ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Basileus777 said:
If you're asking is TP a good enough example of Nintendo destroying the Zelda name? Yes.
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What we know about Legend of Zelda Wii prior to E3 2010
- Thread starter Skiesofwonder
- Start date
If you're asking is TP a good enough example of Nintendo destroying the Zelda name? Yes.
Skiesofwonder
Walruses, camels, bears, rabbits, tigers and badgers.
ShockingAlberto said:
So I should listen to what ShockingAlberto says about LOZ Wii instead of Eiji Aunoma and Shigeru Miyamoto. Right....
AceBandage
Banned
Skiesofwonder said:
ShockingAlberto
is too reasonable
for Nintendo
(Today, 08:06 PM)
Reply | Quote
Aaron Strife
Banned
Nintendo would rename Link "Shitty McNutsack" if it got more people to buy the game.ShockingAlberto said:
If moving to a simpler progression/control scheme gets a net gain of people playing the game, they're not going to care if some nerds on the internet don't buy it.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Relix said:
I never was able to get into OoT. The Last Zelda that I enjoyed was Wind Waker.
Skiesofwonder
Walruses, camels, bears, rabbits, tigers and badgers.
Vizion28 said:
I seriously doubt this. I just think enemies will take fewer strikes of the sword to kill.
AceBandage
Banned
sfried said:
You are correct, sir.
AceBandage
Banned
sfried said:
Really applies to games period.
Fans suck.
ShockingAlberto
Member
So are you willing to be contrite when the game is not a point and click adventure or are you going to keep being sarcastic?Skiesofwonder said:
AceBandage
Banned
Kunan said:
The gif potential of that would be astronomical...
DeathbyVolcano
Banned
darkwings said:
I will fucking hatefuck you.
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
DeathbyVolcano said:
O_0
AceBandage
Banned
DeathbyVolcano said:
Kinky.
Black-Wind
Member
Take THAT Darkwings!!!DeathbyVolcano said:
. . . But no, not EVERYTHING in TP was what fans "wanted", just the main stuff.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
I endorse the new direction of this thread.DeathbyVolcano said:
Hard and fast man. With no lube.
ShockingAlberto
Member
TP had some concept problems and some execution problems.
No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No NoSkiesofwonder said:
wRATH2x said:
No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No No No No No Naw Nah No No Hell No No No Fuck No I Refuse No I'm Not Listening No Fuck That Shit Fuck It Hell No No No No No No No
Skiesofwonder
Walruses, camels, bears, rabbits, tigers and badgers.
ShockingAlberto said:
I have nothing to be contrite about considering I was only brainstorming. I would like to think I've learned a lot about Nintendo's philosophy with the DS and Wii. Hell we all could of kinda figured out what the the Wii's unique features would turn out to be if you looked at previous Nintendo offerings and quotes from the bigwigs at Nintendo. DS having touch screen would obviously lend to pointer control and Wario Ware Twisted and other tilt functioning games would of lead you to believe that Nintendo would make a glorified tilt A.K.A. "motion" controller. Not to mention Iwata constantly comparing it to the DS (and so much stuff I can quote but I don't feel like muddling up the waters in my own thread).
Anyways, in my brainstorming session, I was applying that strategy to LOZ Wii with Phantom Hourglass. Nintendo has before talked about the analog stick being a huge barrier for many people (most likely the main reason it isn't available in Metroid: Other M) and would like to find a more intuitive way of moving around. Pointer control could be that. Of course I don't actually THINK they will do that, but who fricken knows with Nintendo.
Still much better then thinking this:
Shocking Alberto said:
Considering we KNOW this is false:
Wii IGN (E3 2008) said:
And if you just want to call that IGN being IGNorant then maybe you'll accept it from the horse's mouth itself (I hate re-posting stuff from my OP, but just to prove my point):
Shigeru Miyamoto said:
Eiji Aunoma said:
Shigeru Miyamoto said:
Shigeru Miyamoto said:
Eiji Aonuma said:
This all screams that LOZ Wii is a whole new type of Legend Of Zelda with at least have major fundamental changes (if not some totally radical ones).
