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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 6 Offseason Thread

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Congratulations, you've managed to start complaining about a season that hasn't even started filming

Yeah, really. I was excited to finish the books recently and participate in a thread for once.

Imagine my reaction when I enter this one.

I'm honestly not trying to thread shit, but I am genuinely curious: are the majority of you actually as bitter about this adaption as you come across?

Yes, opinions and all that, but a good portion of you in this thread honestly believe that this show is bad in quality? What is the major sticking point besides "D&D don't care about these character like we do and also they're dumb stupid heads!" or "How dare they actually meet their scheduled deadlines and tell US, the book reading elite, story elements that we don't already know!" ?

Also, I am in no way saying that this show is perfect or that we, the audience, should accept anything we can get because we're lucky to have an adaption at all.

I guess, extremely long windedly, I'm asking: why are you all so fucking upset?
 
There were maybe three episodes in S5 that were better than decent, and Hardhome was literally the only thing in the season that deserved any Emmy nominations. Truly the Emmys are nothing more than a popularity contest.

I mean, you're going to tell me Emilia Clarke turned in a better performance than Eva Green in Penny Dreadful? (Technically Eva would probably count as the lead actress, but still.) Is this real life? No, really. Are these people serious?

I don't think Walton Goggins has ever even been nominated for an Emmy, so yes, the Emmy's are bullshit. He gave one of the best performances I've ever seen in the last 4 seasons of the Shield, and I've heard he did some really fucking good work on Justified also (only seen the first season). Bullshit.
 

Emerson

May contain jokes =>
I don't think Walton Goggins has ever even been nominated for an Emmy, so yes, the Emmy's are bullshit. He gave one of the best performances I've ever seen in the last 4 seasons of the Shield, and I've heard he did some really fucking good work on Justified also (only seen the first season). Bullshit.

He was nominated for Justified one season, but didn't win. I agree he's about as deserving as any actor out there though.

Plenty of reasons the Emmys are a joke though (e.g. The Wire).
 

Moff

Member
generally I don't think the shield is anywhere near the wire, but season 5 was indeed incredible thanks to whitaker.
 
He was nominated for Justified one season, but didn't win. I agree he's about as deserving as any actor out there though.

Plenty of reasons the Emmys are a joke though (e.g. The Wire).

Cool, glad he's gotten at least some recognition. Looking forward to his new show with Danny McBride.

The Shield S5 is god tier. Too bad the show isn't on Netflix, I want to re-watch it.

It's not even available on Amazon Prime anymore, unless you buy it. I think it's on Hulu or some shit though.

And yeah, Season 5 is definitely one of my favorite seasons of TV. Along with Season 4 of the Wire (and Season 2 the more I watch it) and some others.
 

WaffleTaco

Wants to outlaw technological innovation.
No, but people like setting themselves up for disappointment so they've got something to complain about well before the season starts

Pretty sure it's almost entirely confirmed:

Pirate, man in his 40’s to late 50’s. He’s “an infamous pirate who has terrorized seas all around the world. Cunning, ruthless, with a touch of madness.”
He’s a dangerous-looking man. A very good part this season.


http://watchersonthewall.com/casting-speculation-season-6-euron-greyjoy/

This, along with other casting news of Sam's father along with Sam going to Oldtown, suggests this will happen.
 

WaffleTaco

Wants to outlaw technological innovation.
Yeah, really. I was excited to finish the books recently and participate in a thread for once.

Imagine my reaction when I enter this one.

I'm honestly not trying to thread shit, but I am genuinely curious: are the majority of you actually as bitter about this adaption as you come across?

Yes, opinions and all that, but a good portion of you in this thread honestly believe that this show is bad in quality? What is the major sticking point besides "D&D don't care about these character like we do and also they're dumb stupid heads!" or "How dare they actually meet their scheduled deadlines and tell US, the book reading elite, story elements that we don't already know!" ?

Also, I am in no way saying that this show is perfect or that we, the audience, should accept anything we can get because we're lucky to have an adaption at all.

I guess, extremely long windedly, I'm asking: why are you all so fucking upset?

It's not really like this, it's the fact that they sometimes just do not make good decisions.
Especially for Season 5. The only thing that was pretty heavily criticized for Season 4 was Yara and the dogs. Season 5 had numerous accounts of where they went wrong. They pulled a Walking Dead with both Barristan and Stannis...just building them up within a season for a few episodes to just be killed off. Stannis's death was also bad since they did not make it clear at all. The whole Northern plot involving Brienne/Sansa/Ramsay/Theon was not done very well either. Dorne was a complete mess, with Doran being the only saving grace. Daenerys's plot could have been done better, as well.
 

