Uncharted 4: A Thief's End |OT| You're gonna miss this ass

Ascenion said:
No it wouldn't.
Click to expand...

What? Yes it would.
Then Drake would be morally obligated to find the treasure and stop the bad guy, instead of realizing that the adventure is pointless and greed is a destructive force and he needs to move on with his life. If the treasure had supernatural qualities the endgame would have been the same "good thing I'm a hero who stopped it from falling in the wrong hands again" which is totally antithetical to the entire 15 hours of story that had been building up in this game
 
Past said:
Has anyone been watching Angry Joe's stream? I don't think he will give it a great score, he looks completely uninterested in the game. He keeps dying and getting stuck despite playing with aim assist.
Click to expand...

Joe seems to be enjoying it from what I'm seeing atm. He's not even playing too.
 
Fancy Clown said:
What? Yes it would.
Then Drake would be morally obligated to find the treasure and stop the bad guy, instead of realizing that the adventure is pointless and greed is a destructive force and he needs to move on with his life. If the treasure had supernatural qualities the endgame would have been the same "good thing I'm a hero who stopped it from falling in the wrong hands again" which is totally antithetical to the entire 15 hours of story that had been building up in this game
Click to expand...

Absolutely agree. It would detract from the character dynamics between Drake and Sam. This would have been a serious interruption to what was primarily a character and thematically driven story.

Edit: The magic, you could say, was in their relationship. Haha
 
Fancy Clown said:
What? Yes it would.
Then Drake would be morally obligated to find the treasure and stop the bad guy, instead of realizing that the adventure is pointless and greed is a destructive force and he needs to move on with his life. If the treasure had supernatural qualities the endgame would have been the same "good thing I'm a hero who stopped it from falling in the wrong hands again" which is totally antithetical to the entire 15 hours of story that had been building up in this game
Click to expand...
Yup.
 
JBwB said:
Joe seems to be enjoying it from what I'm seeing atm. He's not even playing too.
Click to expand...

Well, now he is lol since he just went through the best sequence of the game. He looked completely bored and frustrated during the Madagascar chapter cause he kept dying and getting stuck. He stopped talking for a good 10 minutes and even put the chat into sub only mode.
 
Fancy Clown said:
What? Yes it would.
Then Drake would be morally obligated to find the treasure and stop the bad guy, instead of realizing that the adventure is pointless and greed is a destructive force and he needs to move on with his life. If the treasure had supernatural qualities the endgame would have been the same "good thing I'm a hero who stopped it from falling in the wrong hands again" which is totally antithetical to the entire 15 hours of story that had been building up in this game
Click to expand...

If everything else remains constant (ending spoilers)
then it depends on where it is implemented. If it happens with before they find Sam after Rafe takes him, then maybe. Chances are he'd still be okay letting Rafe have the treasure because it's just money and it's very likely they could make it to where the island itself is supernatural and not the actual treasure. If it happens after they rescue Sam before he runs off then again he has to fight Rafe anyway, the supernatural is just a bonus. Plus your realization is one he already had. He knows that, still doesn't stop him longing for it. He only did this one for Sam anyway. He never wanted to do it. He was guilted into it.
 
funkystudent said:
It was always pretty stupid though.


Unless.
THE PIRATE GHOSTS ARE THE SINGLE PLAYER DLC!
Click to expand...
Oh hell yes. Like
RDR's Undead Nightmare
. You leave the main game untouched and congruent, but the DLC can just go crazy with it.

Have the treasure
be cursed and it attracts the ghosts of pirates who died while seeking fortune, and use that to bring Eddy Raja back. Pirate ghosts can only be defeated with old-school pirate weapons — the flintlock pistol and sword take center stage

Final battle =
sword fight with Ghost!Avery on the top sails of a ghost ship,
and then it's revealed Nate is (ENDING SPOILER)
embellishing the story of 4 to Cassie
 
Past said:
Well, now he is lol since he just went through the best sequence of the game. He looked completely bored and frustrated during the Madagascar chapter cause he kept dying and getting stuck. He stopped talking for a good 10 minutes and even put the chat into sub only mode.
Click to expand...
Joes review will be interesting. He gave TLoU a 10 and that game had slow pacing and a few difficulty spikes, but Uncharted 4 has a lot slower pacing and the difficulty spikes a bit higher.
 
