Negotiator
Member
That's extreme lag compensation (netcode's time rewind machine). SBMM tends to find distant players, so lag compensation kicks in pretty hard.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Uncharted 4: A Thief's End Multiplayer |OT| Swinging To Victory
- Thread starter BaraSailey
- Start date
Playing against people higher level than you is unfair, but playing against people that bend the space time continuum in a way that you have no control of is though 👌 - ND
False Witness
Member
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!
Their MP team is incapable of admitting they made a mistake.
Laggy matchmaking is probably part of their vision for the game or something.
Negotiator
Member
If this costs them Uncharted Point sales, the person in charge will most likely get fired...
Coolbgdog12
Member
I'm already tired of the MP. I'm not even excited to cut it on. it's their worst one yet with the best gunplay.
I love it and am disappointed by it at the same time. I really wish there was a mode without the down/KO system to really change up how the game plays.
I like the Down system, but I do wish I could play it like U2/U3 sometimes as well.
electroflame
Member
Heh, I haven't played it in four days and it gets easier and easier to stay away. I realize now that I was primarily playing it for the daily challenges much like the way that F2P phone games keep you coming back with random daily crap. The "threat" of "missing out" or "getting behind" by not playing is the primary motivator, I think.
It's really not worth it, in my opinion. They've really ruined the multiplayer with semi-pay-to-win and skill-based matchmaking. I've certainly got better things to do with my time than to play a game that doesn't respect my time.
Chronospherics
Member
Forgot to mention I made a ranked tips video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7tqSub5mRM
It features some of you guys, like Looney, Everlong and Wowbaggr. Not sure if anyone will find it useful, but there it is.
I might make more videos but not sure if I should bother since UC4 isn't very popular.
Yeah this is the rather awkward mentality of a lot of multiplayer game devs at the moment. Destiny is, or at least used to be the same, as Trials of Osiris began prioritizing rank over connection quality, and it turned into a rather tragic state of affairs as matches were laggy, and problematic.
I think the rank first matchmaking model is fine if your game uses dedicated servers but the host advantage being provided to one team is too significant to allow network quality to deviate significantly and still retain any sense that the match is 'fair' on games like UC4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7tqSub5mRM
It features some of you guys, like Looney, Everlong and Wowbaggr. Not sure if anyone will find it useful, but there it is.
I might make more videos but not sure if I should bother since UC4 isn't very popular.
Yeah this is the rather awkward mentality of a lot of multiplayer game devs at the moment. Destiny is, or at least used to be the same, as Trials of Osiris began prioritizing rank over connection quality, and it turned into a rather tragic state of affairs as matches were laggy, and problematic.
I think the rank first matchmaking model is fine if your game uses dedicated servers but the host advantage being provided to one team is too significant to allow network quality to deviate significantly and still retain any sense that the match is 'fair' on games like UC4.
Negotiator
Member
Downed by "Player not found". Has anyone seen this shit before?
Amazing coding, ND...
Amazing coding, ND...
obviously someone left and the host didn't keep track of his PSN ID string value.
Negotiator
Member
Is there any technical explanation about the "black screen" and "Match starting 97%" issues by ND?
In the previous gen the console had to read data from an optical disc, so it was understandable... now with the mandatory HDD installs it's unacceptable. HDD bad sectors or what?
In the previous gen the console had to read data from an optical disc, so it was understandable... now with the mandatory HDD installs it's unacceptable. HDD bad sectors or what?
Person who was hosting likely dropped out via Application Quit and then it has to do a host migration, albeit very slowly.
Stallion Dan
Member
I think everyone with a good connection has dropped the game. Every game now the majority of players are 2-3 bars. Think I'm gonna do the same unless they fix the dogshit standards they've set for their game.
The F2P model is a shit anyway. I'll never get what I want without weeks/months per item.
The F2P model is a shit anyway. I'll never get what I want without weeks/months per item.
Negotiator
Member
Well, if anything, even this thread is not as active as it used to be... granted, it's "anecdotal evidence", but it's indicative of the current state of the game.
What I'll never understand is all this "silence" policy by ND. It's the only company I've seen refusing to communicate with their fanbase on a regular basis. Whatever, November is coming soon, they'll reap what they sow.
I bet Arne is reading this post right now, but he won't respond.
Chalupa Batman
Member
They are probably silent because their hands are tied. I'm sure ND cringes at the DLC chest prices and other things that are glaringly bad, but Sony wants it that way and they can't do anything about it. And I think Arne is doing other things at ND now that they have 2 CMs again. I actually wouldn't be surprised if he left the company soon.
