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[Busty]

I think they are smart enough to realize that the Wii model isn't sustainable in the future. In order to survive in the HD console arena 3rd party support is a necessity, and I think Nintendo is starting to realize that.

It wasn't something that they were interested in rectifying between the transition from the Gamecube to the Wii so I don't see why it would suddenly become something that would become such a priority that they change the way they do business now.

It depends what Nintendo has "discovered", if anything.

That is true. But I think that even if Nintendo have made some amazing discovery or pioneered some 3DS esque technical achievement in input or displays they will endeavour to present those 'discoveries' with more modest level of computing power just like they did with the Wii.

Well they went from a machine "all about the games" to the Wii, all reports suggest that they are aiming for a different market from the Wii & people who seem to know what they are talking about suggest that it would be tricky to make a console with less power than the 360/PS3 at this moment in time. What Sony & MS do next is unknown, but there would have to be some fairly brave people willing to take as much of a hit on their HW as they did this gen.

I never said less power that then PS360. I said that I just don't see the Cafe being a true generational leap beyond the current HD consoles.

 

[Chuck Norris]

I find it cute that anyone actually thinks Sony and MS will attempt the "tech arms race" again after how well that worked out for them financially...

They will, especially seeing Sony's stance with NGP. I just don't expect it to be done as aggressively with losses taken on, hence the longer life cycles.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

The recent announcements are nice to know, but I wonder if gaf can avoid eating itself alive until E3. People are already saying that the thing will only be as powerful as a 360 when the GPU alone is more powerful than the 360 GPU by a fair amount(even the weakest in the R700 family is at LEAST on par with it when unoptimized). It's also hilarious that people expect the thing to sit at just 512MB total RAM when the PS3 and 360 are already experiencing bottlenecks with outdated CPU and GPU tech.

This is going to be a painful wait...

You got me this time lol...

I just hope that they reveal something at the 4AM stream. A tiny morsel would be enough at this point.

If the reports from IGN are true, then and 1080p visuals, instead of sub-HD resolutions, that in it self would suggest a memory capacity higher than 512mb. Just having a screen on the controller puts cost up higher than any console Nintendo has released. With comments about Nintendo going after the hardcore gamers, it would not succeed with a console that is just a re-release of a 360.

 

[kinggroin]

ugh... I have this feeling that most gamers entrenched in the ps3/360 ecosystem demand a hardware upgrade that's a magnitude greater than what we have now. If that's not shown at E3 either through software or raw hardware specs, they will pass on the system and wait to see what Sony and MS do. This will cause initial 3rd party support (which will mostly be ports if old "Hd" games) to die out faster than it did on the wii, while hardware sales begin to suffer thanks to casual gamers having migrated to kinect (in their minds, the real wii 2) and Nintendo basically being supported by the usual faithful (folks who bought the cube).

Because sales will NOT eclipse what the 360 and PS3 are managing, the generation will be stretched out even longer. Then, when the successors to the HD twins are released, and gamers see that the visual upgrade over the cafe isnt substantial and they could have been fostering and enjoying a true HD console, it will be too late for the big N.

So basically, Im gonna wait and see how things pan out before buying in.

 

[Totobeni]

I hope, since this is a Nintendo system, that Wii 2 changes the consoles situation in the Japanese market and make the Japanese developers take consoles as priority again, well it might be hard be I believe Nintendo can do it.

Also I hope Nintendo stay on $50 price tag for their games ( and third party games on the system).

 

[d58e7]

Haven't read through this entire thread, but anyone thinking this controller with a screen could be nintendo's take on large scale multiplayer. Imagine infinite numbers of players on one console with the total chaos being on the TV while the players gets their own personal screen on the remote. I think the tech might actually turn out pretty awesome if Nintendo implements it right. The only issue is with them releasing the system ahead of the others they risk having the others copying the idea with their next generation.

 

[Cow Mengde]

Any bets on when this thread will reach the 20,000 post cap?

 

[Michan]

A history which began with Iwata.

Before then, many times they were "chasing innovation" without catching up to it. To be fair though, didn't Yamauchi himself tell Nintendo to make the DS two screens, and then Iwata became the champion of change / innovation / game design that brought it home?

Yes, two screens was Yamauchi's wish.

But prior to that, they were always trying different things with video games. At least, as far as home platforms are concerned. Although GameCube didn't really bring a lot of new things to the table (outside of the doomed connectivity), most of the previous platforms did. Nintendo 64 has several to name, such as its analogue stick and rumble feature.