Ascenion said:
If everything else remains constant (ending spoilers)
then it depends on where it is implemented. If it happens with before they find Sam after Rafe takes him, then maybe. Chances are he'd still be okay letting Rafe have the treasure because it's just money and it's very likely they could make it to where the island itself is supernatural and not the actual treasure. If it happens after they rescue Sam before he runs off then again he has to fight Rafe anyway, the supernatural is just a bonus. Plus your realization is one he already had. He knows that, still doesn't stop him longing for it. He only did this one for Sam anyway. He never wanted to do it. He was guilted into it.
Click to expand...

What would
a supernatural element even add to the story tho? It would distract from everything else because you can't introduce a big ol supernatural element to the plot and not have that become a focal point of the conflict, which again would diminish the story.
 
Past said:
Well, now he is lol since he just went through the best sequence of the game. He looked completely bored and frustrated during the Madagascar chapter cause he kept dying and getting stuck. He stopped talking for a good 10 minutes and even put the chat into sub only mode.
Click to expand...

I don't understand how Joe and Other Joe can be so consistently bad at these types of games. Or maybe it's just with console games because they're not used to playing with control pads? Shadowfall, Halo 5, Quantum Break, UC4, you name it. I mean, for UC4 they have aim lock on for heaven's sake, and even then they seem to completely forget that cover is even a thing. That and perhaps they're not paying as much attention so they miss dialogue, instructions etc that otherwise guide the player (e.g. Sully saying "Nate, that ain't working!", but because they missed him saying that, they carry on doing the thing that isn't working.

On that note, if you have lock on enabled for the entirety of the play through, isn't that sort of taking the bulk of the fun, skill factor and challenge away from the combat? Essentially making the gunfights that much more automated and mundane. I would have assumed lock on was for complete beginners, or those who simply want to go through combat with the bare minimum challenge. Weird that Joe would select it as his default play through method.
 
Fancy Clown said:
Except having a supernatural twist in this one would literally ruin the theme of the story
Click to expand...

more then murdering hundreds of people for no reason? Because that's what happens when it's not to save the world. There's also the other option of: tell a different story then. Save your awesome brothers story for a game better suited for it
 
Spring-Loaded said:
Oh hell yes. Like
RDR's Undead Nightmare
. You leave the main game untouched and congruent, but the DLC can just go crazy with it.

Have the treasure
be cursed and it attracts the ghosts of pirates who died while seeking fortune, and use that to bring Eddy Raja back. Pirate ghosts can only be defeated with old-school pirate weapons — the flintlock pistol and sword take center stage

Final battle =
sword fight with Ghost!Avery on the top sails of a ghost ship,
and then it's revealed Nate is (ENDING SPOILER)
embellishing the story of 4 to Cassie
Click to expand...

I actually really like that concept haha. Would be a great way to tie it in to the
epilogue
.
 
Spring-Loaded said:
Oh hell yes. Like
RDR's Undead Nightmare
. You leave the main game untouched and congruent, but the DLC can just go crazy with it.

Have the treasure
be cursed and it attracts the ghosts of pirates who died while seeking fortune, and use that to bring Eddy Raja back. Pirate ghosts can only be defeated with old-school pirate weapons — the flintlock pistol and sword take center stage

Final battle =
sword fight with Ghost!Avery on the top sails of a ghost ship,
and then it's revealed Nate is (ENDING SPOILER)
embellishing the story of 4 to Cassie
Click to expand...
Thing is,
Uncharted's supernatural worked when they were hinted at and built up through the entire game. A DLC doing it would either spend too little time building or too little time with the supernatural stuff itself IMO.
 
krae_man said:
more then murdering hundreds of people for no reason? Because that's what happens when it's not to save the world. There's also the other option of: tell a different story then. Save your awesome brothers story for a game better suited for it
Click to expand...

Did you miss the part where he thought his long lost brother's (whom he feels responsible for) life depended on finding the treasure. That's a much more interesting motivation than the past games, where he just wanted treasure just to discover it until a third act twist reveals it's a supernatural weapon
 
So what are the chances if this series is revived in the distant future that
Cassie
is main protagonist? I was thinking
Chloe before I played the game, but it could even be Sully and Sam (but I don't think that pairing would too interesting).
Seems like Naughty Dog left some decent options for possible future games.
 
