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WOW OMG: Steam is refunding No Man's Sky even if you played more then 2 hours
- Thread starter Tony Iron Man Stark
- Start date
Sadly that's what kinda made me glad for the ps4 version
But HG has been working hard on fixing those crashes.
I will admit I had mine crash a ton in all hours but now I can go on a warp spree for hours and only crash from the "too quick menu switch"
Dynamite Shikoku
Congratulations, you really deserve it!
May Sean Murray forgive all the sins in this thread
LookAtMeGo
Member
People expect something they bought to work for at least longer than a few dozen hours. Thats not too much to ask. Asking for a refund for something you just dodnt like is another story. But even thats questionable here due to the false promises and shady business tactics.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
It's cool when the damn product fails to work and doesn't let me play the dang thing. I enjoyed my time with it. But you know what Sony had no issues with me refunding it. I didn't even beg or demand. I typed a total of 3 sentences over the entire conversation and got refunded.
Imagine you bought a ps4 or new graphic card and they shit the bed after a month completely unusable, do you just shrug your shoulders and say "well I used it already lol"
Replace PS4 with X360 and you have the RRoD situation
That was the worst case
Well made points. I don't particularly have a horse in this race, so to speak, but a few things about the whole No Man's Sky backlash come across as a little inappropriate:
a) the focus on Sean as a person. You don't know this man outside of his few public appearances, it's not really fair to judge his character or what he may or may not be like behind closed doors. Judge the product all you want but it feels creepy having all these memes and this sort of cult of people hanging on his words / actions / twitter schedule so they can tear them all apart.
b) the imaginings of what is going on or went on at Hello Games. Again, you're not there. Concocting all these conspiratorial, closed door scenarios is just silly, and it is also borderline creepy trying to find the names and job descriptions of all the staff to try to reconstruct what ever happened during development. Again, judge the product to hell and back, but unless they want to release a development diary, the rest is basically useless speculation.
c) the extreme and highly personal language. Hello Games "spit in my face," this game is "giant middle finger." I mean if I bought some appliance that turned out to be a piece of shit I would sound literally out of my mind if I used terms like that when I complained about it or tried to return it.
Anyway, just airing my accumulated complaints and observations. At the end of the day so much of this feels like it's just gone too far for what ultimately boils down to a simple decision about whether or not to buy / refund a video game.
VlaudTheImpaler
tl;dr
Alright, after doing a bit of research I redesigned the tutorial around filing a complaint to the FTC. I think this has a much better chance at actually doing something. Again, let me know if I got anything wrong or if anything needs to be changed. Also, feel free to reformat or make changes yourself and PM it to me. As far as I can tell it's almost identical to the econsumer.gov process that I posted for those outside of the states. I looked into econsumer.gov and it is legit and is in fact related to the FTC.
If you are in the EU or elsewhere click here! I redesigned the other tutorial for out of state only and the econsumer.gov website.
If you are in the US start here, Federal Trade Commission Complaint Assistant.
Select Internet Services, Online Shopping, Computers.
Did you experience any of the following? Please select all of these that apply:
Check- Other
Continue,
read and continue
How much did the company ask you to pay:
Whatever amount you paid
How much did you actually pay the company (total amount obtained by the suspect/subject):
Jowever much you paid
How did you pay the company:
Whatever you paid with
How did the company contact you:
I put "internet website" not sure if this should be "I initiated contact" instead.
When did the company first contact you (mm/dd/yyyy):
I left this blank
How did you respond to the first/initial contact:
Other
Company Representative First Name:
Sean
Company Representative Last Name:
Murray
Company Representative Title/Position:
Founder
Company Information
*These are as best as I can figure, I don't live in the UK and have no idea how addresses work there.*
Company Name:
Hello Games
Company Address:
79 WALNUT TREE CLOSE
Apt/PO Box:
Couldn't find this.
City:
GUILDFORD SURREY
Country:
United Kingdom
State:
England
Zip:
Don't know what to put here
Company Email Address:
hello@hellogames.co.uk
Company Website:
http://www.hellogames.org
Company Phone Number:
Couldn't find
Extension:
Left this blank
Fill in your info
Additional Information
*I had my wife type this up since there was a character limit and she is a journalist who always complains that I am not succinct enough. I don't know how these websites handle copy pastes so if you use this then maybe change it up a little bit by adding something of your own.*
Comments:
For the past several years Sean Murray of Hello Games discussed his company's game, No Man's Sky. At gaming conferences, talk shows, other venues and media outlets he repeatedly gave information about the game, revealing more and more about No Man's Sky. After the games release a few weeks ago, it became glaringly apparant that he had blatantly lied about many features, inlcuding some key features of the game, as shown in the videos of him below. What has been presented about the game by Sean Murray for the past several years, and the information from Hello Games website is blatant false advertising. The game is not as described, and this company has repeatedly lied and continues to lie about the true contents of their product. This is a list of a lot of the missing features that where advertised and sources from when they where advertised to be there: https://archive.is/OCNdQ
If you are in the EU or elsewhere click here! I redesigned the other tutorial for out of state only and the econsumer.gov website.
