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Which engine will dominate next-gen?

G

Gravijah

Member
ArjanN said:
14nikya.gif
Click to expand...

That hair movement is so weird looking.
 
Alexios

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Gram Negative Cocci said:
According to Epic if it wasn't for one feature costing them a 40% loss in frame rate they could have easily optimized Samaritan to run on just one GTX 580. It's perfectly doable on current PCs. Just behind closed doors :(
Click to expand...
Does the comparison shot/video have that one feature off? Of course if they "optimised" ie scaled polycounts, lighting & shadowing complexity, removed whatever that feature is, scaled motion blur, particle physics, texture resolution, etc, etc, etc it would be on par with current gen stuff and so comparable and running on the same hardware.
 
S

Saige

I must do better.
Is CD Projekt’s RED Engine available for licence? I remember them talking about how much work they put into it to make it great for developing non-linear games.

I doubt it will become the standard engine for most games, but I would like to see it used more.
 
O

Orayn

Member
I'd like to see what CryEngine 3 can do. There's going to be a UDK-like release in August, so that may lead to some interesting projects.
Also, I'd like to see an externally licensed, international version of Capcom's MT Framework. It makes for some really pretty games, even if it's a little rigid. Heck, Dead Rising had better object motion blur than almost any game I've every seen, and that was on the 360 in 2006.
 
J

jagowar

Member
I know this would be a huge undertaking but I almost hope one of the console manufacturers will get into the engine game and give it away to develop for their console. Since they control the hardware I could see a big benefit to having an engine optimized for that hardware.
 
Alexios

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
TekkenMaster said:
So did Unreal just recently get a plugin for hair, or has it had hair all along but devs suck and didn't use it?
Click to expand...
I'm sure anyone could have either done hair the good old fashioned way with some shaders, alpha maps and canned animations, that they should be able to get convincing results with for most cases, or just had their programmers implement their own hair physics. They just didn't care to.
 
S

StuBurns

Banned
UE3 will still be most likely. Frostbite is EA exclusive. In fact I could see all the major publishers having a single internal engine each in the future.
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
TekkenMaster said:
So did Unreal just recently get a plugin for hair, or has it had hair all along but devs suck and didn't use it?
Click to expand...
Epic's been upgrading the engine a lot over the years and some developers do extra work on it as well.

You can also see improvements with Gears of War 3 and Mass Effect 3.

unled3copyv.png


image_gears_of_war_3-1sc8n.jpg
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
_dementia said:
Thanks for the help, but no need to be so condescending. :(
Click to expand...

I didn't mean to be condescending. I though that Alice is pretty iconic to recognize her.
 
M

Mr_Brit

Banned
Alextended said:
I'm sure anyone could have either done hair the good old fashioned way with some shaders, alpha maps and canned animations, that they should be able to get convincing results with for most cases, or just had their programmers implement their own hair physics. They just didn't care to.
Click to expand...
There are very few games with good hair due to the lack of good middleware for hair as it it difficult to get right and takes a lot of time/computational power. If someone were to make good middleware for making nice hair cheaply and quickly then you'd see a lot more games with it.
 
N

NBtoaster

Member
TekkenMaster said:
So did Unreal just recently get a plugin for hair, or has it had hair all along but devs suck and didn't use it?
Click to expand...

It's using Physx for that, so it's not actually part of UE3.
 
Alexios

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Mr_Brit said:
There are very few games with good hair due to the lack of good middleware for hair as it it difficult to get right and takes a lot of time/computational power. If someone were to make good middleware for making nice hair cheaply and quickly then you'd see a lot more games with it.
Click to expand...
Well that would depend on your standards. To remove subjectivity from the equation, I'm sure they could have had far better results than most Unreal Engine games bothered to, if they actually tried. They wouldn't be the most awesome and natural hair ever, but I don't see why they restricted the design so much on it. We had more hair last gen. I mean, I see games like The Witcher 2. Geralt's hair are fine. Not the best, but fine. They'd be almost just as fine even if they didn't have physics and just had a canned animation for that bouncy ponytail too. What stopped other developers from doing hair like that other than their own ability and will? It's just a model like any other, with textures and shaders and the extra of haivng some physics that help make it look more natural in certain cases, but that isn't even mandatory to get at least half decent results with some effort.
 