Past said:
Well, now he is lol since he just went through the best sequence of the game. He looked completely bored and frustrated during the Madagascar chapter cause he kept dying and getting stuck. He stopped talking for a good 10 minutes and even put the chat into sub only mode.
Click to expand...

Oh I see lol.

I've gotta say though, I like his reviews and all, but I'm finding him very obnoxious during this stream. He was even laughing at one point during
Elena's confrontation
scene. It's also clear that he's never played any of the previous UC games.

I'm honestly very curious what score he'll give it.
 
StrongBlackVine said:
So what are the chances if this series is revived in the distant future that
Cassie
is main protagonist? I was thinking
Chloe before I played the game, but it could even be Sully and Sam (but I don't think that pairing would too interesting).
Seems like Naughty Dog left some decent options for possible future games.
Click to expand...

I would not like that at all.
A) it would be kind of annoying that Drake worked his to get out of this life only for his daughter to learn the wrong lesson from him and B) really not a fan of the idea of the kid picking up the mantle, I didnt like it in Indiana Jones, I wouldn't like it here. I'd much prefer Sam as the protagonist out of the two of them, since he has a better motivation since he hasn't gotten the reckless adventuring out of his system yet.

The real best continuation of the series would be young Sully in the 70's tho
 
Fancy Clown said:
What would
a supernatural element even add to the story tho? It would distract from everything else because you can't introduce a big ol supernatural element to the plot and not have that become a focal point of the conflict, which again would diminish the story.
Click to expand...

It could just enhance the story add more flare to it because if I'm honest, U4 has been done before, much better elsewhere. This is a winner based on character interactions. The overarching plot is very by the book. Not to mention why must the supernatural element be real? It could easily be like U3 where the water was just a hallucinogenic. What's to say there isn't some bug on the island that made Avery go crazy and made all the Pirates turn on one another thinking the treasure was cursed when it was just like a rash from a plant or a bug bite? I believe they could do it. I mean they basically let you stumble upon Libertalia looking for the gunsboat heist treasure only and Libertalia was never the focal point the treasure was always it. It could've been done, easily.
 
Just finished the game.
Naughty Dogs are something else. They are at the top of their game, their attention to detail is wonderful.

I was constantly going..

that rock is beautiful
that wall is nice
that reflection is awesome
that sand is really something
that statue looks real
that view is amazing

Cant wait for what they have in store for TLOU.
 
Ascenion said:
It could just enhance the story add more flare to it because if I'm honest, U4 has been done before, much better elsewhere. This is a winner based on character interactions. The overarching plot is very by the book. Not to mention why must the supernatural element be real? It could easily be like U3 where the water was just a hallucinogenic. What's to say there isn't some bug on the island that made Avery go crazy and made all the Pirates turn on one another thinking the treasure was cursed when it was just like a rash from a plant or a bug bite? I believe they could do it. I mean they basically let you stumble upon Libertalia looking for the gunsboat heist treasure only and Libertalia was never the focal point the treasure was always it. It could've been done, easily.
Click to expand...

Adding something just for "flair" isn't good storytelling. The supernatural element would enhance the theme or character in any way here, and as I said only detract from it. Like if something were responsible for turning Avery crazy then that would totally destroy the point of the pirate plot which is that they are people who succumbed to their own innate flaws over treause, which is incredibly important to the story because that mirror's and develops Nathan/Sam/Rafe's struggle for the treasure as it tears them apart and catalyzes Drake's realization that he doesn't need this life anymore. There needs to be a better reason to include something than "it would be cool". I can't think of any scenario in which supernatural stuff would enhance the actual storytelling in this game. And I'm curious what story has done what Unchared 4 did and better? Because I can't think of any pulp adventure story that has taken a mature look at its protagonist and the effect of the adventure on their lives in a really human, character drive way as this game has.
 
Fancy Clown said:
Did you miss the part where he thought his long lost brother's (whom he feels responsible for) life depended on finding the treasure. That's a much more interesting motivation than the past games, where he just wanted treasure just to discover it until a third act twist reveals it's a supernatural weapon
Click to expand...


