ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
That is awesome.
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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 6 Offseason Thread
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biosnake20
Member
How much spoilery can it get?
White Walkers or Littlefinger intervening?
Atraveller
Banned
Was this mentioned in the show?King of the North.
Rob legitimized him
Jon is no longer in charge of NW, they won't arm the wildlings and let them dick around. Him being at the head of great northern conpiracy tho.
Steelyuhas
Member
Bueno. Not sure how point A to point B is going to happen, but it makes me excited.
It's really not but I like it. I doubt he'll wear it all of the time anyway.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
This is on the front page of Deadline, completely unspoilered.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
lol I've seen casuals discuss it openly.
Such an obv secret.
Basileus777
Member
TV viewers are getting the true book experience,
Hell, if I had made this exact statement last week I wouldn't have even needed spoiler tags.
everyone knows Jon Snow is alive.
PhoenixDark
Banned
First thing I noticed. Those definitely aren't NW blacks. So is he leading the north against the Boltons, or a wildling army? The earlier rumors pointed to him leading a Glover, Umber, and wildling force against the Boltons (and potentially the Karstarks?).
Seems pretty clear Jon is taking the place of Stannis in TWOW. Stannis is certainly going to win the village battle and probably the Winterfell battle as well in the book. And if Rickon shows up, the north will be rallied behind him/potentially abandon Stannis. Whereas in the show I'm guessing Jon will rally the north for Rickon.
Seems pretty clear Jon is taking the place of Stannis in TWOW. Stannis is certainly going to win the village battle and probably the Winterfell battle as well in the book. And if Rickon shows up, the north will be rallied behind him/potentially abandon Stannis. Whereas in the show I'm guessing Jon will rally the north for Rickon.
dead souls
Member
I'm actually kind of wondering, seeing as they've moved from seven to eight seasons, if this season isn't even going to cover all of Winds' material. Jon seems to be fighting a battle from the beginning of Winds at the end of the season, and filling out the rest of the season with material adapted from the Davos and Manderly plots in Dance, maybe with some Winds Rickon material mixed in. Jaime is doubling back to Riverrun, and the recent images with all the Lannister tents seem to imply that the full siege may actually be in. On top of that, he apparently isn't even leaving to go to Riverrun until after the midpoint of the season. The Ironborn are doubling back to do the full Kingsmoot. Arya is apparently going to spend several episodes still blind and then move into working with the theater troupe, which would have her still only one chapter into Winds after like half of season 6. Bran seems to be mostly dealing with flashbacks. Sam is getting new stuff, but they seem to be taking it slow and focusing on introducing his family instead of jumping head-first into whatever the Oldtown plot is.
The only plots that are moving decisively forward are King's Landing, Dany and the Dothraki, and Tyrion in Meereen, and really it's possible that Tyrion could just be setting things up for them to do the Battle of Meereen, too. I think that those plots may have good mid-book climaxes in Winds, and so we're really only getting Winds Part 1 plus catchup from Feast and Dance here.
The only plots that are moving decisively forward are King's Landing, Dany and the Dothraki, and Tyrion in Meereen, and really it's possible that Tyrion could just be setting things up for them to do the Battle of Meereen, too. I think that those plots may have good mid-book climaxes in Winds, and so we're really only getting Winds Part 1 plus catchup from Feast and Dance here.
biosnake20
Member
That's what I expected the whole time. I never expected them to do all of TWoW in one season.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
Gainesville Regional Airport?
bodyofanamerican
Member
How exactly did we come to believe Jaime is definitely
? Did I miss set pictures?
going to the Riverlands this season
bishopcruz
Member
Man if they adapt stuff in Season 6 that should have been in season 5 I am going to be really pissed. So many of the problems this last season had were a result of rushing the hell out off storylines or coming up with new ones to shoehorn characters into. Oy.