M

Mr_Brit

Banned
Nirolak said:
Does Asura's Wrath count?

http://images.gamersyde.com/image_asura_s_wrath-15314-2131_0005.jpg[/ IMG][/QUOTE]
That hair looks awful and is a good example of why people think unreal engine can't do hair. Epic really need to add in some hair plugin to their engine that lets people create good looking and realistic hair without having to add separate plugins like the Alice developers had to. Right now it's probably the biggest single issue with the engine.
Click to expand...
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Mr_Brit said:
That hair looks awful and is a good example of why people think unreal engine can't do hair. Epic really need to add in some hair plugin to their engine that lets people create good looking and realistic hair without having to add separate plugins like the Alice developers had to. Right now it's probably the biggest single issue with the engine.
Click to expand...
It was still the best example I could think of. :p

PhysX is an integrated partner though, so it's available to all licensees.
 
A

Alrus

Member
The engine in Samaritan is impressive but it'll be a while before we get that running on consoles considering how power hungry the cards used to run that tech demo were.

I'd say Unreal engine will remain dominant.

About Phyreenine, isn't it a Sony engine? How did From Software get it to work on the 360? (or how were they allowed to?)
 
S

Snuggles

erotic butter maelstrom
Saige said:
Is CD Projekt’s RED Engine available for licence? I remember them talking about how much work they put into it to make it great for developing non-linear games.
Click to expand...

Not yet, but I've read that they are considering it. Supposedly it's created with RPG's/open worlds in mind so I'd like to see that happen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4R7VMF800A (CDPR speaking about the RED engine)
 
Z

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
UE3 will probably continue to dominate. The Samaritan demo shows it's capable enough to handle next-gen, and UE4 looks ways away.

Hopefully CryEngine 2 gathers up a bigger share, though. Everything I've heard says that it makes things easier for developers, even if UE3 is the standard atm.
 
D

dramatis

Member
Mooreberg said:
Who else besides Crytek is using it? I know that Nexuiz port for XBLA is... can't think of anything else.
Click to expand...
There's a Korean sandbox MMO called ArcheAge that's using CryEngine 3.

Aion used CE1, if that's also any help. Don't know if NCSoft is using CE in other games.
ZealousD said:
Hopefully CryEngine 2 gathers up a bigger share, though. Everything I've heard says that it makes things easier for developers, even if UE3 is the standard atm.
Click to expand...
The latest version is CE3 >__> I guess they need to promote more.
 
B

beril

Member
Alrus said:
About Phyreenine, isn't it a Sony engine? How did From Software get it to work on the 360? (or how were they allowed to?)
Click to expand...

Yes it's a Sony engine but I believe you're allowed to use it pretty much how you like. We did the same thing at a company I worked at. It already comes with a DirectX renderer for the PC-version so porting it to the Xbox wasn't that much trouble (though I wasn't really involved in that bit myself).
 
G

Gravijah

Member
subversus said:
always seemed like iconic series to me.
Click to expand...

There are only two games and the first one wasn't massive or anything. Don't get me wrong, they are good games, but not iconic at all.
 
V

Vespene

Member
Japanese companies aren't known for great 3d engines. Sure, their internal titles thrive with platforms like MT Framework and the so called Crystal Tools, but these engines are made in Japanese. The language barrier is a huge obstacle in selling these asian tools internationally.
 
D

dramatis

Member
GT Vespene said:
Japanese companies aren't known for great 3d engines. Sure, their internal titles thrive with platforms like MT Framework and the so called Crystal Tools, but these engines are made in Japanese. The language barrier is a huge obstacle in selling these asian tools internationally.
Click to expand...
:| You don't really program in Japanese.