Speevy

Banned
"Promise me young Ned Stark, who is my brother and not actually the father of this baby. Promise me you'll raise this child and keep it a secret from everyone, especially your jealous wife. If he grows up as a bastard, make sure he joins the Night's Watch so he can assume a leadership role. Just watch out for Olly. Robert Bartatheon doesn't understand that I, your sister Lyanna Stark really love Rhaegar Targaryen. Jon Snow is our son, but you must say he your son by some tavern wench or they'll kill him. Promise me Ned."
-Lyanna Stark on her deathbed, season 6

"Nailed it."
-D&D
 
"Promise me young Ned Stark, who is my brother and not actually the father of this baby. Promise me you'll raise this child and keep it a secret from everyone, especially your jealous wife. If he grows up as a bastard, make sure he joins the Night's Watch so he can assume a leadership role. Just watch out for Olly. Robert Bartatheon doesn't understand that I, your sister Lyanna Stark really love Rhaegar Targaryen. Jon Snow is our son, but you must say he your son by some tavern wench or they'll kill him. Promise me Ned."
-Lyanna Stark on her deathbed, season 6

"Nailed it."
-D&D

Bravo. Like a window into the future.
 
Since I've been here, which admittedly was only since the start of season four (finished the books a few months before the premiere) the response was mostly positive with the only thing I can remember being universally panned was the already mentioned Ramsey's dogs o'DOOM and I imagine season three was fairly positively received too, season five though was shit for a lot of reasons and not just because it was different from the books.
 

Szeth

Member
Yeah, really. I was excited to finish the books recently and participate in a thread for once.

Imagine my reaction when I enter this one.

I'm honestly not trying to thread shit, but I am genuinely curious: are the majority of you actually as bitter about this adaption as you come across?

Yes, opinions and all that, but a good portion of you in this thread honestly believe that this show is bad in quality? What is the major sticking point besides "D&D don't care about these character like we do and also they're dumb stupid heads!" or "How dare they actually meet their scheduled deadlines and tell US, the book reading elite, story elements that we don't already know!" ?

Also, I am in no way saying that this show is perfect or that we, the audience, should accept anything we can get because we're lucky to have an adaption at all.

I guess, extremely long windedly, I'm asking: why are you all so fucking upset?

I don't know what you're talking about. Who wouldn't love reading a never ending stream of lame "bad pussy" and "20 good men" jokes? Then there's the old go to of creating scenes that over explain shit because the show is so unsubtle! This stuff is gold man. Truly a thread for the ages.
 

Layell

Member
I'm honestly not trying to thread shit, but I am genuinely curious: are the majority of you actually as bitter about this adaption as you come across?

It's a frustrating experience to have book moments that you really loved get torn apart in front of your very eyes. Some of them are changes for the sake of changes, some of them are because they believe the audience is dumb.

Take for example "Only Cat", instead of "Your Sister". Sure the show never used the Cat nickname but it could have very well been established in that scene. Instead it is changed cause the audience is dumb and forgets who is related to whom. Shay has so many dumb changes, you really have to ask. Why would she sleep with Twyin if she is some "hooker with a heart of gold" like the show made us believe? It makes so little sense, I am still not sure why it was done. The senseless killing and merging of plotlines like Sansa's with Theon's, along with drunk Tyrion adventures through Essos. Meanwhile we get shipping time with Melisandre and the guy with no junk in the trunk.Ramsay is basically God reborn and fights shirtless and needs 20 good men to kill an army. Plus Stannis' defeat even though fans were told this season would not go into unpublished territory.

It makes a fan ask... why were these changes made, some of them seem made just to aggravate readers. I only started reading this series in 2014, imagine what some fans who started reading in the 90s must feel watching this.
 

Moff

Member
I still think it's a very good show and always a highlight of my week when it's on, but I am certainly in the minority here, very likely the only one still posting
 

bengraven

Member
"Promise me young Ned Stark, who is my brother and not actually the father of this baby. Promise me you'll raise this child and keep it a secret from everyone, especially your jealous wife. If he grows up as a bastard, make sure he joins the Night's Watch so he can assume a leadership role. Just watch out for Olly. Robert Bartatheon doesn't understand that I, your sister Lyanna Stark really love Rhaegar Targaryen. Jon Snow is our son, but you must say he your son by some tavern wench or they'll kill him. Promise me Ned."
-Lyanna Stark on her deathbed, season 6

