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[Neiteio]

According to 1Up, it's going to be pretty awesome.

And this is backed up by Iwata saying they know they fucked up with the Wii and DS and are going to be working with outside companies to work on their online. The 3DS might be bare bones right now, but it's fully upgradable.

Hmm, maybe an absolutely amazing online infrastructure is the reason for the "Cafe" codename? A Nintendo system that reaches its full "social" potential by fully leveraging modern online technologies...

Maybe, maybe not. Certainly hope so! Next Smash Bros. would sing Pavarotti with competent online.

 

[evangd007]

According to 1Up, it's going to be pretty awesome.

And this is backed up by Iwata saying they know they fucked up with the Wii and DS and are going to be working with outside companies to work on their online. The 3DS might be bare bones right now, but it's fully upgradable.

That article got me really excited. It made it sound like Nintendo wanted to use their online to recreate the social atmosphere of a late-80s/early-90s arcade.

 

[jacksrb]

In terms of securing exclusives I cant see it being anything more than an IP that isn't one of the 'bigger' IPs (eg: TimeSplitters), or funding development of a new IP all together.

When it comes to established IPs publishers are well aware that there's far more money to be made going multiplatform. Not only that, but with the kind of budgets that are being thrown around they basically need to spread their games across as many platforms as possible.

For Nintendo to secure exclusive rights to GTA, Final Fantasy, Resident Evil, or any of those other huge IPs they'd have to pay hundreds of millions of dollars. A crazy amount of money they'd be out of they mind to throw at the wall like that.

Pushing funding for a relatively low key IP that might not be able to find funding elsewhere (again eg: TimeSplitters) or funding new IPs would be much more affordable.

Right. They will surely recruit some third party to do an exclusive title that is not in Nintendo's sweet spot (like Red Steel was last time). The title would be:

a) a shooter (1st or 3rd person)
b) graphically more realistic and advanced than stuff on the Wii (duh)

 

[Mr_Brit]

According to 1Up, it's going to be pretty awesome.

And this is backed up by Iwata saying they know they fucked up with the Wii and DS and are going to be working with outside companies to work on their online. The 3DS might be bare bones right now, but it's fully upgradable.

He's just speculating in that article, that's not really a rumour.

Also, as proven by the PS3 you have to release your console with your online infrastructure fully complete, you can't port features back as older games won't recognise them. This unfortunately means that 3DS online is forever going to be completely embarrasing.

Nintendo also supposedly worked with outside companies for the Wii online and we know how well that turned out.

It's going to release in 2012, they have to at least beat XBL and preferably be a good cut above as Sony and MS's next gen systems are going to be huge leaps above the current XBL and PSN.

The responsibility is really with Nintendo this E3, if they don't prove that they can deliver an industry leading online infrastructure then they can forget about capturing the hardcore audience.

 

[wsippel]

He's just speculating in that article, that's not really a rumour.

Also, as proven by the PS3 you have to release your console with your online infrastructure fully complete, you can't port features back as older games won't recognise them. This unfortunately means that 3DS online is forever going to be completely embarrasing.

Nintendo also supposedly worked with outside companies for the Wii online and we know how well that turned out.

It's going to release in 2012, they have to at least beat XBL and preferably be a good cut above as Sony and MS's next gen systems are going to be huge leaps above the current XBL and PSN.

The responsibility is really with Nintendo this E3, if they don't prove that they can deliver an industry leading online infrastructure then they can forget about capturing the hardcore audience.

It seems you missed the last paragraph:

So when Stream or whatever it's eventually called is finally released and not everything is exactly as I hypothesized here, don't be shocked or disappointed. I just wanted to give you a taste of some of the rumblings I've heard, if only to paint a picture of what could be, regardless of how it ultimately takes shape. But I can at least assure you of two things: 1. This is absolutely the direction Nintendo is headed with its next console, and 2. Regardless of whether this all materializes in Project Cafe or in some console or handheld later, the future of social gaming as envisioned by Nintendo is sounding pretty darn exciting.

