Wii U Speculation Thread of Brains Beware: Wii U Re-Unveiling At E3 2012

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Deguello said:
That's pretty sad that every single iPhone, iPod, iPad, Android Phone, and Android Tablet combined only makes up 8% of the total games market.

And every iPhone and Android phone combined can only muster 34% of just the portable market despite there being a gajillion more cellphones out there than Nintendo DS's.

I seem to remember when everybody said cellphones would take over handheld games about 7 years ago too.
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Not really. In one year they went from 5 to 8%, even though the market dropped from 24 to 16%.
 
Louis Cyphre said:
This is true and now strong softwarer is upon us. The key is to keep the flow going and the momentum going. Trouble for them is that we now have a much stronger market to get our handheld gaming needs.
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You know, I enjoy my iPod for some light gaming (I've been playing Tower Defense Lost Earth a lot, actually).
But it just does not replace my 3DS as a gaming device.
And given sales of the 3DS since the price drop and sales of the big software thus far, I'd say this is the truth for the majority.

Smart Phone gaming is just not as big a threat as Apple would like you to think...
 
Chopper said:
Royalan has just reminded me, my source also said that to this day they are yet to see any convincing first-party software that sells the concept of the system. This is a major company too, so this news made me sad.
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Is this not just a sign of Nintendo being uber secretive?

I mean, it's not like it's the first time.
 
Exterminieren said:
Is this not just a sign of Nintendo being uber secretive?

I mean, it's not like it's the first time.
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Perhaps. But I know which company I'm talking about. Nintendo would have shown them something other than the E3 demos if they knew what was good for them, I would have thought.
 
Chopper said:
Perhaps. But I know which company I'm talking about. Nintendo would have shown them something other than the E3 demos if they knew what was good for them, I would have thought.
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Nintendo loves to just surprise people with things, really.
I mean, how many developers were surprised that the Wii U existed at E3?
 
EatChildren said:
For what it's worth, I can vouch for Chopper as I know which publisher he is talking about. If he says he heard this, he did.
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So, that's it, huh?

Well, at least we know in advance. The competitive Nintendo really is dead. At least this means there's a chance of it being sold for $250.
 
BurntPork said:
So, that's it, huh?

Well, at least we know in advance. The competitive Nintendo really is dead.
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The competitive Nintendo (in the sense that you are talking about) never existed...
They exist for their software, not to push Teraflops.
 
BurntPork said:
So, that's it, huh?

Well, at least we know in advance. The competitive Nintendo really is dead. At least this means there's a chance of it being sold for $250.
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Well, I mean, everyone is going to have a different view of the hardware. I've always, always held the belief it wouldn't scratch up to the next Sony/Microsoft systems, so I'm not really disappointed or anything (beyond the usual disappointment with Nintendo).

But yeah. Chopper is good people and has legit sources. If they said this, then this is how they feel, and given the publisher it is quite disappointing to hear this.
 
Chopper said:
Perhaps. But I know which company I'm talking about. Nintendo would have shown them something other than the E3 demos if they knew what was good for them, I would have thought.
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One of the big three then. Yup, not good at all.

Is he the only one that's dissapointed or does the company as a whole feel the same about it?

(By company I mean the devs offcourse.)
 
AceBandage said:
The competitive Nintendo (in the sense that you are talking about) never existed...
They exist for their software, not to push Teraflops.
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This is the exact problem, apparently. And will never change. It will, however, drive away third parties.

It's nice to hark back to the successes of the DS in its heyday. I'm inclined to do the same. I am, after all, a 3DS Ambassaddor with a collection of 145 DS games and am a huge advocate for the system. But the undeniable fact is that the market has changed, and history can not repeat unless Nintendo revise their pricing strategy.
 
BurntPork said:
So, that's it, huh?

Well, at least we know in advance. The competitive Nintendo really is dead. At least this means there's a chance of it being sold for $250.
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Leap! Leap to those conclusions!

FFS, BurntPork, you really need to start taking a more objective view of these sort of things. No one developer, no matter how big, is a concrete arbiter of a console's future.