I don't think Jon being alive can be considered a spoiler. No one in their right minds has ever believed he's dead, like never. I remember reading ADWD and doing exactly this
I mean, they obviously killed him, but he is coming back for sure. Jon is not Ned, whom only had a book of developement, or Robb, who was never in the spotlight, or Cat, who had exhausted her character arc; Jon is the central figure in the Wall and arguably the most important character in the books. Killing him and forgetting about him taking into account the books' events makes absolutely no sense narratively.
I mean, they obviously killed him, but he is coming back for sure. Jon is not Ned, whom only had a book of developement, or Robb, who was never in the spotlight, or Cat, who had exhausted her character arc; Jon is the central figure in the Wall and arguably the most important character in the books. Killing him and forgetting about him taking into account the books' events makes absolutely no sense narratively.
Citizen_Insane
Member
This is what actually excites me.
LAUGHTREY
Modesty becomes a woman
I don't know if I like this though.
The Nights Watch would have to kick him out for this to be 'in character'. I mean...they obviously stabbed him to death, but he already had a golden opportunity to leave when Stannis offered to back him for Winterfell. He wants to be in the Nights Watch, and doesn't seem like the type to leave just because he found a loophole.
Is he going to publicly be Jon Stark? Who's going to believe he died, was freed from his oaths, and is now the rightful heir to Winterfell? It's the same problem as before jus tthis time the Nights Watch won't have a problem with him, as long as he leaves.
Is he going to publicly be Jon Stark? Who's going to believe he died, was freed from his oaths, and is now the rightful heir to Winterfell? It's the same problem as before jus tthis time the Nights Watch won't have a problem with him, as long as he leaves.
PhoenixDark
Banned
I've never felt like Jon would leave the NW on a technicality. He's not a lawyer type looking for a loop hole, I think he genuinely believed that the NW was his calling and he wouldn't leave it under normal circumstances. Being betrayed by the Watch changes that. When he gets resurrected or healed I'd imagine that things won't simply go back to normal. I could see him being driven from the Wall.
More than likely Shireen will be involved with bringing him back in the book (ie being sacrificed). Whereas in the show I'd imagine Melisandre will sacrifice herself to get it done. Either way it's going to be a shocking event that causes NW members to believe Snow is some demon, and they'd react with fear and violence.
I used to think Jon would go north and perhaps find himself involved with the Others, but clearly the show is going in the opposite direction. Robb's will doesn't exist in the show, unless they retcon that, but it would still make sense for northern lords to show up and beg Jon Snow to rally the north. Maybe he'll do it for Rickon. Maybe he'll do it if they promise to help fight against the Others having defeating the Boltons.
More than likely Shireen will be involved with bringing him back in the book (ie being sacrificed). Whereas in the show I'd imagine Melisandre will sacrifice herself to get it done. Either way it's going to be a shocking event that causes NW members to believe Snow is some demon, and they'd react with fear and violence.
I used to think Jon would go north and perhaps find himself involved with the Others, but clearly the show is going in the opposite direction. Robb's will doesn't exist in the show, unless they retcon that, but it would still make sense for northern lords to show up and beg Jon Snow to rally the north. Maybe he'll do it for Rickon. Maybe he'll do it if they promise to help fight against the Others having defeating the Boltons.
Moff
Member
I dont see it that way
Stannis offer was not a golden opportunity, he had his oath and yes, he wanted to be lord commander. taking that offer would have made him a traitor in his eyes.
obviously, after what happened at the end of ADWD, he probably changed his mind. who wouldn't? they want him dead.
and how is it important who would believe him if he was dead? the only ones who would care are the nights watch, and they are the ones who did it. and everyone else can gladly go ask them.
I don't think it's important who WON'T believe but how people react IF they believe it, a lord raised from the dead is leading the north? how crazy is that?
but that's an interesting situation on my opinion.
