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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 6

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munchie64

Member
Well that's something the show does quite often. It comes up with these amazing visual flourishes that stir the viewer's emotions, capped off by excellent acting and beautiful locations. It's all very entertaining, but it should not be painful to think about. And since this show has so many interconnected stories, it's impossible not to think about it.

I really like this season, incidentally. Every episode has been a bit different from the previous one, they are moving storylines forward, questions are being answered, they're not skipping stories for 3-4 episodes at a time. It's a definite improvement. It seems like the writers have stopped doing some dumb shit, but they're still doing other dumb shit.

Trust me. If I weren't enjoying the show, I wouldn't post about it. People who hate watch need a new hobby.
Well I definitely agree with most of what you're saying. I definitely hate a bunch of things in the show, but yeah, just this part in particular confused me how much it was brought up. Even though they got repetitive, bad pussy and 20 good men I understood. But I a little understand better now, so thanks for that :)
 
Really don't see a problem with "let's go kill them". Sounds like reaching for a complaint.
The line 'works' on the show, only in the sense that it's a shit line spoken by a shit character, so it makes sense that he's say it at that point.
Of course, the fact that Euron has been in power for 5 minutes and has already lost all of their ships and failed the first task he set out to accomplish just hammers home how sad and pathetic the show's version of Euron is.
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
I wonder where Bran and company are going now. It would be funny if for some reason Benjen has to get back to Winterfell or Bran has to warg with the Winterfell weirwood for some reason, and that breaks the spell on The Wall.
 

munchie64

Member
The line 'works' on the show, only in the sense that it's a shit line spoken by a shit character, so it makes sense that he's say it at that point.
Of course, the fact that Euron has been in power for 5 minutes and has already lost all of their ships and failed the first task he set out to accomplish just hammers home how sad and pathetic the show's version of Euron is.
I don't think he's quite reached shit character level. The actor is doing a lot of work to stop it, but they do have opportunities to make it better.
 

Talon

Member
I remember when things actually happened on this show.

The only reason I'm still watching is because my wife does. Otherwise I would have dropped it two seasons ago.
You mean like 2 of the last 3 episodes? What the hell have you been watching?
 
I don't think he's quite reached shit character level. The actor is doing a lot of work to stop it, but they do have opportunities to make it better.
The Ironborn chapters, along with Dorne, Quentin and the 'Queenmaker' arcs were my least favourite parts of the book, so I wasn't expecting to love them in the show. I disliked the Ironborn mostly for the reasons others have covered above; they're a stupid people. An island full of copy and paste assholes who just weren't very interesting. That was until Euron came along, and he at least seemed like a very different kind of asshole. I enjoyed his pompousness and the mystery he's shrouded in with his creepy crew of mutes and warlocks. I also loved the dynamic between him and Victarion too, who seemed to embody all of the worst Ironborn traits turned up to 11. In fact, the two characters complement each other in a way that seems almost pointless to adapt one and not the other. In any case, the character at least got me more invested in the Ironborn chapters and interested to see were it's all heading.
Euron on the show is none of that. What we have seen of him so far is closer to a weaker, diluted and less competent version of Victarion. Just another boring, generic Ironborn.
The casting doesn't work for me either. The actor lacks any sort of imposing physical presence and delivers the lines with a weak sort of lisp.
 

Madness

Member
I think we're supposed to believe that there is a decent time jump from the Kingsmoot to drowning Euron/Yara and Theon making off with the ships.

At least that was my impression.

Yara and Theon left with a bunch of Iron Born too. Probably the best of the Iron Born.

Not really. They are probably 40 minutes away from the cliff. So this means immediately after the Euron chants, Yara and Theon book it and Euron goes to be baptized.

I do agree the show is acting pretty stupidly around kinslaying. Smalljon Umber saying he'd have killed his own father if the Frey's didn't do it for them, Euron just casually saying he killed Balon and everyone agreeing with him, Euron wanting to kill his niece and nephew and everyone going along with it. Ramsay killing Roose and people lining up to want his help. Tyrion kills Tywin and Dany accepts it without a second thought and makes him a trusted advisor etc.
 

Kain

Member
Watched this

- COLDHANDS OH MAH GAD

- Politics and stuff, nice

- The HS is awesome and Tommen is stupid. As expected of a horny teenager, no complains here, if anything it seems that what the HS is doing is overkill. Poor chap.

