RetroGamingUK
Member
Define "pull it off"
If you mean everything works exactly the same as Rog Ally X with the addition of running BC Xbox games, then yes.
If you expect more than that, then no.
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WC/Jez: Microsoft's ambitious new Xbox: Your entire Xbox console library, the full power of Windows PC gaming, and no multiplayer paywall
- Thread starter RetroGamingUK
- Start date
Define "pull it off"
If you mean everything works exactly the same as Rog Ally X with the addition of running BC Xbox games, then yes.
If you expect more than that, then no.
GHG
Member
At this point you're just saying shit for the hell of it without realising you're making yourself look foolish.
There is only one PC store that is significantly different to the rest, I'll leave it to you to figure out which one that is.
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Odinnii
Member
RetroGamingUK
Member
Ellis
Member
Let's be realistic. There's probably 20 million Series consoles out there. 33+ is honestly laughable. Just can't see that being the case. A lot of them users probably also have a PS5 at this point.
GTA6 will be massive, and sell decent everywhere, but with Sony having the marketing, the healthy userbase, and the hardware out there, the majority of sales will be on PS.
Major Insano
Member
This is a major reason why >90% of hackers are on PC though, because it costs next to nothing. You can buy 100 steam accounts for $25..
Too many MP games on PC and console cross-play are ruined because of this.
I don't mind paying a premium for a 'walled garden'.
Also rather that than bloated, power hungry anti-cheat software.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I do enjoy how you talk like you have any knowledge of what is going on here, dude. Unless you do?
What I meant by pulling it off is creating a seamless console / PC hybrid. Where it works just like a console for those that want that and a PC for those that want to dive deeper. What I mean for that to work is that games would need to ship in the console dev environment. If one title is released natively in this thing. EG not like you have said and NOT just like the ROG Ally that makes everything a lot different.
Do you 100% know that this thing is JUST going to run PC store versions of games? I mean new games. not existing ones.
If one title releases and its delivered and running a different version to the PC store version then that throws your entire suggestion out of the window. Is this what you are saying is not going to happen, with certainty?
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Lets just say, hyper thetically that the Xbox version performs better than the PS5 version. Now true next gen games are releasing we are seeing the Series X version perform better than the PS5 on a regular basis. If someone wants the best running version of the game and that is on Xbox, why would they buy the PS5 version?
We are talking about enthusiasts like ourselves that own multiple consoles and probably watch Digital Foundry.
RetroGamingUK
Member
It'll run all Win32 games as per ROG Ally X and every other Windows PC
Next gen games will be Win32
Xbox ERA is being phased out.
Is Xbox getting Steam integration?!
Microsoft just "leaked" an Xbox interface mock up which has Steam game integration.
www.windowscentral.com
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Ellis
Member
At that point, the Pro exists, and the difference in price between that and SX is not very large. It should be, but it isn't. MS fucked up in that area.
They'll go where their friends are. They'll go to the platform people are still talking about in somewhat good spirits.
The one that will have its brand plastered all over the billboards and TV/online ads.
The number of "gamers" that watch things like DF and frequent forums like GAF are such a small minority. Most people have no idea about the crap will all talk about here daily.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
You literally said, people who own both and not those looking to buy a new console. I have 0 idea why ANYONE would buy an Xbox right now. We are not talking about new buyers.
I am saying, an enthusiast owns both consoles. A standard PS5 and a series x. The standard version runs at a higher res and better framerate on the Series X. Why would anyone with a braincell buy the PS5 version if the game is cross play enabled and runs better on Xbox.
This is a hypothetical and is in response to your original comment, not this new one.
RetroGamingUK
Member
Makes sense.
If a Windows PC contains the BC silicon and boots into the fullscreen "Xbox experience" by default then likely they'll be allowed to use the Xbox brand.
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Ellis
Member
My bad. That's true, but again, most people will not be aware of a few FPS difference between the platforms.
There are plenty of reasons to choose one version over the other. Like when I chose to buy a game on Steam rather than play the GP version because the MS store/app is so shit.
Mister Wolf
Member
I think I'll gladly continue "limiting" myself if the only option is a Windows store key for certain games.
Also, I don't know who you're trying to kid by saying windows full screen experience is in par with SteamOS, but you do you.
I click the button, it starts the game. You guys pretend like it's more complicated then that.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Oh, absolutely. I was just making a counter point. If someone owns both the Xbox and PS they are obviously open to Microsofts platform so why wouldnt they choose the best place to play it?
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
One thing I want to understand is.
Do we trust and believe Jez Cordon on this forum or not?
Seems to be completely dependent on what news he is delivering.
Do we trust and believe Jez Cordon on this forum or not?
Seems to be completely dependent on what news he is delivering.
RetroGamingUK
Member
Yes, because they'll make profit on hardware sales regardless, unlike their old console approach.
