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[Rapstah]

So guys, I have a Mage level 48 and my professions are Herbalism and Minning (almost level 300 on both).

So, I decided to make a new character, a Draenei priest, which is level 7 so far. My question is since my gathering needs are pretty much covered with my mage, which professions should I pursue with my priest? I'm trying to be full support to the party so I was thinking alchemy and I dunno, jewelcrafting maybe?

You'll never level two crafting ones simultaneously with character levelling at its current speed. Go herb/alch or min/jewel.

 

[Twig]

Which guild was he in?

I dunno, but he said he was tired of PUGs, someone suggested he join a good guild, he said "I was in a major raiding guild once and didn't like it."

I mean, if you're not having fun, you're not having fun, and that's fine. I just thought it was a weird thing to say because I'm in what I consider a "good guild" but definitely don't consider a "major raiding guild".

 

[MattPeters]

Our guild is going for Sinestra this week. Tonight we are picking up on ascendant council. Last week we got wrecked on cho'gall, but we won't take that shit again

anyone where have any sinestra experience?

 

[Rapstah]

Our guild is going for Sinestra this week. Tonight we are picking up on ascendant council. Last week we got wrecked on cho'gall, but we won't take that shit again

anyone where have any sinestra experience?

Well she's been downed, what, twice worldwide?

EDIT: I actually don't have a clue about how many times she's been downed worldwide but two sounds sort of realistic.

 

[Dizzy-4U]

You'll never level two crafting ones simultaneously with character levelling at its current speed. Go herb/alch or min/jewel.

I don't understand. Wouldn't I level alchemy and jewelcrafting faster if I send all the herbs and stones I gather with my mage to the priest?

 

[Rapstah]

I don't understand. Wouldn't I level alchemy and jewelcrafting faster if I send all the herbs and stones I gather with my mage to the priest?

It takes a lot more than the materials you'd get from just levelling the gathering professions. If you'd want to spend hours grinding the mats on another char then it'd work, yeah.

EDIT: Oh, faster, obviously, no question about that.

 

[MattPeters]

Well she's been downed, what, twice worldwide?

Thats it? hmm, thought it was more than that. Guess I should pay more attention. :\

 

[Twig]

So, a Tol Barad question: on your servers, does the defending team focus entirely on defending a single point?

On my server, the defending team kinda just goes in a circle, recapping points offense manages to get. Offense wins by breaking that circle. TB changes hands at least once every two days on Stormreaver. Usually once a day, but on occasion one side will hold onto it for more than 24 hours. Which is perfectly acceptable, in my opinion.

The complaints I've heard about TB seem to stem from the fact that on OTHER servers, the defending team just turtles the entire raid group into one point, which makes it EXCEPTIONALLY difficult to cap that point, I would think.

And it seems like the "fix" Blizzard is implementing will only break the latter strategy, and not the strategy used on my server.

 

[SnakeswithLasers]

Thats it? hmm, thought it was more than that. Guess I should pay more attention. :\

Haha, ya. Good luck! =D

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

I dunno, but he said he was tired of PUGs, someone suggested he join a good guild, he said "I was in a major raiding guild once and didn't like it."

I mean, if you're not having fun, you're not having fun, and that's fine. I just thought it was a weird thing to say because I'm in what I consider a "good guild" but definitely don't consider a "major raiding guild".

I think once you're at a certain level it is difficult to come back down. I don't want to be elitist but if you play for a long time with high quality players anything but that will just suck.

 

[Twig]

I've played with more than enough people who got sick of the elitist high-level players and now have fun playing with more casual players who don't take it so seriously.

It goes both ways.