If you are in the US start here, Federal Trade Commission Complaint Assistant.
Select Internet Services, Online Shopping, Computers.
1 Getting Started
Did you experience any of the following? Please select all of these that apply:
Check- Other
Continue,
read and continue
2 Complaint details
How much did the company ask you to pay:
Whatever amount you paid
How much did you actually pay the company (total amount obtained by the suspect/subject):
Jowever much you paid
How did you pay the company:
Whatever you paid with
How did the company contact you:
I put "internet website" not sure if this should be "I initiated contact" instead.
When did the company first contact you (mm/dd/yyyy):
I left this blank
How did you respond to the first/initial contact:
Other
Company Representative First Name:
Sean
Company Representative Last Name:
Murray
Company Representative Title/Position:
Founder
3. Company Details
Company Information
*These are as best as I can figure, I don't live in the UK and have no idea how addresses work there.*
Company Name:
Hello Games
Company Address:
79 WALNUT TREE CLOSE
Apt/PO Box:
Couldn't find this.
City:
GUILDFORD SURREY
Country:
United Kingdom
State:
England
Zip:
Don't know what to put here
Company Email Address:
hello@hellogames.co.uk
Company Website:
http://www.hellogames.org
Company Phone Number:
Couldn't find
Extension:
Left this blank
4. Your Information
Fill in your info
5. Comments
Additional Information
*I had my wife type this up since there was a character limit and she is a journalist who always complains that I am not succinct enough. I don't know how these websites handle copy pastes so if you use this then maybe change it up a little bit by adding something of your own.*
Comments:
For the past several years Sean Murray of Hello Games discussed his company's game, No Man's Sky. At gaming conferences, talk shows, other venues and media outlets he repeatedly gave information about the game, revealing more and more about No Man's Sky. After the games release a few weeks ago, it became glaringly apparant that he had blatantly lied about many features, inlcuding some key features of the game, as shown in the videos of him below. What has been presented about the game by Sean Murray for the past several years, and the information from Hello Games website is blatant false advertising. The game is not as described, and this company has repeatedly lied and continues to lie about the true contents of their product. This is a list of a lot of the missing features that where advertised and sources from when they where advertised to be there: https://archive.is/OCNdQ
Ok. Not sure when you last tried, but there are no more crashes on PS4, and those that did exist before the last few patches were pretty easy to avoid. Open and then close the options menu before your discoveries had loaded and it'd crash, so you know, don't do that, wait for it to load for a few seconds.
Is that a great bit of coding, nope, but it's also not "this game doesn't work". It works fine, it just crashes under certain, avoidable, circumstances. That's fixed now, I haven't had a crash in a week or two.
Well no, that's hardware and what warranties exist for. Hardware fails from time to time. Do you go see a movie and then go demand a refund because you didn't like it? Some people probably do, but that's generally not acceptable behaviour right? Do you order a meal, take a bite and hate it, then eat the entire thing and complain at the end, shouting for your money back? Once you've consumed the product, be it food, game, story, it's yours, there's no refunds .
Aaaanyway, clearly this isn't an argument that anyone is going to win. Some people have had serious, game breaking bugs that didn't allow them to play the game, totally fair enough. Some people have exploited the system and gotten a refund after they'd consumed the product for weeks, not cool at all. Morals are morals, some people just don't have any apparently.
[
You know what? I am fine with not getting my money back. I chose the Steam Wallet option because I was going to spend the money on other indies, but I'll still support them next month. No big, and life goes on. It's just a game.
What I am not fine with is the idea that this travesty of a release is somehow just fine and that people feel a need to DEFEND it. I mean, no one is asking others who enjoy the game to stop enjoying the game. This fallout has happened because those who AREN'T enjoying the game often feel as such because they were LIED TO AND PAID FOR A DIFFERENT GAME THAN THEY GOT. And very often they can't even PLAY the piece of shit anemic facsimile of the game they thought they were buying because they keep crashing all the fucking time.