Sales on PlayStation will more than make up for this too.
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RetroGamingUK
Member
Many other sources have been saying the same for over a year now.
Team Andromeda
Member
I think the guy unstable since Brexit. One day Xbox is the best and the future and next day Xbox is dead.
RetroGamingUK
Member
The confusion here is the "Xbox" branding.
Xbox in terms of games publisher = bright future (look at CoD, Minecraft and Forza Horizon sales across all platforms)
Xbox in terms of PC hardware, Gamepass and PC store = they'll exist and do OK
Xbox in terms of traditional consoles = dead (like the Tories and soon, Labour)
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Jaguar Victory
Member
Jesus Christ some of you sound miserable. Go play PlayStation. I'm looking forward to the multibox. Console experience with the option to play my PC games too. Keep all my decades of game library between console & PC.
Team Andromeda
Member
Whatever...
RetroGamingUK
Member
Accept reality
Baemono
Member
You know what we say about a broken watch
RetroGamingUK
Member
Jez is simply a mouthpiece.
He said "don't expect Xbox games on PS5" because that's what MS told him.
He's likely saying all this because it's what MS told him.
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Unfortunatecookie
Member
I wish him well. He's in for a rough reality if everything he wrote in his article turns out to be true. Reeeeeeally rough reality.
Ar¢tos
Member
Even if there are 30m, let's not forget how many of them are purely Gamepass machines (no "free" GTA6 there), how many are shelved collecting dust and how many are no longer operational (yes, I'm sure there are many shelved and dead ps5 too, but the install base difference is massive).
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
Ok, knock 25% off your estimate and say there's 15 million series consoles out there.
That's enough potential customers to warrant the port even if a single digit percentage of players buy it.
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Linux is only popular on the internet. Who is everybody?
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
It'll run all Win32 games as per ROG Ally X and every other Windows PC
Next gen games will be Win32
Xbox ERA is being phased out.
Is Xbox getting Steam integration?!
Microsoft just "leaked" an Xbox interface mock up which has Steam game integration.
What are your thoughts on this post, out of interest? does that change your opinion of how this COULD be handled?
OK, so atleast we have a starting point of discussion unlike that other guy with his weird wrapper.
So you agree, Xbox PC games will still be built using the GDK, correct? Using the Xbox backend for multiplayer, Cloud saves, achievements etc.
Btw, an Xbox SDK for Windows SDK doesn't exist. There is only the GDK, GDKX extensions for windows based, and Xbox Live SDK extension for the Android GDK and iOS SDK.
Steam/Epic games are built using the Windows SDK, alongside a secondary Store SDK for their respective store backends, aka Epic Online Services and Steamworks. There's no such thing for the Xbox Live backend in conjuction with the Windows SDK, it doesn't exist. Probably used to, long ago for GFWL. But they went straight from WinRT/UWP to GDK for PC, and from XDK to GDKX on consoles.
Another thing is, MS will NEVER release unpackaged games on MS Store, for the Xbox ecosystem and especially Gamepass PC Catalog. They are always MSIXVC packaged and those packages are signed and notarized for Windows OS. Otherwise it would be too easy to pirate and run gamepass games on Linux, like what happens with stuff on Battle.net.
GitHub - microsoft/GDK: Microsoft Public GDK
Microsoft Public GDK. Contribute to microsoft/GDK development by creating an account on GitHub.github.com
Anyways, the GDK is updated twice a year. Any changes to MS game development would be posted there.
https://github.com/microsoft/GDK/releases/tag/April-2025-Update-3-v2504.3.4084
Game Development Kit (GDK) documentation - Microsoft Game Development Kit
Instruction on using the Game Development Kit (GDK)learn.microsoft.com
There is the PC and Handheld Game Development documentation, and there is the Console game development documentation.
PC and Handheld Xbox PC games are together because those games are designed to scale to various hardware. GDK games scale to hundreds of configurations. Console game dev requires the GDKX, in order to optimize those same GDK created games to fixed spec hardware. You don't release fixed spec hardware unless you intend to optimize games for it. That's the entire point of the AMD partnership.
Otherwise MS could simply release any PC hardware with high end Nvidia hardware at various tiers. There will be Xbox Consoles, and there will be Xbox PCs, two separate form factors with differentiation. That differentiation is optimized games AND controller based input designed for the large screen TV experience with multimedia functionality.
Yes, there WILL be Convergence but you can't simply call the Console a PC because there will still be Console SKUs of games. A Console SKU is simply the GDKX optimized version of a GDK created Xbox PC game to whichever fixed spec hardware. EA, Ubisoft, Rockstar all already create GDK SKUs of their console games, they simply don't release them on PC for strategic reasons aka Money.
So PC, Laptops, Handhelds require GDK SKUs, and Consoles, Cloud requires optimized GDKX versions. There is no either or, if a dev wants to create for the Xbox ecosystem, they have to do the GDKX build.
