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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 4 - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
- Start date
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Woo-Fu
Banned
Actually I think it makes perfect sense. Just like those soft idiots in the south they don't understand that winter is coming, that the wall has a purpose beyond being a prison and that magic is real.
The Wall arc is about to get a ton of new characters. The show is faced with the reality of paying actors, so it really doesn't make much sense to keep certain characters, especially if the script won't even have much room for them to have speaking lines. Better to give them heroic deaths in this battle, in my opinion.
Plus, they need to start giving more screen and facetime for Bowen Marsh, who I assume they'll recast.
I think giving Alisser some redemption this episode and making sure to show him being dragged off still alive is them setting things up to replace Bowen with Alisser for the show. Castle Black cast for next season will basically be (minus Sam, Gilly, Aemon, and Janos, who will all be gone in an episode or two) Jon, Alisser, Edd, Stannis, and Melisandre. And a little bit of Selyse and Shireen and the little kid who killed Ygritte.
elrechazado
Banned
Thenns are not the cannibals in the books.
Cornballer
Member
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Uh, because there's no indication of that? We know Olenna wasn't fond of Targaryens anyway. She was engaged to one but went on to seduce Luthor Tyrell ("he couldn't walk for days", apparently).
LAUGHTREY
Modesty becomes a woman
Uh, because there's no indication of that? We know Olenna wasn't fond of Targaryens anyway. She was engaged to one but went on to seduce Luthor Tyrell ("he couldn't walk for days", apparently).
That's what makes it ironic. He can still picture her face, and she didn't even like him.
Sorry but no way in hell would Olenna have turned down the future king and chances are Aemon would have had to inbreed like most of the Targs.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Man so much shit is bound to go down next episode that I hope it doesn't feel like a letdown
Shamrock7r
Member
COTF should be CGI
But a nice slit throat could be prosthetic
I thought the exact same thing when I read that nomination, haha
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
I agree with Stannis. Look!A Storm of Swords said:
That cook is goddamn badass.
Steelyuhas
Member
Content Roundup: The Watchers on the Wall
Reviews and Recaps:
AV Club (experts)
AV Club (newbies)
Alan Sepinwall (Hitfix) Review
Andy Greenwald (Grantland) Recap
Rolling Stone Recap
IGN Review
TIME Recap
The Guardian Recap
James Hibberd (EW) Recap
Washington Post Recap
Huffington Post Recap
The Hollywood Reporter Recap
WiC.net Recap (Book Readers)
WiC.net Recap (Unsullied)
HBO Content:
HBO Viewers Guide
Inside the Episode
"The Battle of Castle Black" Director Neil Marshall talks filming the battle
"The One" Kit Harington & Rose Leslie talk Jon & Ygrritte
"A Formidable Fortress" GRRM talks defending Castle Black
Clip: Wildlings March on the Wall
Interview with Hannah Murray
"The Children" Preview
Interviews:
Game of Thrones team of tragic death at Castle Black
EW: Director Neil Marshall
TIME: Director Neil Marshall
Rolling Stone: Director Neil Marshall
Ratings: 6.9 million viewers on initial broadcast
Emmy Submissions: HBO's Emmy submissions for Game of Thrones
The post will be linked in the OP.
Steelyuhas
Member
I thought the episode was great last night.
Pyp
Grenn
Technically the battle was fantastic, and I think they did a good job with the characters during that episode given their development to this time. Hindsight is 20/20 of course, but I can't help but think that it could've been strengthened by giving Mance some characterization and screen time up to this point. Hinds has been in the show for like 8 minutes.
Pretty surprised they ended the episode at that point, although it worked pretty well (despite all us book readers wanting to see what comes next now). The Children is going to be a fucking bananas episode!
Pyp
Grenn
Technically the battle was fantastic, and I think they did a good job with the characters during that episode given their development to this time. Hindsight is 20/20 of course, but I can't help but think that it could've been strengthened by giving Mance some characterization and screen time up to this point. Hinds has been in the show for like 8 minutes.
Pretty surprised they ended the episode at that point, although it worked pretty well (despite all us book readers wanting to see what comes next now). The Children is going to be a fucking bananas episode!
toddhunter
Member
Re-watched.
My main issue with the battle was the 5 minutes where they let the giants get up to the gate, fiddle around with hooks and mammoths and then proceeded to tear it down.
Only then did they start to drop things on them. You think they could have been a little more prompt given that was pretty much 99.9% of their defence plan.
My main issue with the battle was the 5 minutes where they let the giants get up to the gate, fiddle around with hooks and mammoths and then proceeded to tear it down.
