slightly.
*Focus Attack Level 3 now causes a significantly less hitstun on airborne opponents, preventing follow-ups. Grounded hits are unchanged.

Assists: Thunder Knuckle H, Optic Laser, Burning Kick L.

 

[Azure J]

I've added OTG assists to a few other characters. Thunder Knuckle H is a great crossover counter, so I left it in. Basically, when going through assists, I asked:
1) Does this character have a great projectile? - if so, put it in.
1) Does this character have an OTG with other uses? - if so, put it in.
2) Does this character have a great crossover counter that can lead to full combos? - if so, put it in

After that, I just had to figure out whatever from what was left over.

Also, all EX moves now flash yellow. Not just Seismo.

OK. Also:

Karst you should specify on Viper that against grounded opponents its identical to what it is now. Otherwise a lot of Viper players would be up in arms over it.

This please. LOL Vipers would riot immediately.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Karst you should specify on Viper that against grounded opponents its identical to what it is now. Otherwise a lot of Viper players would be up in arms over it.

Also Viper more people use her OTG assist than her CC assist. Would kill some team compositions. I would put that to a vote at least.

So basically Focus is near-useless on incoming.

 

[Frantic]

Arrow kick is cancelable on block, but not on whiff, according to the guide. Someone is welcome to verify that.

Actually, I was thinking of the Feral Crouch wallbounce kick thing. My bad.

Knee Drop is really bad right now. It's not like it's a dive kick, since it goes straight down. Wolverine's dive kick is 8 frames startup, IIRC. I don't think giving an inferior version of that the same startup is a problem.

It's also a high, unlike Wolverine's, and she can cancel into it from her standing overhead so that's a really quick double overhead. Not to mention shit like 'locked down Somersault into guessing between TK Knee or Feral Crouch low.' She's already got enough bullshit mixups as is! I'll never be able to block her at this rate!