Yet people who have zero investment in this keep calling the victims of Sean's bullshit campaign opportunistic "thieves" and overall pieces of shit. Based on what? Some bullshit principle that arbitrary amounts of time render objectively flawed experiences meaningless? And for what purpose? Defending the poor helpless developer?
No. All issues of "entitlement" and time played and being an informed consumer aside: Someone sold a product that was objectively falsely advertised and oftentimes barely works even aside from said deception. The onus is DIRECTLY on the con here, not the victims. It's really sad to see people rushing in to defend this kind of blatant deception because they are 'concerned' about players taking advantage.
What the fuck? Some consumers are literally more concerned about a few opportunists making off with a few bucks than they are about a company who runs off with millions based on lies peddled to consumers just like them.
I would say that now I've seen it all, but every time I say that people keep surprising me.
What I am not fine with is the idea that this travesty of a release is somehow just fine and that people feel a need to DEFEND it. I mean, no one is asking others who enjoy the game to stop enjoying the game. This fallout has happened because those who AREN'T enjoying the game often feel as such because they were LIED TO AND PAID FOR A DIFFERENT GAME THAN THEY GOT. And very often they can't even PLAY the piece of shit anemic facsimile of the game they thought they were buying because they keep crashing all the fucking time.
Yet people who have zero investment in this keep calling the victims of Sean's bullshit campaign opportunistic "thieves" and overall pieces of shit. Based on what? Some bullshit principle that arbitrary amounts of time render objectively flawed experiences meaningless? And for what purpose? Defending the poor helpless developer?
No. All issues of "entitlement" and time played and being an informed consumer aside: Someone sold a product that was objectively falsely advertised and oftentimes barely works even aside from said deception. The onus is DIRECTLY on the con here, not the victims. It's really sad to see people rushing in to defend this kind of blatant deception because they are 'concerned' about players taking advantage.
What the fuck? Some consumers are literally more concerned about a few opportunists making off with a few bucks than they are about a company who runs off with millions based on lies peddled to consumers just like them.
I would say that now I've seen it all, but every time I say that people keep surprising me.
LookAtMeGo
Member
Shit, I think the people who were enjoying the game and had it stop working for them got it worse than anyone who played for a few minutes and didnt like the shit. Or just said fuck it right off the bat after a few crashes. They had no time invested in it. Having something fall apart after you put so much time in it would feel more frustrating IMO.
I can only speak for myself here, but it's not this particular game I'm defending. Personally I'm enjoying my time with it for the most part, but I'm disappointed that so much was blatantly removed seemingly last minute. I have my fingers crossed it'll be patched in over time, otherwise oh well, I've gotten my dollar per hour value out of it, I'm fine with that. I pay $20 to see a movie here, which is terrible value for 90 minutes, but I still keep doing it.
I don't care what game or product it's related to, what people have been doing (again, only those that explicity decided to exploit the refund system after playing the game for many many hours) is really really shady, and they deserve to be told that, not that it'll make any difference I'm sure. It's just not acceptable life behaviour, it's going nothing to do with this game in particular.
I understand that point of view, and it of course has merit. But in this case, I feel that the severity of the deception outweighs the dishonest behavior of some opportunistic creeps. Like, it's not even in the same ballpark, and though looking at an issue or argument from all sides is certainly a better way to arrive at a reasonable conclusion, the absurdity of the offense here is such that I think many of those who are defending the "no refund" position are not taking that fairly into account.
Not trying to toss molotovs here... I do see what you are saying. The context just makes me not believe in it much, if that makes sense.
Edited for "I type faster than I know how to type well."
KaoteK
Member
Meh, I played the game enough to get the plat (which was piss easy BTW) maybe 20 to 30 hours. To begin with it was fine, no crashes despite friends reporting them.
The more I played, the worse it got, to the point where it would happen almost every warp, often when landing on a planet, and just randomly.
Plus I was farming ships and ended up losing 6 hours of progress because the game decided not to save ffs.
Those are justifiable reasons to refund imo, and it just so happened Sony agreed with me (I don't know if the rep could see the error reports I'd been sending every crash or not)
If a game breaks after a certain number of hours, or just doesn't work to begin with, we should have the option of getting our cash back, fuck waiting for patches (which didn't help, if anything the crashing got worse)
The more I played, the worse it got, to the point where it would happen almost every warp, often when landing on a planet, and just randomly.
Plus I was farming ships and ended up losing 6 hours of progress because the game decided not to save ffs.