Only then did they start to drop things on them. You think they could have been a little more prompt given that was pretty much 99.9% of their defence plan.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Finished the episode. I thought the ending with Jon leaving swordless was too...heroic for this world, but overall that was a badass episode. I remember thinking the last season of Spartacus' finale battle was better than the Blackwater battle, but THIS was easily the best battle I've seen on TV. That tracking shot...holy shit. Perfectly directed. Loved Jon's swagger, loved Sam opening the kennel to free Ghost, loved Thorne fighting in such a classical, "proper" way compared to the wild lunges of the wildlings. Great episode.
And I like how at the end they note the battle isn't over, even if I disliked that final Jon scene. Also didn't like how casual a lot of stuff was. Oh a mammoth? Let's watch it for a few minutes! Where's the urgency. But that's a nitpick I guess.
I still don't understand the logic of having only 100 NW. After that battle they might have what, 30 men? There would have been no harm in saying the watch had 300-500 men or something, or even the nearly 1000 they have in the books. Grenn and Bowen Marsh lead 200 men in a battle at the Eastwatch bridge for instance, why not note that. I'm curious how all this will work out once the wildlings come beyond the wall next season. Having 600+ NW members to deal with them after the truce would make a lot more sense. But then again, maybe Stannis will leave a bunch of men on the Wall. That would work.
Fuck that kid btw. I laughed when he nodded lol, kind of ruined the mood. RIP Ygritte.
And I like how at the end they note the battle isn't over, even if I disliked that final Jon scene. Also didn't like how casual a lot of stuff was. Oh a mammoth? Let's watch it for a few minutes! Where's the urgency. But that's a nitpick I guess.
I still don't understand the logic of having only 100 NW. After that battle they might have what, 30 men? There would have been no harm in saying the watch had 300-500 men or something, or even the nearly 1000 they have in the books. Grenn and Bowen Marsh lead 200 men in a battle at the Eastwatch bridge for instance, why not note that. I'm curious how all this will work out once the wildlings come beyond the wall next season. Having 600+ NW members to deal with them after the truce would make a lot more sense. But then again, maybe Stannis will leave a bunch of men on the Wall. That would work.
Fuck that kid btw. I laughed when he nodded lol, kind of ruined the mood. RIP Ygritte.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I hope this comment isn't against the rules about doing detective work on the no-books thread, it's more just an observation on something I think the show really dropped the ball.
They're talking about the meaning of "The Song of Ice and Fire", what it means, and even talking about Aemon as a Targaryan in Westeros. I think it's a big let down that the show has totally ignored the mystery of Jon's parentage. I think the show watchers are really missing something cool by not having that mystery be laid out in the first season, as it was the first book.
They're talking about the meaning of "The Song of Ice and Fire", what it means, and even talking about Aemon as a Targaryan in Westeros. I think it's a big let down that the show has totally ignored the mystery of Jon's parentage. I think the show watchers are really missing something cool by not having that mystery be laid out in the first season, as it was the first book.
Steelyuhas
Member
Two tracking shots in two weeks, so good
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Forgive my ignorance, but what does "tracking shot" means?
toddhunter
Member
I thought they laid it out well and made a big deal out of it, especially with the scene between Robert and Ned having lunch and the final scene when Jon and Ned part.
If anything they made too big of a deal with it, given the favoured theories are true about the reveal. I wouldn't be surprised if show watchers pieced it together, especially since a mystery mother in tv/film is unlikely to be insignificant.
Steelyuhas
Member
It's a single camera shot that pans a scene or physically moves through a scene without any cuts.
Basileus777
Member
I don't think they've dropped the ball on this at all. Jon's parentage being a mystery is something they established in season 1 and the Unsullied I've spoken to are aware of it.
Basileus777
Member
Not really. Once you figure out the mother, there's only one reasonable candidate for the father.
Quadrophenic
Member
Daario?
I agree with Stannis. Look!
That cook is goddamn badass.
I really hope they bring that dude back. Do it D&D!
I think Ned likely had some affection for Ashara but I doubt anything came of it.
That nod...
Stannis' nod is going to be upstaged by a kid.
just like when the kid from bear island refused whatever stannis said in a letter
Basileus777
Member
Well he can travel through time...
The cook is apparently Three-Finger Hobb (but with all his fingers still intact on the show). Sam mentions him once. lol
So for the past 2 episodes HBO has put up the recaps on the Tuesday before the episode. So we could have our Stoneheart confirmation one way or the other as early as tomorrow. Unless of course they don't upload the recap that early, as they haven't done that for all the episodes, only the last 2 AFAIK.
So the way I see it, it all comes down to whether or not they show the Brotherhood. If they're in the recaps, boom, end is Stoneheart, get hype. If they're not, boom, end is shit, get raged.
