Think that's bad? I saw Trump 2016 on a couple of stop signs today.
US Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders rallies |OT|
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Think that's bad? I saw Trump 2016 on a couple of stop signs today.
Haha, sorry about that but thanks for bringing that to my attention nicely instead of being a jerk.
Yikes.
legacyzero
Banned
They keep getting BIGGER!
But... He's not a contender, right? /s
But... He's not a contender, right? /s
We need more checks.
eBay Huckster
Member
"Yellow curtains again?"
ErasureAcer
Banned
They keep getting BIGGER!
But... He's not a contender, right? /s
Only according to PoliGaf...I mean HillaryGaf.
eBay Huckster
Member
and, y'know, everyone whose professional reputation relies on their accurate forecasting of elections
(you're really doing your best to dispel the ron paul comparisons, though. good job.)
Lil B drops Hillary for Bernie. It's over guys.
legacyzero
Banned
Because Based God just called it LOL
And for srs, this momentum is pretty significant.
eBay Huckster
Member
yeah, next i'll get told sports curses are real and that ghosts exist in the long, wet fart of CNN pretending Lil B's endorsement matters at all in the Democratic primary
Avatar quotes are usually lame, but this one is perfect.
ErasureAcer
Banned
You be wrong. You'd be really wrong if the basic media(mainstream ABC, CBS, NBC) covered him at all. He gets brief mentions on those Nightly News when he just turned out 70,000(15, 28, 27k) people in 3 stops this week.
Laughing about how much Hillary wins the presidency by is mostly up to Donald Trump?
legacyzero
Banned
Hilary on #BernNotice
eBay Huckster
Member
i'd be wrong if you actually pointed out anyone mentioned in the same breath as a wang, sabato, linzer, or silver rather than linking to a video full of media pundits
and i'd be even wronger if ron paul's campaigns hadn't unfolded almost exactly like this in the last two cycles.
money bombs! huge rallies! blindly idealistic supporters!
...still down upwards of 2:1 to someone who literally isn't even campaigning yet
neogaffer1
Banned
salty much?
ErasureAcer
Banned
Yeah, it's totally the same considering that event was about two-thirds less than what Bernie turned out tonight in LA, that event was 8 months later in the election cycle(April 2012) and Paul was in his second go around(name recognition...or third attempt at Pres if you want to count that one back in the day) for President vs. Bernie's first and only needed attempt.
You failed on all accounts.
Amazing. I love the Based God's passion and commentary.
eBay Huckster
Member
salty that everyone seems to have developed another messiah complex eight years after the last one, and in spite of the fact that he turned out to have a totally realistic two terms as president rather than smiting partisanship, a complete joke of a health care system, and an economic recession from his floating fortress? probably
yeah it's totally not the same that an ideological minority within one of the major parties is working itself up into a tizzy, trying to convince themselves that a guy with approximately zero support from the biggest components of the party base has the Big Mo' because he's delivering speeches to overwhelming-majority-white audiences in large cities 6 months before any primaries. you got me.
WaffleTaco
Wants to outlaw technological innovation.
I'm hoping he comes to St. Louis.
Bernie has been in favor of equal rights for both Palestine and Israel since the 80s, and has frequently protested the Israeli government's continued settlements in spite of the direct roadblock to talks. He basically criticized the Israeli PM every time he got a question on Israel throughout the Obama presidency as far as i can remember.
I find it really sad that a lot of people have already packed it up for Bernie and declared Hillary the winner. Its a shame that's what people who claim to want change come down to in the end, name recognition.
All i know is, if Bernie's name is on the ballot come voting time, i'll vote for him. If not, i'll abstain. I just can't vote for Hillary. Maybe i'll just vote green party instead
ErasureAcer
Banned
My argument was to counter your argument of Bernie being Ron Paul but since you wanted to change the goalposts when proven wrong...that's fine.
eBay Huckster
Member
you may want to point out where this actually happens in that quote
like congratulations, you've proven he has numerically bigger white audiences. too bad you've failed to indicate what part of the core analogy - a minority of the party getting overexcited about Big Crowds such that they ignore what actual political scientists looking at the race are saying - actually does not apply to hardcore sanders supporters.
