i played bad so good thing you didn't see.
i didn't really get to use hawkeye anyway.
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Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 |OT3| To infinites... and beyond!
- Thread starter enzo_gt
- Start date
i didn't really get to use hawkeye anyway.I really love how people are coming around to this months after I thought "hey, this could be a pretty serious team".
Needed more Morrigan though.
Think we were all playing bad. I know I was. I started to think too much instead of just playing and reacting to situations. I always notice I play worse when that happens. >_>i played bad so good thing you didn't see.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
So if Zero is cheap, and Morrigan/Doom is cheap, why isn't anyone playing Zero/Morrigan/Doom?
Does the Vergil assist make the team that much better?
I don't know anything about Marvel.
Does the Vergil assist make the team that much better?
I don't know anything about Marvel.
Professor Beef
Banned
I wonder how many weeks it took him to put that video together considering what his success rate of combos is?
FChamp thinks that team is broken. Its also one of my personal top teams in the game.
Viscant speculated that that configuration might actually be the strongest morridoom team. I could see it- zero is a ridiculously strong point character and can kill characters while still being meter positive so that when morrigan comes in she can be in astral vision for days. I don't know how zero could fair with dark harmonizer and hidden missiles, but he can function at pretty high level without really needing assists that badly anyway.
Karsticles
Member
Looks like a typical DHC to Vergil to me!
Why isn't anyone connecting the Soul Drain before the DHC to Vergil? It's free meter!
Not every combination of cheap + cheap = more cheap. I'm skeptical about that team working out simply because Hidden Missiles is only a good assist for Zero, not a great one. It also has no good anchor, and is very vulnerable to snapbacks. It's definitely worth trying, though, and could win tournaments.
Zero can TOD with just Hidden Missiles and he can spam Dark Harmonizer while zoning with Sogenmu.
Thing about the Vergil team is that it handles almost all of the "bad" match ups or supposed counters to Morrigan whereas Zero more or less is susceptible to the same thing. Then again Zero hardly loses to anyone with Sogenmu.
Thing about the Vergil team is that it handles almost all of the "bad" match ups or supposed counters to Morrigan whereas Zero more or less is susceptible to the same thing. Then again Zero hardly loses to anyone with Sogenmu.
Karsticles
Member
I know he can ToD people with Hidden Missiles. I'm wondering about the neutral, and whether that assist is enough for him to handle most matchups.
One thing I always ask myself is: can my team handle an opposing team using my point character with his/her best assist choices? And it seems to me that this team would have problems against other Zero teams, at least, which is the worst kind of team to have trouble against.
Been working on stuff a bit today. I wonder if my execution is ass or if I'm just ass. This stuff makes me sad. I'm trying nova Ammy moons combos. Jh land m h s, mmh fly mmh s, Ammy assist centurion rush in order, l m h. Am I getting it wrong? AUGH. I need to become not ass. So bad.
Zero with Sogenmu > Zero without Sogenmu
Also according to top Zero players, MorriDoom beats Zero even if he has Jam Session backing him up. Zero actually has trouble against heavy zoning and his health becomes a liability.
The characters to watch for would be Dorm, Magneto and Hawkeye. Vergil Strider combo should work too.
Also according to top Zero players, MorriDoom beats Zero even if he has Jam Session backing him up. Zero actually has trouble against heavy zoning and his health becomes a liability.
The characters to watch for would be Dorm, Magneto and Hawkeye. Vergil Strider combo should work too.
Karsticles
Member
Maybe you should start with simpler combos if you're just getting back into it.
Well, the butthurt Zero players have match results to back up their claim.
Zero with Sougenmu > Zero without Sougenmu, no doubt. ;-)
WesternHeretic
Member
I say 1 hour max. He chokes a lot in match, but he's pretty damn flawless in training mode. Fanatiq and Richard had training mode bets and Richard pretty much smoke Fanatiq every single time (to put that into perspective Fanatiq smokes F. Champ). Dude ran through the entire UMVC3 trials in like an hour. Then he went into training mode with ZmC and hit every single combo in 1 try.
In a match it's a completely different story.
Karsts you asked about character changes to your two Mains in hypothetical patch. Didn't want to clutter up the weekly thread with more Marvel talk.
I think Hidden Missiles is the culprit, has to be fixed/reworked whatever. Doom has to get nerfed to, his damage and meter build along with brainless Footdive needs to be addressed. By results he is far and away the best character in the game. HM acting as combo breakers is the first thing that needs fixing.
I have always said Morrigan isn't a big problem especially solo. The chip and lockdown from AV as well as the damage from the fireball juggle is just over the top, they are probably going to adjust that. I am thinking they are just going to be lazy and remove meter gain from AV. Missiles nerf and AV or fireball nerf should be enough. If they nerf both fireballs and AV then they at least have to give her an OTG option for throws.