Now I know some people may think if they don't show them it might be because they want it to be a complete surprise, but I don't think that's true at all. They'd definitely at least remind the audience of the existence of the Brotherhood and they could easily do that without showing the resurrection stuff.
So we'll at least have our answer before the episode as long as they put that recap up sometime before it airs.
So the way I see it, it all comes down to whether or not they show the Brotherhood. If they're in the recaps, boom, end is Stoneheart, get hype. If they're not, boom, end is shit, get raged.
Now I know some people may think if they don't show them it might be because they want it to be a complete surprise, but I don't think that's true at all. They'd definitely at least remind the audience of the existence of the Brotherhood and they could easily do that without showing the resurrection stuff.
So we'll at least have our answer before the episode as long as they put that recap up sometime before it airs.
changes up the reason for people trying to vote him for LC (to get him out of the kitchen).
I kind of figured it was to get him out because he's a horrible cook or something disgusting.
Maybe they're scared of him. Rightly so, it seems.
Monocle
Member
I have mixed feelings about The Wall. The showrunners clearly wanted their Helm's Deep episode, and who can blame them for that? As a standalone work, it's spectacular. They nailed it hard. (Almost to the point that it sticks out as a calculated television event.) As part of this fourth season and the ASOIAF series as a whole... well, the only reason it's not a total waste of time is the entertainment factor of an episode-spanning battle, well executed.
Where does the show stand now, though? Almost exactly where it did at the end of episode 8. That would be fine if we hadn't spent the full hour with the most poorly adapted characters and storylines, or if, at the very least, Stannis had showed up to move the timeline forward in the North. But we have, and he didn't, and now the finale has relatively little time to resolve a heap of key events in many locations. And that's before we even consider any setup for the next season. Lady S., anyone?
So basically I'm expecting The Children either to be too scattered or to condense some major events more than I'm comfortable with. And yet somehow I'm still optimistic, lol.
Where does the show stand now, though? Almost exactly where it did at the end of episode 8. That would be fine if we hadn't spent the full hour with the most poorly adapted characters and storylines, or if, at the very least, Stannis had showed up to move the timeline forward in the North. But we have, and he didn't, and now the finale has relatively little time to resolve a heap of key events in many locations. And that's before we even consider any setup for the next season. Lady S., anyone?
So basically I'm expecting The Children either to be too scattered or to condense some major events more than I'm comfortable with. And yet somehow I'm still optimistic, lol.
Red Arremer
Member
Nah, Hobb's cooking was actually pretty good from what I remember. But yeah, he's quite something else.
Basileus777
Member
There is a lot of truth in this. But I think this episode was actually good for the development of the characters at the wall. And It was important to establish the importance of that plotline for the next season and beyond. I wish they had handled it better in the past, but I wouldn't call this episode a waste of time at all.
The Others have been a bit of a cliched evil force so far, but I don't see how it's really a problem or any kind of snoozefest. Like with a lot of cliches that GRRM likes to use in unconventional ways or kind of turn on their heads, having this "army of darkness" on the move has brought a lot of great moments & awesome drama to the storylines. In the end, it hasn't been as much about fighting this cliched army of darkness, but the kind of humane drama and larger storylines that it has created, just like Dany's dragons are used in a multitude of interesting ways instead of them being an automatic key to victory or an awesome power without any negatives or downsides. The few times they've been seen have established them as a threat worth being scared of and that threat of the Others, in turn, has put the Wildlings on the move which gets us the whole Jon beyond the wall story arc, Jon amongst the wildlings story arc, Ygritte, the superb Battle on the Wall, Stannis at the Wall and all that ensues, Jon deciding to take the wildlings in (which was a great move from him) and the horrors that are happening by the end of ADWD to those who decided to not come south of the Wall.
Of course by the time the Others actually do get to the wall and there's perhaps more interaction with them, hopefully they aren't quite as simple as they've been portrayed as so far, though I don't think it would completely destroy the story even if they were. But... it being GRRM, I'm sure there are at least some more or less awesome twists to them, either in regards to their motives, to what they will actually do or to what they actually are (or to all of those).
Monocle
Member
I think my final opinion of this episode will probably hinge on how well the Wall stuff is handled next season. "Waste of time" might be a bit of an exaggeration if it leads to good things.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
I cannot wait for next week and the Stoneheart reveal to finally end the speculation. It's just GOT to be in there, it's the ray of grim, horrible hope after all the terrible things that have happened. It needs to stay in. No skipping Brienne ahead, no cutting Stoneheart. They've been pretty faithful to some of the more outlandish elements of the series (anyone remember Mel birthing a shadow demon??), this feels like a crucial element that they'd be foolish to cut as the final bit of the season.
Monocle
Member
It would make for a great final WTF moment to get people hyped for Season 5.
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