 

[Raide]

I find it cute that anyone actually thinks Sony and MS will attempt the "tech arms race" again after how well that worked out for them financially...

I wonder how well MS would have done if they had solid tech to start with. Without the whole RRoD issue, they might have had much more traction.

Haven't read through this entire thread, but anyone thinking this controller with a screen could be nintendo's take on large scale multiplayer. Imagine infinite numbers of players on one console with the total chaos being on the TV while the players gets their own personal screen on the remote. I think the tech might actually turn out pretty awesome if Nintendo implements it right. The only issue is with them releasing the system ahead of the others they risk having the others copying the idea with their next generation.

Impossible. Unless they use Cafe as a Private Server to host the games and people just hook into it.

 

[Cerebral Assassin]

I never said less power that then PS360. I said that I just don't see the Cafe being a true generational leap beyond the current HD consoles.

What would constitute a generational leap? As long as it is easily possible to downport/reuse assets from the PS4/Nexbox thats all they need.

 

[thehillissilent]

Haven't read through this entire thread, but anyone thinking this controller with a screen could be nintendo's take on large scale multiplayer. Imagine infinite numbers of players on one console with the total chaos being on the TV while the players gets their own personal screen on the remote. I think the tech might actually turn out pretty awesome if Nintendo implements it right. The only issue is with them releasing the system ahead of the others they risk having the others copying the idea with their next generation.

With Nintendo's emphasis on local multiplayer, I think the screen on the controller is an awesome concept. First person shooters would definately benefit.

What would constitute a generational leap? As long as it is easily possible to downport/reuse assets from the PS4/Nexbox thats all they need.

As long as downports are possible, Nintendo should be fine.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

It wasn't something that they were interested in rectifying between the transition from the Gamecube to the Wii so I don't see why it would suddenly become something that would become such a priority that they change the way they do business now.



That is true. But I think that even if Nintendo have made some amazing discovery or pioneered some 3DS esque technical achievement in input or displays they will endeavour to present those 'discoveries' with more modest level of computing power just like they did with the Wii.



I never said less power that then PS360. I said that I just don't see the Cafe being a true generational leap beyond the current HD consoles.

I don't think anyone expects it to be that much, but powerful enough that it can hold its own against 720/PS4. It is a generational leap compared to the Wii.

 

[Michan]

Any bets on when this thread will reach the 20,000 post cap?

We're posting at a rate of about 2.5 per minute right now. If this limit was maintained on average from start to finish, it would be reached in under 6 days.

 

[Paracelsus]

Thinking about it, it would be nice to have strategy guides on the pad instead of having to look at the pc monitor every single time.

 

[The_Darkest_Red]

It wasn't something that they were interested in rectifying between the transition from the Gamecube to the Wii so I don't see why it would suddenly become something that would become such a priority that they change the way they do business now.

From Iwata (on the 3DS):

We will not make a trend similar to the one found for Wii in Japan now. We feel a need to have closer ties with our third party developers from the beginning.

Also,

"It is true that the third party software sales ratio on Nintendo platforms are comparatively smaller in Japan," Iwata admitted. "Wii's third party software ratio is especially low."

"We need to decrease the concern that only Nintendo software can sell well on Nintendo platforms and third party software cannot sell in the same volume," he continued.

Source: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Nint...rned-About-Third-party-Wii-Sales-159371.shtml

 

[Refreshment.01]

It's a dedicated handheld and isn't going to run into the issues of lag that this will, unless Nintendo has magically got round the issues of streaming. And even then you are crippling the power of your console by making it render so much extra stuff.

It all seems bonkers at the moment, unless we are missing some big idea.

And they don't run great at all, just some people will put up with it for the convenience. And you are destroying the power advantage of your move to HD by having to multi-render everything.

This is all very un-Nintendo.

It´s ok to fear any lag issues, that´s understandable. But you are failing to consider the screen could have a variety of uses that might change depending of the game.

In terms of the bolded part of your posts, leaving lag issues aside. In a game where the developer opted to send the same frame/picture from the TV to the touch screen it won't take away much power becuase the already generated frame would just be downsampled. Thats very easy and quick to do.

