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What we know so far about the Nintendo NX with sources
- Thread starter Hero of Legend
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So this brand new concept has got me stumped for NX.
They've done:
motion controls
Touch screen
Dual screen
VR (looking into it)
Glasses free 3D
And if we gather what we've seen from patents those don't look like new ways to play.
Free form display looks cool and allows new shapes, doesn't change the way you play.
Clickable scrolling shoulder buttons is cool for navigating menus or scrolling through a list or switching guns, not exactly gonna light the world on fire and change the way we play.
Swapping buttons and joysticks out is more of an aethstitic and ergonomic thing that's already been done.
Haptic feedback? Two touch screens? Are those new ways to play? Holographics? Wearable gaming devices?
They've done:
motion controls
Touch screen
Dual screen
VR (looking into it)
Glasses free 3D
And if we gather what we've seen from patents those don't look like new ways to play.
Free form display looks cool and allows new shapes, doesn't change the way you play.
Clickable scrolling shoulder buttons is cool for navigating menus or scrolling through a list or switching guns, not exactly gonna light the world on fire and change the way we play.
Swapping buttons and joysticks out is more of an aethstitic and ergonomic thing that's already been done.
Haptic feedback? Two touch screens? Are those new ways to play? Holographics? Wearable gaming devices?
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
But you see a brand new concept and new way to play isn't really having shared libraries. that's already been done by Apple and Google. It's not new.
Kimishima and Iwata's words are making this sound like the Wii or Wii U with a new gimmick to get people hooked but the difference this time is that they're not intentionally making it weak like the Wii and Wii U.
Maybe they saw how much third party support they would have got if the Wii could run the same engines as the HD twins and wouldn't need ports to be built from scratch?
Imagine the Wii having 360 levels of power plus the motion controls? Third party devs wouldn't ignore that install base and you'd get more then shovel ware.
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
I don't know, I hope it's something "out there".
Many would be pissed but I don't want a PS4(not that there is anything wrong with it) for a Nintendo console.
I can't for the life of me think of what they could do(as VR is already being done and Nintendo obviously aren't doing it in the near future) but they'll find a way.
A lot hate their hardware but I love their hardware vision most of the time, it's fun.
Now that's really neat!
I realize this is a 10-inch tablet. But, how small a form factor could you get these sorts of parts into a handheld? Could the device be half that size and still have that much power without sacrificing anything? (Barring that the screen resolution and such doesn't need to be that high on a handheld.)
They'll kill you five times before you hit the ground!
DrROBschiz
Member
I respect this sentiment but I would like them to go back to basics and deliver modern features before we get back on the train to crazy town
They seem to be saying the right things so far at least
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
The exact opposite.
Quad-A53 is the prevailing upper-entry-level phone config these days (quad A7 being the true entry level).
DaSorcerer7
Member
I just randomly popped in here to check up on NX stuff and I'm leaving nearly fully bummed out hearing about SF0. I really want a thrill ride SF64 successor with modern production and hearing that the game at a fundamental level could be busted just makes me allface, especially considering the future of this franchise.
It might simply depend on who plays it and for how long. Plenty hate the motion controls on Splatoon, plenty hated the pointers controls on Wii.
It might be the learning curve/people not wanting to put the effort in to adapt to a new control scheme/it simply just doesn't click with some.
As with many motion controlled games/new control schemes..I suspect people will be massively split.
GhostTrick
Banned
Well I'm guessing Nintendo will match the consoles of Sony and Microsoft and use octo-core. Maine Octo core A53 on the console and quad core A53 on the handheld.
Wow, that small. That's pretty incredible. I'm assuming it must not take a lot of watts or produce a lot of heat then, which is great for the handheld. With a dedicated OS and such, is a Quad-A53 significantly more powerful than the N3DS? (Just pure horsepower; not counting screens.) I figure they'd want to make a "generational" power leap is why I'm curious.
That's an interesting thought too, and I'm sure by chaining them SCD-style that you could get a pretty good amount of performance out of them both. (Assuming they do this.)
LOL!! There the Nintendo Ninjas go! It's hypnotic how quick and precise they are.
Kobun Heat
Member
a portable that you dock with your tv would be a pretty new concept imho
Graphics Horse
Member
" regarding input and output technologies, I believe that it is also in line with the current technological trend that Nintendo should challenge itself with the creation of a unique user interface. Genyo Takeda Nintendo
I think it's likely we're getting something kooky and the freeform leak & patent are the biggest clues. Remove dpad and face buttons, replace them with a radial screen around each stick, linear actuators and clicking speakers for feedback.
They're is no such thing as Nintendo ni
On the home console I'd expect octo-core A72s. A53s may offer better performance/watt in a mobile/handheld thermal environment, but in an actively cooled environment A72s still give you pretty good efficiency, but with a far higher performance ceiling.
On the handheld either 4 or 8 A53s should be expected (the cores themselves are very small, as far as I can recall a quad-core cluster with L2 cache comes to about 8mm² on a 28nm process). I had previously considered the possibility that they may use A72 cores in the handheld, to minimise the performance gap with the console (as, unlike with the GPU, what's running on the CPU in general doesn't scale linearly with resolution), but to be honest it's likely that you'd have to clock them so low you might as well use A53s, and save a good chunk of die area while you're at it.