It's certainly disappointing, but these cries of D000MED do nothing but make you seem like a parody of yourself.
 
BurntPork said:
So, that's it, huh?

Well, at least we know in advance. The competitive Nintendo really is dead. At least this means there's a chance of it being sold for $250.
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oh burntpork you so crazy
 
Chopper said:
This is the exact problem, apparently. And will never change. It will, however, drive away third parties.

It's nice to hark back to the successes of the DS in its heyday. I'm inclined to do the same. I am, after all, a 3DS Ambassaddor with a collection of 145 DS games and am a huge advocate for the system. But the undeniable fact is that the market has changed, and history can not repeat unless Nintendo revise their pricing strategy.
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The entire industry needs to fix the pricing structure, though.
And I think if they actually try and charge $70 for console games next generation, that we'll see a pretty dramatic drop in sales.

Honestly, I think that games should be priced on a break even strategy. Like... how much should you charge to break even at 500,000?
 
Chopper said:
This is the exact problem, apparently. And will never change. It will, however, drive away third parties.
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I don't really think Nintendo would tell any outside company what they're working on, though. In fact, they are so paranoid that not even their internal studios know what the guys next door are doing most of the time.
 
EatChildren said:
Well, I mean, everyone is going to have a different view of the hardware. I've always, always held the belief it wouldn't scratch up to the next Sony/Microsoft systems, so I'm not really disappointed or anything (beyond the usual disappointment with Nintendo).

But yeah. Chopper is good people and has legit sources. If they said this, then this is how they feel, and given the publisher it is quite disappointing to hear this.
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One thing I've learned from personal experience is that one company can have many different views on things within itself. It matters who you talk to in that company. One group can be gung-ho, the other ho-hum, and neither represent their company's position.

Although, it sounds like he describing Take-Two, so I'm not surprised.
 
The chances of Nintendo really getting 'core gamers' pretty much went out of the window now that the next xbox is supposed to come out in the same year as Wiiu. Right?
 
EatChildren said:
Well, I mean, everyone is going to have a different view of the hardware. I've always, always held the belief it wouldn't scratch up to the next Sony/Microsoft systems, so I'm not really disappointed or anything (beyond the usual disappointment with Nintendo).

But yeah. Chopper is good people and has legit sources. If they said this, then this is how they feel, and given the publisher it is quite disappointing to hear this.
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I was just hoping for Nintendo to be relevant to gamers next gen so we wouldn't have to deal with the type of crap we're seeing with Skyward Sword. :/

My revised spec guess.

Modified 1.5GHz tri-core 476FP @45nm w/10MB eDRAM
1GB GDDR3 RAM (shared)
Modified 550MHz RV730 w/ 320SPs @40nm (will not have a better tessellation unit)
8GB internal flash
Support for two controllers

$249.99

Coolwhip said:
The chances of Nintendo really getting 'core gamers' pretty much went out of the window now that the next xbox is supposed to come out in the same year as Wiiu. Right?
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It went out the window when they decided to hold back again. Now I'm half-hoping it'll be bad enough to get Iwata replaced. :/
 
AceBandage said:
The entire industry needs to fix the pricing structure, though.
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Well, sure. But Nintendo need to open their fucking eyes. I don't actually have a problem with paying £20+ for a handheld game, but that's just because of my age. I'm suitably conditioned. But to compete, and stay in the game, they need to drop their prices.

Disclaimer: I will continue to enjoy the 3DS in the meantime, regardless. Fuck cheapskates. :p
 
Coolwhip said:
The chances of Nintendo really getting 'core gamers' pretty much went out of the window now that the next xbox is supposed to come out in the same year as Wiiu. Right?
Click to expand...


No?

Chopper said:
Well, sure. But Nintendo need to open their fucking eyes. I don't actually have a problem with paying £20+ for a handheld game, but that's just because of my age. I'm suitably conditioned. But to compete, and stay in the game, they need to drop their prices.