Shin Johnpv
Member
DeathbyVolcano said:
I personally think you should rake out his eyes and skull fuck him.
Skiesofwonder
Walruses, camels, bears, rabbits, tigers and badgers.
wRATH2x said:
:lol
Someone did actually ask Miyamoto about whether or not LOZ Wii was going to be in first-person view. He responded with "I don't think it will be that radically different". But that was early 2009, and the way he worded the response makes me wonder.... because I've seen him totally deny something and then three months later it come true. And first person just makes sense with motion+.
So you guys can throw stones and bitch-slap me all you want on June 15th if I am proven wrong, but right now I'm betting on some kind of First-Person View in LOZ Wii. If not for the whole gaming experience, then at least for Sword-fighting, Archery, etc.
Unless of course you play as the "Fairy Queen", then all bets are off.
SuperAngelo64
Banned
Anyone hoping for a first-person Zelda needs to get a fucking reality check.
Hey there everybody, long time Zelda fan, first time poster in a Zelda thread, so don't hate me if things were already discussed in one of the many Zelda threads that float around
I currently don't own a Wii, but my brothers have one back home that I get to play and catch up on some games during the holidays when I visit. Last time I went there I got a chance to play WiiSports Resort, and although it was mostly an enjoyable experience, I did not find the swordfighting gameplay to be that great, maybe I should have given it more time but I remember being putt off by the controls and going back to table tennis or something. Anyway I think I'm one of the few that didn't care about the waggle in Zelda:TP, and to me more Zelda is always great news no matter if they change it drastically or give us OoT part whatever - I love it all. But if the combat in Zelda Wii is gonna be like what's in WSR then I feel like it will slow down the pacing, combat in Zelda always felt fluid because you could basically attack anywhere around you at anytime, I can't see that quick-pace with WSR/FPA/Over-the-shoulder styles, .... but what do I know; I have faith in Miyamoto and the crew !
HYPE HYPE HYPE
I currently don't own a Wii, but my brothers have one back home that I get to play and catch up on some games during the holidays when I visit. Last time I went there I got a chance to play WiiSports Resort, and although it was mostly an enjoyable experience, I did not find the swordfighting gameplay to be that great, maybe I should have given it more time but I remember being putt off by the controls and going back to table tennis or something. Anyway I think I'm one of the few that didn't care about the waggle in Zelda:TP, and to me more Zelda is always great news no matter if they change it drastically or give us OoT part whatever - I love it all. But if the combat in Zelda Wii is gonna be like what's in WSR then I feel like it will slow down the pacing, combat in Zelda always felt fluid because you could basically attack anywhere around you at anytime, I can't see that quick-pace with WSR/FPA/Over-the-shoulder styles, .... but what do I know; I have faith in Miyamoto and the crew !
HYPE HYPE HYPE
Skiesofwonder
Walruses, camels, bears, rabbits, tigers and badgers.
SuperAngelo64 said:
Yeah because Nintendo had actual running demos of Ocarina of Time and Twilight Princess in First Person just for the fucking fun of it.
Don't think they haven't seriously thought about it before and don't act like it's not a possibility. It is.
HylianScribe
Member
I figured it would be a good time to bring this video back to light.
Go to the 1:50 mark of this:
http://www.archive.org/details/eiji_aonuma_gdc_2007
You can see this footage from a pre-release version of Twilight Princess, circa December 2005 (shown at GDC 2007), incorporating first-person swordplay.