 

[Mr_Brit]

It seems you missed the last paragraph:

He means both local and online in the article when referring to social gaming, he in fact doesn't mentiona any rumours in regards to the online system just features that he'd like to see.

And that's the thing I want to make clear about all of this: I really have no idea how much of this Nintendo will actually achieve with its new console. Again, Nintendo is hardly a company with a proven track record when it comes to online. But Nintendo does get social experiences, and if it's really ready to take the plunge on consoles, I believe it could revolutionize the market again, just as it did with the motion control interface last generation.

He is just speculating throughout that whole article based on things Nintendo have said in the past.

 

[AceBandage]

They're never going to be above MS, and that's just crazy to even suggest.
Microsoft has had, literally, decades to perfect their online strategy on PCs (although, they fail at GFWL). They have the immense resources that a company like Nintendo never could.
But even then, Iwata has acknowledged this and that's why they are looking for outside help.

He means both local and online in the article when referring to social gaming, he in fact doesn't mentiona any rumours in regards to the online system just features that he'd like to see.

Actually, he has stated several times that he knows for a fact the Cafe won't use Friend Codes.
Everything in that article aren't things he's like to see, they are things he has heard from developers as being in the Cafe.

 

[mj1108]

What rumours have said that Nintendo are using a non embarrasing online infrastructure? After the 3DS launched in the state it did, it finally convinced me that Nintendo are utterly ignorant and incompetent when it comes to online, they're unable to change when it comes to this part of their business. Anyone expecting anything more than slightly better than the 3DS is setting themselves up for a massive dissapointment.

Not too long ago Iwata admitted their online strategy hasn't been all that and actually praised XBox Live.

 

[Mr_Brit]

They're never going to be above MS, and that's just crazy to even suggest.
Microsoft has had, literally, decades to perfect their online strategy on PCs (although, they fail at GFWL). They have the immense resources that a company like Nintendo never could.
But even then, Iwata has acknowledged this and that's why they are looking for outside help.




Actually, he has stated several times that he knows for a fact the Cafe won't use Friend Codes.
Everything in that article aren't things he's like to see, they are things he has heard from developers as being in the Cafe.

I can see where the confusion arises, he flips between acting like he knows something and just speculating, here's a short quote showing that:

And that's the thing I want to make clear about all of this: I really have no idea how much of this Nintendo will actually achieve with its new console. Again, Nintendo is hardly a company with a proven track record when it comes to online. But Nintendo does get social experiences, and if it's really ready to take the plunge on consoles, I believe it could revolutionize the market again, just as it did with the motion control interface last generation.

 

[Amir0x]

According to 1Up, it's going to be pretty awesome.

And this is backed up by Iwata saying they know they fucked up with the Wii and DS and are going to be working with outside companies to work on their online. The 3DS might be bare bones right now, but it's fully upgradable.

I hope so. If I hear them come out and say "friend codes", though, I'm just going to throw a knife at the PC screen. I am now fully expecting them to finally abandon that junk system

 

[EVH]

You know, would be absolutely great to see that suddenly the 3DS May update implements some sort of renewal for the online platform. But that will never happen

Hope they fix this with Cafe.

 

[AceBandage]

That doesn't prove he's speculating, though.
That's him covering his ass if a feature is pulled from the system during development.

I hope so. If I hear them come out and say "friend codes", though, I'm just going to throw a knife at the PC screen. I am now fully expecting them to finally abandon that junk system

That seems to be the one that that Sam is vehemently set on, that they will do away with Friend Codes on Cafe.

 

[wsippel]

He means both local and online in the article when referring to social gaming, he in fact doesn't mentiona any rumours in regards to the online system just features that he'd like to see.

He is just speculating throughout that whole article based on things Nintendo have said in the past.

Nope: http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3?http://podcast.the1upnetwork.com/flat/LANParty/ODD042011.mp3

 

[Mr_Brit]

They're never going to be above MS, and that's just crazy to even suggest.
Microsoft has had, literally, decades to perfect their online strategy on PCs (although, they fail at GFWL). They have the immense resources that a company like Nintendo never could.
But even then, Iwata has acknowledged this and that's why they are looking for outside help.