Stannis offer was not a golden opportunity, he had his oath and yes, he wanted to be lord commander. taking that offer would have made him a traitor in his eyes.
obviously, after what happened at the end of ADWD, he probably changed his mind. who wouldn't? they want him dead.
and how is it important who would believe him if he was dead? the only ones who would care are the nights watch, and they are the ones who did it. and everyone else can gladly go ask them.
I don't think it's important who WON'T believe but how people react IF they believe it, a lord raised from the dead is leading the north? how crazy is that?
but that's an interesting situation on my opinion.
cartoon_soldier
Member
Resurrection in Episode 2. Jon kills all them traitors in Episode 3
I hope.
Basileus777
Member
Jon already chose Arya over his oaths at the end of ADWD. Granted it was jarring and a bit rushed, but even before his death he was splitting hairs to justify what is essentially desertion and vow breaking.
I think the Night's Watch is fucked. Even putting aside the inevitable invasion of the Others. After the mutiny, who's gonna run the place? Thorne? Plus the wildlings (which include a giant) probably aren't gonna be cool with the crows getting all stabby on their savior.
I think at this point the only question is whether or not
Also it's not really that much of a spoiler from TWOW because
Jon simply escapes from the Wall or if he slaughters the entire NW before he heads South
Also it's not really that much of a spoiler from TWOW because
Jon is clearly taking Stannis' Battle of Ice Material. Whether or not Jon is involved in it remains to be seen. There will probably be some sort of confrontation between Jon and Stannis after when Shireen is inevitably sacrificed. The showrunners simply cut through the entire plotline and are giving everything to Jon.
Believe it or not, it's Olly.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Stannis. The 1000th LC.
Rogue Agent
Banned
Yeah, I think your last sentence has got to be the reason for what we're seeing.
I wouldn't be surprised if either Jon uses that technicality to leave the Wall or someone from the Watch uses it to throw him out, whichever way it goes doesn't matter. But there's no way that Jon is abandoning his actual mission just to repeat what Robb did especially after the things he saw at Hardhome. In fact, if we look at the last few shots of Hardhome you had the Night's King resurrecting all the dead and Jon responding with a look on his face that was like "Jesus christ, even with Stannis & the Wildlings how the hell are we going to beat an army that big?"
Which is to say he's going to need to convince the entire North to come to his side at the very least, but the Boltons are standing in the way of that. Hell Davos last season had some words for Jon that I think are pretty telling about the direction we're seeing this season going now in hindsight "The shield that guards the realm of men. That's what you swore to be. Now I'm not a learned man, but the best way of helping the most people might not be sitting in a frozen castle at the edge of the world. It might just mean wading through the mud, getting your boots dirty and doing what needs to be done. As long as the Boltons rule the North, the North will suffer. Just one man's opinion."
As important as his vows are to him, he probably realizes that he doesn't have even a slither of a chance at stopping the Night's King and his army just sitting at Castle Black. The Boltons need to go and he needs to rally the rest of the North to their side for the bigger battle against the Others.
I wouldn't be surprised if either Jon uses that technicality to leave the Wall or someone from the Watch uses it to throw him out, whichever way it goes doesn't matter. But there's no way that Jon is abandoning his actual mission just to repeat what Robb did especially after the things he saw at Hardhome. In fact, if we look at the last few shots of Hardhome you had the Night's King resurrecting all the dead and Jon responding with a look on his face that was like "Jesus christ, even with Stannis & the Wildlings how the hell are we going to beat an army that big?"
Which is to say he's going to need to convince the entire North to come to his side at the very least, but the Boltons are standing in the way of that. Hell Davos last season had some words for Jon that I think are pretty telling about the direction we're seeing this season going now in hindsight "The shield that guards the realm of men. That's what you swore to be. Now I'm not a learned man, but the best way of helping the most people might not be sitting in a frozen castle at the edge of the world. It might just mean wading through the mud, getting your boots dirty and doing what needs to be done. As long as the Boltons rule the North, the North will suffer. Just one man's opinion."