In the first two games, he starts killing pirates to get to treasure first. But slowly realizes the treasure is magic and bad guys want to use it to take over the world and he vows to stop them. The early killing becomes justified in the end.

In this game he kills to save his brother but learns he didn't need to making the killing unjustified and quite honestly reprehensible. It should be unforgivable. There shouldn't be a happy Sam-Nate ending.
 
Fancy Clown said:
I would not like that at all.
A) it would be kind of annoying that Drake worked his to get out of this life only for his daughter to learn the wrong lesson from him and B) really not a fan of the idea of the kid picking up the mantle, I didnt like it in Indiana Jones, I wouldn't like it here. I'd much prefer Sam as the protagonist out of the two of them, since he has a better motivation since he hasn't gotten the reckless adventuring out of his system yet.

The real best continuation of the series would be young Sully in the 70's tho
Click to expand...
But she is already getting started on that path. Yes they are doing safe, legal exploration now, but probably won't take much veer off that path. Especially with Sully and Sam seemingly still on the more dangerous side.
Not saying I want that to happen, but it wouldn't be a stretch.
 
krae_man said:
In the first two games, he starts killing pirates to get to treasure first. But slowly realizes the treasure is magic and bad guys want to use it to take over the world and he vows to stop them. The early killing becomes justified in the end.

In this game he kills to save his brother but learns he didn't need to making the killing unjustified and quite honestly reprehensible. It should be unforgivable. There shouldn't be a happy Sam-Nate ending.
Click to expand...

um what? He didn't know that his brother was lying to him...that's kind of the whole point. He obviously would not have gone on this adventure and killed bad guys otherwise. Once he found out he just wanted to peace on out of there.
 
Fancy Clown said:
um what? He didn't know that his brother was lying to him...that's kind of the whole point. He obviously would not have gone on this adventure and killed bad guys otherwise. Once he found out he just wanted to peace on out of there.
Click to expand...

I think he is saying they still killed innocent people like at the auction.
 
StrongBlackVine said:
But she is already getting started on that path. Yes they are doing safe, legal exploration now, but probably won't take much veer off that path. Especially with Sully and Sam seemingly still on the more dangerous side.
Not saying I want that to happen, but it wouldn't be a stretch.
Click to expand...

True, but I think after what Nate and Elena went through I think they'd be extra careful to keep their daughter from that sort of thing and provide more constructive outlets, but the lure of adventure is certainly implied at the end. I guess I just would rather it not happen than it shouldn't happen.

StrongBlackVine said:
I think he is saying they still killed innocent people like at the auction.
Click to expand...

The innocent people who were part of the criminal underworld and were shooting at them?
 
krae_man said:
In the first two games, he starts killing pirates to get to treasure first. But slowly realizes the treasure is magic and bad guys want to use it to take over the world and he vows to stop them. The early killing becomes justified in the end.

In this game he kills to save his brother but learns he didn't need to making the killing unjustified and quite honestly reprehensible. It should be unforgivable. There shouldn't be a happy Sam-Nate ending.
Click to expand...

This makes no freaking sense so

It's cool to kill pirates at first because in the end the bad guys want to use it as a weapon. But killing pirates to save your brother, which is a way better reason then going on a treasure hunt is reprehensible because there is no person trying to use the treasure to take overt the world?

This argument is nonsense regardless because it's a video game and stuff like this in a videogame where guns are used is always gonna happen. And in every game these people are actively trying to kill him, the motivation to fight back is so much stronger in this game then others.
 
Just got the Platinum. No more Uncharted :(

I kinda wanna go back and Platinum the first three on PS3 but I would need to replay 1 2 more times since I haven't unlocked crushing yet...ehhh. Also might be difficult to drop from the 1080p/60 FPS to whatever those versions are running at.
 
falconxcrunner09 said:
Just got the Platinum. No more Uncharted :(

I kinda wanna go back and Platinum the first three on PS3 but I would need to replay 1 2 more times since I haven't unlocked crushing yet...ehhh. Also might be difficult to drop from the 1080p/60 FPS to whatever those versions are running at.
Click to expand...

