Oh, I am aware. I think that's what got people riled up. In the unlikely event that book Stannis also murders Shireen, it will probably at least make more sense and garner a completely different kind of reaction from readers.I have some bad news for you
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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 5 - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
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Was that actually a thing or are you making a joke? lol
Haha yeah, I was joking
Personally I see it as pretty natural, but it seems the majority think differently. I would've like it to be more gradual though. Like Melly brining it up episode 1 or something.
You Know Nothing
Member
http://www.avclub.com/article/original-game-thrones-plan-included-jon-arya-tyrio-214926
Very real. From an early Game of Thrones outline.
Basileus777
Member
Pretty much all the kings or queens kill or burn innocent people in this series.
Just kings
-Robb (king in the north)
-Renly
-Tommen (soon to be dead I'm sure)
The point is that Stannis' confidence and leadership made him more appealing. The writers thought we needed a reminder of what happens when Stannis' devotion to the red woman goes too far.
It was just poorly plotted, contrived, and unnecessarily brutal. If it means anything though, there's probably a good reason why they didn't have Melisandre sacrifice Shireen against her king's wishes. And don't say she always does what Stannis commands because she tried to fuck Jon.
So they just wanted Brienne to kill him without the audience turning on Brienne. Or something.
I wonder what the censored paragraph near the end of the letter was about. The end of the series?
Jon to club a seal so we don't feel so bad about Olly stabbing him: Confirmed
#OllyKills
fallen_dawn
Member
There was a post on Reddit awhile back where they tried to figure it out. Related to the planned events at the end of A Game of Thrones. Here's the post if you're interested.
Moff
Member
I find it hard to believe he hasn't written that yet or at least hasnt made the decision if stannis does it himself or if it happens behind his back a long time ago.
I absolutely understand that he does not want to give away plots about his own book because of fan questions, though.
I certainly hope he doesn't change his ideas and plots because of salty fan reactions.
If it actually is Stannis who burns Shireen, it would kind of make sense that this would maybe be a scene from pretty late in Winds that he hasn't written yet. If he needs to get Stannis to the point where he'd do that, it probably would take a whole book of development. Maybe D&D just moved it up since they want to end the Stannis story early.
George Lucas did this with the Star Wars prequels. The removal of Jar Jar Binks to only cameo character status, adding in Qui-Gon voice only because fans complained his body hadn't vanished in Phantom much like Obi-Wan. The most egregious was Revenge of the Sith where he added in all sorts of things to tie up loose ends and to answer what the fans complained about.
JK Rowling did the same. Everyone wanted her to answer who Grindelwald was (random character she made initially), demanded to know the importance of Dumbledore receiving the invisibility cloak, why no magic worked on it so she made up these Deathly Hallows etc. Every creator gets inevitably influenced by fans and in some cases, what precedes their work. There is no way GRRM won't have what the show has done, how fans reacted to the events clouding his judgment as he's writing, even subconsciously. 'They hated Sansa rape in show, maybe she doesn't get raped by Littlefinger now', 'Margaery has become a fan favorite, maybe I'll give her a much larger role' etc.
Moff
Member
I'm fine with most of these examples. I am also fine with GRRM giving more importance to osha because he liked the actress. what I am not fine with is that if he had it already made up in his mind (or already written down) that stannis indeed is the one making that decision and now changes it because of fan reaction. it would really be a bit like using the show as a beta test for his story and that's a bit different than your examples.
apart from that, I still believe it's a very interesting plot to confront stannis with such a decision, do the ultimate sacrfifice or have everyone die. I think it's good writing.
and if he would change it now to happen behind stannis' back because of salty fans would just be a cheap way out.
Why are we complaining about Ramsay's abilities? He's clearly a witcher.
The first evidence for this was back in season 4, when he used Quen to survive shirtless against the Iron Islands' Fifty Best Killas®. He has continually buffed up Axii due to having to keep Reek in line (we'll get back to this in a moment). He ploughs Sansa because that's what witchers do. Then this season he assembled Twenty Good Men® - a merry band for the ages, I'm sure you'll agree. After slurping down a healthy dose of Cat, Ramsay made a cleared a path to Stannis' camp using Aard. He then used his buffed up Axii combined with a mutagen to confuse the guards. After looting a ham sandwich or two for the journey home, he proceeded to plant Dragon's Dream bombs randomly around the camp, before igniting them with a healthy burst of Igni. Finally, all the horses were obviously related to Roach due to their unreliability and sudden random disappearances.