- COLDHANDS AT LAST IM CRYING

- Jaime with tits is boring, but I've come to terms with the char by now.

- Mace is all sort of great. The actor nails it

- Oh man, Tarly is just as I imagined him, he's fucking perfect. That Sam part was so great, Gilly was great and I couldn't help but feel Sam and Gilly's rage too. They were right, you damn piece of shit, Sam is ten time the warrior those two are (at least in deeds performed lol). I didn't expect Sam to run away with the sword, but fuck Tarly. The thing is, where are they going now? Back to the Wall? They shouldn't go to Oldtown...

- You see? Tommen is a tool and was played right into the HS hands. Poor Jaime, two children dead and one is a fool (as I said, expected of a horny teenager). Fuck Cersei.

- COLDHANDS IS BENJEN. BENJEN. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH. That's one theory that shouldn't be proven in the books because of comments by Leaf and stuff, but it would be so, so cool. I understand why George didn't do this because it seems a little bit too convenient and cheap, but it works in the show. It works so damn well. He should have blue eyes though, to show not all WW are evil and so.

- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand then Dany. ZZZZZZZ. Boooooooooooring. Oh she is flying away on Drogon. AGAIN. Oh she is saying grand stuff. AGAIN. Ugh. Let the war begin so that she can die already fighting the WW for fuck's sake.
 

Aurongel

Member
If love to see Euron get some good lines, everything he's had to work with so far is some pretty meatheaded shit. The actor doesn't strike me as the bad ingredient in the pot here. I'm just shocked that he looks as much like Theon as he does. Dany on the other hand has had some good material in the past but Emilia Clarke is maybe the most stilted actor playing a main character. She gets more ferocious speeches than anyone else and doesn't bring much to them.

But I think we can all agree that the actor playing Sam's dad is just about as perfect as casting gets. That guys face just screams racist, stubborn bastard. As soon as I saw the first shot of him it made my skin crawl.
 

Pkaz01

Member
Mercy chapter spoilers
how awesome would it have been if we got Arya reciting Bonobo's line from the play like she did in the book? The part about her becoming the monster now was my favorite part of that chapter
 

SteveWD40

Member
I assume we will get some exposition as to exactly what Benjen is right now, since he just told us he was "killed", then "healed" by having obsidian shoved into his heart...

He isn't a wight, or a WW (the end result when they last did that) but he can't be alive surely?
 

CloudWolf

Member
I assume we will get some exposition as to exactly what Benjen is right now, since he just told us he was "killed", then "healed" by having obsidian shoved into his heart...

He isn't a wight, or a WW (the end result when they last did that) but he can't be alive surely?

Did we ever get a confirmation to what Coldhands is exactly? Anyway, my guess is that Benjen isn't here to stay. He's obviously moving Bran and Meera to the Wall since that's the only logical place for their story to go and if they're really going with the Benjen = Coldhands stuff, Benjen can't move past The Wall.

I guess that is also the moment that they're going to give the explanation that The Wall itself is magic, since I don't think the show has talked about that yet. Could be wrong though.
 
I assume we will get some exposition as to exactly what Benjen is right now, since he just told us he was "killed", then "healed" by having obsidian shoved into his heart...

He isn't a wight, or a WW (the end result when they last did that) but he can't be alive surely?
He's probably closer to a White Walker than a Wight at this point. The Children stopped him from dying and turning outright by shoving dragonglass in his heart, but he's still been mortally wounded. Considering the White Walkers don't appear to age, Benjen might be experiencing something similar.
 

Kain

Member
Forgot about Arya. Boring and her arc makes no sense, all that work for nothing because she likes the lady. OC.

About Euron, it looks that they are preparing him to be the next bad guy after Ramsay dies, but for now he seems pretty laughable. There is no trace of the scary creepy pirate wizard, instead we get a bland Theon lookalike that yells some of Euron's famous speeches. Also the part where he admits he killed Balon is damn right stupid.
 

Moff

Member
Forgot about Arya. Boring and her arc makes no sense, all that work for nothing because she likes the lady. OC.
I think it makes a lot of sense, arya is simply not someone who kills everyone. the show has established that, she asked the hound to not kill people when not necessary. her list makes it clear that she only kills people who deserve it. hiding needle and the play made it obvious that she will never be "no one". she will find a way to get the ability to use the faces but that's it.
 