During his session at GDC 2007, Aonuma said the following:
Now, I know at this time, Nintendo was just gearing up for Wii development, and they didn't have the 4+ years of experience with the controller and hardware like they do now, but I would be lying if I said I wasn't a little concerned the upcoming Zelda for Wii will be utilizing a control scheme originally ditched by Aonuma and labeled as "ineffective" and "awkward". Controls are everything in Zelda, and I might not be in the majority, but the sword mechanics in the Wii version of Twilight Princess were a gimmick, and to do this day I hate playing the Wii version because I have less control with the sword play than I do on the GCN version. However, the aiming mechanics are just fine for weapons like the bow on the Wii version.
Controls aside, I'm hesitant to get hyped about the "changing the formula" statement, only because it's also been said this Zelda will not be radically different than previous ones. Nintendo and Miyamoto know all too well that screwing with the core mechanics leads to backlash. But then again, this is a new Nintendo that caters to more than just its niche fan base (though I say Zelda's fan base is far from niche)...so even if every fan were upset with a decision made about this new game, the masses it might appeal to could more than compensate for the fallout (not to mention most whining fans will buy the game anyway). Still, many of my "hopes" for this game are tucked away and kept in check because they don't really fall in line with Nintendo wanting to make the game more accessible.
Whether it's a throwback to the Zelda 1 style, with very little guidance and more emphasis on a "sandbox" where you mess around and figure out stuff out, or a more guided experience with a rich quest system that provides more to do than ever...I don't see it happening. Instead, what's most likely is a a treatment that takes what has made New Super Mario Bros. and the two Galaxy games so popular and applying it to this franchise. More streamlined, easier to digest in smaller chunks, simple yet refined controls, and a form of the "super guide" mechanic. But they'll also have plenty of what fans want, but it won't be anything extreme. Just all the right touches they've come to expect, but nothing that would turn off newcomers.
It might not be up there on the "what we know" section yet, but you can basically pencil in "Galaxy 2 quality audio" and "one of the best visual efforts to date on the system" there. Obviously opinions, but if you were wanting to make a ban bet with good odds, this would be one to go all-in on. But even still, just so much mystery...and yet we know it's coming. People keep saying "E3 2004 reveal was such a big deal because nobody knew it was coming". That's only part of it, and if you really can remember, fans knew it was (The Wind Waker 2 was formally announced at GDC 2004). A big part of the outpouring of love was the shift in the visual style...so many people were burned by The Wind Waker. Even if they would say to your face it was a great game, they secretly hated those visuals. Back then, it was serious hate, and except for a minority, most people only praised the game's visuals in the end to be "politically correct".
Zelda was also on a popularity decline and was being "milked" by Nintendo. 2000-2004 saw Majora's Mask, Oracle of Ages, Oracle of Seasons, A Link to the Past/Four Swords, The Wind Waker, and Four Swords Adventures. In the span of just over four years, more games came out than in the previous 14 years. And to top off the repeated use of "Toon Link" in some of these games were the "gimmicks" fans kept getting upset with. I think Four Swords Adventures was the low point where many believed the series was finished, given that we all thought The Wind Waker 2 was coming. But it wasn't. E3 2004...expectations were so low. The surprise of Twilight Princess' reveal was what I mentioned above...the look, the attitude.
And here we are. We know Zelda is coming. We saw a piece of artwork. Who knows when it was really "made", and if it still really has any indication as to what the game will look like in action. Aside from fragments of info that don't really mean jack (other than Motion Plus will be required), we really don't know anything about this game. So yea, I think there's a good chance Nintendo could wow fans with the showing, but because they showed off a single piece of artwork and given random statements, some have already drawn their own conclusions and have an "image" in their head. Disappointment is a real possibility here again, and because of that, if it's the type of Zelda most have hoped for, the reaction will be that much sweeter this time.
I really can't wait to see what it looks like. What the story is. How it plays. Knowing it is coming is making it that much harder to deal. I just wish it was next Tuesday already.
I'll be at E3, yea.
