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[Suzzopher]

Anyway...
So, I was thinking. Are they going to have an online version of the 3DS's MiiPlaza? They'll definitely still use Miis, but for what? They are certainly going to keep evolving them.

That would be cool.

 

[[Nintex]]

GameCube had a great line-up. Some awesome third party games like Soul Calibur II, Tales of Symphonia, Timesplitters 2 and Beyond Good & Evil. A bunch of great Nintendo games like Pikmin 2, F-Zero GX and the Wind Waker and finally some unique titles not found on other systems(untill they were ported anyway) Eternal Darkness, Resident Evil 4, PN03, Viewtful Joe, Killer 7, REmake, Rogue Squadron etc.

The GameCube had an incredible line-up it slowed down after 2004 for sure but that doesn't make it any less awesome. I like the Wii too but the line-up is a river of piss with some gems at the bottom. Honestly, I'm sick of diving into the piss to find the gems.

 

[DECK'ARD]

I see the GC and Wii as 2 sides of the same coin really. Both with obvious downsides, but one with an emphasis on software and the other with the emphasis on creating new experiences. You still had the moments of greatness, Pikmin 1/2 and Galaxy 1/2, but neither had a compelling line-up of software that covered all bases.

GC had a real identity problem, it was a messy console really. The Wii didn't suffer from this, however the identity it did end up with was seen as quite narrow in appeal in the end.

Ideally with the next console Nintendo would strike a balance between trying to differentiate your console through software like the GC and trying to differentiate it through the experience like the Wii. If I had to place bets, it will be experience driven again though.

 

[Graphics Horse]

Someone suggested a system like Home, but good.
I can sort of see it working, mingle with online Miis on the TV, or use the direct menu screen on the controller, which would also warp your Mii to the relevant area. It would give you both options without one getting in the way of the other.

 

[JimboJones]

I would love it if they upgraded the look of mii's slightly, maybe give them like a wood grain texture to make them look more like puppets or somthing rather than the cheap shiney plastic look they have at the minute.

I need a game where I can walk around wuhu island freely, exploring it and doing some light platformng and adventuring.

 

[BGBW]

I like the Wii too but the line-up is a river of piss with some gems at the bottom. Honestly, I'm sick of diving into the piss to find the gems.

I never understood the reasoning that the shovelware on Wii makes the awesome games less awesome. It's like before you can purchase a title you have to go through the equation:

Super Mario Galaxy - Imagine Party Babyz = not worth my time.​

Makes no sense. Just ignore them. It's not like they are sitting on your shelf when you get back home.

 

[Metallix]

I need a game where I can walk around wuhu island freely, exploring it and doing some light platformng and adventuring.

Go go Star Tropics Resort!?!

 

[1-D_FTW]

"All digital future" can fuck itself right off a cliff.
I dont want that, at all



No way this will happen.

Back when Steam was locked in at 49.99 for Sega Rally Revo and Gamestop was selling it on their website for 9.99, I still hated DD and used Steam as a necessary evil. Now? DD is awesome. The problem is when companies wanna use it as a monopoly to force games to remain at MSRP for eternity. When it applies the free market principles and becomes what DD has become on mobiles and PC, it's awesome. As evidenced by PSPGo, I don't really believe console makers could ever pull off the first strategy. They could/will try, but I firmly believe it'll be a disaster. But if they adjust and eventually adopt the same models as everyone else, it's a great future. Gamers get cheaper and more varied lineups, and publishers cut out the lepers know as retail and used game sales.

I've been a constant defender of used game sales on the premise they're a symptom of the disease (broken pricing structures). But under the iOS/Steam/PC DD models, it doesn't bother me one bit. I'll trade that "right" for much more aggressive pricing that saves me money and funnels what I do spend directly to the publishers. When done correctly (which is something MS/Nintendo/Sony have yet to do), it's win-win for everyone involved.

P.S. This means you own the library. None of this locked to one machine crap that Nintendo/MS pull.

 

[CaptainDa]

Yeah, the Miis! Didn't really think about that yet. It's almost a given, I think, that the Wii2 will have Miis as well. I wonder if they'll revamp the low poly, yet functional models. I loved making them cause of their simplicity. It was so easy to make a spitting image of all my friends.