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
Nintendo don't have to use A53 on the home side. There are far more performant ARMv8 uarchs for that TDP.
N3ds is quad arm11 @ 8xxMHz - in-order, single-issue, no fp32 SIMD.
A53 tops at 2GHz (at 28nm), is in-order, dual-issue, with 2-way ALU fp32 SIMD.
The much newer, dual-issue uarch does pose a notable IPC advancement - arm11's DMIPS/MHz is 1.25, vs 2.3 for the A53.
Ah I didn't think you could fit 8 of those cores in a handheld. That would be preferable. 8 core in the handheld and console. Handheld with A53 and console with A72. Sounds good to me. How powerful is the A72 in comparisons with the jaguar cpu's?
DrROBschiz
Member
Picard might agree there are 4.
Is out of order execution pretty much mandatory for gaming now? Especially with open world games? I'm just reading that the A53 doesn't support out of order execution, only the A72 does. So I'm wondering if it would be better if the handheld had under clocked custom A72's for temperature and battery saving purposes and then put the full powered A72 in the console?
And knowing Nintendo they'd go with the 28nm fab for both sku's instead of 16nm due to cost concerns. Or maybe go A57's across the board?
Quad core.
Out of order execution can allow CPUs to achieve higher performance per clock (although the extent of which can depend on things like cache size/hierarchy), but it's not much use if the resultant core has to be clocked so low to fit thermal requirements that it underperforms an in-order core which is designed for those thermal envelopes. Basically, my point is that, regardless of in-order/OoO or any other particular aspect of the cores' microarchitectures, if you have the choice between one A72 cluster or 2 A53 clusters, the A53s are probably going to end up giving you better performance in the kind of TDP that you'd expect for a Nintendo handheld.
28nm is very likely for both handheld and home console, but it doesn't affect the choice of cores all that much (just the expected clocks you might get out of them). There are plenty of entry-to-mid level phone SoCs made on 28nm with octo-core A53s.
A57 doesn't make much sense for either device, unless the design was locked before A72s could be added. They take up less space than the A57, and have higher IPC and better power efficiency. There's a reason the A57 has been promptly dropped from phones.
4 core with a super-low clock (444MHZ). Even 4 A53 cores at 1-1.2GHZ would be a massive improvement.
A72 has been available since early 2015 iirc, so i hope that's not the case (especially considering how we read multiple times that the specs hadn't been finalized).
Temperature wise for sure.
The CPUs are what's really holding back all these next generation games. I'd hope that if Nintendo uses a gpu comparable to the Xbox one and uses a much better CPU that it won't tank below 30fps all the time.
LordOfChaos
Member
I saw that today, the A53 is definitely in "good enough" range for budget smartphones and some tablets, but this Mediatek SoC was clearly chosen for cost here. The rest of the specs shout that pretty clearly, 2GB of RAM, 1280 x 800 resolution, in this year.
Canonical didn't even make it, they took the Aquaris M10 tablet from Spanish manufacturer BQ and slapped Ubuntu onto it.
I don't think any of that means anything for anything, besides Canonical showing off the convergence concept with cheap off the shelf hardware.
In theory the A72 has about double the IPC (measured by DMIPS/MHz) of Jaguar, but I haven't been able to find reliable benchmark figures for either, so I'd take that with a grain of salt. The A72 may well also be able to clock higher at 28nm in a console SoC, but that's a difficult thing to say until we get A72s in a 28nm console SoC (which should hopefully be not that long from now with the NX).
I'd hold back on blaming the XBO's framerate issues on the CPU. The console uses the exact same CPU config as the PS4, and at a higher clock speed, so if the XBox One is struggling to maintain solid framerates where the PS4 isn't, then it's not the CPU that's to blame.
Both CPUs are holding the framerates back. I already accepted the Xbox GPU is 40% weaker and will always have lower resolution than PS4. It's the multiplats titles that struggle to hit a consistent 30fps. I assumed it was CPU problems, over ambitious games or poor development or a combo of all three.
Does someone know more about this?
Nintendo NX has cloud support?
I read somewhere this new console like the wii u but now has cloud support meaning we can play such games like splatoon online anywhere using a similar gamepad controller to play but using a internet provider of some sort to do this?
It has some sort of Cloud support. Kimishima showed it during the presentation for "My Nintendo" yesterday.
https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/631516-wii-u/73241768
Nintendo NX has cloud support?
I read somewhere this new console like the wii u but now has cloud support meaning we can play such games like splatoon online anywhere using a similar gamepad controller to play but using a internet provider of some sort to do this?
It has some sort of Cloud support. Kimishima showed it during the presentation for "My Nintendo" yesterday.
https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/631516-wii-u/73241768
TheMoon
Member
lol fan fiction
don't read gamefaqs for anything other than tips for games.
NX has cloud support in the way that Nintendo Account will support cloud saves in the future.
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
It's the more expensive 260eur version (1920x1080) that canonical chose for their platform debut. Canonical do not make hw.
I never said Canonical made it. Apologies if I misled somebody into thinking that.
They chose this hw. They could have chosen a different one. Anyway, I believe I explained precisely what tangent I brought that device on.
I think I'm sold on ARM providing the chip for the console as well at this point. I guess my question would be the price of the A72 in comparison to a similar performing CPU on the AMD x86 side. I know people aren't that happy with the Bulldozer family and Zen is too new. ARM seems to be more future-proof and would let you give the portable and console similar architectures.
Given the complaints about the Wii U's processor (that Takeda has acknowledged) and the fact that 3rd parties have complained about XB1/PS4's processors being a bottleneck, I would suspect the NX console will have a faster processor in comparison to its GPU than either of those 3 machines.
LordOfChaos
Member
Bootloader access, open source SoC drivers, and BQ and Mediateks willingness to work with them were likely a large part of the decision too, more than "hey, A53 really is desktop-able". I mean, I'm not saying it isn't capable. Just don't think there's much of anything here to read into.
Quad a53 handheld, AMD designed modified A72 stationary with Radeon graphics IP? I think I'd be cool with that.
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
MediaTek and OSS? Ha ha. Their reputation in the linux world is second worse only to Allwinner's (which are where they are only because the community has spent gargantuan efforts to reverse-engineer Allwinner's bottom-low-cost products). MT are none better than the rest, with that SoC in particular. A HiSilicon or a Snapdragon would have been much smoother choices if it was about adequate SoC vendor support. Heck, a subsidized CherryTrail would have been a smoother debut (see Jolla for reference).
So basically you got perfectly fine what I was sayin*, you just felt like chatting. Fine with me : )
Everybody would, sans a few kids who watched one-too-many commercials.
* That the SoC they chose was deemed capable of doing the job of a light desktop runner.
LordOfChaos
Member
This is an old article but it was well written and explains the benefits of the NX going with cartridges
These quotes are sort of the main talking points in relation to the benefits of it. There is a lot more at the link and I'd suggest giving it a read.
Read more at http://gamingbolt.com/nintendo-nx-w...-work-in-the-big-ns-favor#WD7BSdkGm6vKQm5v.99
These quotes are sort of the main talking points in relation to the benefits of it. There is a lot more at the link and I'd suggest giving it a read.
Read more at http://gamingbolt.com/nintendo-nx-w...-work-in-the-big-ns-favor#WD7BSdkGm6vKQm5v.99
Graphics Horse
Member
I would be a bit cautious of thinking cards are instant loading, it's not like NES->GBA cartridges where accessing a cart was a comparable speed to accessing internal ram.
You only have to look at an eShop game installed to internal storage to know loading from solid state isn't instant. Handheld games tend to have lower storage but loading times have been a thing since DS cards. Some hide it better than others.
Having said that, cards r cool and I hope they use them! It's a good time to quit discs.
You only have to look at an eShop game installed to internal storage to know loading from solid state isn't instant. Handheld games tend to have lower storage but loading times have been a thing since DS cards. Some hide it better than others.
Having said that, cards r cool and I hope they use them! It's a good time to quit discs.
Different era, different Nintendo, different CEO. We don't got Yamauchi anymore.
OG_Original Gamer
Member
ReyVGM
Member
He's a producer on Star Fox Zero, not a director. An d in that capacity:
Miyamoto is always the producer, rarely the director. Check your game credits and you'll see.
Cartridges...Thinking about FFVIIR just maybe coming to NX after its timed exclusivity ends is poetic enough, thinking about it coming to NX on a cartridge...lol .
I mean if NX can run it, which, who knows, it might not be able to, and it sells well enough at least in Japan, which is another big if, I'd imagine FFVIIR would come to NX when it comes to PC/Xbox. We'll see. Personally, I'm dubious of FFVIIR and more so with every reveal but this would be a very amusing occurrence.
. I mean if NX can run it, which, who knows, it might not be able to, and it sells well enough at least in Japan, which is another big if, I'd imagine FFVIIR would come to NX when it comes to PC/Xbox. We'll see. Personally, I'm dubious of FFVIIR and more so with every reveal but this would be a very amusing occurrence.
Lol yeah that would be funny. But times have changed and these cartridges are not like the ones used from NES-N64.Cartridges...Thinking about FFVIIR just maybe coming to NX after its timed exclusivity ends is poetic enough, thinking about it coming to NX on a cartridge...lol
I mean if NX can run it, which, who knows, it might not be able to, and it sells well enough at least in Japan, which is another big if, I'd imagine FFVIIR would come to NX when it comes to PC/Xbox. We'll see. Personally, I'm dubious of FFVIIR and more so with every reveal but this would be a very amusing occurrence.
Fahzgoolin
Banned
If the NX truly goes with a cartridge design, it instantly becomes massively appealing to me.
It's that weird or uncommon to feel they way?
The perks of cartridges aside, the tangible nature of it is just so fun to me.
It's that weird or uncommon to feel they way?
The perks of cartridges aside, the tangible nature of it is just so fun to me.
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