Dorm can have his damage value on normals toned down a bit so Dorm players actually have to learn real combos. I personally think a lot of the mashable hypers do over the top damage even after max scaling so they need to fix that for some of them... Chaotic Flames applies. To compensate for the two damage nerfs he should have his 3C move buffed so that it hits OTG and can be used at end of combos. He should have one of his assists replaced as well with Dark Matter.
I think Hidden Missiles is the culprit, has to be fixed/reworked whatever. Doom has to get nerfed to, his damage and meter build along with brainless Footdive needs to be addressed. By results he is far and away the best character in the game. HM acting as combo breakers is the first thing that needs fixing.
I have always said Morrigan isn't a big problem especially solo. The chip and lockdown from AV as well as the damage from the fireball juggle is just over the top, they are probably going to adjust that. I am thinking they are just going to be lazy and remove meter gain from AV. Missiles nerf and AV or fireball nerf should be enough. If they nerf both fireballs and AV then they at least have to give her an OTG option for throws.
Dorm can have his damage value on normals toned down a bit so Dorm players actually have to learn real combos. I personally think a lot of the mashable hypers do over the top damage even after max scaling so they need to fix that for some of them... Chaotic Flames applies. To compensate for the two damage nerfs he should have his 3C move buffed so that it hits OTG and can be used at end of combos. He should have one of his assists replaced as well with Dark Matter.
remove TAC side exchange meter loss crap to make up for it. although i would like some more nerfs to TAC besides just that.
SolarKnight
Member
Forgot to ask. Of what little we got to play, what did you guys think of the new team?
what's your new team.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
Just change stupid fucking footdive to how it was in Vanilla and make missiles disappear when he's hit it's not that hard.
SolarKnight
Member
It was Strider/RR/Ammy / RR/Strider/Ammy.
Karsticles
Member
I'm cool with all of that, and I'd take an AV + Soul Fist damage (or hitstun?) nerf for an OTG option for Morrigan. I don't think 0D3C hitting OTG for Dormammu would matter, though, because in the end it really means choosing between these two scenarios:
1) Combo, 3D0C, Dark Hole, Chaotic Flame
2) Combo, 0D3C, done.
No Dormammu player is going to go for option 2.
I would rather 0D3C be a 1-frame move like 1D2C and 2D1C are. It would give Dormammu an answer to random full-screen hypers like Maximum Voltage and Shinkuu Hadoken. These are really frustrating when zoning because if you Dark Hole while Maximum Voltage starts up, Maximum Voltage eats the Dark Hole. This is why almost every Dormammu out there plays a rushdown Dormammu. His zoning is too susceptible to getting rocked by opposing hypers.
While I'm cool with his damage getting toned down, I don't see what's so crazy about it unless you're using Liberations (which should deal crazy damage) or using Samurai Edge to relaunch, which should produce good damage since you're sacrificing a support assist for combo extension.
Like check this very basic combo out:
c.LMHS, sj.MMHS, dp.M, qcf.AA - 632,100 damage, -40% net meter What's so wild about that number? I'm not arguing about whether his damage goes down - I don't really care. I just don't get why everyone thinks that's such a big scary number when a lot of characters do that meterless.
Then, there's the Chaotic Flame damage issue...really, and I think you will agree with me on this, it's not an issue with Chaotic Flame's damage. The issue is Capcom decided to make some hypers mashable, which increased their damage substantially, and overall health stayed the same, so it's a big deal. Even though meter gain was nerfed, this was not a wise decision. It would be best if Capcom just removed the mashing upgrades for all hypers.
Phoenix could use some buffs. Fix the X-Factor TAC glitch and let her throw fireballs in the air without going prone again, and give her a bit of a health buff.
I just want her back as a point character, haha.
What's the big deal with footdive?!
Ogrekiller
Member
It wouldn't.
No free snap alone makes it easier on phoenix teams. And TAC infinites still exist, unless they take those out as well.
i would like that. a lot of characters deal too much damage as it is. btw i don't know how this suggestion will go but here it is. i don't think characters with level 3's that can be combo'd into should be able to continue it after its over. i don't see how some characters get to continue them while others don't. i understand low damage characters like rocket getting to continue but not others.
I'm guessing it's something along the lines of being a button that results in far too much for what is essentially two actions, jump and dive.
I mean, I guess I can't completely relate when I play a team that says lol to it in it's entirety, but I'm trying!
Cool. It was fun. Just felt bad that I haven't had a breakout moment on stream yet. :lol
SolarKnight
Member
Oh, but you do have great moments on stream!