 

[Bisnic]

Speaking of TB, I'm glad i only need 3 more commendations for the drake. I already bought the trinket, so that's the only thing left i want. TB sucks on my server cause Alliance control it like once or twice a week, so i only get 5-6 commendations a day. Tomorrow, it will all be over.

fuckyeah.jpg

 

[Flib]

Thats it? hmm, thought it was more than that. Guess I should pay more attention. :\

Actually, Paragon has killed her, and the fight changed and is changing so much, it's not clear what state it's in at this point.

edit: I apparently can't read, 4 guilds have downed her.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

Just about to move into Uldum, about a third of the way to 85. Hi-ho, hi-ho.

 

[MattPeters]

Haha, ya. Good luck! =D

Thanks. lol

We are cockblocked on heroic Cho'gall, spent 4,5 hrs on him last week with no kill. We are doing it on 10m, and ive heard that 10 is harder than 25. Any thruth to that?

 

[Trasher]

So, a Tol Barad question: on your servers, does the defending team focus entirely on defending a single point?

On my server, the defending team kinda just goes in a circle, recapping points offense manages to get. Offense wins by breaking that circle. TB changes hands at least once every two days on Stormreaver. Usually once a day, but on occasion one side will hold onto it for more than 24 hours. Which is perfectly acceptable, in my opinion.

The complaints I've heard about TB seem to stem from the fact that on OTHER servers, the defending team just turtles the entire raid group into one point, which makes it EXCEPTIONALLY difficult to cap that point, I would think.

And it seems like the "fix" Blizzard is implementing will only break the latter strategy, and not the strategy used on my server.

The strategy that people use on my server is pretty much a bug. What you do is when you get into the battle, you get one honorable kill, and then leave the raid group. By doing this it lets you stay in the battle, and then those people begin forming a second raid. That then makes room in the "real" raid thus enabling more and more people to join the battle. The alliance on my server seemed to have figured this out first because they out-zerg us all the time by simply outnumbering the horde. It's really dumb, and I can't believe it hasn't been hotfixed yet.

 

[Twig]

The strategy that people use on my server is pretty much a bug. What you do is when you get into the battle, you get one honorable kill, and then leave the raid group. By doing this it lets you stay in the battle, and then those people begin forming a second raid. That then makes room in the "real" raid thus enabling more and more people to join the battle. The alliance on my server seemed to have figured this out first because they out-zerg us all the time by simply outnumbering the horde. It's really dumb, and I can't believe it hasn't been hotfixed yet.

The game balances based on people in the zone, not people in the raid.

In other words, while it might give Alliance more people, it also gives you more people.

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

Thanks. lol

We are cockblocked on heroic Cho'gall, spent 4,5 hrs on him last week with no kill. We are doing it on 10m, and ive heard that 10 is harder than 25. Any thruth to that?

You only get two tanks instead of three on 25, which makes handling adds and Cho'gall's tank debuff trickier.

Other than that, I'm not sure.

A lot of fights favor 25-mans this tier I think though, just because you get more flexibility with tanks, and can have 3 (or even 4 on H Halfus), and the fights this is useful on far outweighs the fights where more room to spread out is useful.

 

[Trasher]

The game balances based on people in the zone, not people in the raid.

In other words, while it might give Alliance more people, it also gives you more people.

That's not what's happening. There's definitely an exploit going on right now.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1921698606

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1922564746

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

It's possible to have fun doing trial and error no matter what they give you... it's been a major part of game play since vanilla and other MMO's before WOW. It's built into the dfenition of progression, which people obviously done in WOTLK. If you played in the middle of ICC's release and people expected you to know everything, yeah, but that's not progression that's being carried and them expecting you to pull weight despite not having practice like tons of other people have had in the previous months. It's going to be the same when this content is on farm and the new raids aren't released yet.

And I'm pointing out it is MORE possible now.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

The game balances based on people in the zone, not people in the raid.

In other words, while it might give Alliance more people, it also gives you more people.

Raid leaders can invite people not in the fight, its a glitch.