The first evidence for this was back in season 4, when he used Quen to survive shirtless against the Iron Islands' Fifty Best Killas®. He has continually buffed up Axii due to having to keep Reek in line (we'll get back to this in a moment). He ploughs Sansa because that's what witchers do. Then this season he assembled Twenty Good Men® - a merry band for the ages, I'm sure you'll agree. After slurping down a healthy dose of Cat, Ramsay made a cleared a path to Stannis' camp using Aard. He then used his buffed up Axii combined with a mutagen to confuse the guards. After looting a ham sandwich or two for the journey home, he proceeded to plant Dragon's Dream bombs randomly around the camp, before igniting them with a healthy burst of Igni. Finally, all the horses were obviously related to Roach due to their unreliability and sudden random disappearances.
This is brilliant, Ramsay the Witcher. Seriously though I despise the luck some characters carry in this show.
Not Renly. Or Robb.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
He's probably saving writing the Shireen part for last. It's too painful.
#optimism
#optimism
to be fair, at that Point, Tyrion probably wasnt a dwarf and had all the characteristics of Jaime
You Know Nothing
Member
Yeah, that makes the most sense. Reading through the outline Tyrion was originally a murder machine. Not that he isn't somewhat of a murder machine in the actual books, but he's taking people on left and right in direct combat.
"God's Beard!"
Member
Tyrion's murder spree in the battle of the Blackwater in the books is still one of the least believable parts of the series. Super random and against everything built up about the character.
Well, we know he spoke about increasing Osha's presence because he really liked how Natalia Tena liked it, so it's not outside realm of possibility that some events might change somewhere down the road.
Basileus777
Member
Renly sure, he didn't have the chance. Robb did indirectly, his soldiers were pillaging and killing the same as everyone else's.
You Know Nothing
Member
[quote="God's Beard!";167158973]Tyrion's murder spree in the battle of the Blackwater in the books is still one of the least believable parts of the series. Super random and against everything built up about the character.[/quote]
Show Ramsay's predecessor.
That really was an incongruous character moment. Especially as the explanation fundamentally boiled down to "orcish battle lust" giving him some supernatural combat ability.
Show Ramsay's predecessor.
That really was an incongruous character moment. Especially as the explanation fundamentally boiled down to "orcish battle lust" giving him some supernatural combat ability.
Just realized that the last episode was a huge step-up for the Meereen plot. We didn't get lava hand or giant armies but at least the dragon ride let Dany ditch
1) Boring Daario
2) The unsullied who can't even fight
3) The most worthless plot on show, the Grey Worm / Missandei romance
4) The whole city
It's all gonna get better from here on for sure.
1) Boring Daario
2) The unsullied who can't even fight
3) The most worthless plot on show, the Grey Worm / Missandei romance
4) The whole city
It's all gonna get better from here on for sure.
Red Arremer
Member
Mind you, Tyrion was not a disfigured dwarf in that outline.
hendersonhank
Member
I got the impression that it was more specifically that he tolde them Stannis is the one who sacrifices her.
Did anyone think TWOW was coming out before the series was over?? LOL!
Stannis is Azor Ahai, you know, the legendary hero who forged Lightbringer by plunging it into his beloved wife's heart. At least that's what his so far undefeated red witch advisor has been telling him for years.
I know how dumb this is, but just had the strangest dream that on the blu-ray set they included a comedy song and dance routine that the people of kings landing sang about wanting to roll varys in chocolate and oats and eat him. They were in the middle of the big finale when my wife woke me up for work. Lol.
Book Stannis is that too. Yet trapped in the blizzard with his death looking likely, he isn't sending messages to burn his daughter. Instead he's sending messages to crown his daughter in case of his death.
Local newspaper is saying the big twist for the finale is an unpublished book spoiler.
I lol'd.
At least we have the TV show to tell us what's gonna happen, right.
right guyz
guyz
Oldest Snake
Member
Let's hope you're a greenseer.
bodyofanamerican
Member
Man, I have no idea why GRRM even bothers making any sort of public statement anymore with the amount of parsing every word of his gets. "Haven't written yet" = haven't published yet. That's all he meant.
The only thing he's mentioned have been additive. (Possible twist, Osha reappearance) - he's never once mentioned taking things out due to feedback.
Admiral Woofington
Member
Hodor is Azhodor Ahodor reborn
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
Patchface makes his long awaited debut and kills Stannis, oh, oh, oh.
Basileus777
Member
He said written, you're the one reinterpreting it here. If GRRM had meant published he probably would have said so. It's not a big deal that he hasn't written it yet though.
Jon being rezzed / Stannis dying would both qualify.
Could also refer to Arya's storyline, if they follow parts of Mercy.
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