Like landing on my claymore after a teleport while I was underground with the raccoon
Like landing on my claymore after a teleport while I was underground with the raccoon
Parallax Scroll
Banned
Dahbomb, you mentioned Zero/Morrigan/Doom as a potential best team. I think I remember seeing Flocker pick that in tournament when he was up against the wall. He didn't accomplish much with it, but it shows at least someone has tried the team.
Karsticles
Member
I'd rather this go the other way around. All level 3s should have one of the following traits:
1) Massive utility.
2) Post-hyper solo combo potential.
3) Massive damage.
An ideal hyper from category 1 is Silent Kill. An ideal hyper from category 2 is Penance Stare. An ideal hyper from category 3 is Raging Demon.
I've talked about this elsewhere, but not here: Dark Dimension and Darkness Illusion are pieces of shit. I would take either of them as a level 1 that does half its current damage in scaled form just for the utility. Why?
Well, first off, they both do crap damage.
Dark Dimension: 400,000 damage.
Darkness Illusion: 405,000 damage.
Second of all, Dark Dimension has extremely little utility (basically, level 3 hyper quality invincibility, which is to be expected) and no post-hyper solo combo potential. Darkness Illusion has medium utility (gets her in safe for 3 bars - ack) and no post-hyper solo combo potential.
Third, both are on characters who really have better things to use their meter on. Why Darkness Illusion when I can have 3 Astral Visions up?
Compare the damage between Dark Dimension and a fully mashed Chaotic Flame: 338,300. A ~60,000 difference before you include damage scaling, and Chaotic Flame gets Purification OTG damage too! Why on earth would anyone use Dark Dimension unless it's to finish the match or waste an opponent's X-Factor time?
I'm just using these as examples because they're my characters. There are far, far worse level 3s in this game: Divine Instruments, Final Justice (the most ass ever), Mad Beast, and Fatal Mutation to name a few (what were they thinking with this?!). Everything should be on the same level as the 3 ideal hypers I listed.
It's just easier to use, though. You could still abuse it in Vanilla to get full combos. I think people overrate this buff.
Dark Dimension has OTG capability afterwards so you have to at least add the damage from Purification. Morrigan's lvl3 can be used in the air to escape set ups like a rich man's Harddrive. Not exactly practical but its there.
And yeah it goes without saying TACs will be nerfed.
As far as mashable hypers go some got more benefits than others. Characters like Deadpool needed the damage but fucking Wolverine did not need it on Fatal Claw. It should be removed altogether but the characters who need that extra damage like Storm should retain it.
As far as 3C goes I forgot to mention that it also comes out on 1 frame. Can be used as a reversal against a problem XF3 character who's just teleporting over the scrter
And yeah it goes without saying TACs will be nerfed.
As far as mashable hypers go some got more benefits than others. Characters like Deadpool needed the damage but fucking Wolverine did not need it on Fatal Claw. It should be removed altogether but the characters who need that extra damage like Storm should retain it.
As far as 3C goes I forgot to mention that it also comes out on 1 frame. Can be used as a reversal against a problem XF3 character who's just teleporting over the scrter
Karsticles
Member
The first point tends to be moot because if you use Dark Dimension, it's to kill. More often than not the opponent is dead before you can OTG Purification.
I mention the escape method of Darkness Illusion. Since I generally anchor Morrigan, I use it all the goddamn time. I'm grateful for it, but I'm also bitter as hell every time because it's 3 bars down the drain.
I would say it's the execution require for Morrigan. As Karst has said before she's probably easily top 10 in terms of difficulty for mastering movement. You can count the number of Morrigan players who have won a major with one finger.
Aside from combo video masters, and people who don't show up for tournies, they just don't have the execution for her OR don't want to use her because she has that "lame" aura surrounding her that prevents people from using her even if they want to because they don't want to be known as a lame player or a bandwagoner.
Chris G was right on twitter when he responded to Justin, it is him that's leading Morridoom to victory, and he's basically the only player that performed consistently with that shell.
Marvel Minions seem to dislike zoning in general and that's where alot of disdain comes from in general. Though I shared those sentiments in MvC2 since I hate Cable.
I know right?
I don't get people who complain about point doom. He has a bunch of characters that straight up body him regardless of who his teammates are. He's on a million teams because he's a great support character who's decent on point without being very difficult to use. Name me one player aside from clock who starts Doom and I'll eat my own ass.
If hidden missiles assist didn't exist and TACs were removed from the game, you'd see a hell of a lot less Doom. Doom become flavor of the month through the promulgation of TAC swag combos (and infinites as well, once they were discovered) which solve any point character's damage output problems/lack of good actual resets, and the realization by many top players that hidden missiles is the best assist in the game.
Anyway- regarding shitty level 3s, 4th wall crisis makes me die a little inside each time I remember how ass it is.