"Nailed it."
-D&D

tumblr_nngou7qqSf1tqumkpo5_1280.gif
 

takriel

Member
Jon will be resurrected within the first 10 minutes of episode 1

OMG Stannis is still alive moment at end of episode 1

Sansa and Theon, their clothes a little bit wet from the snow on the ground, join forces with Brienne mid-episode 1

Jaime returns to King's Landing, Cersei loses her shit upon seeing dead Myrcella, declares war

Arya still not up to anything interesting, has to train yet again, this time because she's blind

Daenerys befriends the khalasaar
 

John Dunbar

correct about everything
"Promise me young Ned Stark, who is my brother and not actually the father of this baby. Promise me you'll raise this child and keep it a secret from everyone, especially your jealous wife. If he grows up as a bastard, make sure he joins the Night's Watch so he can assume a leadership role. Just watch out for Olly. Robert Bartatheon doesn't understand that I, your sister Lyanna Stark really love Rhaegar Targaryen. Jon Snow is our son, but you must say he your son by some tavern wench or they'll kill him. Promise me Ned."
-Lyanna Stark on her deathbed, season 6

"Nailed it."
-D&D

you have to include a mention that rhaegar is the brother of the unborn daenerys targaryen.
 
It's not really like this, it's the fact that they sometimes just do not make good decisions.
Especially for Season 5. The only thing that was pretty heavily criticized for Season 4 was Yara and the dogs. Season 5 had numerous accounts of where they went wrong. They pulled a Walking Dead with both Barristan and Stannis...just building them up within a season for a few episodes to just be killed off. Stannis's death was also bad since they did not make it clear at all. The whole Northern plot involving Brienne/Sansa/Ramsay/Theon was not done very well either. Dorne was a complete mess, with Doran being the only saving grace. Daenerys's plot could have been done better, as well.


Thank you for the level headed response. I certainly agree with some of these criticisms.

It was interesting reading both books 4 and 5 while simultaneously watching, what I thought, was mostly a great season of an excellent show.

In my opinion, there were stretches of both both books that were super dull and I thought the consolidation of an almost 2,000 page section of this incredibly complex story was handled (mostly) masterfully.

While I certainly didn't come into this thread wanting a circle-jerk of fandom, I didn't expect it to be such a vacuum of lame ass jokes and vitriol.
 

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
While I certainly didn't come into this thread wanting a circle-jerk of fandom, I didn't expect it to be such a vacuum of lame ass jokes and vitriol.
And now you know why we laugh when people suggest there be one thread in the future. Imagine what the experience of non readers would be even if there was nothing to spoil.
 
AFfC and ADWD definitely had room to cut a ton out of but a lot of what they replaced it with (if they did replace it) wasn't so good even in the show's own narrative...
 

mokeyjoe

Member
It's a frustrating experience to have book moments that you really loved get torn apart in front of your very eyes. Some of them are changes for the sake of changes, some of them are because they believe the audience is dumb.

Take for example "Only Cat", instead of "Your Sister". Sure the show never used the Cat nickname but it could have very well been established in that scene. Instead it is changed cause the audience is dumb and forgets who is related to whom. Shay has so many dumb changes, you really have to ask. Why would she sleep with Twyin if she is some "hooker with a heart of gold" like the show made us believe? It makes so little sense, I am still not sure why it was done. The senseless killing and merging of plotlines like Sansa's with Theon's, along with drunk Tyrion adventures through Essos. Meanwhile we get shipping time with Melisandre and the guy with no junk in the trunk.Ramsay is basically God reborn and fights shirtless and needs 20 good men to kill an army. Plus Stannis' defeat even though fans were told this season would not go into unpublished territory.

It makes a fan ask... why were these changes made, some of them seem made just to aggravate readers. I only started reading this series in 2014, imagine what some fans who started reading in the 90s must feel watching this.

You see I disagree that the Ramsay change is negative. He's just a really two dimensional bad guy in the book, not really much different from Vargo Hoat. His only purpose is to serve Theon's storyline. I think he's more interesting in the show and I like Iwan Rheon's performance.

Thank you for the level headed response. I certainly agree with some of these criticisms.

It was interesting reading both books 4 and 5 while simultaneously watching, what I thought, was mostly a great season of an excellent show.

In my opinion, there were stretches of both both books that were super dull and I thought the consolidation of an almost 2,000 page section of this incredibly complex story was handled (mostly) masterfully.

While I certainly didn't come into this thread wanting a circle-jerk of fandom, I didn't expect it to be such a vacuum of lame ass jokes and vitriol.