 

[nckillthegrimace]

I would love it if they upgraded the look of mii's slightly, maybe give them like a wood grain texture to make them look more like puppets or somthing rather than the cheap shiney plastic look they have at the minute.

I really like that idea. If I may add to it, they should also have marionette strings and dead, doll eyes.

 

[[Nintex]]

Makes no sense. Just ignore them. It's not like they are sitting on your shelf when you get back home.

Yes they are it sucks to get review copies of that shit I tell ya.

Also, it's not just the line-up that is ass. The GameCube was high tech when it came out we were all stunned to see such a small box with so much power. The small disks, that was living in the future baby. The Wii... is... well... ;_;

 

[DECK'ARD]

I never understood the reasoning that the shovelware on Wii makes the awesome games less awesome. It's like before you can purchase a title you have to go through the equation:

Super Mario Galaxy - Imagine Party Babyz = not worth my time.​

Makes no sense. Just ignore them. It's not like they are sitting on your shelf when you get back home.

Yeah, it's a silly argument. The shovelware explosion of the Wii was just due to the combination of it's popularity and the casual angle. The PS2 had just as much crap, the Wii is just an easier target because of how it was marketed and the fact 3rd parties were off doing their HD thing.

The GC was niche, it never received all that so people remember the good stuff. I'd never say the GC was a golden-age for Nintendo though, not in say the way the Dreamcast was a golden-age for Sega creatively.

Nintendo can do better all-round than both the GC, and the Wii. It just depends on what angle they are going to go for, and what their priorities are.

 

[AceBandage]

Someone suggested a system like Home, but good.
I can sort of see it working, mingle with online Miis on the TV, or use the direct menu screen on the controller, which would also warp your Mii to the relevant area. It would give you both options without one getting in the way of the other.

The problem with Home is there isn't a lot to do, and what there is to do costs REAL money.
And this is after being developed for the entire generation and then some.

Something smaller and simpler would be better, like a Wuhu Island where you can explore it as your Mii with everyone else. And just keep in all the WSR games to play against other people.

 

[BGBW]

Yeah, the Miis! Didn't really think about that yet. It's almost a given, I think, that the Wii2 will have Miis as well. I wonder if they'll revamp the low poly, yet functional models. I loved making them cause of their simplicity. It was so easy to make a spitting image of all my friends.

If N6 and 3DS support connectivity I'll assume they have an equal number of parts. I like the simplicity of them and the fact that the focus is on the face rather than accessories like Avatars on the 360.

 

[fabricated backlash]

I would love it if they upgraded the look of mii's slightly, maybe give them like a wood grain texture to make them look more like puppets or somthing rather than the cheap shiney plastic look they have at the minute.

I need a game where I can walk around wuhu island freely, exploring it and doing some light platformng and adventuring.

Or combining Animal Crossing with Wuhu island. Basically you could have an Island for yourself serving as your Space, with Wuhu Island being the online hub where you can meet other players etc.

I would be down for that.

 

[From The Dust]

I'm still surprised there was no "Mii City" like concept on the Wii. I guess it was a limtation of the online? in either way, a Home-like app would be cool if they can keep support of it

 

[JGS]

I'm probably one of the few people who prefers the Wii over the Gamecube, but I can definitely understand the love for the latter.

I see the Wii as an extension of GC, but I see the GC as much more gamer friendly console.

I honestly think nintendo drank too much of their own graphics over gameplay kool-aid.

While I agree with that concept, it was disappointing that a majority of their games were GC level or less even though the Wii could do better than that. They cheaped out for no good reason considering how much money they were making.

So the Wii for me was meh simply because of the philosophies adopted. Nintendo basically let the thing sell itself. The marketing even slacked off big time after the first year or so (Particularly after Wiifit).

GC had a bit of a desperation about it that the Wii never had, so after they front loaded it with releases or announcements, they seemed to focus on DS & Mii titles.

 

[DECK'ARD]

The talk of online hubs and stuff is interesting, because this was one of the Wii's biggest missed-opportunities. With Wii Connect 24 you could have pulled down other people's savefiles (ie. their towns in Animal Crossing) and visit them even without them having to be using their Wii. You wouldn't even need servers.