Go to the 1:50 mark of this:
http://www.archive.org/details/eiji_aonuma_gdc_2007
You can see this footage from a pre-release version of Twilight Princess, circa December 2005 (shown at GDC 2007), incorporating first-person swordplay.
During his session at GDC 2007, Aonuma said the following:
Eiji Aonuma said:
Now, I know at this time, Nintendo was just gearing up for Wii development, and they didn't have the 4+ years of experience with the controller and hardware like they do now, but I would be lying if I said I wasn't a little concerned the upcoming Zelda for Wii will be utilizing a control scheme originally ditched by Aonuma and labeled as "ineffective" and "awkward". Controls are everything in Zelda, and I might not be in the majority, but the sword mechanics in the Wii version of Twilight Princess were a gimmick, and to do this day I hate playing the Wii version because I have less control with the sword play than I do on the GCN version. However, the aiming mechanics are just fine for weapons like the bow on the Wii version.
Controls aside, I'm hesitant to get hyped about the "changing the formula" statement, only because it's also been said this Zelda will not be radically different than previous ones. Nintendo and Miyamoto know all too well that screwing with the core mechanics leads to backlash. But then again, this is a new Nintendo that caters to more than just its niche fan base (though I say Zelda's fan base is far from niche)...so even if every fan were upset with a decision made about this new game, the masses it might appeal to could more than compensate for the fallout (not to mention most whining fans will buy the game anyway). Still, many of my "hopes" for this game are tucked away and kept in check because they don't really fall in line with Nintendo wanting to make the game more accessible.
Whether it's a throwback to the Zelda 1 style, with very little guidance and more emphasis on a "sandbox" where you mess around and figure out stuff out, or a more guided experience with a rich quest system that provides more to do than ever...I don't see it happening. Instead, what's most likely is a a treatment that takes what has made New Super Mario Bros. and the two Galaxy games so popular and applying it to this franchise. More streamlined, easier to digest in smaller chunks, simple yet refined controls, and a form of the "super guide" mechanic. But they'll also have plenty of what fans want, but it won't be anything extreme. Just all the right touches they've come to expect, but nothing that would turn off newcomers.
It might not be up there on the "what we know" section yet, but you can basically pencil in "Galaxy 2 quality audio" and "one of the best visual efforts to date on the system" there. Obviously opinions, but if you were wanting to make a ban bet with good odds, this would be one to go all-in on. But even still, just so much mystery...and yet we know it's coming. People keep saying "E3 2004 reveal was such a big deal because nobody knew it was coming". That's only part of it, and if you really can remember, fans knew it was (The Wind Waker 2 was formally announced at GDC 2004). A big part of the outpouring of love was the shift in the visual style...so many people were burned by The Wind Waker. Even if they would say to your face it was a great game, they secretly hated those visuals. Back then, it was serious hate, and except for a minority, most people only praised the game's visuals in the end to be "politically correct".
Zelda was also on a popularity decline and was being "milked" by Nintendo. 2000-2004 saw Majora's Mask, Oracle of Ages, Oracle of Seasons, A Link to the Past/Four Swords, The Wind Waker, and Four Swords Adventures. In the span of just over four years, more games came out than in the previous 14 years. And to top off the repeated use of "Toon Link" in some of these games were the "gimmicks" fans kept getting upset with. I think Four Swords Adventures was the low point where many believed the series was finished, given that we all thought The Wind Waker 2 was coming. But it wasn't. E3 2004...expectations were so low. The surprise of Twilight Princess' reveal was what I mentioned above...the look, the attitude.
And here we are. We know Zelda is coming. We saw a piece of artwork. Who knows when it was really "made", and if it still really has any indication as to what the game will look like in action. Aside from fragments of info that don't really mean jack (other than Motion Plus will be required), we really don't know anything about this game. So yea, I think there's a good chance Nintendo could wow fans with the showing, but because they showed off a single piece of artwork and given random statements, some have already drawn their own conclusions and have an "image" in their head. Disappointment is a real possibility here again, and because of that, if it's the type of Zelda most have hoped for, the reaction will be that much sweeter this time.