ErasureAcer
Banned
You may want to change your initial statement that Bernie Sanders is Ron Paul. And Bernie Sanders' support is equivalent to Ron Paul's support. Post #420.
neogaffer1
Banned
as if hillary would've done much different
eBay Huckster
Member
then you may want to reread that post, given that it was given a clarification edit before you even responded to it.
speaking of support levels, here's another fast fact: clinton's lead looks smaller than it actually is because pollsters are still including joe biden (whose support mainly goes to clinton when excluded) for no apparent reason
i'm not saying she wouldn't have done much different - it probably would've taken every republican candidate in 2010 simultaneously being caught with a dead girl and live boy for that to be the case - i'm saying i'm salty that seemingly the same type of people who disengaged after obama didn't immediately wave his magic wand and fix the economy are back at it again.
enthusiasm is good. blind enthusiasm (some of 2008, and apparently now some of 2016) is bad. and enthusiasm that seems to be 50% "tearing down everyone else in the primary process because they aren't as pure and perfect", like what happens literally any time hillary clinton is brought up in the general vicinity of one of these threads, is obnoxious.
And_Gignac
Member
Nationally? Perhaps. But most state wide polls where Sanders is gaining momentum do not include Biden anymore.
For instance, PPP last Iowa poll does not include Biden and yet the difference between Sanders (25%) and Clinton (52%) has gone down 22 points since April.
The trend is pretty obvious, and coming the debate the results may improve. So the enthusiasm is not grounded in delusions, I would say.
eBay Huckster
Member
now that's a fair point and i appreciate that you're actually coming at me with real data
but at the same time, i'm not sure there's an obvious trend toward an actual shot at him winning beyond Iowa/NH to begin with (partly because practically no other state's getting polled even semi-regularly, and largely because both of those states aren't particularly demographically representative of the Dem base).
not to mention this is coming with clinton refusing to actually campaign beyond sporadic policy platform releases, which i'd expect to change nearabouts the debate. she's invisible on and around the stump thus far, which can't be helping her numbers with Bernie actually traveling around and stumping, but at the same time that's not going to last forever - and we're talking about someone who came damn close to beating Candidate Obama.
i appreciate that Bernie's trending into a very strong second because practically all of this country's overton windows need a sharp shift to the left sooner rather than later, but that's basically all the trend's really showing so far.
(e: last post for the night, so i'll get to any responses later)
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
I feel like the trend doesn't really mean much because it was inevitable. The only reason Clinton and especially Biden poll as well as they do at this point is the name recognition. As Sanders gains recognition, of course he is going to poll better.
Once debates start, polls will probably start to reflect more than just "I know of that person and might vote for them."
Once debates start, polls will probably start to reflect more than just "I know of that person and might vote for them."
And_Gignac
Member
I know this is a Sanders thread but people brought Hillary into it so fuck it.
Is Hillary generally considered to be a good speaker? I was just thinking about how I couldn't remember what she sounded like when spitting from a podium so I looked up a video. I don't get it.
Is Hillary generally considered to be a good speaker? I was just thinking about how I couldn't remember what she sounded like when spitting from a podium so I looked up a video. I don't get it.
neogaffer1
Banned
i haven't sat down and watched any of her speeches but the few snippets i've heard just sound kind of disinterested and not emotional at all whereas what i've heard of bernie is always more spirited and in the moment.
