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[SneakyStephan]

To be fair I don't expect the image quality of that beyond bullshot in the final game (look at the hair and the eyebrows, they are defined and sharp, looks like 4xmsaa or some downsampling to me).
edit: lol the source of that picture is a 5100x2100 resolution screencap? haha no wonder.
Image quality is always a big part of graphics.

Also samaritan didn't impress a lot of people because it still has that ue3 look to it (ugh).

Despite the Dof being really expensive and the hair being impressive (something that ue3 chokes on) and it running with 4xmsaa (unreal engine and msaa is not a good match if you want any performance) and the reflections being realtime (which you'll probably only notice if you are playing it yourself and would otherwise break the illusion) it's still ue3...
It still looks like an ue3 game, just a fancy one with unusually good image quality for unreal engine 3.

That tech demo was the very defninition of poor design and tacked on effects.
They added a bunch of extremely expensive effects (bokeh, msaa etc that I mentioned above) to an engine that is not even remotely equipped to deal with them and a detailed char model to an otherwise unappealing and really limited scene.

Typical epic, they don't have any talented artists or designers to back up their engines.

Look at the agnis demo, that didn't require 3 gtx 580s to run (and it also ran at 60 fps , with 8x msaa) but since the art was there to back up the tech it looks amazing.
And more importantly it does easily look a generation and a half ahead of anything on xbox/ps3 including beyond two souls...

 

[LCfiner]

I don't know, man.. With this specs, it sure feels like MS will bet on upscale and public ignorance to market "1080p games".

eehhh... can't agree here. When it comes to graphics, it's easier to show pictures and video to prove how good looking your game is than to use marketing copy of "1080p games". I feel like the console CoD games showed that no one gives a crap about native res except a tiny minority - who are already skipping console versions and buying games on PC.

that said, I agree with lots of other posts on here that the main selling points that will be pushed to mainstream crowds won't be graphics but will be entertainment services and stuff like Kinect.

but for the titles that publishers will push for graphics, video of pretty effects will win out over text describing the native res.

 

[Shadow of the BEAST]

This level of "in game" character modeling is what I'm hoping for next gen. No more low fidelity models for game play and hi detailed models for the ut scenes.

you are not going to get it.

Just as silent hill 3 esque models did not happen this gen.

its a combination of talent, art and tech.

Most modellers simply aren't as talented.

 

[Baconsammy]

And thats why I think Watchdogs looks currentgen, the character models suck for a supposedly nextgen game

I think they look great. Shrug. What do people think of Sleeping Dogs on PC with the high rez pack? Personally if next gen consoles look like that, and run like that, it's a big upgrade. Maybe I have a low bar.

 

[EvB]

People are badly underrating what the next gen systems will be able to do. On a mobility ATI 2600 with 512mb gddr3 and a 1.9ghz C2D with a 600mhz FSB I can run Overgrowth, a game that has a lot of features that you will see in the PS4/XB3, at 720p no problem. On this same laptop I can run unity and get my sucky procedural animation script running well.

Jeez I hope the next gen doesn't look like the offcuts from a late 90s flight sim.

 

[Reiko]

you are not going to get it.

Just as silent hill 3 esque models did not happen this gen.

its a combination of talent, art and tech.

Most modellers simply aren't as talented.

Yo Silent Hill 3...

Meet Resident Evil 5.

 

[TGO]

They really do:

Not sure if serious?

The DOF in that Beyond 2 Souls shot has a strange effect, as if the entire screen has a 2D blur filter applied over everything except the Ellen Page model is cut out and not perfectly. You can see a bit of the background around the edge of her shoulder. Is that a low cost technique for DOF?

I just grab it from google

That's like saying since Silent Hill 3 models hold up well it's comparable to this gen's graphics.

good point, but SH3 is SH3 lol

 

[charsace]

I've said it before and I'll say it again; most people only care about how the character models look. Once models are 25000+ poly and have 2048 res textures most people won't be able to see a difference.