I found the 4th book heavy going. I don't necessarily think that the answer for issues in the last season was to be more like the book. The main thing I disagree with is the reduction of Daenary's antagonists to just being the Harpies. In the book she's under siege and the other cities have turned against her - the threat in the show seemed rather weak in comparison.
 

NeoGiff

Member
You see I disagree that the Ramsay change is negative. He's just a really two dimensional bad guy in the book, not really much different from Vargo Hoat. His only purpose is to serve Theon's storyline. I think he's more interesting in the show and I like Iwan Rheon's performance.

An unstoppable plot device that has every other character drowning in futility is interesting? Ramsay is Superman sans kryptonite.
 

Turin

Banned
Iwan Rheon's doing a fine job as Ramsay. It's the use of the character that's the problem.

I wish GoT could afford Michael Fassbender. He could play anyone.

Well, he's always come to mind when I think of who I'd want to play Rheagar.

I still think it's a very good show and always a highlight of my week when it's on, but I am certainly in the minority here, very likely the only one still posting

I'm pretty much in the same boat as you.

The show does some things that are agitating but I still thoroughly enjoy it for the most part.
 

Euron

Member
Season 5 is basically the same as how Gaming Side views games like Uncharted 3 and Dark Souls 2. Was it as good as its predecessor(s)? No. Did it do a few really stupid things? Yes. But is it still better than the majority of other things out there? Absolutely.

Since Hannibal is cancelled and True Detective has taken a huge hit in quality, I don't think there's a show I'm looking forward to more than Game of Thrones Season 6. Well maybe Rick and Morty but that's something entirely different.

I will certainly criticize the show's shortcomings and dumb decisions and in a much harsher way than I criticize other shows but don't think that means I don't like it. I was actually a showwatcher only first and just picked up the books because after the Red Wedding I wanted more of the story asap.

I complain because I care and I make "bad pussy" and "20 gud men" jokes because I just find them funny for some reason.
 
The show took a nosedive this season but I'm not angry. The barrage of bafflingly idiotic decisions they've made at least made the season less boring than 2&3!

It was way better this season than Season 2 was imo. Dany's and Bran's arc that season were not good at all, and the only thing that saved it was Tyrion and Theon's respective arcs, and Blackwater.
 

Anoregon

The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
And the fact that he's been in Belfast for the last few days, during the days when filming for season 6 just happens to be starting.

Oh I actually missed that, cool!
 

Speevy

Banned
Imagine if they threw in some conflict to the Ramsay win parade.

Let's start at the beginning. Ramsay's introduction was perfect. Horn blower, Theon thinks he's being saved, really good stuff that should be in there.

Then throw in someone who doesn't agree that Theon should be mutilated. This would fit into how Roose told Ramsay he "wanted Theon whole". Ramsay debates this man and ultimately kills him in a brutal fight in which Ramsay receives as many licks as he gets.

Theon makes a desperate attempt to fight Ramsay before he is made to be Reek. He nearly kills him before Ramsay's men show up and chain Theon back up.

Then in season 4, actually flesh out Roose and Ramsay's twisted relationship. He not only distrusts him, but he wants him hanged for what he's done at the Dreadfort. Instead of sending Locke on that utterly pointless excursion, Ramsay travels himself but ultimately fails to find Bran and Rickon. This creates a desperate Ramsay, one that will do anything, which prompt the whole Moat Caitlin trick. See, Ramsay is just as sick and twisted, but he's also experienced some setbacks.

Completely cut the dog thing. Have Theon chained up. Yara tries to rescue Theon in dead of night but Reek stabs her in the heart.

So after Moat Caitlin is captured, Roose makes Ramsay his heir and everyone returns to Winterfell. They could even leave in Sansa marrying Ramsay, only change the circumstances. Sansa is taking Robin Arryn on a tour of the countryside when a group of Bolton men kill all the guards and take Sansa hostage, bringing her back to Winterfell. Roose warns Ramsay not to lay a hand on Sansa because she's too valuable as a prisoner. He warns him not to cross him again. This creates tension. What if Roose found out? It's not just Sansa in danger.

Roose reveals that fat Walda is pregnant and tells Ramsay that he shouldn't take anything for granted.

Then of course introduce some northerners. Perhaps a northern plot JUST to kill Ramsay. They know what he's done. Their plan fails however when the plot is discovered.

Ramsay kills Walda and her unborn son to Roose's indignation.