Actually, he has stated several times that he knows for a fact the Cafe won't use Friend Codes.
Everything in that article aren't things he's like to see, they are things he has heard from developers as being in the Cafe.

It will have been 7 years between the launch of the 360 and Wii 2! You can't possibly excuse Nintendo from not being able to beat a 7 year old system. There's literally no excuse for that and that goes for the NGP as well, they've had ample time to copy XBL's features and come up with newer and better features to make it better than XBL.

 

[Amir0x]

Forget Facebook alerting you to what your friends have been doing in their games -- how about a platform that actually shows you?

i am definitely turning off the ability for other people to see what I'm doing! Still this would be a pretty neat feature, the next natural evolution over just seeing what people are playing. Approve.

If this were true, though, imagine watching somebody painfully try to pan the camera to some anime characters upskirt in their preview screen?

Much hilarity will be had.

The one real downside of his speculation is the idea that it'll always be shuttling new content to your console. If it only has 8GB of flash memory built-in, this is a bad idea. That's why Nintendo really needs a 60GB+ HDD.

 

[AceBandage]

It will have been 7 years between the launch of the 360 and Wii 2! You can't possibly excuse Nintendo from not being able to beat a 7 year old system. There's literally no excuse for that and that goes for the NGP as well, they've had ample time to copy XBL's features and come up with newer and better features to make it better than XBL.

Except that during those 7 years, MS has been upgrading XBL as well. Adding features, refining it.
I mean, you talk like it's the exact same system that it was when it launched. It isn't.

 

[Man God]

I hope so. If I hear them come out and say "friend codes", though, I'm just going to throw a knife at the PC screen. I am now fully expecting them to finally abandon that junk system

There are certain advantages to a single system friend code like system; mainly the ability to change your nickname between games kinda like how Steam does it.

The only real annoying part about 3DS system right now is that it doesn't notify you when someone attempts to register you. A simple pop up screen that could be disabled via parental controls for the 100% safe system would fix the problem entirely.

 

[EatChildren]

The thing with Iwata is that while he is very humble, honest and blunt in his manner of speaking about Nintendo and industry (which is why I love hearing him talk), and likely very truthful in what he feels Nintendo needs to do, it doesn't always match up with how it is executed.

Pre-Wii there was a ton of talk from Iwata and co about how they were going to persue a stronger online, particularly in the 'always on' state of the Wii and how updates would flow in for games and the system. This never materialised in any respect.

The 3DS is early days, but they've said similar things that we're hearing now. "Better online, more third party support". Their online network hasn't rolled out and we dont even know exactly when it will or what it will contain, which is pretty dreadful, and we're still in somewhat of a limbo when it comes to third party support as a vast majority of the good stuff is coming from Capcom. This is hard to judge as the system only just launched a lot will likely be revealed at E3, but it's another example of a system not quite matching the promises, at least not yet.

When Iwata says that the Wii had a problem with third parties, and that Nintendo needs help with online, I dont doubt that he is absolutely truthful. When he says they will persue these two things more aggressively, I dont doubt that they will. The problem is Nintendo has a tendency to live inside a strange little bubble, and their perception of a 'good' online wont necessarily match what the market needs.

Friend codes are probably the best example. That 1up article can speculate all it likes, but I just cant see Nintendo ditching a system they seem so confident using, not when their most recent platform rolled out with the exact same framework. Fact of the matter is no matter how good the online service will be, as long as there are friend codes there will always be a stigma.

We'll see at E3 I guess. I do very, very little online gaming on consoles so it's not a big issue for me, but if there's one big area that I'm not confident Nintendo will deliver on, no matter the promises, it is online.

 

[Neiteio]

If this were true, though, imagine watching somebody painfully try to pan the camera to some anime characters upskirt in their preview screen?

i am definitely turning off the ability for other people to see what I'm doing!