 

[Eideka]

I think they look great. Shrug. What do people think of Sleeping Dogs on PC with the high rez pack? Personally if next gen consoles look like that, and run like that, it's a big upgrade. Maybe I have a low bar.

Sleeping Dogs looks superb on PC but it's nowhere near the level of visual fidelity I expect from the first wave of next-gen games.

I may be insane but I genuinely think SW1313, WD and Crysis 3 PC are the baseline of next-gen graphics.

 

[dbztrk]

The rumored spec have turned out to pretty much be true and I am not impressed.

 

[UrbanRats]

And thats why I think Watchdogs looks currentgen, the character models suck for a supposedly nextgen game

For a crossgen open world game, that's supposedly coming out at launch, it looks good.
Characters' models can't be your only metric, the game looks absolutely not current gen.

 

[EvB]

And thats why I think Watchdogs looks currentgen, the character models suck for a supposedly nextgen game

I actually think that is a better example of an actual running game, you may say it looks worse than Star Wars 1313, but it appears to be open world.

It still looks like a cut above Saints Row or Assassin's Creed

 

[shinobi602]

And thats why I think Watchdogs looks currentgen, the character models suck for a supposedly nextgen game

It's an open world multiplat.

 

[alexandros]

Has it bothered the majority of console owners this gen that much?

Judging by the huge drop in sales in the last years, apparently so.

We're still going to see extremely high fidelity games from these consoles.

I guess it depends on your definition of extremely high fidelity.

 

[derFeef]

What, the Asian character in Watch Dogs looked fantastic. Plus the fidelity of everything is the first indicator that this can not run on current consoles.

 

[UrbanRats]

Where's Dennis when you need him?

 

[Clay Davis]

Every major 3rd party/middleware manufacturer gets to give their two cents to the hardware manufacturers, it doesn't mean they'll listen.

I'd imagine Epic had told Sony that the PS3's design would make UE3 problematic but that didn't stop Sony from going with their esoteric design.

If MS is committed to their business model it doesn't matter how much Epic complains, the business model will remain the same. Some concessions were likely made (maybe that's why we have 8GB of DDR3 instead of 4GB), but they aren't going to scrap the whole thing and change focus if they don't believe in it.

you're probably right, I just find it strange is all. they listened to them in the past, so to ignore or not follow their advice, after it worked out so well last time seems...strange.

They realize that its not feasible. These consoles are likely being produced at 28nm and at least for the foreseeable future 22nm and below seem to cost more due to yield problems. So releasing a 600 dollar money losing behemoth would be terrible business since it would be that price for 6-7 years.

I know little about this, if that's the reason, I suppose it's fair enough.

Do we know that they didn't (and failed)? Maybe Microsoft scanned the landscape, saw one development house after another crashing and burning, saw Wii and Kinect succeed, and decided the focus shouldn't be on expensive games because expensive huge games are dinosaurs. So here's a box with access to tons of services and will also play games in an attractive way. And oh yeah, don't forget to buy an XBL subscription. It's possible that what we believed to be two new next gen consoles similar in power and scope may turn out to be false. Perhaps Microsoft and Sony really are diverging.

good points, but kinect, while helping microsoft surely can't still be selling enough for them to think it would make their new console more appealing. it's essentially like wii fit. people already have one, they'll see no reason to buy it again.

Top brass has changed a bit in 5 years.

this is a very good point. I hope it's not to the detriment of the whole division.

 

[statham]

Where's Dennis when you need him?

who needs him?

 

[TGO]

It's an open world multiplat.

I'm still expecting a little bit more, not Ellen Page more but better

 

[Ashes]

I think they look great. Shrug. What do people think of Sleeping Dogs on PC with the high rez pack? Personally if next gen consoles look like that, and run like that, it's a big upgrade. Maybe I have a low bar.

Until we get software on final hardware, we're gonna speculate and that speculation leads me to think we will have UC3 with 10x computational power upgrade. And the same with Beyond. God of war.

