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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 6
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
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MisterR
Member
Wasn't so much that for me. The whole, well it's one of the best five things ever thing, just didn't feel organic at all. It all felt like a skit. The grandma joke was anachronistic as hell.
bishopcruz
Member
LIttlefinger's teleporter is a running gag. I wouldn't use it as a defense. It sucks when he does it, and it always has, but it's been accepted over time. But even his worst teleports, which were last season, weren't this nonsensical.
As for the ship. Trys was on the same ship as Jaime, Bronn, and Myrcella. There was one ship at port in KL, there was one ship ready to leave Dorne at the end of last season, and we again, see him in KL. Same ship. So we have to assume that ALL the guards in Dorne were on the take, and didn't kill the Lannisters on the trip, but waited for Jaime to get back, then waited to let the sand fakes onto the ship later. A ship Trys honestly shouldn't have even been on at this point.
It is all nonsense.
Dash_Riprock
Member
It felt like a skit cause they were literally parodying the famous line from Conan.
Peter Ian Staker
Member
Seeing him in a battle scene in the trailer and seeing the actor on a battle set with a different outfit than the night watch's.
Also they drag out the corpse business for like a second episode, usually a character that actually dies in this show does pretty conclusively and quickly.
Liquidsnake
Banned
Excellent episode, I already feel like this year will be better than last!
Excellent stuff.
Excellent stuff.
Red Arremer
Member
Yep.
The thing is, though, that the Dornish trust Doran. They know he's a smart and passionate man, even though he is crippled. He has the reputation of being patience personified. And the Sand Snakes also aren't ruthless murderers with no sense of perspective either in the books. Not even Obara is that stupid. But in the show... Like, do they really think the Dornish houses are going to be following them after assassinating the legitimate ruler and his heir, who was innocent of anything his father might've done or not?
This is especially rubbish because Oberyn and Doran were insanely close. This is definitely not anything Oberyn would've wanted. It's absolutely insane to think that Oberyn, who was supposed to be the wild, untamed warrior among the Martells actually ends up being a moderate politician in comparison to his paramour and bastard children. The realization that he was the second-tamest and considerate person after Doran makes me kinda mad.
So, not only is it dishonouring Oberyn's memory, but it also should have the consequence of Dorne completely falling apart into civil war. The houses that were loyal to Doran would not take kindly to their liege lord getting murdered by the angry girlfriend of his younger brother, and the houses that are open rivals of the Martells would obviously immediately go and try to claim becoming the princes of Dorne. If I was one of the rival houses like Yronwood, I would immediately go to forge an alliance with the Lannisters or Tyrells or whomever and root out these rebels. They're traitors to the crown, traitors to the Prince, traitors to Dorne.
But obviously that's not what's gonna happen in the show. Instead, Dorne will of course stand united behind this lobotomized coup d'etat.
I'm glad actually. I don't see any possible way the show wouldn't have fucked that reveal up.
I hope when the future adaptation inevitably happens in 20-30 years Dorne is treated better. Doran is, along with Stannis, the character that gets the most short shrift and it sucks.
CopperPuppy
Member
Yeah, the writers often insert anachronisms like that as an attempt at humor only for the lines to fall on their face. Instead of the characters saying something relatable and funny, the anachronistic language jars the viewer out of the experience and is mostly cringe-y.
On the other side of the spectrum, Witcher 3 inserts tons of clever little anachronisms as funny nods and references to other media. These anachronisms are so well-woven into the dialog as to be almost unnoticeable. Every player will notice some and miss others, which is the entire point. They're unobtrusive, clever, and humourous; there to be picked up on if you're in the know, indistinct otherwise.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Also confirms that it wasn't really Aegon.
The Dorne scene was like
They killed off 3 characters in like 15 seconds, none of whom had gotten any substantial screentime so it meant nothing and made nearly the entirety of last season's subplot meaningless.
What a bizarre reset button. And probably reset the wrong characters at that.
Oh well. Hotah being killed in one hit by a five foot tall pixie was at least worth a good laugh.
They killed off 3 characters in like 15 seconds, none of whom had gotten any substantial screentime so it meant nothing and made nearly the entirety of last season's subplot meaningless.
What a bizarre reset button. And probably reset the wrong characters at that.
Oh well. Hotah being killed in one hit by a five foot tall pixie was at least worth a good laugh.
I don't know about that. It's more of an indication that even if Aegon is really Aegon he won't have much of a role in the endgame.
