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[elrechazado]

Love that Q&A.

Here's another quote from the Something Awful forum megapost from earlier in this thread:



Really, the more I look, the more I realize that there really isn't any compelling evidence to support calories in/calories out. It's truly mystifying to me why this concept dominates modern nutrition and diet

Spoiler

mis

information. I guess people really do just like a simple answer, whether it's the truth or not.

It survives because it "just makes sense", and we are culturally attuned to think "people who are gluttons are fat".

 

[ipukespiders]

The fatter people are, the more concerned they are about my "sudden weight loss".
"I may have lost the fat, but it looks like you found it!" - no I don't say that.

I think I want to print out that SA calorie quote and put it on index cards or something (do people still use index cards? LOL).

Here, read this
*hand them card*
walk away whistling

 

[Etrian Oddity]

I do see a glare in the carbs = fat argument though, even though I myself follow the low-carb diet.

The traditional Japanese diet consists of about 6 cups of white, glutinous rice every day. That's 250 grams of carbohydrates every day just from rice alone. And yet, the Japanese are historically one of the healthiest, slimmest (barring sumo), longest-lived ethnic groups on the planet. It wasn't until the introduction of fast food that they began to see a true rise in body mass.

Can this be used as a legitimate counter to the anti-carbohydrate argument???

 

[ch0mp]

I do see a glare in the carbs = fat argument though, even though I myself follow the low-carb diet.

The traditional Japanese diet consists of about 6 cups of white, glutinous rice every day. That's 250 grams of carbohydrates every day just from rice alone. And yet, the Japanese are historically one of the healthiest, slimmest (barring sumo), longest-lived ethnic groups on the planet. It wasn't until the introduction of fast food that they began to see a true rise in body mass.

Can this be used as a legitimate counter to the anti-carbohydrate argument???

There's more than just macros when you're talking about rice and fish vs mcdonalds. Fast food is generally high carb (drinks, fries etc) and high fat (burgers, fried foods) though. Which is possibly the worst combination.

 

[elrechazado]

I do see a glare in the carbs = fat argument though, even though I myself follow the low-carb diet.

The traditional Japanese diet consists of about 6 cups of white, glutinous rice every day. That's 250 grams of carbohydrates every day just from rice alone. And yet, the Japanese are historically one of the healthiest, slimmest (barring sumo), longest-lived ethnic groups on the planet. It wasn't until the introduction of fast food that they began to see a true rise in body mass.

Can this be used as a legitimate counter to the anti-carbohydrate argument???

250 grams of carbs is nothing compared to what obese populations eat daily. And japanese consume something like 1/3 the sugar that americans do.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I do see a glare in the carbs = fat argument though, even though I myself follow the low-carb diet.

The traditional Japanese diet consists of about 6 cups of white, glutinous rice every day. That's 250 grams of carbohydrates every day just from rice alone. And yet, the Japanese are historically one of the healthiest, slimmest (barring sumo), longest-lived ethnic groups on the planet. It wasn't until the introduction of fast food that they began to see a true rise in body mass.

Can this be used as a legitimate counter to the anti-carbohydrate argument???

No, it can't be used as a counter. I found this on reddit with a quick search. The quoted passage is from Gary Taubes's book "Why We Get Fat and What We Can Do About It".

Just because there are people who stay skinny on a diet that is relatively high in carbohydrates, does not mean that reducing carbohydrates will not help people who are overweight.

Also, you say "glutinous rice" as if it's a bad thing. All you're saying is that the rice is sticky. Rice does not contain gluten; wheat does. If you're going to have carbs, rice is certainly better for you than bread.

 

[teh_pwn]

I do see a glare in the carbs = fat argument though, even though I myself follow the low-carb diet.

The traditional Japanese diet consists of about 6 cups of white, glutinous rice every day. That's 250 grams of carbohydrates every day just from rice alone. And yet, the Japanese are historically one of the healthiest, slimmest (barring sumo), longest-lived ethnic groups on the planet. It wasn't until the introduction of fast food that they began to see a true rise in body mass.

Can this be used as a legitimate counter to the anti-carbohydrate argument???

I think it is a bit more complicated than carbohydrates, but that a low carb approach is so close to ideal that I don't bother talking about it too much.