I really can't wait to see what it looks like. What the story is. How it plays. Knowing it is coming is making it that much harder to deal. I just wish it was next Tuesday already.
AniHawk said:
I'll be at E3, yea.
AceBandage
Banned
Ugh, first person Zelda looks horrible.
It just loses so much impact when it's first person.
It just loses so much impact when it's first person.
neoism
Member
I'm just as excited for this as the next Zelda fan, and even though I have doubts... I'm sure to nerd-gasim as soon as I see it, but I would kill, if Fumito Ueda, and Shigeru Miyamoto would work together on a Zelda game. Only why can't they make the game easier on easy mode, and make a Hard Zelda game for the old fans, with like a hardcore mode or something.I know this is a fantasy and will never happen...
viciouskillersquirrel
Member
The background on the fandom at the TP announcement is very interesting, TSA. I only got back into gaming circa 2006, so I wasn't aware that when TP was announced, people were fully expecting Wind Waker 2. Did people really hate the WW artstyle that much that TP's first trailer had them frothing at the mouth?
Also, I could see how Four Swords Adventures might've had people pronouncing the death knell for the series.
It's funny that six years later, we're by all accounts less than six months from release and we still only have one piece of artwork (seeing the artwork for the first time was glorious, however). I wonder what the reaction this time'll be.
Also, I could see how Four Swords Adventures might've had people pronouncing the death knell for the series.
It's funny that six years later, we're by all accounts less than six months from release and we still only have one piece of artwork (seeing the artwork for the first time was glorious, however). I wonder what the reaction this time'll be.
JzeroT1437
Member
You guys really think this is going to be released this year? Really?
I mean, Twilight Princess was delayed for what--a year and a half?
I mean, Twilight Princess was delayed for what--a year and a half?
I get how Miyamoto would love to do first person and that they experimented with it before, being a Zelda fan you know these things. I'm just speaking from my own opinion, and I'd hate an FPS Zelda. Even if I end up liking it I'd much prefer the third person view.
I mean I'm the kind of guy who doesn't like the first person view for fantasy games, and since Zelda is my favorite videogame series you can forget me ever wanting an FPS Zelda. Hell I'm happy Retro wasn't developing it, puts me at ease.
I mean I'm the kind of guy who doesn't like the first person view for fantasy games, and since Zelda is my favorite videogame series you can forget me ever wanting an FPS Zelda. Hell I'm happy Retro wasn't developing it, puts me at ease.
HylianScribe
Member
Eiji Aonuma's presentation on the "Essence of Zelda" at GDC 2004 wrapped up with a slide that had dates and sales data on Zelda titles. It had Four Swords Adventures listed for 2004, and then The Wind Waker 2 listed as 2XXX. Rumors about a "realistic" Zelda surfaced a few weeks before E3 2004, and I believe somebody (probably IGN) made a remark before the show how what we would see of "Zelda" would be a big surprise (even though Zelda's presence wasn't officially confirmed for the show beforehand, though reports suggested it would be). Then as I've said numerous times, NOA accidentally uploaded the screens for Zelda to their press site early, but I think there was just a general disbelief they were genuine.
http://cube.ign.com/articles/501/501735p1.html
These were the original three images I saw on NOA's site before the press conference:
Edit: Yea, the IGN article states Aonuma said Zelda would be at E3...so it was expected (lending more evidence it was the visuals that drove the surprise reaction).
http://cube.ign.com/articles/501/501735p1.html
These were the original three images I saw on NOA's site before the press conference:
Edit: Yea, the IGN article states Aonuma said Zelda would be at E3...so it was expected (lending more evidence it was the visuals that drove the surprise reaction).