Disclaimer: I will continue to enjoy the 3DS in the meantime, regardless. Fuck cheapskates. :p
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I'm sorry, but I disagree.
I don't think that a pricing structure like the App Store is good for long termed health of the industry.
It might be the flavor of the month, so to speak, but there's no way it's sustainable. Too many people still like their gigantic budgeted games.
 
AceBandage said:
Oh come on.
Pretty much all their consoles and especially handhelds were weaker than the competition.
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Handhelds, yes, but consoles were always on-par before the Wii. Now they're always a gen behind. You're lying to yourself by saying that nothing has changed.

If this is the route they're taking, I hope that they commit to a 10-year plan for all consoles from now on. If they're not competing, there's no reason to force the consumer to spend money just for prettier graphics. I can't keep buying two consoles every generation if one only gets two games I want every year!
 
Coolwhip said:
The chances of Nintendo really getting 'core gamers' pretty much went out of the window now that the next xbox is supposed to come out in the same year as Wiiu. Right?
Click to expand...
That chance was all but gone the moment Nintendo decided to make systems targeting Wii Sports audience instead of COD/GTA/other hardcore series audience. The fact that the next Xbox is coming out soon after just buries it.
 
I think the era of predictable outcomes has long since passed. It was easier back when the market was simpler. But the industry has grown to encompass so many different types of consumers, products, and distribution models that I don't think it's going to come down to shear power.

Part of me really wishes there was an other video game crash though. I don't like seeing all these bloated budgets and studios closing left and right. It just doesn't seem sustainable. And call me petty, but part of me does miss the days when games weren't so mainstream and bro-tacular.
 
Chopper said:
Well, sure. But Nintendo need to open their fucking eyes. I don't actually have a problem with paying £20+ for a handheld game, but that's just because of my age. I'm suitably conditioned. But to compete, and stay in the game, they need to drop their prices.

Disclaimer: I will continue to enjoy the 3DS in the meantime, regardless. Fuck cheapskates. :p
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Off topic, but: Considering that Pokemon Black and White have sold more than 4 million in the US alone in just over 6 months at £35, I'd suggest that the problem is more compelling software than software prices.

Consumers will see Mario Land and Mario Kart as worthy of £40 in a way that they won't the vast majority of the rest of the 3DS lineup.
 
H_Prestige said:
That chance was all but gone the moment Nintendo decided to make systems targeting Wii Sports audience instead of COD/GTA/other hardcore series audience. The fact that the next Xbox is coming out soon after just buries it.
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So... the fact that they dedicated most of their Wii U time to hardcore games means... what?
 
AceBandage said:
I'm sorry, but I disagree.
I don't think that a pricing structure like the App Store is good for long termed health of the industry.
It might be the flavor of the month, so to speak, but there's no way it's sustainable. Too many people still like their gigantic budgeted games.
Click to expand...
I don't think App store prices are the way to go either. I whole-heartedly agreed with Iwata when he said that the low prices devalue the product that people work so hard on, especially in a time when pirated downloads are at an all-time high, and people are resenting having to pay for a game at all. But there has to be a compromise. Prices between £10-£20 are not unrealistic prices.
 
I think for some games it is.
I mean, there's already $20 3DS games. But you can't expect people to pay $20 for like... Resident Evil Revelations. I mean, that game basically has a console like budget.
 
AceBandage said:
So... the fact that they dedicated most of their Wii U time to hardcore games means... what?
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Are you talking about the video reel showing ps3/360 games? Great, the system will likely get ports. How will they sell compared to MS/Sony SKU's? That's what determines whether they have a chance or not at dethroning the Xbox. As it is, Sony can't even do it, so what the hell is Nintendo going to do?
 
H_Prestige said:
Are you talking about the video reel showing ps3/360 games? Great, the system will likely get ports. How will they sell compared to MS/Sony SKU's? That's what determines whether they have a chance or not at dethroning the Xbox. As it is, Sony can't even do it, so what the hell is Nintendo going to do?
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Dethroning XBox?
Do what now?
 
JJConrad said:
Although, it sounds like he describing Take-Two, so I'm not surprised.
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I dunno. I don't think take-two is that big. At least not as big as he's making them out to be.