I think the problem is more:
1. Fasting blood glucose levels - a measure of how well the body handles carbohydrates and burns it with lean tissue. Ie, if you are the opposite of being diabetic, rice and potatoes aren't going to hurt you much because your body will efficiently store the glucose in fat and lean tissue and then switch over the burning free fatty acids in the blood. Insulin levels quickly go down allowing fat metabolism to happen. If you are diabetic, which obese people tend to be, this process is in disorder and insulin isn't received well by lean tissue and glucose hangs around longer in the blood preventing fat metabolism.

2. Food reward. However mashed potatoes, chips, sugar, etc are all strong markers for food reward and low carb hits this.


Specifically the Japanese tend to have good insulin sensitivity because their carb staple is rice. Sugar (fructose) seems to be one of the causes of insulin resistance, and the Japanese eat virtually no sugar. So without the diabetes, rice is harmless. With diabetes, rice is toxic.

 

[Etrian Oddity]

Gyah, I forgot about their lack of sugary stuff in their diets. Good on yall for clearing that up for me.

Anyway, I have bronchitis, so I have to wait several days before getting back into the workout regimen. I hate getting sick because it makes me intensely crave comfort food since I'm, well, in discomfort.

 

[Akim]

K guys I think I survived work. I had a piece of roast beef rolled up with shredded cheese and ground beef. The problem is, I have no idea how many calories that was.

 

[AceBandage]

K guys I think I survived work. I had a piece of roast beef rolled up with shredded cheese and ground beef. The problem is, I have no idea how many calories that was.

It was enough.

 

[elrechazado]

K guys I think I survived work. I had a piece of roast beef rolled up with shredded cheese and ground beef. The problem is, I have no idea how many calories that was.

Doesn't matter, that's the beauty. Were you full? good. Not full? eat some more. Count the pounds you lose, not your calories

 

[Deleted member 17706]

http://www.globaltvbc.com/video/index.html?releasePID=XYSAmVfaZ4g7VUcPxKL9oAmx9pTy9m9j

Cool video about how giving a group of lab mice that are prone to developing breast cancer a low-carb diet appears to have greatly reduced their chances for developing the cancer, while at the same time keeping them slim and fit.

High-carb test group: 7/11 developed breast cancer and they got fat.
Low-carb test group: 3/11 developed breast cancer, and they stayed slim and fit.

Ignore the anti-meat propaganda at the end of the video.

 

[AceBandage]

Meat meat, I must have meat!

 

[teh_pwn]

http://www.globaltvbc.com/video/index.html?releasePID=XYSAmVfaZ4g7VUcPxKL9oAmx9pTy9m9j

Cool video about how giving a group of lab mice that are prone to developing breast cancer a low-carb diet appears to have greatly reduced their chances for developing the cancer, while at the same time keeping them slim and fit.

High-carb test group: 7/11 developed breast cancer and they got fat.
Low-carb test group: 3/11 developed breast cancer, and they stayed slim and fit.

Ignore the anti-meat propaganda at the end of the video.

Yep. Generally ketogenic diets help starve cancer cells out because cancer cells tend to have extra insulin and IGF receptors and have trouble handling ketones.

Really the burden of proof of meat causes cancer stuff is on the people that claim it. I'm skeptical that such a link exists because humans have survived on meat during harsh famines and winters. Our ape cousins do too - Chimps eat meat during dry seasons. The implication is that these periods of famine/winter should have strongly selected for genes that digest meat well because if you couldn't digest meat you didn't reproduce.

I see it more likely that our genes weren't selected for mass sugar consumption. Wild fruit is seasonal and low sugar load.

 

[Gary Whitta]

K guys I think I survived work. I had a piece of roast beef rolled up with shredded cheese and ground beef. The problem is, I have no idea how many calories that was.

Beef wrapped in beef, you are my new hero.

 

[LegoArmo]

Is it cool to eat a bowl of tuna mixed with a spoon or two of mayonnaise (the full fat kind has basically 0 carbs)? Or is the fat in mayonnaise bad for you?

Calories total around 300.

 

[elrechazado]

Is it cool to eat a bowl of tuna mixed with a spoon or two of mayonnaise (the full fat kind has basically 0 carbs)? Or is the fat in mayonnaise bad for you?

Calories total around 300.

Depends on the mayonaise. Lots of mayo is made with crappy soybean oil. I found one made from olive oil that we buy regularly. But yeah, a few spoons won't kill you, and the tuna is a fantastic idea.

I tend to use hot sauce to "wet up" my tuna personally.