 

[blu]

The only real annoying part about 3DS system right now is that its online infrastructure was not ready at launch, and we all have to wait for the next update.

Fixed.

 

[AlphaDragoon]

I hope so. If I hear them come out and say "friend codes", though, I'm just going to throw a knife at the PC screen. I am now fully expecting them to finally abandon that junk system

I REALLY hope they've learned that folks want the total online infrastructure like Live/PSN at this point.

But given some of the rumored info we've been hearing, I think they actually might give us what we want and not "lol friend codes" again.

 

[Zeal]

I truly well made Nintendo Online network would be amazing. Hell, bring in outside people to get it done. You know it must happen sooner or later anyway, and it's long overdue.

 

[Lionheart1827]

i am definitely turning off the ability for other people to see what I'm doing! Still this would be a pretty neat feature, the next natural evolution over just seeing what people are playing. Approve.

If this were true, though, imagine watching somebody painfully try to pan the camera to some anime characters upskirt in their preview screen?

Much hilarity will be had.

The one real downside of his speculation is the idea that it'll always be shuttling new content to your console. If it only has 8GB of flash memory built-in, this is a bad idea. That's why Nintendo really needs a 60GB+ HDD.

This is a feature that I always thought would be a cool idea if it was possible. Lets say I'm eating lunch or something but I'm online talking to a friend who is in my party playing a game. It would be pretty cool to spectate and watch what hes up to in the game.

I know there's services for streaming but not everyone has the know-how or computer equipment to do that, nor would want to bother. It would be cool to just have a spectate mode built-in.

 

[Ashodin]

I honestly think if Nintendo does not have hard drives, they are being stingy.

I'm pretty sure whatever third-party or outside help they'll get on Online infrastructure will be encouraging them to use hard drives to store content. Unless Nintendo plans on you using SD cards to transfer data between the 3DS and Cafe.

 

[Lord_Byron28]

The thing with Iwata is that while he is very humble, honest and blunt in his manner of speaking about Nintendo and industry (which is why I love hearing him talk), and likely very truthful in what he feels Nintendo needs to do, it doesn't always match up with how it is executed.

Pre-Wii there was a ton of talk from Iwata and co about how they were going to persue a stronger online, particularly in the 'always on' state of the Wii and how updates would flow in for games and the system. This never materialised in any respect.

The 3DS is early days, but they've said similar things that we're hearing now. "Better online, more third party support". Their online network hasn't rolled out and we dont even know exactly when it will or what it will contain, which is pretty dreadful, and we're still in somewhat of a limbo when it comes to third party support as a vast majority of the good stuff is coming from Capcom. This is hard to judge as the system only just launched a lot will likely be revealed at E3, but it's another example of a system not quite matching the promises, at least not yet.

When Iwata says that the Wii had a problem with third parties, and that Nintendo needs help with online, I dont doubt that he is absolutely truthful. When he says they will persue these two things more aggressively, I dont doubt that they will. The problem is Nintendo has a tendency to live inside a strange little bubble, and their perception of a 'good' online wont necessarily match what the market needs.

Friend codes are probably the best example. That 1up article can speculate all it likes, but I just cant see Nintendo ditching a system they seem so confident using, not when their most recent platform rolled out with the exact same framework. Fact of the matter is no matter how good the online service will be, as long as there are friend codes there will always be a stigma.

We'll see at E3 I guess. I do very, very little online gaming on consoles so it's not a big issue for me, but if there's one big area that I'm not confident Nintendo will deliver on, no matter the promises, it is online.

This. He is very humble and when he speaks at E3 or investor holdings he seems to have a very down to earth understanding of everything going on around him. However, like you said the execution isn't anywhere close to how people were expecting.

 

[Disguises]

Pretty excited to see this at E3, however I totally don't expect them to reveal everything about the console. I think some people will be disappointed that we possibly won't hear things like the online infrastructure or it's specs etc.

 

[EatChildren]

Pretty excited to see this at E3, however I totally don't expect them to reveal everything about the console. I think some people will be disappointed that we possibly won't hear things like the online infrastructure or it's specs etc.