 

[zugzug]

Speaking of TB, I'm glad i only need 3 more commendations for the drake. I already bought the trinket, so that's the only thing left i want. TB sucks on my server cause Alliance control it like once or twice a week, so i only get 5-6 commendations a day. Tomorrow, it will all be over.

fuckyeah.jpg

You know its this attitude that the blizzzard developers like to see. They have no need to fix it because you no longer care you got what you wanted. It dosen't matter whether they created a good or truly bad system of play you got what you needed you quit playing it and now that validates the Blizzard Developers to never fix the problem.

Not to be rude but its people like you who hasten bad mmos into being bad.

 

[Bisnic]

You know its this attitude that the blizzzard developers like to see. They have no need to fix it because you no longer care you got what you wanted. It dosen't matter whether they created a good or truly bad system of play you got what you needed you quit playing it and now that validates the Blizzard Developers to never fix the problem.

Not to be rude but its people like you who hasten bad mmos into being bad.

I dont bother with TB because its a shitty PVP zone and being on Offense is not fun at all since this zone favor Defense. And Alliance is 80% of the time on Offense. Not wasting my time in something that isn't fun. I would probably participate in the battles even after i got my trinket and drake if it was fun being on Offense, but it's not. I'm not going to do something i dont like in hope Blizzard fix it.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

You know its this attitude that the blizzzard developers like to see. They have no need to fix it because you no longer care you got what you wanted. It dosen't matter whether they created a good or truly bad system of play you got what you needed you quit playing it and now that validates the Blizzard Developers to never fix the problem.

Not to be rude but its people like you who hasten bad mmos into being bad.

What? Comments like that should tell blizzard that world pvp zones like that suck, and they do.

 

[Retro]

What? Comments like that should tell blizzard that world pvp zones like that suck, and they do.

But it also tells them that their player base is more than willing to slog through shit (repeatedly) just to get slightly better stats. That keeps players playing and paying, which is a success by Blizzard's standards. Thus, it is much more likely to see the bar on content quality remain at or about the same level as TB.

If people aren't just content, but actually willing to deal with shitty content on a regular basis, then why strive give them anything better?

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

But it also tells them that their player base is more than willing to slog through shit (repeatedly) just to get slightly better stats. That keeps players playing and paying, which is a success by Blizzard's standards. Thus, it is much more likely to see the bar on content quality remain at or about the same level as TB.

If people aren't just content, but actually willing to deal with shitty content on a regular basis, then why strive give them anything better?

People do that shit for rated bgs, arena, and raids.

 

[Angry Grimace]

You know its this attitude that the blizzzard developers like to see. They have no need to fix it because you no longer care you got what you wanted. It dosen't matter whether they created a good or truly bad system of play you got what you needed you quit playing it and now that validates the Blizzard Developers to never fix the problem.

Not to be rude but its people like you who hasten bad mmos into being bad.

There's so many logical problems with this "theory" that its comical.

 

[wonderdung]

Thats it? hmm, thought it was more than that. Guess I should pay more attention. :\

Up to four kills worldwide now. More info on the fight should be coming soon and we'll start seeing more Sinestra kills. The big problem is probably that only 10 guilds have downed Heroic Cho'gall worldwide.

 

[zugzug]

People do that shit for rated bgs, arena, and raids.

Very defensive response on your part, not a good comeback to discuss.

Edit: very typical response from angry grimace. and very boring.

 

[charlequin]

Well she's been downed, what, twice worldwide?

EDIT: I actually don't have a clue about how many times she's been downed worldwide but two sounds sort of realistic.

Now, now, it's up to four now.

(Heroic Cho'gall is at 10, Heroic Ascendant Council's at 21.)

 

[dimb]

Level 76 on my Shaman alt. Holy fuck Northrend is ploddingly slow. It feels like I'll never escape.

 

[Dizzy-4U]

Quick question: Discipline or Holy? Which one is better for party support?

edit: Nevermind. I went Discipline.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

Very defensive response on your part, not a good comeback to discuss.

Edit: very typical response from angry grimace. and very boring.