Veritigo_X
Member
I loved how they made a big deal about speaking Valyrian in Meereen and then immediately show graffiti written in English.
bishopcruz
Member
Does anyone need confirmation of that? It's pretty clear in the text that he's a fake.
I think we can throw out "confirmations" of anything by now, especially Dorne. Given people like Ellaria in the show are literally polar opposites of how they are in the book, and half the characters were cut and the remaining half in totally different roles, I don't think you can make a single judgement on anything forthcoming in the books from the show's version.
At this point all they have in common is the same character names.
At this point all they have in common is the same character names.
Red Arremer
Member
I think Aegon was folded into Dany almost entirely. Like, you have Varys who is a staunch supporter of Aegon as opposed to Daenerys sitting in Meereen in the show now, ruling it with Tyrion. And Jon Connington was folded into Jorah. So obviously, anything of importance tied to Aegon in the books will be in relation to Dany in the show.
I believe that in the books, Dany will actually end up coming to Westeros much later than Aegon, and after Aegon has established a strong powerbase. There will either be a standoff between the two or they will ally. I think that in the show, we will a similar development, but instead of Westeros being in shambles because of Aegon's invasion, it will be in shambles because of the imminent conflict between the Lannisters, the Tyrells, Dorne and the Faith.
I believe that in the books, Dany will actually end up coming to Westeros much later than Aegon, and after Aegon has established a strong powerbase. There will either be a standoff between the two or they will ally. I think that in the show, we will a similar development, but instead of Westeros being in shambles because of Aegon's invasion, it will be in shambles because of the imminent conflict between the Lannisters, the Tyrells, Dorne and the Faith.
Operations
Member
We can: irrelevance. The Dorne plot in the books is also going nowhere.
Yeah, I am kind of shocked by Doran and Stannis in the show (or lack thereof now). I've never really made a fuss about changes or anything from the books, but eliminating someone like Doran completely in a quick scene was...I dunno, guess we'll have to see how things progress but it feels pretty weird.
Also the sense of time progression is now incomprehensible. Generally you'd assume each episode is taking place at the same time, about chronologically, as you would any show.
But now the Wall plot obviously takes place at most a few hours after the end of season 5, but the King's Landing plot obviously must be weeks later, because you don't sail from the Water Gardens to King's Landing in a couple of hours. If it somehow is the next day at best, then Tyene's hair was somehow longer than it was last season (I will ignore Olly being a year older suddenly, you can't help that) and I have to wonder what they were doing for the last several weeks.
Then Dany has seemingly been in the Khalasar for a few days at least, but only now has Khal Moro bothered to take a look at her?
The only solution is the assume they're all taking place at different times. But they never identify which is which so having to guess is just confusing.
But now the Wall plot obviously takes place at most a few hours after the end of season 5, but the King's Landing plot obviously must be weeks later, because you don't sail from the Water Gardens to King's Landing in a couple of hours. If it somehow is the next day at best, then Tyene's hair was somehow longer than it was last season (I will ignore Olly being a year older suddenly, you can't help that) and I have to wonder what they were doing for the last several weeks.
Then Dany has seemingly been in the Khalasar for a few days at least, but only now has Khal Moro bothered to take a look at her?
The only solution is the assume they're all taking place at different times. But they never identify which is which so having to guess is just confusing.
bishopcruz
Member
And how do we know this? Tell me have you read TWoW? Because in the preview chapters
it's pretty clear that Arianne will be joining up with the Golden Company and Dorne will be a major part of the force that takes out King's Landing. Or at least weakens it.
I'm not a book reader and I disliked the episode, there was no drama, intrigue or mystery. It felt like an episode 0 instead of a premier.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Yeah, there's a reason why Season 5 broke ratings records despite most book fans considering it the worst season by far.
petethepanda
Member
I managed to not see the "possibly only 13 episodes after this season" thing until today. My immediate reaction was "how," but after thinking about it a bit more, I think I'd be on board with it. At this point, both the show and the books are sprawling and muddled to the point where an end is hardly in sight, and it's probably for the best if the show takes advantage of moving ahead of the books and decides to skip out on huge chunks of yet-to-come plot in favor of finally starting to tie together all the threads that are floating around.
Starting After the Thrones. Still can't believe this is an official thing now.
Starting After the Thrones. Still can't believe this is an official thing now.
Psychoward
Banned
Put me in as a non-book reader (after 3 at least) that was unimpressed with this episode and last season.
I might be a bit biased though cause I have a friend who's up to date with the books who fills me in about stuff they leave out.