Kain

Member
Was Euron ever drowned in the books? Because him not being so actually does explain why he's the only one with half a brain there.
 

Chuckie

Member
Was Euron ever drowned in the books? Because him not being so actually does explain why he's the only one with half a brain there.

I don't think so. Wasn't he some sort of heathen? At least in the eyes of Damphair who favors Victarion.
 

Nodnol

Member
I know Tommen gets a lot of hate for being weak-willed, soft, wet etc...


....but has he accidentally become a great King? Prior to the Faith Militant turning up, he and Margery were liked by the people. The people then look to the Faith, so the marriage between the two surely means Tommen and Margery are both revered by the people.

Whilst the rest of the kingdom might be falling apart, Dorne is going through a revolution, there's a defiant siege at Riverrun and the North is all sorts of fucked up, when it comes to the people of King's Landing, Tommen has to be the best King they've had in years.

The only downside I can think of, is he's allowed the ruination of a once great trade of King Landing in its whore houses. RIP.

He's inherited a shit heap of a kingdom, and has only ever accidentally harmed his bitch mother and her scheming. I'm sure he'll be killed off soon, but you'd imagine the people will remember him as Kind Tommen or something.
 

duckroll

Member
No, a great king isn't one who is merely well liked by the populace, but one who has a strong will and betters the kingdom through his actions and decisions. Being popular in a time of relative peace because you side with the factions who have the favor of the people at the time does not make one a great king, but a convenient puppet.
 
With regards to Cold Hands being Benjen, hasn't this already been debunked by GRRM?

Not in the books, but his editor (I think) asked him before ADWD was released and GRRM confirmed he's not. Makes sense too, since Coldhands is described as having been killed 'a long time ago' by Leaf (or something to that effect) which doesn't exactly fit with Benjen having gone missing a year or two before Bran meets up with Coldhands.
 

Moff

Member
the weird thing is that he said "when I last saw you, you were a little boy" wasn't that like a year ago? how much time has passed since season 1?

maybe colhands is benjen but as a trime traveler who went back in the time from the far future when the night king rules the world.
this would explain why the children said he was very old.
 

comedian

Member
Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I found the music during the Benjen scene very odd. Here's Benjen killing a bunch of wraiths and the music is dome kind of Professor Layton elevator music.
 

CloudWolf

Member
the weird thing is that he said "when I last saw you, you were a little boy" wasn't that like a year ago? how much time has passed since season 1?

maybe colhands is benjen but as a trime traveler who went back in the time from the far future when the night king rules the world.
this would explain why the children said he was very old.
No, in the show one season equals one year, so Benjen has been missing for six years now, which is plenty of time for someone to go from a little boy to a teen. It would be weird if Benjen said that same line in the books.
 
the weird thing is that he said "when I last saw you, you were a little boy" wasn't that like a year ago? how much time has passed since season 1?
About 4-5 years have passed since season 1.
Generally speaking 1 season = 1 year in the show though that isn't always accurate.
Edit: Beaten
 

Moff

Member
No, in the show one season equals one year, so Benjen has been missing for six years now, which is plenty of time for someone to go from a little boy to a teen. It would be weird if Benjen said that same line in the books.

About 4-5 years have passed since season 1.
Generally speaking 1 season = 1 year in the show though that isn't always accurate.
Edit: Beaten

really? is there any source for this? that doesn't make sense for many places
 

Sean C

Member
really? is there any source for this? that doesn't make sense for many places
The writers have said it many times.

And no, it doesn't make any sense for most of the stories. But they've got a bunch of child actors who have clearly aged 7 years since they were first cast.
 

Eidan

Member
Forgot about Arya. Boring and her arc makes no sense, all that work for nothing because she likes the lady. OC.
It makes perfect sense. That you would say it doesn't is kind of baffling. Do you know what "sense" means in this context? Or what an arc is?
 

Kain

Member
It makes perfect sense. That you would say it doesn't is kind of baffling. Do you know what "sense" means in this context? Or what an arc is?

