I'm not sure personally - only thing I can think of is during the end of day transition with the shrinking screen.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!
- Thread starter IrishNinja
- Start date
- Status
I'm not sure personally - only thing I can think of is during the end of day transition with the shrinking screen.
I put this in the Mega Drive thread too, but I just got my Master System games running on it in RGB SCART with a cart converter I scored for a buck. Looks nice!
It's in 60Hz but it isn't full screen. If I switch back to PAL I get an even smaller screen so not sure if it's fixable. Still cool none-the-less.
It's in 60Hz but it isn't full screen. If I switch back to PAL I get an even smaller screen so not sure if it's fixable. Still cool none-the-less.
when you access the Bomber's Notebook to look at the stufff you've done. it switches to 480i there. it switches back when you exit it.
IrishNinja
Member
^nice shot peagles, lookin sharp!
as 456 said, ive had it happen on way more saturn games than any other system...havent tried too many PSX ones yet though
as 456 said, ive had it happen on way more saturn games than any other system...havent tried too many PSX ones yet though
Thanks! Can't believe I got that in one snap! Master System games must behave nicely
manipulate
Member
Hey guys, possibly a silly question - I'm quite ignorant when it comes to these matters - but I was wondering if games from the 32 bit era with pre-rendered backgrounds (e.g. FFs, RE, etc) would benefit much from these kind of set ups? Does anyone have any shots to illustrate that? Those SOTN shots look great.
Cross posting here from the saturn thread since I was told I might get a faster answer here.
Ok, so I finally broke down and got me a Saturn. local yard sale had an old blockbuster rental unit(wanted the case) with some games and a few controllers. Anyway I took it by Irish's place to test out and while we can get it working with composite cables we couldn't get it to work with his rgb set up.
What we were wondering was is there a difference in models? Mine's a model 1 and his is a model 2 with the euroscart cables into a framemister. Would I need different scart cables or is my unit's rgb borked? Thanks for any help, trying to see if I need to back to the guy I bought it from to get my money back.
Ok, so I finally broke down and got me a Saturn. local yard sale had an old blockbuster rental unit(wanted the case) with some games and a few controllers. Anyway I took it by Irish's place to test out and while we can get it working with composite cables we couldn't get it to work with his rgb set up.
What we were wondering was is there a difference in models? Mine's a model 1 and his is a model 2 with the euroscart cables into a framemister. Would I need different scart cables or is my unit's rgb borked? Thanks for any help, trying to see if I need to back to the guy I bought it from to get my money back.
IrishNinja
Member
well, Chacranajxy's section of the OP shots are (i believe) all 32-bit era, and if its mostly RGB (not upscaler) you're after, great screenshots here
Those pictures really do a disservice to gaming on real hardware. You look at all those pictures, and on almost all of them, the emulator shot is superior. This is in large part because the composite/rgb pics weren't taken from the same screen the emulator pics were.
Here's a better compilation of comparison pics from the same site:
http://www.chrismcovell.com/gotRGB/rgb_compare.html
Although, there isn't anything in the way of 32bit stuff in that link though
IrishNinja
Member
^you know, that's a very valid complaint; i was just looking at the shots there & thinking that. having one setup for Saturn on emulator & another with it RGB over framemeister, i don't think that gives an accurate/full representation either....and that's even with my lazy results where i don't do nearly enough tweaking per system (i still wish we had a good detailed setup page, i'd use that more! the wiki is largely barren). Retro Gaming Hazard (where i get much of my upscaler info) has some fantastic shots but again, that's for upscaling.
baphomet
Member
So are you literally just switching the cable out of irish's setup into yours and it's not working? As far as i know there's no difference between the 2 of them. The Pinouts are the same on the av out port. That's a very strange issue. I wouldn't even know where to begin with troubleshooting it.
IrishNinja
Member
^that's exaclty what he's doing, yeah. like he said, AV cables were fine, RGB was nothing, i tested 2 model 2's and it worked great, and i can't recall retro_console_accessories telling me there was any difference in the wiring per system, pretty sure when i bought it she didn't have any other kind up for sale (unlike say RGB cables separate for model 1 & 2 genesis). we're hoping to try fellow gaffer Bishopcruz's model 1 on my setup in the morning just to make sure...he also bought some systems from the same garage sale that went poorly so we'll see? guess i should've tested that GBA out, heh
MikeHattsu
Member
Dunno about the framemeister stuff, but I've used the same RGB SCART cable for both model 1 and model 2 PAL Saturn consoles here in Norway.
baphomet
Member
The saturn outputs composite video and has it's own composite sync pin. it should literally be exactly the same between the 2 systems. mine is a model 1 and it works perfectly fine in rgb. i would lean towards there being something wrong with the system, but why would composite video work and not rgb? honestly got no idea.
Just found an app for android that lets me shoot with a variable shutter speed. Hooray, I can now take clear CRT shots!