If hidden missiles assist didn't exist and TACs were removed from the game, you'd see a hell of a lot less Doom. Doom become flavor of the month through the promulgation of TAC swag combos (and infinites as well, once they were discovered) which solve any point character's damage output problems/lack of good actual resets, and the realization by many top players that hidden missiles is the best assist in the game.
Anyway- regarding shitty level 3s, 4th wall crisis makes me die a little inside each time I remember how ass it is.
Karsticles
Member
How's your team search coming, anyway? I was disappointed that you were busy in training mode last time we were all on.
Edit: I just read the rest of your post. Fuck Cable.
YES.
Well, to be fair to the team, it was only their second fighting game. I think they did a goddamn good job with how much experience they all had, and they've never done anything like this before. It was also really low budget. I don't disagree that the game could have had a lot more badass stuff, but it's not like they did a poor job considering the circumstances.
Let's not forget that we're lucky to get the game at all. Though I wonder, if Inafune were still there, would we be getting more updates? Dude was all about pleasing westerners.
Ogrekiller
Member
THC hyper selection ala assists should be standard already. I want shadow servant on my dark harmonizer. I like my red health as Nova. I want hailstorm on every assist I choose. I want a beam that shoots forward AND repulsor blast.
Custom assists. Aerial THCs. Tag throws. Tag cancels. Variable Cross. Level 2 hypers. Character ratios.
Fucking incompetent halfwits. So many little things that could have truly evolved the vs series not implemented. Instead we get trash like Heroes and Heralds, throwaway characters like galactus and shitty ass TACs, overhead tags, overpowered Xfactors, etc.
Custom assists. Aerial THCs. Tag throws. Tag cancels. Variable Cross. Level 2 hypers. Character ratios.
Fucking incompetent halfwits. So many little things that could have truly evolved the vs series not implemented. Instead we get trash like Heroes and Heralds, throwaway characters like galactus and shitty ass TACs, overhead tags, overpowered Xfactors, etc.
shaowebb
Member
You wanted an okay version of Hsien Ko so I made one.
If attacked she goes invincible gold armor and starts chucking maces at you. She also bounces and uses gongs. I gave her back her speed too. When she attacks you can see I even got the boob window in her outfit, the belt, and the collar in place too.
If attacked she goes invincible gold armor and starts chucking maces at you. She also bounces and uses gongs. I gave her back her speed too. When she attacks you can see I even got the boob window in her outfit, the belt, and the collar in place too.
You wanted an okay version of Hsien Ko so I made one.
If attacked she goes invincible gold armor and starts chucking maces at you. She also bounces and uses gongs. I gave her back her speed too. When she attacks you can see I even got the boob window in her outfit, the belt, and the collar in place too.
Is there any way for you to take videos of the stuff you're making, for those who don't have the game?
shaowebb
Member
Im not sure. There is a video section on the steam workshop for this game, but I don't know of any Steam ability to record stuff. I think i'd need something like a screen capture program to do it.
What about using something like FRAPS?
shaowebb
Member
Probably could work. Ill be making Phoenix next. Though I'm way behind on my keyframing and need to slow down some. BTW Haggar is in the top 10 pages now out of 68 pages of stuff. Folks love his grappling ability apparently. Morrigan is the next highest. The highest loved thing out of my whole collection has to be the Samus my wife made though. Its spot on and its the only good one on Steam. I expect her Metroid to do the same.
Heres hoping I can push Marvel vs Capcom stuff through the ranks some more though.
That combo isn't that complicated. It drops at the H Centurion Rush. I'm wondering if maybe there's just too much there in my notation.
Pure popularity-wise, I think better known marvel characters (Doom, Spidey, etc) and maybe a few capcom icons (Dante, Ryu, etc) are your best bet.
Random aside, it turns out you can indeed cancel Tasky's counter hyper into an install hyper (only tested Dante so far) and get a full combo! It seems like from limited testing, the opponent is always left in a spinning knockdown state so it's really easy to continue the combo afterwards. Also, you can DHC almost immediately to get the same effect while minimizing damage scaling (damn you Dante!) at the cost of giving up the full damage from the entire counter hyper.
nobody wants to play zero morridoom b/c zero is stupid looking
jumpin s started and hasn't used hidden missiles yet? i'd love to see that happen in a match
jumpin s started and hasn't used hidden missiles yet? i'd love to see that happen in a match
Before H C.Rush hits or after? If it's after you can chancel into a super earlier. If it's before you may need to fix the timing on the L C.Rush.
this was over on reddit, but its apparently the first time ChrisG used Morrigan at big two in UMVC3. TEam was Phoenix Wright/Dante/Morrigan, I can't believe that I complete forgot about the invincible assist PW used to have. That would be SOOOOOO LAME with Morrigan fireball bullshit, you can't even approach her.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6Taf_XXYR8&feature=youtube_gdata_player
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6Taf_XXYR8&feature=youtube_gdata_player