Nintendo still hasn't released any official specs of the Wii, let alone the 3DS. It's all had to come from third parties, rumours, speculation and other sources.

I wouldn't be surprised if they never release official specs for the Wii 2.

 

[Sadist]

I only expect a few vague promises about online being different. Maybe the name of the partner which will be in charge of designing the new online system.

 

[Eteric Rice]

What rumours have said that Nintendo are using a non embarrasing online infrastructure? After the 3DS launched in the state it did, it finally convinced me that Nintendo are utterly ignorant and incompetent when it comes to online, they're unable to change when it comes to this part of their business. Anyone expecting anything more than slightly better than the 3DS is setting themselves up for a massive dissapointment.

I get the distinct feeling that Nintendo's 3DS online will tie into the Cafe's online, hence why it's incomplete and why a lot of touted features are absent.

Could be wrong.

 

[Cosmozone]

I can't imagine them lose friend codes. For machine-independent accounts, you need server space. Server space costs something. If they ever plan such a thing, it would either come with a fee, which is unlikely, or with other trade-offs such as allowing them to collect your data. Apple gets away with something like that, but Nintendo?

 

[Rich!]

I can't imagine them lose friend codes. For machine-independent accounts, you need server space. Server space costs something. If they ever plan such a thing, it would either come with a fee, which is unlikely, or with other trade-offs such as allowing them to collect your data. Apple gets away with something like that, but Nintendo?

Well...posted in the other thread, but anyway. Nintendo sent an email to each of it's UK Club Nintendo members asking them to accept the new terms and conditions for May 2011 onwards. The main change was the function to link your club nintendo account with your 3DS console for purchases online.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

I get the distinct feeling that Nintendo's 3DS online will tie into the Cafe's online, hence why it's incomplete and why a lot of touted features are absent.

Could be wrong.

I did wonder - the timing for the big update with the eShop is interesting too. "Late May" could easily run into the beginning of E3, just a week later...

 

[abstract alien]

I get the distinct feeling that Nintendo's 3DS online will tie into the Cafe's online, hence why it's incomplete and why a lot of touted features are absent.

Could be wrong.

If nintendo really is serious about the 3DS/Cafe online being a significant leap into something more modernized, the May update will really have to come close to completely wiping the structure it currently has and replacing it with something different all together. I really don't think this will happen, but hopefully they surprise us.

Well...posted in the other thread, but anyway. Nintendo sent an email to each of it's UK Club Nintendo members asking them to accept the new terms and conditions for May 2011 onwards. The main change was the function to link your club nintendo account with your 3DS console for purchases online.

Didn't know about this, but its good to see at least this being implemented. A few of us were discussing it a while back, but I didn't think it would happen. Cool to eat crow sometimes lol

 

[Rich!]

If nintendo really is serious about the 3DS/Cafe online being a significant leap into something more modernized, the May update will really have to come close to completely wiping the structure it currently has and replacing it with something different all together. I really don't think this will happen, but hopefully they surprise us.

it's easily possible. The firmware is really quite bare-bones at the moment.

 

[shadyspace]

it's easily possible. The firmware is really quite bare-bones at the moment.

Plus unlike the Wii or DS, the 3DS has hooks built into it for complete overhauls of the OS via system updates.

 

[Rich!]

Plus unlike the Wii or DS, the 3DS has hooks built into it for complete overhauls of the OS via system updates.

Yep, totally. The internet icon and message confirm that to some extent. I'm just hoping for an overhaul of the friend system. Account linking and friend messaging, please.

 

[abstract alien]

it's easily possible. The firmware is really quite bare-bones at the moment.

Plus unlike the Wii or DS, the 3DS has hooks built into it for complete overhauls of the OS via system updates.

This is promising...

 

[AceBandage]

I wouldn't expect a complete overhaul in the May update, especially if they're going to link the 3DS to the Cafe in some way.
However, we should see some hints to what their future plan is with the update.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Plus unlike the Wii or DS, the 3DS has hooks built into it for complete overhauls of the OS via system updates.