Why do all junior members think like this?

 

[zugzug]

Why do all junior members think like this?

oh hi my account created 3 months before you, my 259 posts to your 2,000 posts.

Your opnion is vastly more important than mine.

TY for dismissing me based upon nothing. You win.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

oh hi my account created 3 months before you, my 259 posts to your 2,000 posts.

Your opnion is vastly more important than mine.

TY for dismissing me based upon nothing. You win.

You dismissed yourself with the post you made. You made a "umad" post.

Very defensive response on your part, not a good comeback to discuss.
Edit: very typical response from angry grimace. and very boring.

There is no "opnion" here it's just you attacking people instead of trying to make a case for your argument.

 

[Zaptruder]

But it also tells them that their player base is more than willing to slog through shit (repeatedly) just to get slightly better stats. That keeps players playing and paying, which is a success by Blizzard's standards. Thus, it is much more likely to see the bar on content quality remain at or about the same level as TB.

If people aren't just content, but actually willing to deal with shitty content on a regular basis, then why strive give them anything better?

In a situation where you have limited time and resources (irrespective of how considerable they are), and have too many requests and demands (which too often conflict) to fufill, coming from many different angles (community tools, itemization, appearances, UI, PVP balance, PVE balance, etc, etc)...

What would you do?

 

[dimb]

In a situation where you have limited time and resources (irrespective of how considerable they are), and have too many requests and demands (which too often conflict) to fufill, coming from many different angles (community tools, itemization, appearances, UI, PVP balance, PVE balance, etc, etc)...

What would you do?

Hire more people with their boatloads of money.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Very defensive response on your part, not a good comeback to discuss.

Edit: very typical response from angry grimace. and very boring.

Yes, your theory that not playing bad content encourages Blizzard to make more bad content is VERY worthy of a legitimate discussion.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

why are wow players so aggressive?

I run into this sort of thing in pugs as well, and the second I show a bit of warmth or common decency and a " " people seem to either instantly remember there's a person on the other end or that they're raging about losing the role for a ring that would have given them a +4 intellect increase.

It's just like... chill.

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

why are wow players so aggressive?

I run into this sort of thing in pugs as well, and the second I show a bit of warmth or common decency and a " " people seem to either instantly remember there's a person on the other end or that they're raging about losing the role for a ring that would have given them a +4 intellect increase.

It's just like... chill.

But, but, heroics are serious business, it's not like I they only have a one day lockout...

(Though I did go through 2 straight weeks trying to get my shammy the healing trinket from Halls of Reflection before it even dropped once, having no competition.)

 

[notsol337]

Level 76 on my Shaman alt. Holy fuck Northrend is ploddingly slow. It feels like I'll never escape.

I know what you mean. I got a paladin up to 76 and I just can't stand it anymore. I gave up D:

 

[Ramirez]

Level 76 on my Shaman alt. Holy fuck Northrend is ploddingly slow. It feels like I'll never escape.

Yea, it's extremely stupid how slow leveling is there compared to every other leveling experience in the game now. Even with rested it's slow, I don't even want to imagine straight up without it. :|

 

[Retro]

In a situation where you have limited time and resources (irrespective of how considerable they are), and have too many requests and demands (which too often conflict) to fufill, coming from many different angles (community tools, itemization, appearances, UI, PVP balance, PVE balance, etc, etc)...

What would you do?

Not release shit, or having inadvertently released shit, fix that shit, removing it for a period of time and offering a temporary fix. Irregardless of requests and demands, Blizzard owns their product (as every EULA you click through is designed to remind you) and controls their product.

If something isn't working, they should rip it out and fix it. Instead, it seems like they're just letting things go on as it is because they know the majority of their players are willing to slog through it for the rewards, even if they don't find it fun. The latest patch only makes sure players get all of the daily quests.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

the 'ir' in irregardless seems kind of redundant

 

[Angry Grimace]

Not release shit, or having inadvertently released shit, fix that shit, removing it for a period of time and offering a temporary fix. Irregardless of requests and demands, Blizzard owns their product (as every EULA you click through is designed to remind you) and controls their product.