Who are the biggest mega-publishers in the world?

Activision
EA
Ubisoft
Square-enix
Capcom (maybe?)

I can't see nintendo being too open to any other devs about their upcoming games.
 
Exterminieren said:
Off topic, but: Considering that Pokemon Black and White have sold more than 4 million in the US alone in just over 6 months at £35, I'd suggest that the problem is more compelling software than software prices.

Consumers will see Mario Land and Mario Kart as worthy of £40 in a way that they won't the vast majority of the rest of the 3DS lineup.
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Correct on all fronts. But all three of those games are developed and published by Nintendo. Nintendo games will always sell well. And yes, Monster Hunter will too. But moving forward, however, handheld Nintendo titles will be alot more niche than people accept, amongst the throngs of cheap (and quality) App Store offerings.
 
Chopper said:
I don't think App store prices are the way to go either. I whole-heartedly agreed with Iwata when he said that the low prices devalue the product that people work so hard on, especially in a time when pirated downloads are at an all-time high, and people are resenting having to pay for a game at all. But there has to be a compromise. Prices between £10-£20 are not unrealistic prices.
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Actually, they are. For third-party games, that £/$10 has to be split between packaging and shipping costs, the retailer, Nintendo, and finally the publisher. Less than £/$15 for new retail games is unrealistic. Digital distribution is the more viable choice at that point, be it App Store, Android Market, eShop, XBox Live, or PSN.
 
BurntPork said:
Actually, they are. For third-party games, that £/$10 has to be split between packaging and shipping costs, the retailer, Nintendo, and finally the publisher. Less than £/$15 for new retail games is unrealistic. Digital distribution is the more viable choice at that point, be it App Store, Android Market, eShop, XBox Live, or PSN.
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Do you realize how much profit Nintendo made on the DS titles they released? I know it depends on volume, but on a handheld console, with the right support and some decent maths, it can be a reasonable price.
 
AceBandage said:
Nintendo...
Even with the few months of the 360 selling a bit more, it would take years for it to catch up.
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Catch up...to what? A meaningless LTD number? For the market segment you think Nintendo has a chance of breaking into, MS has dominated this entire generation.
 
Chopper said:
Do you realize how much profit Nintendo made on the DS titles they released? I know it depends on volume, but on a handheld console, with the right support and some decent maths, it can be a reasonable price.
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That's why I specifically mentioned third-parties. And Nintendo can't undercut third-parties because they wouldn't like that.

15-20 for budget titles, 20-25 average, and 25-30 for big sellers is most realistic.
 
guek said:
I dunno. I don't think take-two is that big. At least not as big as he's making them out to be.

Who are the biggest mega-publishers in the world?

Activision
EA
Ubisoft
Square-enix
Capcom (maybe?)

I can't see nintendo being too open to any other devs about their upcoming games.
Click to expand...
He described a big company, apparently "hardcore" in nature, that won't invest in the handhelds but instead iOS. None of those really fit, some of those don't even come close. Who else could it be, but Take Two?
 
Microsoft's recent success comes down to the price dropping down to mass market levels. The 360 will pull customers away from the Loop just like it will do to the Wii U. However, among next generation systems, I think the Wii U should perform well out of the gate because it should be significantly cheaper. Whether Nintendo can keep the momentum is questionable as that requires a robust online system, good first party games, and a healthy third party software environment but as long as their console is the budget choice, Nintendo is well primed for the beginning; their position is quite tenable if they're willing to make the proper investments.
 
JJConrad said:
He described a big company, apparently "hardcore" in nature, that won't invest in the handhelds but instead iOS. None of those really fit, some of those don't even come close. Who else could it be, but Take Two?
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Yeah you're probably right.

In that case I don't think it was too surprising that nintendo would keep them out of the loop.
 
H_Prestige said:
Catch up...to what? A meaningless LTD number? For the market segment you think Nintendo has a chance of breaking into, MS has dominated this entire generation.
Click to expand...

You post said "selling the most consoles and games in NA." That's Nintendo. Don't move the goalposts.
 
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