Those are justifiable reasons to refund imo, and it just so happened Sony agreed with me (I don't know if the rep could see the error reports I'd been sending every crash or not)
If a game breaks after a certain number of hours, or just doesn't work to begin with, we should have the option of getting our cash back, fuck waiting for patches (which didn't help, if anything the crashing got worse)
Dreams-Visions
Member
agree. it really is quite ugly on both sides. regardless, I hope everyone that feels cheated gets their money back. they should not be entitled to your money if they got it through deception. fuck that.
I think their help desk manned by U.S. staff doesn't know anything about UK law even if their senior managers with responsibility for overseas regions do, and Valve in general know that most people won't pursue it. Doesn't mean it isn't worth pursuing, and all of our next moves towards resolution in the UK involve a first step of reminding the seller of UK consumer law and that their company policy doesn't override it.
Take it to Trading Standards at that point once you have Valve's reply saying they think they can ignore it, it'll start with a phone call at the link below and they'll talk you through it. Pretty sure that UK Trading Standards know more about UK digital trade laws/consumer rights than Valve.
If anyone in the UK feels they were misled or sold a broken product, and Valve is ignoring UK law on the matter, this is a good place to start, especially if you have it in writing that they think their company policy is all they need to ignore your consumer rights.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/get-more-help/report-to-trading-standards/
I am getting a bit tired of overseas-based companies like Sony and Valve feeling that they can ignore our laws when selling digital goods in the UK, it's pretty clear what they are when digital goods have a specific section under the sale of goods act.
In particular to digital content, this became law in October last year with regard to technical issues.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-rights-for-consumers-when-buying-digital-content
Backlogger
Member
Got denied on my Steam refund request via support ticket. 26 hours played. Oh well was on the fence anyway. I'll just shelve it in hopes it gets fixed.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
Dude, this is some serious stuff.
FloatingDivider
Member
The thing is I don't understand why there are sides to this thing.
It's not like this was a massive orchestrated scam to attempt to get refunds, it's legitimately a grouping of consumers who feel like they have been done an injustice and are looking for some sort of recourse.
It is absolutely disturbing that people feel the need to personally attack people for requesting refunds by using heavily loaded terminology. It almost feels like certain individuals are essentially trying to bait people into ridiculous banworthy arguments where they have to defend themselves for not liking a product and wishing to see it refunded.
Requesting a refund for a non functional product is allowable and I believe these accusations of organized dishonesty are ridiculous. Go look at the steam reviews, go look at the hello games twitter, go look at the steam community this game is just that upsetting to people. This is not GG or some other hate group it's just random people trying to get refunds. And somehow this is being interpreted as a massive coordinated attack when it is in actuality a bunch of consumers reaching a similar conclusion at roughly the same time. It has happened previously with Batman Arkham Knight and while it took slightly longer to happen with this game this is exactly the same situation.
Calling people that ask for refunds thiefs, losers, etc.. is offensive beyond belief and I'm just going to have to walk away from this one SMH.
For what it's worth I'm going to file complaints with all of the relevant organizations (regardless of how much "power" they have) because I want to defend my rights as a consumer and the application of boilerplate by customer support is distinctly anti-consumer.
P.S
Thanks for the links and information Vlad I bookmarked for later tonight.
It's not like this was a massive orchestrated scam to attempt to get refunds, it's legitimately a grouping of consumers who feel like they have been done an injustice and are looking for some sort of recourse.
It is absolutely disturbing that people feel the need to personally attack people for requesting refunds by using heavily loaded terminology. It almost feels like certain individuals are essentially trying to bait people into ridiculous banworthy arguments where they have to defend themselves for not liking a product and wishing to see it refunded.
Requesting a refund for a non functional product is allowable and I believe these accusations of organized dishonesty are ridiculous. Go look at the steam reviews, go look at the hello games twitter, go look at the steam community this game is just that upsetting to people. This is not GG or some other hate group it's just random people trying to get refunds. And somehow this is being interpreted as a massive coordinated attack when it is in actuality a bunch of consumers reaching a similar conclusion at roughly the same time. It has happened previously with Batman Arkham Knight and while it took slightly longer to happen with this game this is exactly the same situation.
Calling people that ask for refunds thiefs, losers, etc.. is offensive beyond belief and I'm just going to have to walk away from this one SMH.
For what it's worth I'm going to file complaints with all of the relevant organizations (regardless of how much "power" they have) because I want to defend my rights as a consumer and the application of boilerplate by customer support is distinctly anti-consumer.
P.S
Thanks for the links and information Vlad I bookmarked for later tonight.