And if you think x360 is on a similar plane to those efforts, you will also be happy-to-amazed with x3, as it will be in the same ballpark.

Hopefully, loading times are reduced eh?

And we get more 1080p games.

 

[TGO]

For a crossgen open world game, that's supposedly coming out at launch, it looks good.
Characters' models can't be your only metric, the game looks absolutely not current gen.

launch? day 1?
ok fair enough

 

[UrbanRats]

who needs him?

I need him to post his Watch Dogs gifs.

launch? day 1?
ok fair enough

We obviously don't know yet, but:
1) we know it's cross gen, so it'll probably be launch window.
2) It was supposed to come out in 2013.
3) Ubisoft is usually the publisher flooding the launch of new consoles.

 

[shinobi602]

I'm still expecting a little bit more, not Ellen Page more but better

And also most likely a launch game.

 

[iMax]

And thats why I think Watchdogs looks currentgen, the character models suck for a supposedly nextgen game

They really do:

.

 

[Honey Bunny]

Sorry I can't talk about that, in fact, this is my last comment in one of this threads (i mean consolewars, specs, etc, I will participate in gaf in the rest of the forums).

You cannot simply re-iterate what you've said on this topic on this forum previously?

 

[googleplex]

you are not going to get it.

Just as silent hill 3 esque models did not happen this gen.

its a combination of talent, art and tech.

Most modellers simply aren't as talented.

I would put The Last Of Us "in-game" character models against silent Hill 3 cut scene models any day of the week.

 

[Baconsammy]

good points, but kinect, while helping microsoft surely can't still be selling enough for them to think it would make their new console more appealing. it's essentially like wii fit. people already have one, they'll see no reason to buy it again.

But we need to remember that they're not making their decisions during the timeframe of the Kinect/Wii flameout. The decision for what their box was to become was probably made years ago. I have no idea, obviously. Just speculating. The 360 was supposedly weak as well, and look what they managed to do almost exclusive off of the strength of XBL and two or three retail exclusives (and an army of XBLA titles).

Until we get software on final hardware, we're gonna speculate and that speculation leads me to think we will have UC3 with 10x computational power upgrade. And the same with Beyond. God of war.

And if you think x360 is on a similar plane to those efforts, you will also be happy-to-amazed with x3, as it will be in the same ballpark.

Hopefully, loading times are reduced eh?

And we get more 1080p games.

Admittedly I have a low bar(World of Warcraft still looks good to me). All I really want are consistent framerates and no tearing.

 

[TGO]

And also most likely a launch game.

ok, the environments looked great I take it it was New York, it just the character models, especially the npcs

 

[Casanova]

Layman's terms please?

How does this compare to an up-to-date gaming PC capable of running Ultra settings?

Acceptable pricetag, based on computational power only?

Does the "8 times more powerful than current gen" rumor comply with these specs?

 

[TGO]

.

Thats what I mean, if it is nextgen that the type of nextgen it is lol

 

[phosphor112]

Do we have a triangle rate figure for Orbis yet?

- 1.6 billion triangles/s, 1.6 billion vertices/s. Same on both.

 

[Drek]

you're probably right, I just find it strange is all. they listened to them in the past, so to ignore or not follow their advice, after it worked out so well last time seems...strange.

Different people in charge, different target demographic, and different priorities being dictated from MS' core leadership.

Sony did the same thing to start last generation, prioritizing blu-ray over games and price point.

 

[Zeppelin]

So, the specs are shit compared to Sony's? Doesn't surprise me. We've seen MS heading down this route for some years now. It's been nice knowing you, Microsoft.

 

[gazele]

And also most likely a launch game.

Beyond being a PS4 launch game really does make a lot of sense

 

[Shadow of the BEAST]

I would put The Last Of Us "in-game" character models against silent Hill 3 cut scene models any day of the week.

i would too.

but the last of us. Is as representable of current gen characters as silent hill 3 was of last gen.

both are in top 5% of their generation.

Pick 10 random games from this gen, and i bet 8 of them will have worse character models than silent hill 3.