I don't know why people are still using crappy compressed google image shots of emulated DKC2 to argue their point after I've posted these of what it really looks like. sigh, ah well. Either way, pity my camera phone is shit.
I don't know why people are still using crappy compressed google image shots of emulated DKC2 to argue their point after I've posted these of what it really looks like. sigh, ah well. Either way, pity my camera phone is shit.
Has anyone used the Lenkeng Lkv363 by any chance?
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B008F29NYY/
I don't have the time/skills to mod any of my old consoles to RGB and they are all PAL ones which apparently creates extra problems.
I'm just looking for a quick and easy solution to connect my NES/SNES/N64 to my HDTV without having to use the composite input on my tv because
it looks awful. Although I'm not sure if the Lkv363 will actually improve the image quality (since it converts the composite to HDMI).
Any comments/thoughts would be appreciated.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B008F29NYY/
I don't have the time/skills to mod any of my old consoles to RGB and they are all PAL ones which apparently creates extra problems.
I'm just looking for a quick and easy solution to connect my NES/SNES/N64 to my HDTV without having to use the composite input on my tv because
it looks awful. Although I'm not sure if the Lkv363 will actually improve the image quality (since it converts the composite to HDMI).
Any comments/thoughts would be appreciated.
Ooh nice snaps! What's the app called? My camera phone is so crap but it's all I got for now.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.flavionet.android.camera.pro&hl=en
It's a paid app, but give the lite version a try first. One neat thing is that it saves images in PNG!
I don't have a choice at the moment since my CC just got hacked. Will try out the Lite but when I get my card I'll grab the paid version if it's good!
PNG though... *drool*
It is hard to imagine that thing giving you good image quality, it would probably do the same thing your tv would already do. Composite will look nasty without spending the money on decent hardware scalar, in which case it still won't look great.
I think if you want to get serious, you have to go CRT (which is awesome since you live in a pal region where no doubt there plenty of RGB capable sets for free/cheap).
Or get a proper upscaler (expensive).
Yeah I kind of guessed it would be the same since it probably doesn't upscale like the Framemeister for example.
I'm wondering what the results would be if I insert the Composite into the Framemeister without modifying the console for RGB.
I'm currently using an old CRT but it's a very small one and getting a big CRT in my appartment might prove to be quite the challenge
(I'm on the third floor and the elevator is very small)
Thanks for the reply though
If you're hooking up a console to the XRGB without RGB, then you've wasted your money.
baphomet
Member
Composite into an XRGB will still look like composite. Just scaled up to 720/1080p. You're best bet is just getting rgb cables for the consoles that support it out of the box (master system, genesis, snes, saturn, playstation, dreamcast, gamecube if you're in pal land, etc) and using an rgb to component converter. That's going to give you the best possible quality without spending the money on an XRGB. You'll just have to live with composite/svideo on the other consoles unless you decide to pay someone to mod them. That hdmi converter would look far worse than just plugging your consoles into your tv with composite. I'm sure the scaler in your tv is much better than the one in the box.
On another note i finally got my tate monitor setup to play around with. It's a 14n6u with very few hours on it manufactured in 00. Now i just need to set up a "studio" downstairs so i have someplace to keep it hooked up all the time.
Makes sense and now I feel like a total idiot for not realizing this earlier. I'm going to start looking around for a bigger CRT then
and maybe in the future when I have time look into getting my consoles modded.
Thanks guys
You listed NES, SNES and 64 right? NES is a really expensive mod as it needs a custom board fitted. 64 isn't too bad, but you need one of a range of revisions - PAL consoles are a no no. I got my RGB modded 64 from gaffer baphomet 666, and it's amazing.
But SNES? SNES outputs RGB natively. You just need a properly wired cable from eBay. Mine cost £3. Buy a couple of wires, a resistor and a throw switch (£5 altogether from maplin) and you can get your PAL SNES as multi region with 50/60hz capability. Even if you don't do that, you still have RGB output as standard with no modding.
Be wary that PAL and NTSC RGB SCART cables For the SNES are wired differently though.
But yeah, if you do get one for your snes you're gonna want to mod it for 60hz regardless. I can't even begin to imagine how nasty 50hz games with giant borders would look on an XRGB, even with RGB. It's a dead easy mod though - I did it when I was 15.
To be fair, S-Video works fine. RGB is better of course but I would be lying if I say that I noticed much of difference between RGB and S-Video on my PS1.
Because the difference was so small, I went back to S-Video. The mess caused by all the cables connected together to get a separate output audio isn't worth it IMO.
I depends on the console you are using of course. The difference is more noticeable on Super Nintendo for example.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
It's true. S-video is not perfect, as RGB is, but not bad. It's relatively free of the artifacts that make RF or composite depressing.
I'd rather swap cables or buy an RGB switcher than ever downgrade to s-video myself, though.