If you mean that the development companies are Japanese and that forms a barrier, that's ok. Engines need more than just code to be amiable, they need documentation and support.
 
V

Vespene

Member
dramatis said:
:| You don't really program in Japanese.

If you mean that the development companies are Japanese and that forms a barrier, that's ok. Engines need more than just code to be amiable, they need documentation and support.
Click to expand...

Documentation of course, and the language things are displayed on screen.
 
M

Metroid-Squadron

Banned
This thread needs more pictures, gifs, videos, etc...

CryEngine 3:

"Beauty, Speed, Interaction"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tPfM1QnPlo

Cascaded Light Propagation Volumes for Real-Time Indirect Illumination
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPQ3BbuYVh8

GDC 2010
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-D9oINHI11E

GDC 2011
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqNHJ-ekMR4

DX11 Crysis 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRKLB_3qFWE

CryEngine 2 (still applies to CE3, except for the "realtime ambient maps", those were dropped):

2005 trailer:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8B1ZEv02UQ

GDC 2006
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySXCVQWe7vI

GDC 2007:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yG1ZUSCrgqM

And a bonus from a CE2 mod:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4No43o7zkDQ
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Unreal tech is incredible. My only problem with it is the character models and skeletal animation. The characters in Unreal 3 engine don't look human from any physical perspective, unless humans means super roided wrestling freaks.

I hope Witcher 2's TSOOD engine catches like wildfire in the realm of RPG development. It's insane. Insanely good that is. Incredible number of NPCs on screen including huge battles, decals, props, animations and other things going on. No two NPCs look alike (different facial hair/clothes) too. Best of all, simply the best lighting system in any game I've played.

the-witcher-2-tech-det8o5w.jpg


KT0QU.jpg
 
B

beril

Member
Just because no one has mentioned it yet I though I'd bring up Unity. It has gained a lot of traction with indie devs and hobbyist, and has started to get some use in bigger projects as well; though I still don't think there has been a retail console game announced yet. I'm not sure it's really suited for big games, or that it's really that good, but anything could happen. I've worked with it a bit and didn't hate it as much as I expected to. From the little I've seen UE and Gamebryo developementI haven't been really impressed by those either. Personally I think a lot of companies would be better making their own tech
 
S

swordfishtrombones

Member
beril said:
Yes it's a Sony engine but I believe you're allowed to use it pretty much how you like. We did the same thing at a company I worked at. It already comes with a DirectX renderer for the PC-version so porting it to the Xbox wasn't that much trouble (though I wasn't really involved in that bit myself).
Click to expand...

I was surprised to see that Dirt and Grid both ran on PhyreEngine. I always associated it with cartoony, cell-shaded stuff (Atelier, Critter Crunch). But then again, apparently it also gave us flower and Demon's Souls, so I will keep an eye out to see what they can do with this engine.

But to answer the question: UE3+ & CE3
 
D

Dreams-Visions

Member
UE3. It's capable, scalable and most importantly...it's a known quantity that many (most?) developers are familiar with at this point. Anyone else will have a helluva mountain to climb to become as relevant as UE.
 
B

Blizzard

Banned
Nirolak said:
Epic's been upgrading the engine a lot over the years and some developers do extra work on it as well.

You can also see improvements with Gears of War 3 and Mass Effect 3.
Click to expand...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the hair a proprietary modification made by the studio that developed Alice?

NBtoaster said:
It's using Physx for that, so it's not actually part of UE3.
Click to expand...
I think PhysX stuff is basically integrated into UE3, even the UDK, as far as I know.

However, according to this post, the hair is not PhysX. It was custom-made by Milo Yip from Spicy Horse: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=28703399&postcount=876

r_image08brkj.jpg


As for the thread topic itself, I think of the available 3D engines that can be licensed, either UE3/variants and/or CryEngine 3 will be popular. EA games can use Frostbite 2, and other people may use their own engines, but those two seem like the biggest options to me that are available at the moment.
 
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