If something isn't working, they should rip it out and fix it. Instead, it seems like they're just letting things go on as it is because they know the majority of their players are willing to slog through it for the rewards, even if they don't find it fun. The latest patch only makes sure players get all of the daily quests.

I don't get why people actually believe Blizzard could just hire more people and fix things. There is a point at which throwing more money or people at a problem doesn't fix things. I'll grant you Tol Barad is broken and dumb as fuck, but this theory that Blizzard either has infinite resources or that infinite resources would just instantly fix problems is kind of silly.

I personally wouldn't slog through that shit for those rewards. I can't fathom how they are worth it. A trinket I could replace with a better one by raiding (or leveling Alchemy) or another goddamn drake...am I missing anything else?

Speaking of Drakes, I really can't stand them and decided to grind out Cenarion rep for the Hippogryph. It's really not that long/hard, especially if there is any quantity of Armaments in your local Auction House.

 

[Deputy Moonman]

I don't get why people actually believe Blizzard could just hire more people and fix things. There is a point at which throwing more money or people at a problem doesn't fix things. I'll grant you Tol Barad is broken and dumb as fuck, but this theory that Blizzard either has infinite resources or that infinite resources would just instantly fix problems is kind of silly.

I personally wouldn't slog through that shit for those rewards. I can't fathom how they are worth it. A trinket I could replace with a better one by raiding (or leveling Alchemy) or another goddamn drake...am I missing anything else?

Speaking of Drakes, I really can't stand them and decided to grind out Cenarion rep for the Hippogryph. It's really not that long/hard, especially if there is any quantity of Armaments in your local Auction House.

You make a good point: Tol Barad is awful, but it's more likely to be the result of a failed attempt at making a good BG, and not because blizzard didn't try or because they didn't have the resources. Some things just don't turn out well and it's a fact of life.

Regarding the stone drakes... I think they look so bad that it's painful. I can't tell what kind of head armor they're supposed to be wearing, but it's anything but good looking. And when people are afk flying their stone drakes in Stormwind or Orgrimmar, they look like limp dicks with wings. It's so bad I'm not even fussed with getting my glory of the cataclysm hero achievements done. I don't want a stone drake ever.

Having said this, I think the drakes of the north/south/west/east winds actually have a nice appearance. But I'm still not going to get 200 commendations from TB just to buy the West one. I'm sticking with my headless horseman mount.

EDIT: I forgot to mention... My guild downed Council tonight. We had a 3% wipe and a .4% wipe (yes you read that correctly) on our 2nd and 3rd attempt of the night. Then we got really sloppy and died repeatedly for the next couple of hours before cleaning our act up and downing the boss. Had a little bit of time to try a few attempts at Cho'gall. I think we should be able to finish him off next week and get in some really good attempts on Nef.

 

[zugzug]

You make a good point: Tol Barad is awful, but it's more likely to be the result of a failed attempt at making a good BG, and not because blizzard didn't try or because they didn't have the resources.

The problem is Grimace never made the point that Tol Barad was bad in the past 24 hours, he started a name calling contest at me in this thread instead of making a polite point on his side. Grimace defended Blizzard for what is universally known to be a bad zone. Which was pointed out to Blizzard in beta that Tol Barad was terribad yet it was still released in its terribad state. Then Blizzard added a terribad hotfix that was removed after enough win trading went on. The players me and Grimace and Cuevas are still sitting here waiting for Blizzzard to correct the error and have Blizzard admit Blizzard made an error. Yet Grimace and Cuevas are defending Blizzard by namecalling me and others. Grimace only now says Tol Barad is bad and you can see he is doing it in defense of his position to save face. Maybe Grimace released he was defending Blizzard to clearly with his fanboy nature that Grimace has shown in the past.