Imagine Brothers in Arms. TV displays the 720p/1080p image with no HUD. Touch screen has the same image plus the HUD layered and its used to control your teams. So the user is playing in the TV, goes into cover. Focus in the control screen, touches the bazooka team icon and then touches the exact part of the enviroment where it wants to send them. Since both screen images are the same the user wont feel any dissconection.

That could be 1 interesting use among many others.

P.S.: I dont want Nintendo to abandon the split controller and pointing interface of the Wii but maybe the can offer both?

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

What would constitute a generational leap? As long as it is easily possible to downport/reuse assets from the PS4/Nexbox thats all they need.

Nintendo could possibly end again with the same situation that 3DS: more powerful than the current gen, but without the possibility of enjoying NGP downports, which right now seems the case (at least we can say any game with UE3 on NGP)

 

[Michan]

From Iwata (on the 3DS):

Also,

Source: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Nint...rned-About-Third-party-Wii-Sales-159371.shtml

I absolutely adore Iwata's honesty.

 

[thehillissilent]

Nintendo could possibly end again with the same situation that 3DS: more powerful than the current gen, but without the possibility of enjoying NGP downports, which right now seems the case (at least we can say any game with UE3 on NGP)

I hope that this won't be the case, but that is up to MS/Sony and middleware companies.

 

[boyshine]

quick re-paint

 

[RPGCrazied]

So its true?! Playable at E3? Well, at least videos of what this thing can do? Omg. *saves monies*

To play an HD Zelda & Metroid has me giddy like a school girl.

 

[Elios83]

quick re-paint

Doesn't that look the same of....:

 

[kinggroin]

I think its pretty funny how we are essentially getting in function, a non portable ds with beefy hardware! I can just see the games that have us throw objects from the controller screen onto the big screen. Could make for some fun, if gimmicky, ideas.

 

[d58e7]

I wonder how well MS would have done if they had solid tech to start with. Without the whole RRoD issue, they might have had much more traction.




Impossible. Unless they use Cafe as a Private Server to host the games and people just hook into it.

Infinite was a bad choice of words, but on one console they might be able to handle 8-12 depending on the amount of data being pushed onto each controller and this would still be a pretty big change from the 4 player splitscreen that's been common on a local console

 

[Raist]

quick re-paint

So it's the 60GB version and the previous pictures were the 20GB right?

 

[SolarPowered]

Hasn't the Wii been significantly cheaper than both the PS3 and 360 throughout most of it's lifespan?

Yeah, it has definitely been cheaper. It was probably the driving force behind it's massive success.

I'm not suggesting that's the main reason behind it's success but it's certainly a factor.

This is a moderate approach and I agree. I just think that this console will differentiate itself quickly with the right games. The jump in the presentation and the new features(screen on a controller and an unknown variable that Nintendo is still keeping secret) differentiates this console more than any other feature in this generation. People can look at the Kinect and see a derivative of the eyetoy and they can see Move as an improved Wiimote, but the Stream is looking more and more like a gigantic leap when viewed next to the improvements made on the HD consoles.

This factor will do more than enough to garner the interest of the consumers in my eyes.

If the reports from IGN are true, then and 1080p visuals, instead of sub-HD resolutions, that in it self would suggest a memory capacity higher than 512mb. Just having a screen on the controller puts cost up higher than any console Nintendo has released. With comments about Nintendo going after the hardcore gamers, it would not succeed with a console that is just a re-release of a 360.

I agree completely here. The rumors and reports can lead us to certain conclusions and smarter folks(brain stew for one) have already made some really smart guesses using the rumors and estimates. A certain number of pixels(1080P) nearly confirms that a minimum amount of RAM is needed. The streaming rumors are an indicator of a powerful processor(rumored 3 core Power PC) and CPU(rumored R700 family GPU which at it's best can pump out PC visuals at Crysis levels of quality) at work and it's hard to imagine that 512MB would be sufficient when it obviously does not work on soon to be outdated systems. Nintendo's handheld is already working with such great tech that it can push effects and shaders that we only thought could appear on HD consoles just a couple of years ago. Nintendo can only aim upwards of the current tech at this point(even if it's not a revolution it's certainly a leap forward from where we currently stand).

 

[RPGCrazied]

So, I guess it is coming out next year. Maybe they will show us a few of the launch lineup and talk about price. I guess thats too soon though.

 

[A.KU.MU]

quick re-paint

http://i56.tinypic.com/2ugl1s2.jpg

Nice render.

 

[GameE]

No leaks from Nikkei or anything?