I think the reception there has been as mixed as it is here in this thread. Plenty of non book readers still think Dorne sucks.
Psychoward
Banned
.
Right now I'm in it for the payoffs that we're owed since the first few seasons of the show: Tower of Joy, Matrix Bran, Arya sent to assassinate Cersei, Dany invading Westeros, Jon Snow kicking the Night's King's ass, Sansa conquering Winterfell.
From the promos, it looks to me that at least some of these will happen this season, so I'm willing to put up with disappearing dogs and their homage to Hercules: The Legendary Journeys with Dorne.
From the promos, it looks to me that at least some of these will happen this season, so I'm willing to put up with disappearing dogs and their homage to Hercules: The Legendary Journeys with Dorne.
Psychoward
Banned
Basically why I'm watching as well.
Rewatched this ep, as I took the day off and didn't have anything better to do.
I like that they went with the old crone route. It's actually quite fitting.
I am glad they realized the entire Dorne shit was a dead end and decided to kill everyone and move forward. I'm also glad they realized people don't like watching that Meereen or wherever crap, so they moved Tyrion there so viewers will care. God that entire continent should be renamed Fastfordwess after season one.
I liked it. It's not a strong episode but it's better than anything from s5 aside from Hard Home. Which also has the benefit of having a title worthy of an amazing porno.
I like that they went with the old crone route. It's actually quite fitting.
I am glad they realized the entire Dorne shit was a dead end and decided to kill everyone and move forward. I'm also glad they realized people don't like watching that Meereen or wherever crap, so they moved Tyrion there so viewers will care. God that entire continent should be renamed Fastfordwess after season one.
I liked it. It's not a strong episode but it's better than anything from s5 aside from Hard Home. Which also has the benefit of having a title worthy of an amazing porno.
MisterR
Member
I'll agree with this. Shes the only redeeming thing about Dorne.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Atraveller
Banned
Good post, it feels like this episode was written with cliffhanger resolving in mind, tying up the loose ends from last season. That's why the Lannister-Dorne line deviated in time from the rest of the POVs so much, the writers couldn't spend time on the awkward ship ride (for both Trystane and Jaime) all the way to KL.
Dash_Riprock
Member
To be fair, thats been a problem with the show since season 2.
Wait I don't remember this, please refresh my memory -- how is book Aegon fake?
Atraveller
Banned
Potentially a Blackfyre pretender.
Ocarina_117
Banned
Entered the non-book reader thread and saw the comment about the Dorne scene being very nuanced story telling.
Hmm. Not sure how I feel about it, maybe knowing how much more dorne could be has just soured me on that story all together.
Hmm. Not sure how I feel about it, maybe knowing how much more dorne could be has just soured me on that story all together.
Seems obvious to me that Doran's plans were going to go to shit, and that the end game of the book Dorne plot is Dorne in open rebellion. The show just cut out the bullshit and got straight to the point.
This.
Eh, I think book Doran ends up pushing Aegon a Targ civil war with Dany because of how bitter he'll be with her over Quentyn. No Aegon on the show though, so they seem to be replacing the violence of a civil war with the antics of the Murder Sisters.
Dash_Riprock
Member
So they did in 15 seconds whats taken GRRM 5+ years and God knows how many pages.
...I can buy that.
hipsterpants
Member
My favorite part about Dorne is that the Sand Snakes decide that the best way to avenge Oberyn is to murder his entire family.
And that apparently everyone in Dorne is so butthurt about it that they are totally okay with the royal family getting slaughtered.
And that Doran is apparently such an awful ruler that he has literally one single loyal guard, everyone else hates his guts.
And that the Sand Snakes will probably start ruling Dorne, but everyone will be okay with that because they're so butthurt about Oberyn.
Dorne sucks.
e: even if there is conflict in Dorne I'm sure it will get wrapped up in like 2 seconds.
And that apparently everyone in Dorne is so butthurt about it that they are totally okay with the royal family getting slaughtered.
And that Doran is apparently such an awful ruler that he has literally one single loyal guard, everyone else hates his guts.
And that the Sand Snakes will probably start ruling Dorne, but everyone will be okay with that because they're so butthurt about Oberyn.
Dorne sucks.
e: even if there is conflict in Dorne I'm sure it will get wrapped up in like 2 seconds.
Remember the snakes / Dornish have a habit of poisoning their blades. He's dead.
VenomousCoffee
Member
If the Sand Snakes really want to get revenge, why not, you know, kill Jamie while he's at sea? That does way more damage to House L than killing Myrcella.
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