• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 6

Status
Not open for further replies.
Jons always looked like a wounded puppy though. And it makes sense. From when the red head died, to almost losing castle black, to shooing his best friend hurley(..?), and finally being stabbed by his own subjects.

If I was killed Id be pretty depressed too

The whole point of his story arc is to do the right thing, despite what others may think. "Kill the boy and let the man be born." When he came back he should have been pissed and more resolute than ever. Not wanting to go away and live out his second chance at life somewhere where it's warm.
 

nampad

Member
I presume the same reason why Bran and Co were no longer safe with the three eyed raven in the cave. I suspect Bran and Meera will cross the wall again basically opening up the ability for the night's King to follow.

The raising of the dead is something the nights King does but really we've seen several instances south of the wall

Bran being the reason why the white walkers can cross the wall and be a threat?
I can totally see that because Bran is such a shithead and annoying character!

I liked how they turned Arya into an uncharacteristic idiot so that they could injure her.

How about the waif being to dumb too actually kill her?
 
This.

Via the Wiki:






Should I even bother responding to this or are you just taking the piss?

That's a far cry from killing a priest and his flock for not offering to starve theirselves for you.

That group seemed more like the type of group pretending to be from the Brotherhood, like Biter and company in the books.
 
Ja2YfWB.gif

I foresee some good uses for this GIF.
 

Raynes

Member
Some dumb questions need answering please.
Why is Jamie allowed to treat Walder Frey's sons like shit?
Why doesn't Jamie just storm Riverrun?
Why was the Blackfish perfectly ok with having them kill his son?
If Edmure is of no use, why didn't the Freys just kill him?
 

Layell

Member
Some dumb questions need answering please.
Why is Jamie allowed to treat Walder Frey's sons like shit?
Why doesn't Jamie just storm Riverrun?
Why was the Blackfish perfectly ok with having them kill his son?
If Edmure is of no use, why didn't the Freys just kill him?

1. Nobody likes Freys
2. If you mean during the talk that would probably have ended badly for him and his men, if you mean lay siege in general, that never seems to go well.
3/4. Some bad writing along with Freys are shit.
 

rando14

Member
Some dumb questions need answering please.
Why is Jamie allowed to treat Walder Frey's sons like shit?
Why doesn't Jamie just storm Riverrun?
Why was the Blackfish perfectly ok with having them kill his son?
If Edmure is of no use, why didn't the Freys just kill him?

1) The freys are loyal to house lannister
2) riverrun is surrounded by water on three sides and has a huge moat on the 4th, it would be extremely difficult
3) that's his nephew, he was calling their bluff
4) He's still a bargaining chip
 

Pein

Banned
Some dumb questions need answering please.
Why is Jamie allowed to treat Walder Frey's sons like shit?
Why doesn't Jamie just storm Riverrun?
Why was the Blackfish perfectly ok with having them kill his son?
If Edmure is of no use, why didn't the Freys just kill him?

1. Because he's uncle of the king and freys are pledged to the lannisters, he's far above the freys.
2. because storming the castle would mean he'd lose thousands of men.
3. Thats not his son, its his nephew, he's not gonna give up all his men to save his nephew especially to freys who would kill him and everyone in the castle as soon as they surrender.
4. why kill your only valuable hostage?
 

Brakke

Banned
Ayo...do we really know that the three men that attacked the show's version of the quiet isle were members of the BWB?

What if they were a play on the book plot with the remaining members of the Bloody Mummers?

The Ringer after show referred to them as Brotherhood Without Banners. No idea if they have any access at all to the show's production tho.
 

Gigglepoo

Member
Game of Thrones went from decapitating its protagonist to stabbing a girl five times but no one believes she's dead.

So much for fearing death.
 

Lothar

Banned
Blackfish thinks they'll kill Edmure no matter what he does. That's what he says in the books. So he'd rather they just be done with it instead of tormenting him.
 

ryseing

Member
FWIW I think his death wasn't handled in the best way possible either. Ending a book on a cliffhanger that everyone knows the outcome of, with interviews in the 5-6 year gap between books that basically go "wink-wink you don't think Jon is dead do you?", the mistake's already been made and I don't think there's any way to "save it", either in season 6 or in book 6.

That said, I do see why Jon is the only person that could unite the realms of men for the White Walker conflict. He can't do that without getting involved in the wars, and he can't do that as Lord Commander. He had to be a men of the Nigh's Watch to understand the threat, but he can't be one to face the threat. In that sense his death and resurrection make perfect sense.

Yeah, I don't think Winds will justify it either. IIRC didn't he kill Jon because he lost a bet?
 

Gattsu25

Banned
How about the waif being to dumb too actually kill her?
It only makes the scene worse. How many times have you seen the "hero falls in water, killer assumes hero died. hero proceeds to eventually kill the killer" trope?

It's fucking played out and boring. It's a trope for a reason: it's lazy writing.
 

Gigglepoo

Member
Yeah, I don't think Winds will justify it either. IIRC didn't he kill Jon because he lost a bet?

Nope, that was Ser Patrek:

MARTIN: Well there's this guy named Patrick St. Denis, who runs a fantasy website called Pat's Fantasy Hotlist. And Pat is a big Dallas Cowboys fan. So we would have a standing bet for a number of years about whether the Dallas Cowboys or the New York Giants would do better. And I won the bet the first two years. But finally, in the third year the Cowboys finished ahead of the Giants. And what I had to do if he won the bet was to kill him horribly within the books.