 

[Paradicia]

If this was to equate into a gpu on the present market what would it be close to in terms of power? From all this talk lately it seems Orbis will wipe the floor with Durango.

 

[UrbanRats]

ok, the environments looked great I take it it was New York, it just the character models, especially the npcs

Chicago, AFAIK.

 

[SneakyStephan]

If this was to equate into a gpu on the present market what would it be close to in terms of power? From all this talk lately it seems Orbis will wipe the floor with Durango.

It's been asked a few times before in this thread
~hd 7770 (in pc land a hd7770 = ~ hd6850 = ~hd5850 =~gtx 285 in benchmarks ; 6850 and 5850 will perform better at high resolutions as they have way better memory bandwidth than 7770, just listing as many as I can as a lot of people will have owned one of these in the past 4 years for reference)

 

[Glorified G]

If they've never seen a PC for the past four years, sure.

If you believe next gen are going to be hi res 360 games, I've got a bridge to sell you.

 

[Voice of Reason]

So this is concretely true right? No possibility for a drastic change up until reveal?

 

[alexandros]

Layman's terms please?

How does this compare to an up-to-date gaming PC capable of running Ultra settings?

GPU-wise, Durango is equivalent to a mid-range PC graphics card from two years ago. Now, obviously said card will perform somewhat better in a closed console environment, but don't expect miracles.

 

[Ashes]

good points, but kinect, while helping microsoft surely can't still be selling enough for them to think it would make their new console more appealing. it's essentially like wii fit. people already have one, they'll see no reason to buy it again.



.

Honestly, the core development team is targeting the best possible spec for a given price point, ($299); but I reckon, by giving in to devs demands for more ram, they cut back on other areas. By devs I don't mean third party alone, I mean the tests Microsoft did themselves to see where bottlenecks lie.

I do recall crytek once claiming that ram was always less favoured when it came to designing a console. This was in relation to next gen consoles and I think, not such a subtle hit at ps4.

Arguably, maybe, it is avs simple as marketability, and it is easier to explain hard drive sizes and ram sizes than bandwidth...

I reckon also, that that Samaritans demo was a render target for x3.

But we do live in a post kz2 e3. Do we not?

 

[alexandros]

If you believe next gen are going to be hi res 360 games, I've got a bridge to sell you.

That's not what I'm saying. These consoles (especially Durango) will be weaker than a mid-range gaming PC by the time they are released.

 

[Represent.]

ok, the environments looked great I take it it was New York, it just the character models, especially the npcs

the character models looks great.

 

[MikeE21286]

It's been asked a few times before in this thread
~hd 7770 (in pc land a hd7770 = ~ hd6850 = ~hd5850 =~gtx 285 in benchmarks ; 6850 and 5850 will perform better at high resolutions as they have way better memory bandwidth than 7770, just listing as many as I can as a lot of people will have owned one of these in the past 4 years for reference)

I'm no tech expert by any means but that seems disastrously underpowered for my tastes.

 

[alexandros]

So is it fair to say at this point that the wizard is suffering from erectile dysfunction?

 

[charsace]

Jeez I hope the next gen doesn't look like the offcuts from a late 90s flight sim.

The game has a great procedural animation system, great physics, great AI and open world environments. Graphics aren't everything. And stills do a terrible job of showing what a game does.

Character models don't prove shit. I've seen some models that are 14,000 tri's and then smash the fuck out anything you will see in a game that has 20,000+ tri models.

 

[Reiko]

the character models looks great.

GOW: A and Beyond do not compare to this at all.

 

[derFeef]

So is it fair to say at this point that the wizard is suffering from erectile dysfunction?

I think the only safe thing to say is that people make dumb jokes about that.

 

[FordGTGuy]

but they're the same people that released the Kin and Vista.

You know you could pick any company and we can pick out their worse failures if that makes you feel better....

So is it fair to say at this point that the wizard is suffering from erectile dysfunction?

Someone broke his wand.