 

[Ripclawe]

Is it cool to eat a bowl of tuna mixed with a spoon or two of mayonnaise (the full fat kind has basically 0 carbs)? Or is the fat in mayonnaise bad for you?

Calories total around 300.

do it all the time with light mayo, it tastes great though mouth wash afterwards is a must

 

[Akim]

Goddamn, I decided to look up those quest bars thanks to Gary. 2.25 a bar!? Holy good god.

 

[Cosmic Bus]

I tend to use hot sauce to "wet up" my tuna personally.

Trader Joe's has an eggplant hummus that's pretty low carb (2g net) that I've been using in place of mayo in quite a few instances, and it's great mixed into tuna.

 

[NomarTyme]

Goddamn, I decided to look up those quest bars thanks to Gary. 2.25 a bar!? Holy good god.

It quite expensive, and it taste alright. I got a free sample bar from them, but I rather snack on sardines instead.

Depends on the mayonaise. Lots of mayo is made with crappy soybean oil. I found one made from olive oil that we buy regularly. But yeah, a few spoons won't kill you, and the tuna is a fantastic idea.

I tend to use hot sauce to "wet up" my tuna personally.

You can EASILY make mayo with some eggs, lemon,olive oil. etc...

 

[Gary Whitta]

Goddamn, I decided to look up those quest bars thanks to Gary. 2.25 a bar!? Holy good god.

Yeah, they're not cheap. But they really are good.

 

[Akim]

Just curious, does anyone here cycle carbs?

 

[Andiie]

I'm curious if someone can help me understand a couple things when losing weight.

So atm I feel like I'm on a roller-coaster ride in terms of weight loss. I started on the 10th of this month and my weight has been fluctuating a lot and I'm not entirely sure if that's completely normal.

I stupidly couldn't figure out how to post an image so I just copy-pasted this from fitday. Ignore the 10th, I weighed that with clothes on... Take it from the 14th as I had one day exercise then it was the weekend.

06/23/2011 267 lbs
06/22/2011 264.4 lbs
06/21/2011 264.8 lbs
06/20/2011 265.2 lbs
06/19/2011 267 lbs
06/18/2011 265 lbs
06/17/2011 266 lbs
06/16/2011 266 lbs
06/15/2011 267 lbs
06/14/2011 267 lbs
06/13/2011 267.6 lbs
06/12/2011 265.6 lbs
06/11/2011 263.6 lbs
06/10/2011 268.8 lbs

I know I'm not going to see huge drops until I make a full change and give it some time but it just seems ridiculous that despite the changes I have made I just can't seem to lose weight consistently without it jumping back up to past numbers.

What actually causes that? I feel I had a very similar day to yesterday if not a more active one (ate similar foods too). 2.6 pounds seems a lot for one day.

I'm trying not to read too much into it just want to understand better what to expect.

I'm excited about tonight and beyond as I want to see if I can't pushed it back under 264.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Are you weighing yourself at more or less the same time every day, under the same conditions?

I weigh myself every morning immediately after I wake up and take a piss. My weight will typically be exactly the same for a couple of days in a row, then it will drop by 0.5-2.0lbs all at once. I weigh more at night, though, usually by 1-3lbs.

Out of curiosity, what changes have you made?

 

[Domino Theory]

Just curious, does anyone here cycle carbs?

Something similar to this is what I do. On days I workout, I aim for around 100g of carbs. On days I'm resting, I'm usually lower than that.

Are you weighing yourself at more or less the same time every day, under the same conditions?

I weigh myself every morning immediately after I wake up and take a piss. My weight will typically be exactly the same for a couple of days in a row, then it will drop by 0.5-2.0lbs all at once. I weigh more at night, though, usually by 1-3lbs.

Out of curiosity, what changes have you made?

I wear the same clothes when I weigh myself every Tuesday (will be Monday starting next week).

 

[parrotbeak]

Is it cool to eat a bowl of tuna mixed with a spoon or two of mayonnaise (the full fat kind has basically 0 carbs)? Or is the fat in mayonnaise bad for you?

Calories total around 300.

If you're concerned and want an even tastier option, mix the tuna with avocado.

 

[SeanR1221]

Going out for sushi with my bosses tonight, which roll will give me the best protein bang? The spicy tuna?

It's going to be weird to have some carbs for dinner. Anymore I only get them at lunch (PB sandwich and some fruit and almonds). Breakfast and dinner are always no carb choices.