Most people had accepted Wind Waker's style by then, but you have to remember a lot of people had been hyped by the very old teaser footage of realistic Link fighting realistic Ganondorf from the spaceworld demo. In essence when TP was first revealed it reignited the hype from that first teaser as the Zelda people had always been waiting for. The fact that it came when most people had given up hope of that Zelda ever existing just made it all the more special.
viciouskillersquirrel
Member
Twilight Princess was first shown about a year before it was initially meant to release (i.e. it would have been nowhere close to a finished product) and was delayed... twice - once was a teatable delay and the other was the Wii version delay.JzeroT1437 said:
In this case, we're supposed to get a trailer and a playable demo and the release date is set for Q4 this year. We're getting the first real media for it six months from its intended release date. By all accounts, development should be at the polishing stage now. It's a totally different situation.
Skiesofwonder
Walruses, camels, bears, rabbits, tigers and badgers.
Thanks for posting a video of that presentation TSA. I searched and searched for it but couldn't actually find anything. That's pretty much what I expect from LOZ Wii. Run around in third person, switch to First Person for fighting, puzzles, etc.
I know most Zelda fans will scream bloody murder at the top of their lungs if LOZ Wii is actually fist-person, but if it's going to happen now is the time. They haven't been fooling around with it for nothing. They know that Motion control just works better in some sort of First-Person mode, and now that Motion+ is involved, I just can't see them NOT taking advantage of all the cool things you could do from that viewpoint with the peripheral.
And the Retro Studios involvement at one point (basically confirmed by Hal_Laboratory early in this thread) really makes me think it's going to happen. Why else would they have anything to do with Zelda? And for the record, if they do go this route, I personally hope they just stick with First-Person mode for the entire fricken game. No need to switch in out of viewpoints, it just ruins the immersion.
But then I find myself agreeing with a lot said by TSA. So... who fuckin knows.... it's Nintendo after all. All I know is that the suspense is killing me. :lol
I know most Zelda fans will scream bloody murder at the top of their lungs if LOZ Wii is actually fist-person, but if it's going to happen now is the time. They haven't been fooling around with it for nothing. They know that Motion control just works better in some sort of First-Person mode, and now that Motion+ is involved, I just can't see them NOT taking advantage of all the cool things you could do from that viewpoint with the peripheral.
And the Retro Studios involvement at one point (basically confirmed by Hal_Laboratory early in this thread) really makes me think it's going to happen. Why else would they have anything to do with Zelda? And for the record, if they do go this route, I personally hope they just stick with First-Person mode for the entire fricken game. No need to switch in out of viewpoints, it just ruins the immersion.
But then I find myself agreeing with a lot said by TSA. So... who fuckin knows.... it's Nintendo after all. All I know is that the suspense is killing me. :lol
Your prediction of a super-streamlined Zelda, catering to non-Zelda-fans comes off quite bitter, tsa. I dont think Nintendo has done anything to grant such negativity. As Miyamoto said, controls will be made more accesible...which doesnt have to mean something bad, seeing how swinging a sword by a swing of the remote IS more accessible than some button-layout. We might see stuff like the super guide, but that´s also rather in favor of a. well, "hardcore"-Zelda experience.
Also, stop that, skiesofwonder. A birds-eye-view Zelda, with wiimote-pointer controls is my worst nightmare. it´d be like flushing down all the immersion there is in one push. And that video tsa posted actually isnt that bad. surely, tp wasnt built to be first person, but imagining being able to do precise sword-slashes against that Stalfos knight doesnt sound so bad. But again, and over-the-shoulder-view would be best imo.
Also, stop that, skiesofwonder. A birds-eye-view Zelda, with wiimote-pointer controls is my worst nightmare. it´d be like flushing down all the immersion there is in one push. And that video tsa posted actually isnt that bad. surely, tp wasnt built to be first person, but imagining being able to do precise sword-slashes against that Stalfos knight doesnt sound so bad. But again, and over-the-shoulder-view would be best imo.