Wii Connect 24 was a really good idea, but totally squandered. I hope they build on it with the next console, along with all the other online things they need to do.

 

[ReyVGM]

GameCube had a great line-up. Some awesome third party games like Soul Calibur II, Tales of Symphonia, Timesplitters 2 and Beyond Good & Evil. A bunch of great Nintendo games like Pikmin 2, F-Zero GX and the Wind Waker and finally some unique titles not found on other systems(untill they were ported anyway) Eternal Darkness, Resident Evil 4, PN03, Viewtful Joe, Killer 7, REmake, Rogue Squadron etc.

The GameCube had an incredible line-up it slowed down after 2004 for sure but that doesn't make it any less awesome. I like the Wii too but the line-up is a river of piss with some gems at the bottom. Honestly, I'm sick of diving into the piss to find the gems.

Indeed. I think what killed the GC was the look of the console. People saw the PS2 and Xbox and saw a mature console, but the GC looked like a toy (specially with that damned handle). It didn't matter than the GC had almost the same 3rd party library as the Xbox (and much much better exclusive 1st party games).

 

[blu]

Well, it was 18 months to be more accurate. Though as the link notes, it then sold enough to warrant restarting production.

That article is making some very far-stretched conjectures there, to put it mildly. Namely, that nintendo decided to end-life the cube, and then changed their minds after some sort of a last-moment fluke in the shape of a desperate price cut. How about: of course they'd leave their old supplies run out if they were planning to release a streamlined redesign.

ed: On a second read, the conjectures were not so much in the article as me projecting the discussion from this thread onto that article. Anyway, point being, the fact production of cubes stopped temporarily implies only one thing: that the vendor meant to clear out stock. The fact production resumed with a new, cheaper revision imply the vendor felt confident about marketing their revised product at the new pricepoint.

 

[Metallix]

I'm still surprised there was no "Mii City" like concept on the Wii. I guess it was a limtation of the online? in either way, a Home-like app would be cool if they can keep support of it

I believe the Mii Plaza on 3DS is a test of such a concept. I fully expect a "Mii Resort" set on Wuhu for the Cafe.

 

[Plinko]

The talk of online hubs and stuff is interesting, because this was one of the Wii's biggest missed-opportunities. With Wii Connect 24 you could have pulled down other people's savefiles (ie. their towns in Animal Crossing) and visit them even without them having to be using their Wii. You wouldn't even need servers.

Wii Connect 24 was a really good idea, but totally squandered. I hope they build on it with the next console, along with all the other online things they need to do.

Agreed--and they're squandering it again with the 3DS. The ability to trade Miis through Streetpass is the focus instead of allowing to download Miis through a WiiConnect-like process is a huge mistake.

 

[From The Dust]

I believe the Mii Plaza on 3DS is a test of such a concept. I fully expect a "Mii Resort" set on Wuhu for the Cafe.

it would be a great online hub app if done properly

 

[DECK'ARD]

Indeed. I think what killed the GC was the look of the console. People saw the PS2 and Xbox and saw a mature console, but the GC looked like a toy (specially with that damned handle). It didn't matter than the GC had almost the same 3rd party library as the Xbox (and much much better exclusive 1st party games).

GC was nice hardware, but everything about it was a Nintendo that was totally insulated at the time from everything else that was going on. Everything from the design of the console, to the pad's button layout, to the disc format. It was all wrong from a perspective of what was happening to the industry outside Nintendo. It was doomed from day 1.

They fixed most of those mistakes with the Wii, the design of everything was spot-on. As was the marketing for what they were aiming at. The 'ignoring what the industry was doing' aspect this time round, HD, was also deliberate. Whether they choose to ignore the industry again, or combine the approaches of both the Wii and GC, is the most interesting aspect of the next console.

From Iwata's comments in theory, and some of the rumours, we should expect a combination of both. But the odd-ball nature of most of the rumours makes me not so sure, as does Nintendo saying absolutely nothing about the angle of the system until E3.

It's definitely going to be the most interesting console unveiling in a long while.

 

[SuperJay]

It might be cool if they built in a version of Animal Crossing as a home-like hub world for the console, but that's probably too cutesy for a system supposedly targeting hardcore gamers.