Negotiator
Member
Sony takes a 30% cut of Uncharted Point sales. They must really want this MP to be successful if they want to make money (the prime objective of a company). Maybe I'm missing something, I don't know...
Chalupa Batman
Member
Chronospherics
Member
Awful changes. A ranking system in a team based game that focuses on individual player performance is not a good ranking system at all. Rolling out the C to S reward system for all ranks is a a terrible move.
The master rank system, for what it's worth, is a lot better in the new update at least. Earning 7 points for a win with an S rank score previously was insane.
Overall, pretty terrible reworking of the ranking systems and another step in the wrong direction.
Nonsense. You're still graded as a team if you're playing in a party. But now, if you're the only good player on a team of useless randoms, you can avoid losing points just because the matchmaking is lousy.
Frequently being the top player of either team but still losing ranking points is a big part of what lead me to quitting the game entirely. Someone who plays well but is unlucky when it comes to getting matched with competent teammates doesn't deserve to be stuck in silver or gold forever.
I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of folks are just getting fed up with it. That's what happened here.
The game just doesn't have enough content. It's been months since release and it still has less content than Uncharted 2 had on release ffs. Three modes, THREE. Seriously how difficult is to make Team Objective? It's the best mode by far, Command is awful and no one wants to play it as a standalone mode.
Uncharted 3 had basically 5x the content, and I'm not even bringing co-op to the table. They put more effort into the fucking microtransactions crap than bothered to be on par with the previous games in terms of content. I mean, I understand that they'd delay co-op because the whole thing was rushed and co-op needs proper development, but more modes? Not a single new one since May? Seriously. No wonder it's dying.
Remnants is a vomit, too. Made me stop playing a lot of times.
Uncharted 3 had basically 5x the content, and I'm not even bringing co-op to the table. They put more effort into the fucking microtransactions crap than bothered to be on par with the previous games in terms of content. I mean, I understand that they'd delay co-op because the whole thing was rushed and co-op needs proper development, but more modes? Not a single new one since May? Seriously. No wonder it's dying.
Remnants is a vomit, too. Made me stop playing a lot of times.
Rewrite
Not as deep as he thinks
And Naughty Dog hasn't said a single word about any future content or give us updates for anything.
I still don't like their answer in regards to adding the missing MP characters. It's the last uncharted game, and you're going to tell me they're not going to bother adding all the past heroes and villains? Gtfo.
The biggest issue right now are the lack of game modes. Still can't believe there's only 3 modes...
And not just that, but there have need no official statement in regards to the skill based matchmaking backlash. Wtf are they doing.
I still don't like their answer in regards to adding the missing MP characters. It's the last uncharted game, and you're going to tell me they're not going to bother adding all the past heroes and villains? Gtfo.
The biggest issue right now are the lack of game modes. Still can't believe there's only 3 modes...
And not just that, but there have need no official statement in regards to the skill based matchmaking backlash. Wtf are they doing.
Chronospherics
Member
Oh, I actually missed that line about it being graded for your party. That's good, though it means I won't want to play with bad players...
As for solo qeueing though, it sounds like an absolute nightmare. Have fun qeueing with randoms all scavenging after KOs just to boost their SPM. All running staff and marking because support score is overpowered in regards to how it influences SPM.
It's a team orientated game, and playing with a group of players all fighting for their own individual performance, isn't going to bring your team anywhere closer to the unified goal.
Also for the people complaining about not being able to enter a solo queue playlist, the note from ND basically tells solo queuers to join a team.
"Playing with friends is the best way to succeed on your journey towards Master. To encourage this, there are no party restrictions to play Ranked together. Play as a team, communicate often and you will prevail."
I find that amusing, as that's my own perspective on the matter. You can't expect to achieve a high ranking in a team based game by being isolated away from the team based elements in your own queue. If you want to do well, you're going to need to join a party. Even in a party your individual score isn't enable you to keep increasing when you hit platinum / diamond. In a game full of parties, regardless of how good you are, you're not going to win even 40% of your matches at that level when solo queueing.
Chalupa Batman
Member
KO stealing doesn't bother me because the objective of TDM is first to 40. I'd rather win the match and get the 10
points than worry about my ratio or SPM. Downs are worth more than KOs anyway in relation to SPM.
As for solo players, I wish they'd have separate playlists, even moreso now with the changes. Even though I never really play ranked it's fun to hop into for a better challenge once in a while.