My thought :30 into watching her economy speech: "oh, THIS is why I don't remember anything about Hillary from 2008."
eBay Huckster
Member
popping back in just for a minute
now that's the kind of analysis i was looking for! yeah, not saying the Bern has no chance whatsoever, just that Clinton's probably safer than certain suspects
P) are letting on.
and yeah, hopefully she doesn't underestimate this part of the base even in a runaway win, just because any extra leftward pivot's good from the dumpster fire of acceptable policy this country's been stuck in
i always thought she was considered fairly mediocre, actually - think i've seen "bland" leveled most often (and most accurately) against her speaking style
luckily, she's going to have the two best living public speakers in american politics (and elizabeth warren) as surrogates, as would Bernie if he did wind up beating the odds.
now that's the kind of analysis i was looking for! yeah, not saying the Bern has no chance whatsoever, just that Clinton's probably safer than certain suspects
P) are letting on. and yeah, hopefully she doesn't underestimate this part of the base even in a runaway win, just because any extra leftward pivot's good from the dumpster fire of acceptable policy this country's been stuck in
i always thought she was considered fairly mediocre, actually - think i've seen "bland" leveled most often (and most accurately) against her speaking style
luckily, she's going to have the two best living public speakers in american politics (and elizabeth warren) as surrogates, as would Bernie if he did wind up beating the odds.
Big Green Anus
Member
She's not and would be wise for her to have Bill help her since he has a lot of charm and charisma, which she greatly lacks.
Feel the Bern
i feel like sanders is the president america needs (and deserves), but not the one it will get. just pulling hillary left would be good though, especially if it helps frame the overall election in 2016 over values the left cares about like race, equality, and opportunity. even if he wins the nomination, i have a really hard time seeing him not getting blown the fuck out by a republican with billions of dollars backing them. and the optics of 74 year-old (75 year-old next year) bernie sanders up against a mid-40s slimeball like scott walker or marco rubio probably wouldn't be that positive. plus, if age was an issue regarding john mccain, i can't see how it wouldn't be with sanders.
Age wasn't really a issue with McCain, it was more the factors of that election made people pause because of his age.
McCain the old, white, frumpy republican vs young (relative), charismatic African American in a year where the republicans were coming off of the worst or second worst (second only to arguably nixon) presidency since the maybe the civil war. People wanted change, and McCain's look and age vs Obama just reflected the status quo.
Also, after Palin showed up the DNC started spinning hard the "well, what if he dies?" line and a lot of people just were probably scared fucking shitless of that person being one heartbeat away from having the finger on the red button.
I doubt Berny's age becomes a problem because the "old, frumpy white dude" line doesn't really carry any (or enough) weight to swing left voters to a party that has come to define the old white dude's party, regardless of who they put up there.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
Yeah, I think Bernie could alleviate most age concerns with a solid VP pick. I don't know who that would be though. Ideally you'd want someone ideologically similar, but most prominent young democrats seem to be considerably to the right of Bernie.
shadowsdarknes
Member
No he's not going to win over the hardcore libertarians who use words that are supposed to be insults but aren't such as statist.
But that's not your average libertarian. The average libertarian wants to cut down on the military, be able to legally smoke weed, and not have a candidate blatently working for the interests of a big political party.
Bernie absolutely has cross support. Because he has earned their respect due to his record.
But if you're one of those dweebs on the internet who uses the word statist as an insult, then yeah, you're already balls deep in Praxeological bullshit.
WeAreStarStuff
Member
Has my vote.
I think given this weekend, a trip to Ferguson would be risky but necessary. To win, Bernie's going to have to take a bunch of risks and have them all pay out. He's still a longshot, but Hillary has to be sunk before she can lose in the general
for VP Jim Webb or Claire McCaskill I think would be solid choices for Bernie. If Kay Hagan had won I'd say she would be a solid pick (VA/NC would be a must for Bernie in a general)
I know folks are worried about the minority vote- but what swing states would a lower black turnout hurt Bernie in the most, and would he be helped by a larger percentage of the white vote (Bernie WILL do better among whites than Obama, and probably Hillary)
Elizabeth Warren? Or could we not handle that unified ticket?
Pardon my language, but fuck her. She tried to bury him a few weeks ago by calling him "extreme" in his positions. She's totally on the Hillary camp.
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