 

[abstract alien]

It might be cool if they built in a version of Animal Crossing as a home-like hub world for the console, but that's probably too cutesy for a system supposedly targeting hardcore gamers.

This is what a friend and I discussed the moment the announced Wii Connect 24 and all its other features. I figured that they would surely have an Animal Crossing Channel as it just made too much sense.

Never happened :^(

 

[Metallix]

it would be a great online hub app if done properly

Agreed. Sony had a fantastic idea with Home, but failed to implement it properly. I think Nintendo could take the concept and run with it.

 

[Graphics Horse]

It might be cool if they built in a version of Animal Crossing as a home-like hub world for the console, but that's probably too cutesy for a system supposedly targeting hardcore gamers.

Yeah it should be creepy mannequins like Home to appeal to teh harcores...
They already have bald and bearded Miis, the just need to add an over the shoulder view and AK & pouch accessories.

 

[VisanidethDM]

That article is making some very far-stretched conjectures there, to put it mildly. Namely, that nintendo decided to end-life the cube, and then changed their minds after some sort of a last-moment fluke in the shape of a desperate price cut. How about: of course they'd leave their old supplies run out if they were planning to release a streamlined redesign.

ed: On a second read, the conjectures were not so much in the article as me projecting the discussion from this thread onto that article. Anyway, point being, the fact production of cubes stopped temporarily implies only one thing: that the vendor meant to clear out stock. The fact production resumed with a new, cheaper revision imply the vendor felt confident about marketing their revised product at the new pricepoint.

You may try to rationalize it and dig more on the context, but it's not up to detabate whether the GCN was a success or not. It was a colossal bomba of unheard of proportions for Nintendo.

What concerns me in this case is that despite its flaws, the GCN was a good console with good, if not excellent software. And it failed, miserably, for circumstantial and timing problems Nintendo seems to be hell bent in repeating.

What I'm worried of is that someone, up there, may be thinking "we failed cause we went Hardcore, now look at the Wii!" instead of "We really need to try and understand the hardcore crowd, and third party developers, and stop releasing low-specc machines at the worst time possible".

 

[ReyVGM]

GC was nice hardware, but everything about it was a Nintendo that was totally insulated at the time from everything else that was going on. Everything from the design of the console, to the pad's button layout, to the disc format. It was all wrong from a perspective of what was happening to the industry outside Nintendo. It was doomed from day 1.

Everything else I understand, but I don't get why people keep bringing up the disc format. The discs were fine. No one really cared about the format or size since most games fit easily. Remember that unless a game was FMV intensive, it probably didn't even fill half of a normal DVD. And those FMV intensive games were mostly Japanese, which weren't going to come to the GC anyways since back then the PS2 was the one getting everything.

The only time I heard a developer saying "no" to a GC port due to the disc size, was EA (or one of those Sport companies) because they couldn't fit all the data/stats on one disc. And making a two-disc game wouldn't be an issue except a sports game with 2 discs just doesn't fly.

Now, I'm not saying no one else complained, but I don't remember reading about it. And back then I was an avid GC follower that read everything about it.

Aside from that, the discs were just fine. Except the petit discs looked silly or toy-like, right along with the design of the console.

 

[Pathetic Basement Virgin]

GameCube had a great line-up. Some awesome third party games like Soul Calibur II, Tales of Symphonia, Timesplitters 2 and Beyond Good & Evil. A bunch of great Nintendo games like Pikmin 2, F-Zero GX and the Wind Waker and finally some unique titles not found on other systems(untill they were ported anyway) Eternal Darkness, Resident Evil 4, PN03, Viewtful Joe, Killer 7, REmake, Rogue Squadron etc.

The GameCube had an incredible line-up it slowed down after 2004 for sure but that doesn't make it any less awesome. I like the Wii too but the line-up is a river of piss with some gems at the bottom. Honestly, I'm sick of diving into the piss to find the gems.

So you are the the only dumbass that played random Wii games til you found a decent one? At least that is what your story is saying.

I managed to avoid piss on every system I've ever ovwned except for NES being a kid & all.

 

[brochiller]

Another flaw, although probably not a game breaking one, for the Gamecube was the memory card size. Anybody else remember Memory Card 59's? I fucking hated those things. A franchise in Madden took up an entire memory card. I still have a ton of them in a box somewhere. The 512 kB was not nearly enough and this was while Sony was making 8 MB memory cards for the PS2. Nintendo didn't start making the 8MB memory cards until the end of the Gamecube's lifecycle.