As important as his vows are to him, he probably realizes that he doesn't have even a slither of a chance at stopping the Night's King and his army just sitting at Castle Black. The Boltons need to go and he needs to rally the rest of the North to their side for the bigger battle against the Others.
LAUGHTREY
Modesty becomes a woman
Uh, Ned finds the deserter in the first episode and executes him, after he tells a (true) but supernatural and hard to believe story.
"Weren't you in the Night's Watch?"
"Well let me tell you about that..."
"Sure buddy" /slice.
I think in the show his resurrection will be early. In the books, I think he'll be dead for most of Winds, and there will be some extended plot about Mel trying to res him, but they don't care about that here, and they'll bring him back early to have him do the Northern lords plot. I think that's how they're able to double back like that without having the North get way behind the other stories.
Atraveller
Banned
Plot requires them to hold the Wall for a while, wildlings would go with Jon Snow, he's not gonna let them turn on NW even he hates Olly to the guts.
He dead tho
RobotChant
Member
How is Jon taking Stannis' place when we already know Stannis lost his Bolton battle? Stannis lost and is presumed dead in the books, and presumed dead in the show. His Winds material looks to provide more detail on what we've already been told happens through the pink letter. Most likely because something that happens during this time will affect other characters story lines, but in the end it's still shaping up to be a lost for Stannis.
I still can't get over how they fucked up S5 and now have to backtrack to cover their bases. How is Jamie dealing with Rivverrun going to work if there is a Northern army rallying in the North as evidence by these Jon Snow leaks. You're safe in your fortified castle and the enemy is outside dealing with the elements, with your allies regrouping in the North. Winter is here, or it should be. Certainly they can just make something up, but it'll take a lot of twisting for it to all make sense.
I still can't get over how they fucked up S5 and now have to backtrack to cover their bases. How is Jamie dealing with Rivverrun going to work if there is a Northern army rallying in the North as evidence by these Jon Snow leaks. You're safe in your fortified castle and the enemy is outside dealing with the elements, with your allies regrouping in the North. Winter is here, or it should be. Certainly they can just make something up, but it'll take a lot of twisting for it to all make sense.
I bet he totally forgives Olly after a heart to heart.
I've a hard time believing Jon would just give up those remaining at the Wall or ignore the oncoming threat of White Walkers just to fight the Boltons. Unless it results in a united north that he could help lead against the White Walkers. But then you're just gonna have Littlefinger try to fuck everything up because it goes against his plans. Dunno, the implications are really interesting though and I'm looking forward to seeing out it pans out regardless.
Cpt.Underpants
Member
What enemy? As far as the Crown is concerned their allies just defeated the last remaining threat that was Stannis. Riverrun is the last thing they need to consolidate, makes sense to send Jaime there to take care of it. And logistically for the show it made sense to save the Riverlands for season 6 to have more time to do it justice (and casting calls seem to suggest they'll do quite a bit there).
Acidote
Member
As far as I know,
Stannis isn't presumed dead in the books. Far from that. I think GRRM even took the time saying something about that after the show episode.
ChaosZeroX
Banned
Correct. Stannis is definitely alive int he books.
Awesome to see Jon in stark clothing though.
Very similar to Neds
biosnake20
Member
Some new major details from Tower of Joy filming
Big news about that Season 6 battle
Bran is there, two actresses are there, and maybe even a young Barristan. Lyanna is one of the actresses probably but I wonder who the other is.
Big news about that Season 6 battle
Battle of the six armies sounds sick. Looks like we can see Stark, Mormont, Hornwood, and maybe some others.
demosthenes
Member
My hype for this season is getting out of control. So many set pics. I'm really excited for this season already.
ChaosZeroX
Banned
Battle of six armies sounds incredible. This next season has my hype levels of 9000.
Technically speaking, however, they're not 6 different armies. Sounds cool, though, just hope it's not fanfic.
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