Coolbgdog12
Member
I think so. I played UC2 MP since the day I bought it(April 2010) up until the release of UC3 which was over a year later.
UC3 MP i played pretty much up until like 2012 so a year.
I'm already tired of this one and it's only been 3 months.
There's just simply not enough content, dumb design choices and things holding it back.
Chalupa Batman
Member
It's a shame because character movement, animations and gunplay, the most important elements to get right, are incredible.
Negotiator
Member
ND should outsource MP/netcode development to another studio (Blizzard/DICE/whatever) and keep the graphics dev team (ICE Team). Best of both worlds.
Rewrite
Not as deep as he thinks
Despite my complaints and frustrations with how this whole MP is being handled, the core gameplay mechanics are very good that I still play daily. Honestly, in terms of gun balance, this MP has the best gun balance out of UC2 and 3. I see a ton of variety when it comes to guns, and that's very good to see. It's not a M9 fest like it was in 3, or just an AK fest/FAL fest in 2. I love the weapons and how each feel viable in whatever range they work best in. That's one thing I can say, ND got the gun balance right in this game.
Coolbgdog12
Member
In a perfect world UC4's MP would've had:
TDM, 3TDM, FFA, TO, Plunder, new MP mode, COOP adventure, Horde.
The core mechanics would've been the same as UC2 i.e. no downs, no sprint, vertical maps, pickup weapons.
The sidekicks wouldn't be in the game and mysticals if any would've been a special pickup treasure that spawns a few times during the match.
Right before this game came out as I was playing the beta I used to imagine, "Man I wonder what else is in store!?"
low and behold literally two other modes were it. I just don't like the changes they did. They got the shooting and gameplay tight but added a bunch of crap around it and barely put in any content. Maps could go too. I don't really like any map in UC4. There's tolerable maps like River, Sunken Ruins and Rooftops which are okay but the rest aren't really anything special. They have a very generic feel to them.
I blame TLOU.
Also it's funny that dev said you only need to play like a week to unlock all gameplay stuff, when I needed whole month of daily grinding to unlock everything except for Path of Indra. It's useless anyway.
Never played UC2/UC3 Multiplayer, so it's really sad for me to hear that UC4 has less content. 3 modes doing nothing for players, everyone's in TDM or Command, Plunder is pretty much dead by now.
Never played UC2/UC3 Multiplayer, so it's really sad for me to hear that UC4 has less content. 3 modes doing nothing for players, everyone's in TDM or Command, Plunder is pretty much dead by now.
Well Plunder is completely broken by smoke grenades and el dorado/indra. I got bored of it when I had to use smoke in every single game because it's basically a guaranteed idol and every single match is a shitty boring smoke fest. How is that balanced or fun?
Way to kill the best mode with just one new stupid weapon.
God this game is a mess. What a waste of perfected gameplay.
#1 defender
Member
Iirc he said you need a week to earn enough relics for one gameplay chest and that you can get everything by buying 7 chests. Path of Indra is pretty fun in command, because it lets you zoom from one command point to another (provided there is someone there to lock onto), or make quick getaways as the captain.
Stallion Dan
Member
Play it every 3 days and do all 3 days worth of challenges at once.
But yes, it is dying.
Solo playlist, no parties. Not rocket science.
Negotiator
Member
Chronospherics
Member
Well I mean the statement makes it pretty clear that they don't want the game played like that. If you were master rank from a solo playlist that would not be the same as being master rank from a team playlist, the latter would feature a much higher level of play, than the former, so ND probably don't want to distribute the same rewards to both. That's how the statement reads anyway.
It's a team game so if you want to be considered good at it (as in, ranked as master), you're going to need a good team.
It's not like other games, like MOBAs or Overwatch etc. feature separate queues for solo players. It's rather universal that these team games expect solo queuers to find regulars to play with, or suffer the consequences of inconsistent team mates and absent communication. UC does try to steer solo queuers together, but the problem is that there are very very few solo queuers in the upper ranks of the game (platinum, diamond, master) that once you reach that area you begin to meet parties pretty consistently. Plus, parties that aren't full are always going to need solo queuers to fill the gaps.
Coolbgdog12
Member
sure you're meeting new people, but that doesn't mean the game isn't dying. there's only anecdotal evidence to go around but it seems like the majority of people I know that played UC MP a lot don't really get on as much. I personally don't play it much unlike when i had 3 I played pretty much daily.. UC3 MP had problems, but it had lots of content and at times could be fun. This game on the other hand has little to do and the good gameplay that's here is obscured by a lot of superficial crap.