 

[Father_Brain]

Yeah, it has definitely been cheaper. It was probably the driving force behind it's massive success.

The fact that Wii was cheaper than its competition drove its success more than the Wii Remote did? Really?

 

[YourMaster]

Probably many people, since Nintendo seems to have a history of doing irrationally different/"innovative" things with each hardware release.

3DS: 3d
Wii: Remote/motion sensing
DS: Two screens

Don't forget:

Gamecube: Handle

 

[Raide]

Infinite was a bad choice of words, but on one console they might be able to handle 8-12 depending on the amount of data being pushed onto each controller and this would still be a pretty big change from the 4 player splitscreen that's been common on a local console

Certainly could be interesting for certain types of games. The only problem is that Split-screen is a dying breed and has been taken over by online play. If Nintendo can nail that, then having lots of players on a single console + online players, could be great fun. How that would work for an FPS, I have no idea, since you would still have to shift over all the players information, not just the main unit.

 

[schuelma]

My timing guess- Next Spring for Japan, Summer for the rest of the world.

 

[From The Dust]

Don't forget:

Gamecube: Handle

the handle was a godly innovation that hasn't been matched yet because it can't be done again

 

[Erebus]

Cool. It seems that this E3 will be pretty interesting after all.

 

[Father_Brain]

My timing guess- Next Spring for Japan, Summer for the rest of the world.

I predict a Q2 launch worldwide, as I doubt that Nintendo would give the system its playable debut more than a year in advance of its release. But that won't become clear until later this year, I assume.

 

[brandonh83]

Man when I woke up and saw "officially announced" in the topic title I just about passed one.

 

[SolarPowered]

The fact that Wii was cheaper than its competition drove its success more than the Wii Remote did? Really?

I don't think so. I actually agree with you on this point. I'd say that they are both VERY important factors. The Wii would have never sold as much as it's competitors without the Wiimote as it's standout product and the differentiator.

I would've edited my previous post, but the thread is moving so fast that I worry about confusing the people that I'm responding to. Sorry about that...

 

[RPGCrazied]

Cool. It seems that this E3 will be pretty interesting after all.

New console
New PS2 HD collection
Tales of Grace F shown in English?


I don't think it can get any better for me.

 

[beje]

quick re-paint

So... another sandwich design incoming?

 

[Wolves Evolve]

Cool. It seems that this E3 will be pretty interesting after all.

E3 2012

- 3DS first year games. Big announcements.
- NGP full details and launch line-up.
- Cafe full details and game previews.
- Second generation Kinect games.
- Second generation Move games.

 

[Michan]

Don't forget:

Gamecube: Handle

And the colour purple.

 

[From The Dust]

So... another sandwich design incoming?

it doesn't look bad though. the only problem is that it isn't a modern SNES

 

[Kusagari]

quick re-paint

It kind of looks like a big ass hard drive.

 

[get2sammyb]

If a DualShock 3 costs $50 (and I know there's a bit of price gouging to be factored into that), surely we're looking at $75-$100 for a controller that's -- at the very least -- a DualShock with a touch-screen on it.

Doesn't that strike you guys as a little bit crazy? If the feature is a removable "added extra" that you buy seperately and slot into the controller, then what's the point?

I dunno. There' no smoke without water but I don't buy some of these rumours. I get Nintendo might have had a change of heart when it comes to some of their philosophies, but they've cited for years how the controller is the barrier for user activity. Now you're telling me they're going to make a more complicated controller than their peers?

Hmm... I don't know. This whole thing sounds very un-Nintendo.

 

[RPGCrazied]

I don't care what it looks like, long as it has a matte finish. I can't stand the glossy ones, at all. Those are so prone to scratches and fingerprints its not even funny. I had to skin my Wii just to get rid of those.

Please be like the PS3 slim.

 

[Phonomezer]

quick re-paint

That would look THE SEX in glossy black!

 

[Sammy Samusu]

I think you guys are expecting too much graphically, calm down!

First, it's a Nintendo platform, and second, developers are still working on the console. Remember when people called Xbox 360 the Xbox 1.5?

They removed the image so it must mean something.

I see an ocarina.

 

[beje]

It kind of looks like a big ass hard drive.

It can also be seen as two Wiis duct-taped one above the other with a little extra at the top =D

 

[140.85]

Going to sell my Wii.

What are the chances of this not being backwards compatible? I think none.