 

[Oppo]

I think if Home were on the Wii, with the Mii avatars, it would be a bigger hit than it is on the Sony system.

It's not true that there's not a lot to do - there's tons to do. It's just that most of it is a bit boring. But the games are for the most part (entirely?) free, it's just the items/houses that cost ya.

I still think Home is a good concept, it just needs an overhaul. They have improved it considerably since launch, but some core problems remain.

 

[blu]

Aside from that, the discs were just fine. Except the petit discs looked silly or toy-like, right along with the design of the console.

Those petit disks also offered seek times developers on the other consoles could only dream about.

 

[[Nintex]]

So you are the the only dumbass that played random Wii games til you found a decent one? At least that is what your story is saying.

I managed to avoid piss on every system I've ever ovwned except for NES being a kid & all.

The piss also refers to the shitty online system, the stupid friendcodes or the shoddy motion controls among other things. Also:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=27641776&postcount=8812

 

[VisanidethDM]

So you are the the only dumbass that played random Wii games til you found a decent one? At least that is what your story is saying.

I managed to avoid piss on every system I've ever ovwned except for NES being a kid & all.

Avoiding the piss among Wii games is an act of epic dexterity. The good-to-bad game ratio is something like 1-to-212564869761203431201383203billions.

The Wii has good games, for sure, but it's probably the single console in all of history with the lowest average software quality, and that's including the Jaguard and the 3DO.

 

[BGBW]

Indeed. I think what killed the GC was the look of the console. People saw the PS2 and Xbox and saw a mature console, but the GC looked like a toy (specially with that damned handle). It didn't matter than the GC had almost the same 3rd party library as the Xbox (and much much better exclusive 1st party games).

Funny because I remember in the early days people describing it as the "iMac" of the systems because of its looks. To be fair, it was competing with the XBox.

 

[manueldelalas]

Avoiding the piss among Wii games is an act of epic dexterity. The good-to-bad game ratio is something like 1-to-212564869761203431201383203billions.

The Wii has good games, for sure, but it's probably the single console in all of history with the lowest average software quality, and that's including the Jaguard and the 3DO.

It's probably the same ratio of good/bad games the PS2 had. Just saying. Shovelware goes to the biggest selling console, big news, stop the presses.

 

[ReyVGM]

Those petit disks also offered seek times developers on the other consoles could only dream about.

Not on 3rd party games from USA or European companies. I remember having to wait a long time for games like XIII or Splinter Cell to load. They were just porting the games without improving the load times.

The Wii has good games, for sure, but it's probably the single console in all of history with the lowest average software quality, and that's including the Jaguard and the 3DO.

Now you are just being mean. The Jaguar and 3DO had NOTHING. Well, maybe that Aliens vs predator game and a few decent FMV games for the 3DO, but after that, the Wii is miles ahead of them.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

Avoiding the piss among Wii games is an act of epic dexterity. The good-to-bad game ratio is something like 1-to-212564869761203431201383203billions.

The Wii has good games, for sure, but it's probably the single console in all of history with the lowest average software quality, and that's including the Jaguard and the 3DO.

I'd understand if you meant for the general public, but how can people who are members from forums such as this one be affected when it comes to the games they buy?

 

[JGS]

What concerns me in this case is that despite its flaws, the GCN was a good console with good, if not excellent software. And it failed, miserably, for circumstantial and timing problems Nintendo seems to be hell bent in repeating.

If GCN's games were merely good, then the other guys games sucked exclusive wise.

What I'm worried of is that someone, up there, may be thinking "we failed cause we went Hardcore, now look at the Wii!" instead of "We really need to try and understand the hardcore crowd, and third party developers, and stop releasing low-specc machines at the worst time possible".

I don't really think they need to understand the hardcore crowd too much. The stereotypical "hardcore" crowd are easier to figure out then who they were going for. I just think Iwata knew from the beginning they would be the secondary system for them and hoped 3rd parties would see the potential just on install base which did not happen.