Coolbgdog12
Member
Apparently UC4 MP maps are "well-crafted":
well crafted my ass lol.
These maps just aren't interesting. I much preferred UC2 and 3 maps even.
There's nothing in UC4 that's on the level of The Village, High Rise, Fort, London Underground anything.
Negotiator
Member
UC2/UC3 maps are "intermediate", lol.
Chronospherics
Member
I get that, but at the point where you've climbed up to platinum or something like that, you're going to need more than that 10 points when solo queuing. Winning half of your games and getting C ranks isn't going to cut it, so either you're going to need to start caring about your individual performance (by means such as adapting your playstyle in ways to increase SPM, and taking KOs asap) otherwise, you won't rank up.
But I mean, what do I care? I don't solo queue, and this system is only going to make it easier for me to rank up. If solo queuers are happy with it, then by all means, enjoy it, but to me it's just ND saying 'were not adding a solo playlist, you're still going to lose a tonne of games to parties, but here's a system that'll allow you to fight among your team mates to determine who gets punished'.
I guess it's better than nothing, and I wouldn't want them to split the players into two pools, but individualistic performance ratings sound like a nightmare, all the same. Personally I don't struggle to outperform my team mates, but I don't try to either, I like being able to play the game and think about the win, not how well I'm doing. I like being able to jump in for revive and not worry about how it affects my grade if it goes bad.
A lot of them are better than any official map really. Some of them were awesome, I played lab exclusively the last months of my U3 play.
I might start doing that, since you can get more offline relics at once.
Also, did they "nerfed" Devil weapon skin? It was glowing like lava, but now you can barely see that cool effects. I had to replace it with other nice skins like Alien. What do you guys think about this?
Stallion Dan
Member
Uninstalled the game.
Logged on to do my 3 challenges and there is just zero fun in it.
Was gonna write a long rant with reasons but everyone knows them all. If this wasn't Uncharted I would have dropped it the week of release for being so god damn fucking awful, the legacy of UC2/3 is the only thing that kept me playing.
But enough, final result of UC4 is one of the worst MP experiences ever. Hope whoever is respnsible for this dogshit moves on to another company.
Logged on to do my 3 challenges and there is just zero fun in it.
Was gonna write a long rant with reasons but everyone knows them all. If this wasn't Uncharted I would have dropped it the week of release for being so god damn fucking awful, the legacy of UC2/3 is the only thing that kept me playing.
But enough, final result of UC4 is one of the worst MP experiences ever. Hope whoever is respnsible for this dogshit moves on to another company.
Chalupa Batman
Member
I don't agree with this at all. It's super easy to get carried to wins in this game (and Master as a result) if you play with other teammates who are better than you and just stay near them and out of trouble. I would consider a solo Master player infinitely more skilled than a group Master player because you actually have to play well all the time. There's way more high-level individually-skilled players than there are high-level groups, most obviously because there's a larger data set (1 vs 5 at a time). As a result, yes, two high-level groups going at it will be way more competitive, but it doesn't happen as much. High-level groups frequently steamroll the competition.
Hypothetically, if there were no parties allowed and all the best players had to play solo, that would balance out the "headless chicken" bad players. From there, the best players would have to carry the entire team, which is a lot harder to do than being a part of a superteam and steamrolling 90% of the competition.
The reason why there are very few solo players at the upper ranks is due to the bandwagon effect/herd behavior, meaning that everyone just assumes "Ranked is harder because it counts, so we need to only play in parties". As a result, everyone is afraid to play solo, so they don't. This is why I want solo playlists. There's a larger group of us out there than you would think.
Negotiator
Member
I would agree if by "solo" you meant a FFA playlist, not TDM. Yes, FFA requires more skill than TDM (because you have no teammates to back you up) and a bit of luck (spawn-wise).
Then again, kill-oriented modes are terrible for competition (Ranked, tournaments etc.), not to mention horrible lag that causes undeserved deaths.
Command (without welfare BS) or Plunder would be a lot better for team-based competitive matches. Who cares about deaths, it's all about the objective.
Too bad ND panders to TDM-only players... because apparently "it's not fair to expect from TDM players to know how to play objective modes" according to certain ND devs (LOL). No wonder the "Competitive" scene is a joke in ND games. It's either TDM or 1v1
(baaags of skeeeeel)
Similar threads
- x2