MARTIN: So I invented a character called Ser Patrek of King's Mountain and described his heraldry as looking somewhat like the heraldry of the Dallas Cowboys with the silver star on a white field. And then I had him ripped apart by a giant.

Big difference between killing a dude who doesn't matter and Jon Snow because of a bet.
 

DPhentom

Member
Kind of a silly question but is there any significance to them calling Edmure Lord Edmure over Lord Tully?
They seem to always call Starks Lord Stark over Lord "firstname"
 

Chopper

Member
Just say what is is. Spoiler tag if necessary.

Is he returning to the show?
I have no idea. He was explicitly asked by the host if Syrio had ties to the house of black and white, supporting a popular online theory...

He immediately said "Yes" before awkwardly stuttering, backtracking and then claiming it was his ties to Braavos he was referring to. My missus and I immediately picked up on it.
 

mantidor

Member
SHOCKING!

It does bother me she made a big deal to not send a raven to her uncle and needed Brienne instead but with Littlefinger is ok to send a raven. Again plot points move characters instead of the other way around, because we know we need the Brienne/Jaimei reunion.
 

Sheroking

Member
Some dumb questions need answering please.
Why is Jamie allowed to treat Walder Frey's sons like shit?

Who is going to stop him?

Why doesn't Jamie just storm Riverrun?

Storm it how? They'd need to siege to get through the walls and that would take time and more Lannister lives. Jaime thought he'd try diplomacy before that.

Why was the Blackfish perfectly ok with having them kill his son?

His nephew.

It's not so much about caring, he just thinks they'll kill him anyway and that one Tully life isn't worth surrending Riverrun.

If Edmure is of no use, why didn't the Freys just kill him?

Because they don't know if he's out of uses, yet?

He's basically the one bargaining chip they have.

SHOCKING!

It does bother me she made a big deal to not send a raven to her uncle and needed Brienne instead but with Littlefinger is ok to send a raven. Again plot points move characters instead of the other way around, because we know we need the Brienne/Jaimei reunion.

Why would a raven to Littlefinger get shot down, since nobody is currently at odds with the Vale? Does she have a second Brienne to send to Baelish?

The show's logic is fine.
 

Brakke

Banned
The real question is how is a raven going to find Littlefinger. The way that dude moves he could be anywhere within a forty thousand mile radius of his last-known location.
 

Faddy

Banned
SHOCKING!

It does bother me she made a big deal to not send a raven to her uncle and needed Brienne instead but with Littlefinger is ok to send a raven. Again plot points move characters instead of the other way around, because we know we need the Brienne/Jaimei reunion.

Littlefinger knows Sansa is alive and what she is about.

A raven to the Blackfish from Sansa could be a Lannister trick or she could be their hostage. So yeah for that she needs to send someone to meet him face to face.
 

Faddy

Banned
The real question is how is a raven going to find Littlefinger. The way that dude moves he could be anywhere within a forty thousand mile radius of his last-known location.

Raven logic is never really explained in the books. How birds are exchanged so they can find home so let's not dwell on how ravens find people and their 100% success rate unless explicitly shot down.

It is a quirk of the setting.

Also Littlefinger told her he is at Moat Cailin. She probably sends the raven there.
 

mantidor

Member
Why would a raven to Littlefinger get shot down, since nobody is currently at odds with the Vale? Does she have a second Brienne to send to Baelish?

The show's logic is fine.

The only way to know who a raven is being sent to is to shot it down, Sansa's specific worry was Ramsay intercepting it, not just anyone.

Littlefinger knows Sansa is alive and what she is about.

A raven to the Blackfish from Sansa could be a Lannister trick or she could be their hostage. So yeah for that she needs to send someone to meet him face to face.

I do like this explanation better, but it also has the problem of Ramsay shooting down the raven, isn't he obviously going to shot down anything that comes from the far north? I know that he can't intercept everything but the risk is there. I guess the element of surprise is not important for this specific attack? I don't know, it should be.
 

Sheroking

Member
The only way to know who a raven is being sent to is to shot it down, Sansa's specific worry was Ramsay intercepting it, not just anyone.

It would also depend on where they are and where the Raven is flying. If you're sending a Raven south from The Wall, it's going to pass through Winterfell and it's surrounding area, making it a vulnerable target. Bear Island and the Wolfswood are to the West of Winterfell. Also, she already sent Brienne. Who else is she going to send?
 

Kerned

Banned
I think I inferred from the books that they send out multiple ravens for any given message to increase the chances of finding the target. It's also possible I made that up in my head to make the implausibility of the Raven Express make more sense.
 

Gigglepoo

Member
Ravens fly from back and forth between locations, right? Like, King's Landing has a raven that flies to Winterfell and then, when a Winterfell Maester gives it a letter, it flies back to King's Landing. I think that's how ravens work. Or am I confusing that with real life?
 
Ravens fly from back and forth between locations, right? Like, King's Landing has a raven that flies to Winterfell and then, when a Winterfell Maester gives it a letter, it flies back to King's Landing. I think that's how ravens work. Or am I confusing that with real life?

That's how it works in TV. In real life it's a bit more complicated then that.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom