Unity3D will never be adopted for really big console projects as long as they don't change some base concepts. The 3.5 feature set seems to be a step in the right direction but it's still too focused on hobbyists, web developers and mobile developers. A list of fancy visual effects is not what matters for seasoned devs.ElectricThunder said:
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Which engine will dominate next-gen?
- Thread starter Gram Negative Cocci
- Start date
funkystudent
Member
Unreal probably. Alot of devs use it and epic will probably make it easy to move stuff over to the next iteration of the engine.
Hope they can get more consistent across consoles. The engine is a joke on ps3 which is probably because of a mix of Epics close relationship with microsoft and the weird hardware of the ps3.
When the iphone version has Anti Aliasing and he ps3 version doesnt maybe you should fix that.
Hope they can get more consistent across consoles. The engine is a joke on ps3 which is probably because of a mix of Epics close relationship with microsoft and the weird hardware of the ps3.
When the iphone version has Anti Aliasing and he ps3 version doesnt maybe you should fix that.
element
Member
99% of the discussion here is about tools not the engine. Most developers use middleware for the toolset, and make modifications in the engine to best fit their project. Take BioShock Infinite, it uses Unreal, but they have written their own lighting renderer. Most developers make large modifications to even licensed engines.
Unreal will continue to be the most widely licensed middleware. The number of studios using it currently is only going to continue to grow, and the number of users getting their first experience with tools is with Unreal, so the talent pool will continue to grow.
One of the main reason why Epic will continue to be at number one is SUPPORT. Epic releases monthly bug fixes to the editor and underlying engine, as well as having a robust ticket system if issues arise during development. Majority of game developers using Unreal happen to be in North America, and Epic is in North Carolina, so most issues can be addressed in a couple hours. That wouldn't be the case if support was in Europe.
CryEngine 3 will gain support, but it is going to need a AAA game outside a game being developed by Crytek to do so. It would help if they opened a support office in North America.
Unreal will continue to be the most widely licensed middleware. The number of studios using it currently is only going to continue to grow, and the number of users getting their first experience with tools is with Unreal, so the talent pool will continue to grow.
One of the main reason why Epic will continue to be at number one is SUPPORT. Epic releases monthly bug fixes to the editor and underlying engine, as well as having a robust ticket system if issues arise during development. Majority of game developers using Unreal happen to be in North America, and Epic is in North Carolina, so most issues can be addressed in a couple hours. That wouldn't be the case if support was in Europe.
CryEngine 3 will gain support, but it is going to need a AAA game outside a game being developed by Crytek to do so. It would help if they opened a support office in North America.
I guess we can't know anything on the outside, but do you think the Too Human lawsuit was an isolated case, and/or Epic's support got better after the fact? I thought one of the key points of the lawsuit was that Epic claimed certain things were possible with the engine, or claimed they would provide a certain level of support, but they instead focused their own efforts on a Gears of War game and didn't help the Too Human people enough.element said:
I don't know if it's true, but I just wondered if you had any additional info on it.
TacticalFox88
Banned
CryEngine 4. Crytek will probably have it out by then, so yeah.....it.
A Black Falcon
Member
It is too bad that id isn't going to be licensing their engine out this time apparently, the Doom and Quake engines were so good with that, and Epic needs some competition...
A Black Falcon
Member
I did indeed.Snuggler said:
Most popular? Unreal Engine, without a doubt. It's not like Epic Games is just sitting there doing nothing. They got a bunch of people working on the engine all the time, they keep adding new features and I would bet they will try and go for better illumination tools soon (ala CryEngine).
What Unreal Engine is missing right now, imo, is the strength to do great open environments like CryEngine does, and the whole lightmass setup (tons of wasted time waiting for the light to get baked). If they get good real time lighting and shadows going on without much of a performance hit, then it would be godly
Anyway, I can't see any engine other than Unreal Engine or CryEngine being on the top. There are smaller engines like Unity3D that might get slightly bigger on the smartphone market, and... that's about it. And even then, Unreal Engine is available for iOS (not Android afaik, but that could change) and you don't need an extra license besides the Apple one, to do stuff and get it on your iOS device.
Which reminds me, one of these days I will grab an iOS license and do something with UDK Hopefully someone can work out a 3D model viewer for the iPad. That would be.. epic.
What Unreal Engine is missing right now, imo, is the strength to do great open environments like CryEngine does, and the whole lightmass setup (tons of wasted time waiting for the light to get baked). If they get good real time lighting and shadows going on without much of a performance hit, then it would be godly
Anyway, I can't see any engine other than Unreal Engine or CryEngine being on the top. There are smaller engines like Unity3D that might get slightly bigger on the smartphone market, and... that's about it. And even then, Unreal Engine is available for iOS (not Android afaik, but that could change) and you don't need an extra license besides the Apple one, to do stuff and get it on your iOS device.
Which reminds me, one of these days I will grab an iOS license and do something with UDK
Hopefully someone can work out a 3D model viewer for the iPad. That would be.. epic.PuppetSlave
Member
Finaika said:
First thought I had when Sega announced their support of the Wii U, was please bring back this series to a console then. And a proper sequel and not a port but I guess I know whats gonna happen...
According to this article, Android support should (might?) eventually happen.Mik2121 said:
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/33958/Epics_Rein_UDK_Will_Eventually_Come_To_Android.php
In addition, this platform page shows Android, Sony NGP, and mentions Mac OS is in development: http://www.unrealengine.com/platforms
Phonomezer
Banned
I would love to see CryEngine 3 being used in a genre outside of FPS. Crysis 2 is top-tier on consoles.
bloodforge
Member
I fully expect Unreal Engine to dominate next gen as it did this one.
I'd like to see this too.
Phonomezer said:
I'd like to see this too.
element
Member
This always makes me sad when I see things like this. An engine isn't magically going to make a game run at 60 FPS, it is the content. Every developer using Unreal, CryEngine, Unity, MT Framework, or whatever can make their game 60 FPS if they wanted to, but it comes as concessions in other areas. Using a certain engine doesn't magically make it easier to run at 60 FPS.
GhostWriter24
Member
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAFinaika said:
I wish =(
Garrus Vakarian
Member
Bjoern the Smexy
Member
Actually I have nothing against developers using the engine which they are most comfortable with.
If so many developers switch to UE3, then so be it.
Many developers are doing GREAT things with it (BioShock from Irrational Games, Alice from Spicy Horse, Mortal Kombat 9 from Netherrealm, they all look great).
If Valve ever get's developers to use their Source Engine it'd be okay too. The Source Engine is an amazin piece of technology, always getting updated and although it made it's debut with Half-Life 2 in 2004, the more recent games made with it (Portal 2, Left 4 Dead 2), although all in-house developments at Valve, are still looking damn good.
I'm always amazed over how realistic Left 4 Dead 2 looks compared to many games made with UE3, not in terms of polygon counts or anything, but more the general all-around design.
So i my opinion: I don't care, which engine will be the best 5 years from now, as long as I can play the games I wanna play at an acceptable framerate with acceptable texture resolution plastered on models with an acceptable polygon count in an acceptable environment with acceptable gameplay ideas.
So yeah. I'm a gamer. I game what I wanna game and I don't let no stinking engine rule over how much fun I'm going to have.
If so many developers switch to UE3, then so be it.
Many developers are doing GREAT things with it (BioShock from Irrational Games, Alice from Spicy Horse, Mortal Kombat 9 from Netherrealm, they all look great).
If Valve ever get's developers to use their Source Engine it'd be okay too. The Source Engine is an amazin piece of technology, always getting updated and although it made it's debut with Half-Life 2 in 2004, the more recent games made with it (Portal 2, Left 4 Dead 2), although all in-house developments at Valve, are still looking damn good.
I'm always amazed over how realistic Left 4 Dead 2 looks compared to many games made with UE3, not in terms of polygon counts or anything, but more the general all-around design.
So i my opinion: I don't care, which engine will be the best 5 years from now, as long as I can play the games I wanna play at an acceptable framerate with acceptable texture resolution plastered on models with an acceptable polygon count in an acceptable environment with acceptable gameplay ideas.
So yeah. I'm a gamer. I game what I wanna game and I don't let no stinking engine rule over how much fun I'm going to have.
Unknown Soldier
Member
Canvas Engine didn't do AA on either PS3 or PSP. I would need a pretty damned convincing reason why Sega should use it again, VC didn't really look that great from a technical standpoint and you can do the cel-shading effect as a shader program on UE3 if you wanted.
Mohonky
Member
What is everyones problem with UE3 exactly? The biggest problem with the engine is many developers have failed to really adapt it to their game and has basically just injected it into their title without making any real effort to tailor it to their needs.
There have been plenty of games that have looked gorgeous on that engine, when and if the developer has actually done something other than try and copy and paste a gears game to it.
There have been plenty of games that have looked gorgeous on that engine, when and if the developer has actually done something other than try and copy and paste a gears game to it.
~Devil Trigger~
In favor of setting Muslim women on fire
name one thats not Mortal Kombat(was Unreal Tourney 60fps? cant remember)RedSwirl said:
SneakyStephan
Banned
Mohonky said:
Because all games made on it have looked the same.
The addition of lightmass etc semi recently makes it look a bit different than games made before, but there are like 1-2 games out there only where you can't immediately tell from a mile away that it's UE3.
Many engines have their own look, from the quake 2 engine, to source, to ue3, and seeing that same fucking look in every second game got tiresome a while ago.
Hurhur we can copy meshes efficiently , lets spam a level full of the same dozen meshes repeated over and over that'll be cool and go for maximum symmetry while we are at it, ugh.
(+the shitty AA support really bugs me too).
unreal engine why is this even a debate, its the most scalable, best performing on fixed hardware, most user friendly, diverse toolsets libraries, and most professionals are experienced with it which means cheaper labor.
the UE "look" is a fallacy and people that dont understand how rendering works and ignorantly parrot it. the reason it looks the way it does is because they went with the defaults and created art assets to fit that look. borderlands, alice, blue dragon, XIII, Red Steel, Hawken just examples of games which look completely different from other unreal games.
the UE "look" is a fallacy and people that dont understand how rendering works and ignorantly parrot it. the reason it looks the way it does is because they went with the defaults and created art assets to fit that look. borderlands, alice, blue dragon, XIII, Red Steel, Hawken just examples of games which look completely different from other unreal games.
DanielJr82
Member
Can the Unreal Engine even do open world games? What engine do they use in GTAIV and RDR? That's some impressive tech, there.
DanielJr82 said:
its rockstar's inhouse engine RAGE (Rockstar Advanced Game Engine) started with Table Tennis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockstar_Advanced_Game_Engine
I have a feeling that because of sooooo many developers working with UE3 this generation, there will be a massive migration to UE4 simply because the tools will be so familiar to so many. Say what you will about the "UE3 look", Ps3/360 developers who put in the time and effort to make their game look unique were still able to do so. Hopefully the next iteration will be home to even more varied themes, while cutting back on the vaseline.
SneakyStephan
Banned
element said:
You misread what I wrote.
I didn't say there are only two games out there that use it, I said there are only 1-2 games out there of which I couldn't immediately tell that they use UE3. (seperate of the lightmass comment).
S8 prejudice uses it, and it looks like any other ue3 game, just a bit better.
Oh and I forgot, lol@ that 2D background featuring the capitol etc in samaritan demo.
Claim next gen engine but it needs 3x gtx580, wastes 90 percent of resources on bokeh DOF, still has lighting that gets shat on by the radiosity from frostbite 2, but make it super colorful and flashy so people will notice it, then have 2d skybox and backgrounds like it's 1999 and we are watching half life 1.
I wish there was better (and more efficient) AA support. Mirror's Edge is the only UE3 game I've played that I remember doing it well and having support out of the box. Plus, performance was even decent.SneakyStephan said:
Regarding meshes though...what are you talking about? Are you saying an engine is to blame if level designers reuse the same meshes everywhere? =P
SneakyStephan
Banned
Blizzard said:
Yes, because it is a laborious pain in the ass to use the engine and place lights and align everything, and it's easy to just copy paste meshes + groups of lights and put them all over the place (aka mirror EVERYTHING yo) , alignment and all.
It's kind of easy to learn to use but it just feels like really akward labor intensive lego.
Epic pushed the idea of repeating meshes because their engine can do it on the cheap without affecting performance much.
You saw those highly detailed cluttered tech demos and those were achieved by doing just that.
Way too many UE3 games do it, and even the ones with devs that do go the extra mile (which the engine doesn't encourage) end up with the uncanny faces and models, 2d backgrounds and skyboxes, UE3 trademark jaggies (and bad forced AA performance) , terrible vegetation etc etc which gives them that UE3 look.
SneakyStephan
Banned
element said:
Bulletstorm did it, mass effect does it, like all ue3 games do it. (the 2d backgrounds).
Games that do have an AA option in the menu (same kinda driver forced AA I guess) and repeat geometry a little less , well they always run like a dog compared to the ones that don't.
Bulletstorm is the latest example of that.
Yes and no. How each engine creates the behaviour of light also influences it. Two different engines producing (at stock) the very same effect will look different. Good art overcomes/changes all of this, of course, but having a certain 'UE look' or 'Source look' isn't just down to the artists.element said:
les papillons sexuels
Banned
SneakyStephan said:
uhh, every game uses 2d backgrounds, even when a game does a good job of masking it like in halo reach, there's still a 2d skybox at the very end.