Although I've been doing this for 2 months, I haven't lost a single pound. Then again, I lift 5 days a week, so I could be just balancing out fat loss with muscle gain.

 

[chicko1983]

straight scotch - how bad is it for weight gain?

I have a scotch tasting night tomorrow night so will be drinking a few glasses, probably half a dozen.

 

[AceBandage]

If you're concerned and want an even tastier option, mix the tuna with avocado.

Pretty much anything with avocado is a win.

straight scotch - how bad is it for weight gain?

I have a scotch tasting night tomorrow night so will be drinking a few glasses, probably half a dozen.

Alcohol is pure energy, so pretty much anything you drink is going to be stored as fat.
Of course, like all things, it's about moderation and your own goals. Not everyone is on a carb free diet.

 

[Andiie]

Are you weighing yourself at more or less the same time every day, under the same conditions?

I weigh myself every morning immediately after I wake up and take a piss. My weight will typically be exactly the same for a couple of days in a row, then it will drop by 0.5-2.0lbs all at once. I weigh more at night, though, usually by 1-3lbs.

Out of curiosity, what changes have you made?

Yep, as soon as I get up every morning I'll strip off and weigh myself. It'll be within the same hour every morning.

Haven't made too many drastic changes. I used to just sit on my backside all day without paying much mind to what I eat. Decided I was sick of it. Dumped the sodas and coffee which is all I really drank. Been drinking a lot more water (around 7-8 glasses, at least enough to keep hydrated). I haven't changed my eating habits as much as I plan to soon but I'm more conscious of what I eat. Avoiding just flat out bad foods as much as I can, eating more veggies and fruits instead.
As for exercise I walk 5kms home a night, takes 40-45 mins. Some times I'll run for a little bit. I tried riding but it was embarrassing how pathetic I was at it lol. It's been a while.

I want to try some interval running soon to fast track it a bit, maybe throw in some running/walking in the mornings too. Maybe start riding more since my brothers on my back about it. Want to also eat properly but rather than rush into it I want to do it right.

Hope my weight goes back down in the morn. fingers crossed.

 

[bodyboarder]

I miss bread and cookies.

 

[elrechazado]

I miss bread and cookies.

I do too. Lots of low carb people say they get sick from the thought or taste of sugar after a while, but not me. I could go back to my sweet sweet carbs anytime. It's like that hot chick who's a psycho.

 

[bodyboarder]

I do too. Lots of low carb people say they get sick from the thought or taste of sugar after a while, but not me. I could go back to my sweet sweet carbs anytime. It's like that hot chick who's a psycho.

Haha yeah. I'll give it a week or two and see how it goes "results wise".

 

[gutterboy44]

Don't really have any fun pictures to post but I just wanted to give a thanks to everyone in the thread. It was a huge motivating factor for my weight loss that I kicked off last year. When I started I was 218 and now I am down to 178 looking to knock off another 10-15 lbs this summer. I also went vegetarian last August. Luckily I did the bigger part of the weight loss with the carb cutting when I still ate meat which made it much easier. Cutting out alcohol and getting back on a solid exercise routine should get me to my target weight by summers end.

Overall I am much happier with the vegetarian diet day to day. I cook 5 days a week if not more and am eating healthier than I have in my life. I also have a new love of quinoa, it is amazing. I didn't workout much over the winter buy my weight stabilized for its first time in years much in thanks to the veggie diet. (For the record I see nothing wrong with eating meat, it was a personal choice for dietary reasons, my gf I live with is vegetarian and there is a history of colon cancer in my family and virtually all recent studies have shown a significant decrease in risk for colon cancer on a vegetarian diet. I miss fish and beef jerky though, hehe)

Cheers again for being direct and indirect motivation. Keep it up for all of those who are in that phase where you feel like you are busting your ass or starving and haven't see the results yet. They will come and they are so worth it.

 

[Chorazin]

I do too. Lots of low carb people say they get sick from the thought or taste of sugar after a while, but not me. I could go back to my sweet sweet carbs anytime. It's like that hot chick who's a psycho.

And that's why a lot of people bomb out on low-carb diets, they can't have the breads and sweets everyone else has. I know that why I did when I did low carb years and years ago.

Calorie restriction (i.e. Weight Watchers) works for me because I can choose what I want, the restrictions are less. I eat less carbs because carbs are higher in points, but if I wanted to eat more carbs I could by adjusting the other things I eat.