What MS is trying to do with the portfolio of devices using AMD chips like Magnus is two things. Convergence means completing, bringing together the two form factors without destroying either.
Xbox and AMD: Advancing the Next Generation of Gaming Together - Xbox Wire
This week, Xbox announced it is actively building its next-generation lineup across console, handheld, PC, cloud, and accessories. Find out more inside.news.xbox.com
They want to bring Windows SDK games from third party PC stores to Consoles. AND they want to bring GDKX optimized (aka Console) games to Xbox PCs that run on Magnus. That means Magnus will have Forwards Compatibility with whatever the Console is running. No additional work for devs, but the devs still create GDKX optimized versions that could run on Xbox Consoles, Xbox Cloud, Xbox PCs.
Team Andromeda
Member
Mister Wolf
Member
I think that will depend on if their current desktop is weaker than this and they were considering an upgrade. Most people including in here do not have a 5070TI/5080 level GPU in their PC. Or a high end CPU.
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crazyriddler
Member
I know that here it's fashionable to hate Xbox (and rightly so, tbh), but this concept is something I've been waiting for for years and, if done right, could be great. A PC designed as closed hardware in console format, with a UI adapted for controllers and games optimized for it with a specific preset, compatible with previous generation console games.
Multiple stores including Steam, free online and mods, and the entire PC catalog, emulators... It's basically taking the best of PC and console and putting it into a single device.
Multiple stores including Steam, free online and mods, and the entire PC catalog, emulators... It's basically taking the best of PC and console and putting it into a single device.
Markio128
Member
I haven't been a PC gamer for many years, but when I was, I'd be more inclined to upgrade the unit I had rather than replace it with another.
Edit: And likely those who don't have such a high level PC don't because of the cost? Not sure how this Xbox PC will help with that aspect.
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
It will run it not because it's a "console hybrid" but because GTA 6 will release on Xbox Series X and will play on this device due to BC.
The question everyone should be asking is: once this device is launched and games are not releasing on Series X|S anymore, will the released versions of the game be PC versions or will this device receive dedicated console versions? In other words, will GTA 7 be playable on this device if it does not release on PC?
Ar¢tos
Member
Except, it's not upgradeable, it's tied to whatever features MS allows/enables on it, meaning in the future they can also remove/change things if it suits them (steam getting too popular and stealing money from Windows Store? No problem! We'll just move it behind a paywall!, etc)
If you want a pc, it's always better to get a pc than "closed/semi-closed" pc hybrid .
jm89
Member
Bro done with reality. Now wants to create hypotheticals to make him self feel better.
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Mister Wolf
Member
How much of the populace that games on PC do you believe are competent enough to do that? Or even opened the case of their computer. Give me a percentage.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
If they do a good job, this PC will play all of my legacy Xbox purchases, protecting my catalogue and allow me to load my entire steam library. For someone who has invested in the Xbox Platform it seems like the best thing.
The problem is, MS has handled the xbox business so terribly this gen, they have to work out how they incentivise and generate trust for this next box and the eco system. That is going to be the hardest sell.
The series X is a great console, it is now beating standard PS5 in most new game releases and even trades blows with the PS5 pro on performance in UE5 games. So, making awesome hardware is not unusual for MS. the problem is everything else.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Bro done with reality. Now wants to create hypotheticals to make him self feel better.
Hypotheticals based on current reality. Go watch any UE5 digital foundry for this year. Xbox is handily performing better in current gen games than PS5. So, it is not a hypothetical that is out of the realm of possibility
Astray
Member
Repair shops exist for this kind of work.
YouTube tutorials also exist in massive abundance.
crazyriddler
Member
I doubt that can be done legally, though. As for not being able to upgrade it, that's precisely the "advantage" of closed hardware. You can't upgrade laptops or handhelds either.
This device would not be intended to replace PCs, but rather to provide a curated console experience with many of the advantages of PCs, designed to be used only with a controller from the TV.
MisterXDTV
Member
I mean it's obvious no dev in gonna make a dedicated version of games for a PC
Xbox SDK is gone once devs stop releasing games for Series consoles
And that's happening as soon as they can leave those dead consoles behind
So when this PC and PS6 releases
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Ar¢tos
Member
The only advantage I see in it being closed hardware is the possibility of installing SteamOS on it and getting rid of Windows. Being closed hardware and AMD means Valve can easily making a SteamOS version for it.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
I will admit when talking to people they would always talk about the console and the Xbox PCs as being 2 separate entities and even when Xbox and AMD made their video they talked about consoles and PCs
I guess their PR speak even in private circles was just a PC all along and yes I know people here have repeated that for a long time that all signs pointed that way
Just talking to people privately and the talk coming from people like Jez doesn't line up but I guess I will admit defeat on this one, maybe