Littlefinger meanwhile learns of everything and tells Cersei, which now actually makes sense because he'd need her help. Ramsay meanwhile meets Sansa as his true self, and she knows what is in store for her. None of this "playing the game" business.

So after winning his father's approval and title, he must keep it by winning battles against the Baratheon forces. He manages to disrupt their supply lines through several daring (but plausible) excursions with a few hundred (not 20) men.

Then at the end of Ramsay's storyline, Roose puts him in the vanguard, sure that his vicious son will be the first to die.

Ramsay emerges from the battle however, having sneaked around the advancing Baratheon forces.

The Boltons receive reinforcements from the men who defected after Shireen's sacrifice, and manage to rout Stannis' army.

Stannis is bloodied. He can barely walk. Same scene as in the show. He hears men dying. It's Ramsay. Ramsay tries to kill Stannis but it stabbed through the neck in the same way that no name Bolton soldier was in the finale. So that's the end of Ramsay and his storyline, his arrogance, and his invincibility.

Brienne meanwhile does help Theon and Sansa escape on horseback along with Pod. They each take one in tow.

The Boltons still win, and Satan was still used to his full potential.
 

Layell

Member
You see I disagree that the Ramsay change is negative. He's just a really two dimensional bad guy in the book, not really much different from Vargo Hoat. His only purpose is to serve Theon's storyline. I think he's more interesting in the show and I like Iwan Rheon's performance.

I love Iwan's performance too, but 20 good men and shirtless Ramsay with the dogs was a bit too much. He is an ideal casting. But remember Ramsay in the books is a great foil to Jon in the "bastard and their lot in life". His most defining trait and likely his weakness is his hatred of his bastard name, he kills his half brother out of jealousy just to be the only child of Roose. This aspect is something the show has now only started to portray
 

Speevy

Banned
The show hasn't really shown why Ramsay can fight at all.

Jon Snow learned to fight because Ned is honorable and would have done that for all of the boys under his roof, even Theon.

Tyrion didn't learn to be a master swordsman, and he's trueborn.

I'm not saying Ramsay should be a coward, but his specialty is torture and information. He might even have a clever mind. He doesn't look like a fighter.
 

Patriots7

Member
Elia = good girl
Lyanna = bad pussy

The line had a deeper meaning, guys! The events of the show are simply showing the repercussions of Rhaegar's desire for bad pussy.
 

Zolo

Member
The show hasn't really shown why Ramsay can fight at all.

Jon Snow learned to fight because Ned is honorable and would have done that for all of the boys under his roof, even Theon.

Tyrion didn't learn to be a master swordsman, and he's trueborn.

I'm not saying Ramsay should be a coward, but his specialty is torture and information. He might even have a clever mind. He doesn't look like a fighter.

Ramsay can fight well for the same reason Stannis leads in the front. It makes good TV/more entertaining. It's why you also tend to get motivations and many other events simplified with a bit of reasoning that you can't spend as much time in TV as you can on a book.
 
Yeah, Dinklage and Clarke really didn't have that much to do this season...


But holy fuck at Mother's Mercy getting nominated, HBO must have bribed them with the bad pussy.

I really hope the new season is full of the bad pussy.

Varys will get some of that bad pussy in the season 6 premiere. A little bird told me.

Elia = good girl
Lyanna = bad pussy

The line had a deeper meaning, guys! The events of the show are simply showing the repercussions of Rhaegar's desire for bad pussy.

This page alone.

z9pT0z4.jpg
 

NeoGiff

Member
This page alone.

z9pT0z4.jpg

You cannot stop us. You cannot change the bad pussy. If you're not happy with the bad pussy, don't draw bad pussy attention to yourself, or you may be involuntarily shoved face first into (and be forced to eat) the bad pussy.

Speevy, that alternate Satan storyline is great, but it makes too much sense for D&D to write it that way.
 

axb2013

Member
The show hasn't really shown why Ramsay can fight at all.

Jon Snow learned to fight because Ned is honorable and would have done that for all of the boys under his roof, even Theon.

Tyrion didn't learn to be a master swordsman, and he's trueborn.

I'm not saying Ramsay should be a coward, but his specialty is torture and information. He might even have a clever mind. He doesn't look like a fighter.
For me, Ramsay gets a pass on "fighter looks" because of Loras who doesn't look like a fighter either but is established as one. I'm more interested in the "20 good men" at his command:
0fky7mnu3o2f.jpg



boltonsv3oyk.jpg



As for criticism directed at D&D, I found little to nitpick about. Then again, I saw the show before I read the books so there's that. I noticed that most of the critics of the show read the books long before watching the show.
 
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