Just think of all the screen tearing and texture pop in as a cool unlockable filter!
 
krae_man said:
In the first two games, he starts killing pirates to get to treasure first. But slowly realizes the treasure is magic and bad guys want to use it to take over the world and he vows to stop them. The early killing becomes justified in the end.

In this game he kills to save his brother but learns he didn't need to making the killing unjustified and quite honestly reprehensible. It should be unforgivable. There shouldn't be a happy Sam-Nate ending.
Click to expand...

It's not quite that simple, and I don't believe it is unforgivable.
Yes the lie was reprehensible, and risked not only Nate's life but also his marriage (though it's important to note that Sam believed that any damage done to Nate's relationship as a result of the lie, would merely be temporary), but Sam also doesn't view this entire thing in that outright negative manner, and very likely neither does Nate. To Sam going after Avery's treasure is the most important and defining discovery him and his brother have ever, or will ever will embark on, and almost something they are destined for. It not only defined their very nature and names, from the time they were children, right through to their adulthood, but it is also their deceased mothers only unfinished expedition, and also the very thing that landed Sam in prison in the first place, and lost him 15 years of his life.
To him, and in some ways to Nate, this is unfinished business unlike any other, and an absolutely pivotal part of their lives. Sam knows Nate has been on multiple similarly dangerous adventure's whilst he has been in prison, so what's one more? One more that is considerably more important, and potentially far more rewarding than any the others.

I think Nate can empathise with Sam's deep and unwavering desire and lust to finish this thing they've been trying to solve since they were children. Had Nate not been through similar reckless undertakings himself, and become wiser and gained more to lose as a result of those experiences, he too would still be exactly where Sam is in terms of his frame of mind. Luckily Nate has lived a compelling life that allowed him to mature and grow, whilst Sam got stuck in prison and was never afforded the same luxury. Ultimately, Nate can totally relate to Sam's sentiment.
 
StrongBlackVine said:
I think he is saying they still killed innocent people like at the auction.
Click to expand...

Exactly. In the first two games the killing goes from unjustified to justified. In 4 it goes from unjustified but understandable(why not just kill Alcazar instead?) To unjustified.

What if instead as shit starts hitting the fan, Sam gets cold feet and says "Nate, let's find another way to save me" and eventually says, "Nate I lied, I don't need the treasure to save my life" and Nate says "No, we gotta stop the bad guys from getting this magic power." And Sam grows as character and leans to do the right thing?
 
Fancy Clown said:
True, but I think after what Nate and Elena went through I think they'd be extra careful to keep their daughter from that sort of thing and provide more constructive outlets, but the lure of adventure is certainly implied at the end. I guess I just would rather it not happen than it shouldn't happen.



The innocent people who were part of the criminal underworld and were shooting at them?
Click to expand...

Well Sam choked out a waiter. I guess we can assume he didn't kill him. I can't remember if any other innocents were harmed. Also are the security guards really criminals in this scenario when Sam, Nathan and Sully were literally stealing a VERY valuable item?
 
StrongBlackVine said:
Well Sam choked out a waiter. I guess we can assume he didn't kill him.
Click to expand...

He punches the waiter, and specifically says that he's just gonna wake up with a headache.

The game makes it pretty clear that the only people who get killed are people who are already trying to kill them.

People need to get over it and just accept that these are action movie games. 80's style, friend. The good guy is allowed to kill bad guys one moment and have fun dialogue another moment and get the girl and never have any repercussions because within the fiction of the universe they never did anything wrong. That's the genre. It's really not as dissonant as people keep trying to make it out to be. The only thing Nate does wrong is he lies to his wife. And the game handles that very well.
 
Gsnap said:
He punches the waiter, and specifically says that he's just gonna wake up with a headache.

The game makes it pretty clear that the only people who get killed are people who are already trying to kill them.

People need to get over it and just accept that these are action movie games. 80's style, friend. The good guy is allowed to kill bad guys one moment and have fun dialogue another moment and get the girl and never have any repercussions because within the fiction of the universe they never did anything wrong. That's the genre. It's really not as dissonant as people keep trying to make it out to be. The only thing Nate does wrong is he lies to his wife. And the game handles that very well.
Click to expand...