No I don't because I'm stupid apparently (seriously?). But just to clarify, for me it doesn't make sense in this context because Arya has not finished her training nor this arc has led her anywhere except for the realization that killing "innocents" is bad (maybe). She had a list, she wanted to kill the people on the list, she wanted to get into the Faceless men because she thought that with enough training from them she would get the skills to kill the people she hates. She had plenty of time to get out of the organization if she saw something funny (there was funny stuff from day one) and she decides to do so know because she liked the actress and felt pity or something? Now, she is clearly not Book-Arya, where she is killing people left and right at every corner, but I'm not really sure what she is here. I kind of understand the feeling pity and not killing people out of the list thing, but all she has learned is to scrub floors and fight with a stick afawk. So that makes this arc a sort of filler in my mind, if the finality was to realize that killing "innocent" people without actually killing anyone (or witnessing other killings, because it seems the house of the Faceless is composed of two and a half people) in the process is bad... it all seems kind of pointless. That's what not making sense is to me.

That or I don't understand stuff, which could perfectly be too, of course.
 

Eidan

Member
No I don't because I'm stupid apparently (seriously?). But just to clarify, for me it doesn't make sense in this context because Arya has not finished her training nor this arc has led her anywhere except for the realization that killing "innocents" is bad (maybe). She had a list, she wanted to kill the people on the list, she wanted to get into the Faceless men because she thought that with enough training from them she would get the skills to kill the people she hates. She had plenty of time to get out of the organization if she saw something funny (there was funny stuff from day one) and she decides to do so know because she liked the actress and felt pity or something? Now, she is clearly not Book-Arya, where she is killing people left and right at every corner, but I'm not really sure what she is here. I kind of understand the feeling pity and not killing people out of the list thing, but all she has learned is to scrub floors and fight with a stick afawk. So that makes this arc a sort of filler in my mind, if the finality was to realize that killing "innocent" people without actually killing anyone (or witnessing other killings, because it seems the house of the Faceless is composed of two and a half people) in the process is bad... it all seems kind of pointless. That's what not making sense is to me.

That or I don't understand stuff, which could perfectly be too, of course.
Feels like you just don't understand stuff. Which is fine. Her decision makes perfect sense in the context of her character (she doesn't like killing innocent people), it's consistent with the trajectory has character has been in (she has only killed those she felt were evil, or killed in self-defense, and was consistent with this as of last season), and works as a catalyst for her plot in Braavos (despite already being reprimanded and threatened, will our hero compromise her values in order to complete her training?). Like I said, I find your complaints kind of baffling. It's a sensible arc so far.
 

Kusagari

Member
So I was rewatching the episode and actually thought about the Sam scenes.

Why does no one in his family, including his dick of a father, seem to care at all about him breaking his vows and having a kid?
 

Real Hero

Member
So I was rewatching the episode and actually thought about the Sam scenes.

Why does no one in his family, including his dick of a father, seem to care at all about him breaking his vows and having a kid?

lmao, I guess nights watch vows matter as much as kin slaying
 

Sean C

Member
So I was rewatching the episode and actually thought about the Sam scenes.

Why does no one in his family, including his dick of a father, seem to care at all about him breaking his vows and having a kid?
Because vows in the show are not something people take seriously, which annoys me since attempting to honour vows is a major theme in the books, and a source of dramatic tension.
 

Nodnol

Member
No, a great king isn't one who is merely well liked by the populace, but one who has a strong will and betters the kingdom through his actions and decisions. Being popular in a time of relative peace because you side with the factions who have the favor of the people at the time does not make one a great king, but a convenient puppet.

Absolutely, I was trying to say ham-fistedly that from the perspective of the people, that Tommen would be well liked and received. Whilst he hasn't ruled his kingdom sufficiently, he also hasn't made the mistakes his brother and father made (apart from listening to Cersei).
 
Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I found the music during the Benjen scene very odd. Here's Benjen killing a bunch of wraiths and the music is dome kind of Professor Layton elevator music.

The music was one of the White Walker themes. It's been used before. I love the music that they've done for the white walkers. Really sets the tone.
 

Drazgul

Member
The show has been great with casting in general, I think that's part of why Euron seems so mediocre - it just isn't a very good casting. Plus they went about it quite lazily too, where's the eyepatch, the warlock stuff and the dragon horn and the mute crew? He just comes off as a douchebag who purely relies on his status as Ironborn nobility, much like Theon was.

Hoping we'll see at least some of the above in future eps, but all of that should've been presented up front to properly establish him as a dangerous player, not some tertiary shithead that gets killed off at a convenient plot point.
 
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