The 3rd parties really get on my nerves with their whining though. It's already lame that they have the nerve to say they can't compete with Nintendo on similar games. It's also silly to deny the amount of money they make on Wii software even it makes less than the other guys considering it cost less too.

I do think Nintendo needs to wine and dine them and for at least two years the 3rd parties will have no excuse to diss Nintendo except for the then obvious fact that they simply don't like them. I also don't think that Nintendo should budge one iota regarding the efforts they put into their own software and from the software perspective should realease more software across genres rather than less.

 

[BGBW]

It's probably the same ratio of good/bad games the PS2 had. Just saying. Shovelware goes to the biggest selling console, big news, stop the presses.

PS2 was the favourite console of last gen whereas the Wii is the one everyone likes to hate on. Shovelware levels could be the same but we are more aware of the shovelware for the Wii because people make an issue of it. It's a nice bulletpoint in the Trolling Wii 101 Manual.

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

PS2 was the favourite console of last gen whereas the Wii is the one everyone likes to hate on. Shovelware levels could be the same but we are more aware of the shovelware for the Wii because people make an issue of it. It's a nice bulletpoint in the Trolling Wii 101 Manual.

The PS2 had higher amounts of quality third party software. I wouldn't say that the ratio was near the same for both systems.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

That's like saying you don't own a DVD player because there's so many crappy movies.

 

[manueldelalas]

The PS2 had higher amounts of quality third party software. I wouldn't say that the ratio was near the same for both systems.

Amounts of quality third party software is not what is in discussion here, don't derail this, everyone here knows that the PS2 had better third party software than the Wii.

The great/shitty ratio of games was about the same; there are thousands of crapware games on the PS2, just like the Wii.

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

Amounts of quality third party software is not what is in discussion here, don't derail this, everyone here knows that the PS2 had better third party software than the Wii.

The great/shitty ratio of games was about the same; there are thousands of crapware games on the PS2, just like the Wii.

Nah. They both have around the same amount of titles, right? Or is the Wii library smaller?

 

[BGBW]

The PS2 had higher amounts of quality third party software. I wouldn't say that the ratio was near the same for both systems.

Most likely, but I still think people only exaggerate the ratio for the Wii because they make a point to focus on it. No one knows what the ratio for the PS2 is because no one was insane enough to bother looking at PS2 shovelware.

Also seems that the definition of shovelware has changed just like casual and hardcore. Wii Music may not be everyone's cup of tea, but it certainly isn't shovelware. It's almost as if for some the definition now is "kiddy/not hardcore = sovelware".

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

Most likely, but I still think people only exaggerate the ratio for the Wii because they make a point to focus on it. No one knows what the ratio for the PS2 is because no one was insane enough to bother looking at PS2 shovelware.

Also seems that the definition of shovelware has changed just like casual and hardcore. Wii Music may not be everyone's cup of tea, but it certainly isn't shovelware. It's almost as if for some the definition now is "kiddy/not hardcore = sovelware".

I always look at shovelware as shitty games but I get your point

 

[ShockingAlberto]

The ratio wasn't the same, but I honestly wonder what people think Nintendo could do about that?

Don't get me wrong. The obvious way to improve the ratio is to have more good games, not less bad games, but that clearly isn't a situation that the Wii was going to find itself in. Third parties abandoned that system in a huge way, but I've seen angry forumers and podcasters and general rantings that insist Nintendo should not have let so much crap hit the shelves.

The reasoning was, I believe, that Nintendo should bring back the Nintendo seal of quality and leverage that to prevent things like, say, Imagine Horsez from being released for their systems. As if preventing Ubisoft from releasing their shovelware titles will make them realize, It's A Wonderful Life-style, that they should actually be making Prince of Persia on the Wii as their lead SKU and stop releasing low-budget, high-yield children's games.

The more likely situation is that they just wouldn't put games on the Wii at all.

Which I feel like most people here would probably prefer, as a good average is apparently better than the alternative, I think it would likely sink any chance Nintendo has at ever releasing other systems and getting decent third party efforts.

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

Yeah, I'm not quite sure if Nintendo could have done anything else with the Wii other than work with third parties earlier and more often in its life cycle, a la MH3.

Anyone who says Nintendo should have been monitoring the quality of the games released for the Wii is just delusional.