Certainly seems so.

I can understand people being sceptical of Nintendo developing something more sophisticated for the 3DS, but the potential is there to see the 3DS OS develop in a similar fashion to the 360 dash.

 

[KrawlMan]

Plus unlike the Wii or DS, the 3DS has hooks built into it for complete overhauls of the OS via system updates.

Wow, really? Good decision on Nintendo's part if so. Let's just hope they actually act on negative feedback for the system.

 

[Graphics Horse]

Just out of interest, how does the 3DS handle pressing the home button while playing an online game?

 

[Disguises]

Just out of interest, how does the 3DS handle pressing the home button while playing an online game?

It doesn't. I think it just simply doesn't allow you to use it.

 

[Rich!]

Just out of interest, how does the 3DS handle pressing the home button while playing an online game?

It displays a crossed out home icon on the bottom screen. That's it.

 

[AceBandage]

Yeah, it won't let you access the OS while in an online match.
Likely to prevent people dropping easily.

 

[Boney]

Just out of interest, how does the 3DS handle pressing the home button while playing an online game?

You can't access home while online, and saving.

 

[Amir0x]

There are certain advantages to a single system friend code like system; mainly the ability to change your nickname between games kinda like how Steam does it.

The only real annoying part about 3DS system right now is that it doesn't notify you when someone attempts to register you. A simple pop up screen that could be disabled via parental controls for the 100% safe system would fix the problem entirely.

well you can sit over there with your "advantage" and the rest of us will be waiting for the future and Nintendo to finally abandon their friend code system once and for all like any civilized company

I figure one gen or another, they will finally do the right thing. Based on how apparently focused on the social aspect this system is, I hope this is the one.

I hope messages people send pop up on the controller screen so I can read them while I play without stopping gameplay. Would be rad.

 

[Graphics Horse]

I see, thanks!

 

[herzogzwei1989]

What's so bad about that? With modern GDDR5 you're still going to get nearly 3x the bandwidth of the 360 and couple that to a larger on chip solution and memory bandwidth really isn't going to be an issue at all.

If it means an extra 512MB of GDDR5 then why the hell not. It'd be the right sort of compromise IMO. It'll mean lower production costs over the life of the system yet a much more future proofed system with a much better chance of supporting PS4 ports.

It's just that I was hoping for a 256-bit bus, but was expecting a 128-bit bus. I mean, 128-bit bus has been around since the late 1990s and 256-bit has been around since 2002.
Even 128-bit would be disappointing since consoles have had that since the Xbox1.

 

[fabricated backlash]

well you can sit over there with your "advantage" and the rest of us will be waiting for the future and Nintendo to finally abandon their friend code system once and for all like any civilized company

I figure one gen or another, they will finally do the right thing. Based on how apparently focused on the social aspect this system is, I hope this is the one.

I hope messages people send pop up on the controller screen so I can read them while I play without stopping gameplay. Would be rad.

The one friendcode per system would actually not be that bad, if it weren't a requirement for both to input it to register. Friend requests would make the system hassle free, and really a minor nuissance.

Actually I would go with a two ways solution: Friendcodes and dual side registration process for kid accounts and enabled or disabled by parental controls.
No friendcodes and proper online friend requests for adult accounts.

The part about reading messages or checking friend lists etc on the controller in real time without having to get into a menu or anything would be great.

 

[Amir0x]

The one friendcode per system would actually not be that bad, if it weren't a requirement for both to input it to register. Friend requests would make the system hassle free, and really a minor nuissance.

i don't get it. it's a really poor defense of something imo when you ever have to use the sentence: "it's not that bad."

What that means is: "Well, it is bad, but you can live with it, so why not settle and stop complaining?"

The answer is: "Because they have competitors, and competitors have competent online systems not restrained by terrible, offensive friend codes, so there is no reason to make excuses for it there."

One day they'll drop it and then finally people will stop finding ways to argue that we should live with it...