Now Grimace is also saying listen guys Blizzard messed up but to not to fix it and simply move onto the next patch of new content because its been more 2 months and we the player base are clearly ready for new content. Grimace and Cuevas are clearly ok with paying for the substandard content and do not care. Nor care to call Blizzard out on their crappy content.


Queue more name calling on a public forum till Grimace and Cuevas have broken down each line and make themselves feel satisfied as board warriors.

 

[Angry Grimace]

The problem is Grimace never made the point that Tol Barad was bad in the past 24 hours, he started a name calling contest at me in this thread instead of making a polite point on his side. Grimace defended Blizzard for what is universally known to be a bad zone. Which was pointed out to Blizzard in beta that Tol Barad was terribad yet it was still released in its terribad state. Then Blizzard added a terribad hotfix that was removed after enough win trading went on. The players me and Grimace and Cuevas are still sitting here waiting for Blizzzard to correct the error and have Blizzard admit Blizzard made an error. Yet Grimace and Cuevas are defending Blizzard by namecalling me and others. Grimace only now says Tol Barad is bad and you can see he is doing it in defense of his position to save face. Maybe Grimace released he was defending Blizzard to clearly with his fanboy nature that Grimace has shown in the past.

Now Grimace is also saying listen guys Blizzard messed up but to not to fix it and simply move onto the next patch of new content because its been more 2 months and we the player base are clearly ready for new content. Grimace and Cuevas are clearly ok with paying for the substandard content and do not care. Nor care to call Blizzard out on their crappy content.


Queue more name calling on a public forum till Grimace and Cuevas have broken down each line and make themselves feel satisfied as board warriors.

Nobody is "name calling" you anything; that's outright false.

I simply said your logic was so faulty as to be comical, but that's because it is. You're suggesting Blizzard's actual intent is to make zones actively non-fun so that they won't have to do any more work on them.

It's not a good, logical or well-founded argument at all. It's completely speculative, and frankly, rather delusional speculation.

Also:

Maybe Grimace released he was defending Blizzard to clearly with his fanboy nature that Grimace has shown in the past.

Actually, I....uh.....well, you see........what?

 

[Twig]

That's not what's happening. There's definitely an exploit going on right now.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1921698606

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1922564746

I've never seen it work, even once, despite people consistently leaving the raid when I do TB.

No one has yet to actually prove that it works, and until they do, I won't believe that it works, when, in fact, I've seen it not work when I do TB during peak hours.

Raid leaders can invite people not in the fight, its a glitch.

This, however, might work. I don't know. I've never heard anyone actually suggest this before. The "glitch" that I know of is performed via the following method:

1) Get in TB.
2) Get honor kill.
3) Leave main raid.
4) Someone else fills your spot in main raid, while you get to stay in TB.

The problem is, no matter how many times I see people leave the main raid, I NEVER see the main raid fill up in a way that is at all indicative of being a result of someone leaving the main raid. It's just the normal slow trickle in, or no one at all. If it REALLY worked, the main raid would literally be full at all times, except when one person left. Then that spot would immediately fill back up.

 

[wonderdung]

I think the problem with TB is actually the players. It'd be fine if people were willing to try to understand strategy, but in my experience they're all too busy whining about the zone rules in raid chat to figure out where they should be going next.

It's impossible to figure out where the real balance problems are at this point. Does defense have a huge advantage or a small one? I can't tell because no one on offense is playing it like you would play a zone capture BG where you need all points to win. They're still playing it like people play safe AB. Good AB teams are never content to sit on 3 nodes and defend, but that's all PUGs know how to do, so that's how they play TB.

Calling TB substandard content just because you don't like the rule setup is a bit of a stretch. Saying things should be changed just because people whine about them isn't a very solid game design philosophy.

And if you have time to complain about TB you're clearly not doing enough Archaeology.