I'm not losing as fast as I would if I was doing strict low-carb, but I'm in this for the long haul so a slow, steady weight loss in fine.

 

[fadetoblack]

Going out for sushi with my bosses tonight, which roll will give me the best protein bang? The spicy tuna?

It's going to be weird to have some carbs for dinner. Anymore I only get them at lunch (PB sandwich and some fruit and almonds). Breakfast and dinner are always no carb choices.

Although I've been doing this for 2 months, I haven't lost a single pound. Then again, I lift 5 days a week, so I could be just balancing out fat loss with muscle gain.

Spicy tuna would be great, and a lot of places have brown rice as options so you might want to opt for that if you insist on going for a maki roll.

That said, I would avoid the maki altogether. Get some sashimi

 

[Fireye]

Beef wrapped in beef, you are my new hero.

Cow covered with the milk of cow, wrapped in cow. I only feel that this needs to be deep fried in cow fat to make it complete.

straight scotch - how bad is it for weight gain?

My understanding is (from reddit threads mainly), that your liver will work to process the alcohol before your body can continue losing any weight. It won't get stored as fat, but it will delay any actual fat loss for a while.

(That is, in the case of moderate drinking. Heavy drinking is probably a different story)

 

[Sarye]

I'm curious if someone can help me understand a couple things when losing weight.

So atm I feel like I'm on a roller-coaster ride in terms of weight loss. I started on the 10th of this month and my weight has been fluctuating a lot and I'm not entirely sure if that's completely normal.

You only started 2 weeks ago. Give your body time to adjust.

Just keep working hard and don't let it get to you. The lbs will come off. If you want some anecdotal evidence, back when I first started a weight loss program I didn't lose any weight for two weeks even though I was eating less and exercising more.

Keep it up!

 

[Chorazin]

I'm curious if someone can help me understand a couple things when losing weight.

Dude...maybe I'm the only one here that does this, but I only step on the scale once a week. Don't drive yourself crazy with daily checking!

 

[Zoe]

Dude...maybe I'm the only one here that does this, but I only step on the scale once a week. Don't drive yourself crazy with daily checking!

Pretty much. It's fairly normal to see day to day fluctuations due to water weight and such.

I do check my weight daily though to see my water %.

 

[Schlep]

Dude...maybe I'm the only one here that does this, but I only step on the scale once a week. Don't drive yourself crazy with daily checking!

I gave away my scale. I know what I'm doing is working, and I don't need to keep a demotivational tool around.

 

[Cosmic Bus]

I miss bread and cookies.

Bread is something that really can't be tinkered with and still come out well, but there are lots and lots of easy low carb, sugar-free cookie and dessert recipes! If you don't normally do any baking, this is a great time to get a crash course in it, and along the way you'll learn about the hows and whys involved in the processes, which can be pretty interesting itself.

 

[heyf00L]

It gives me little satisfaction other than satisfying thirst. It's almost always more desirable to drink something flavorful.

Although I love straight water, I also find that eating a hard-boiled egg makes me crave water for an hour or two. So maybe try eating something that makes you thirsty.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I'm still working through Why We Get Fat and What to Do About It, but this is some really enlightening stuff. It also seems so obvious once you stop to think about it. That the amount of food we eat and the amount of exercise we do is a direct result of our body's drive to either put on fat or get rid of it, and not the other way around, really makes a lot of sense.

I really recommend that everyone give this book a read.

 

[Akim]

weigh in today

starting: 193.2
today: 187.2

lol water weight

 

[FallingEdge]

Yeah, I have had anywhere for 5-10lbs change from day to day. It can really be frustrating and annoying.

Rely more on the tape measure and weighing yourself once a week.

 

[Gary Whitta]

Wow if true!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/jun/24/low-calorie-diet-hope-cure-diabetes

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Wow if true!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/jun/24/low-calorie-diet-hope-cure-diabetes

I think it's been known for a while that fasting can cure type 2 diabetes, usually caused by long years of abusive high-carb diets that kill insulin sensitivity. By not eating anything, your blood sugar doesn't spike, and your insulin gets a chance to recover. Then again, what kind of food causes blood sugar to spike? Carbohydrates... There's accumulating evidence that simply going low-carb can greatly help against type 2 diabetes, and you don't even have to starve yourself.

 

[ipukespiders]

Wish I could convince my brother. He's type 2.
LOL low carb fad diet!