SNES VC on WiiU are well upscaled and look very clean.
NES on the other hand are blurry and look like shit.
If you really want a gorgeous image quality of NES games, you have 2 solutions:
- RGB mod for NES
- Use the Wii version of NES VC which is well emulated.
You'll need a Framemeister for both of them if you are using a HD TV.
The 2nd solution is easier but unfortunately you will miss many good games that weren't released on VC.
Thank you! Just the info I was looking for.
That isn't entirely true, at least for the SNES games. For example, Kirby Super Star looks a lot darker than the SNES & Wii version.
ColonelSkills
Member
Just as a PSA: viletim's NESRGB boards back in stock if you missed out on the first go around.
He's got a proper store this time and everything: http://etim.net.au/shop/shop.php
He's got a proper store this time and everything: http://etim.net.au/shop/shop.php
Just added the NESRGB mod to my NTSC NES, and god damn the picture is great, damn you Nintendo for depriving us of RGB for 28 years!!!!, the audio is also greatly improved with this mod too......
Just added the NESRGB mod to my NTSC NES, and god damn the picture is great, damn you Nintendo for depriving us of RGB for 28 years!!!!, the audio is also greatly improved with this mod too......
Just ordered an NESRGB. Got any pics of your mod work?
I'm not sure exactly what I'm going to use for an av out.
Just bit the bullet on this and the RGB cable. Is the mod hard? Hopefully I can pull it off!
IrishNinja
Member
^bapho is the dude you guys wanna talk to for the details on this mod
wait, it improves the audio as well, having it pass through the SCART cable? that'd be awesome to find out, but it's the first i'm hearing of it
wait, it improves the audio as well, having it pass through the SCART cable? that'd be awesome to find out, but it's the first i'm hearing of it
I just made up a scart lead myself, you can find the mini-din plugs on ebay and just bought some 8 core wire and scart plugs.
I just made up a scart lead myself, you can find the mini-din plugs on ebay and just bought some 8 core wire and scart plugs.
Nice work, this is going to be a fun mod.
Good idea to place the palette switch there.
Not sure I like the mini-din. Would rather have a snes style AV port. Might be kinda hard to do that and make it look nice.
Just added the NESRGB mod to my NTSC NES, and god damn the picture is great, damn you Nintendo for depriving us of RGB for 28 years!!!!, the audio is also greatly improved with this mod too......
Are you using a Framemeister or a TV with a SCART input?
Yeah I would have preferred to use a Nintendo multiout but getting hold of one is a chore and fitting it would take more work. Maybe someone will start to fabricate a run of the multiout ports and maybe a blanking cover for easy install
Framemeister
metsallica
Member
I'd like some details on the sound as well, as I wasn't aware that it did anything there either!
Shadow Hog
Member
Honestly, I'd want somebody to do the mod for me, but preferably to my personal NES rather than another one. I'm waiting for the board to become common enough that that's an option.
baphomet
Member
Not particularly. More room for adding the connections, and some have mentioned that the ppu can touch the cpu below the board. He may have corrected the adapter board which would fix that problem though.
ColonelSkills
Member
It shouldn't be that bad, according to the posts I've seen and pieces I've read, but I can't offer anything personal because I missed the board the first time around too.
Bit on it here, though.
baphomet
Member
Just take a good look at the instructions and installs and know exactly what you're going to do before you ever have the board. Its more time consuming than difficult. Make sure you have the correct tools to remove the existing ppu cleanly like lettuce above. Aside from that it's pretty easy. Removing the ppu is the most difficult part. It can be finicky.
Yeah the PPU on the first one I did was such a pain to remove, there was like 3 legs that just refused to come lose no matter how many times I used my electric solder sucker on them.....but eventually they did so just be patient and don't rush.
Defo get an electric solder sucker pump, without one your fighting a losing battle, if you do happen to snap a leg off the PPU it's not the end of the world (as long as it's not a break where you don't have any of the leg visible anymore) as you can always solder some solid core wire to the leg once the PPU is in place on the NESRGB pcb. Also never use a flat head screw driver to try and ease the PPU out from the nes mainboard you could end up going through a trace, find something plastic instead that you can wedge between the PPU and mainboard to try and ease it out once you have removed the solder from the legs of the ppu. Good luck and just take your time
Defo get an electric solder sucker pump, without one your fighting a losing battle, if you do happen to snap a leg off the PPU it's not the end of the world (as long as it's not a break where you don't have any of the leg visible anymore) as you can always solder some solid core wire to the leg once the PPU is in place on the NESRGB pcb. Also never use a flat head screw driver to try and ease the PPU out from the nes mainboard you could end up going through a trace, find something plastic instead that you can wedge between the PPU and mainboard to try and ease it out once you have removed the solder from the legs of the ppu. Good luck and just take your time
- Status