I agree I was just trying to look at the other side of the argument
 
Well just wrapped it up. Solid 10/10 for me. Never used the PS4 screenshot option so many times in my life. I have no interest in collecting trophies/multi. I may buy uncharted collection because I have forgotten quite a few parts of overall story. Thanks Naughty Dog for making such great games.
 
So that first firefight in the
ship graveyard
is abysmal on Crushing. Not just hard, but actually cheap. Anyone else have issues there? Any way to cheese it so I can spare myself another headache?
 
TheXbox said:
So that first firefight in the
ship graveyard
is abysmal on Crushing. Not just hard, but actually cheap. Anyone else have issues there? Any way to cheese it so I can spare myself another headache?
Click to expand...

Cheese without bonuses? dunno

With bonuses, you could use the slow-mo aiming, or the constant slow-motion. And an RPG + infinite ammo
 
Fancy Clown said:
Adding something just for "flair" isn't good storytelling. The supernatural element would enhance the theme or character in any way here, and as I said only detract from it. Like if something were responsible for turning Avery crazy then that would totally destroy the point of the pirate plot which is that they are people who succumbed to their own innate flaws over treause, which is incredibly important to the story because that mirror's and develops Nathan/Sam/Rafe's struggle for the treasure as it tears them apart and catalyzes Drake's realization that he doesn't need this life anymore. There needs to be a better reason to include something than "it would be cool". I can't think of any scenario in which supernatural stuff would enhance the actual storytelling in this game. And I'm curious what story has done what Unchared 4 did and better? Because I can't think of any pulp adventure story that has taken a mature look at its protagonist and the effect of the adventure on their lives in a really human, character drive way as this game has.
Click to expand...

Making things more interesting isn't good storytelling? I still don't see how it would detract from the themes. They still stand just fine. The supernatural is just an explanation for why Libertalia basically self destructed. Reason to include it? Sam wants a Nate Drake adventure the supernatural is pretty much synonymous with that. I mean I spent the entire game waiting for it to happen. Plus it doesn't change the message in any way, it depart even cheapen it a bit. Rafe is still as psycho as ever and Avery and Tew still end up killing each other over treasure while trying to leave. I also disagree about the catalyst. It's more an affirmation. Nate already knows he doesn't need this life, and if not for Sam's lie he wouldn't even be here. He leaned this in U3. In terms of done the general plot of long lost sibling better: FFIX, in a way Frozen handles the same themes of sibling strife much better. Long lost siblings is troped to hell and back, especially jealous, backstabby ones. U4's plot does nothing new, I saw everything coming from a mile away. Nothing surprised me. The character interactions are the highlight and are well done. You are right about this not having been done in this specific genre, but I'm positive if you look at film and books you will see even the themes handled far better. And honestly it's Sam and Rafe struggling. Nate doesn't actually care. From the moment Sam's lie was exposed he checked out.
 
K just started the game recently
I'm passed the boat-chase, teenage segment and small tower expedition thingy
, does it get any better? I'm not trying to be facetious or anything but it's not clicking
 
There's an acceptable level of suspension of disbelief and this game goes about a thousand miles beyond that.

Ending spoilers:

Yes Cassie, let me tell you about the time I saw mystical blue men... Or more recently, the time I decimated an entire army of mercenaries. Oh yes, at one point I didn't even take cover and slowly walked toward them with a massive machine gun which I stole after killing a fully body armored highly trained soldier.

That criticism aside, the gameplay was solid, the graphics were top tier, and overall I really enjoyed my time with the game.

I agree with the reviews that skew toward the 7's and 8's more than the 9's and 10's.
 
Took me 15 hours to finish the game on hard. what a ride. I'm looking to play the game on normal to see if I can be more free flowing in combat. Whereas I was a bit more conservative in hard mode.
 
vinnygambini said:
K just started the game recently
I'm passed the boat-chase, teenage segment and small tower expedition thingy
, does it get any better? I'm not trying to be facetious or anything but it's not clicking
Click to expand...

Yes, that is what a lot of people consider to be the 'slow' part of the game.

For me it picked up at about Chapter (spoiler)
6
.
 
Holy shit the
clock tower and libetaria nadine fight
set pieces...and people said this game doesn't have any good set pieces lol.
 
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