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
The more apt comparison would be when you purchase a ticket, go see a movie, then the projector fails mid-way or the sound is missing.
Would you request a refund if that happens?
WhiskeyKnight
Member
Honestly, do you feel good about asking for a refund after playing for 26 hours?
FloatingDivider
Member
Honestly, what's it to you? How does him asking for a refund for a product he was displeased by harm you? Why do you honestly care so much? Does this affect you in any way? Honestly?
Agree entirely, it takes a civil matter and turns it into an argument. Consumer rights aren't 'entitlement'.
Does Murray feel good after lying his ass off many times and selling the game on these lies?
Maybe. Maybe not. But he still did it.
thomasmahler
Moon Studios
I don't understand why some people here are so worried that people getting refunds might harm other developers in the long run. I think that's BS. I'm a developer. If we ever end up making a game where I outright LIED to people even after I had to know that certain things didn't make it into the game, by all means, get a refund, cause in that case I was being a major asshole and misused your trust.
It's not like people will now get refunds on every game they don't LIKE, but you should be able to get your money back if the game that you've got is much less than what was advertised and / or if the game stops properly working (crashing constantly) some ways in. In that case, the only developers that'll get harmed are those that lie to their customers and the ones that didn't properly QA their games and that's just dandy.
It's not like people will now get refunds on every game they don't LIKE, but you should be able to get your money back if the game that you've got is much less than what was advertised and / or if the game stops properly working (crashing constantly) some ways in. In that case, the only developers that'll get harmed are those that lie to their customers and the ones that didn't properly QA their games and that's just dandy.
Probably not the right thread to post this in but I thought this was funny.
https://youtu.be/JEIUwjLyPVI
https://youtu.be/JEIUwjLyPVI
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
You would get a refund. Playing for over 50 hours is unlikely to be the same thing, that is comparing apples to oranges IMHO. As I said, I can see why some people expected more, how some of the advertising was quite deceptive and hinting at more stuff that has not materialised yet, and how all of that makes it tricky just to rely on the hours played count, but on the other side you are receiving plenty of patches to help polish the experience further and the game was not that broken to begin with... and the person played with it for over 50 hours.
Randy Monk
Member
I cancelled my preorder thankfully but what happened to giving the developers a chance to patch up the games technical issues instead of going for a straight up refund?
What are you trying to argue here. That because he wronged, you get to do whatever?
As a consumer, you need to get as much information as possible to make an informed purchase. Caveat emptor. I think 2 hours is quite generous for refund, and Steam is even willing to make exceptions for longer hours if technical problems arise that can't be discovered within those initial two hours.
But playing 26 hours and then requesting a refund? What?...
Don't buy the game, then.
FloatingDivider
Member
If they wanted to run an early access kickstarted that'd be fine. They're not though, they're claiming it's a feature complete technically competent game, which it is not. I waited until the end of my refund period of 2 weeks before filing a complaint to see if they would patch my issues, and they haven't so I am asking for a refund.
CharminUltra
Member
Goodness, this thread is 3,500 posts long.
My interest in this game was pretty high close to release, but now I feel like I dodged a hell of a bullet.
My interest in this game was pretty high close to release, but now I feel like I dodged a hell of a bullet.
LookAtMeGo
Member
How do people not get it? A game is not supposed to just stop working after you play it for a while. Even if it was a 2 hour long game you should be able to replay it as many times as you see fit. A game should not have an expiry date that lasts less than a week. How is that hard to understand? If you dont want people to get a refund on your game then you should make sure it works before you release it. Driveclub was a fantastic game but it was advertised as a social game and the online portion of it was fucked at release. It got hammered for it and people refunded the game or traded it in ect and bashed it to high heaven. Same thing with Skyrim in PS3.
The difference here is at least those games were just technical issues. This game is both broken and had some pretty deceptive marketing. It still will do well sales wise IMO but calling people thieves and shit because they want a refund for being sold a broken piece of shit is ridiculous. And I love No Mans Sky.
They are patching it and thats awesome and they are doing a good job of it but that doesnt undo the damage done. If they patch it up and its great and they add more stuff, people will come back and the perception will change like it did for Driveclub.. and that studio shut down pretty much over that.
The difference here is at least those games were just technical issues. This game is both broken and had some pretty deceptive marketing. It still will do well sales wise IMO but calling people thieves and shit because they want a refund for being sold a broken piece of shit is ridiculous. And I love No Mans Sky.
They are patching it and thats awesome and they are doing a good job of it but that doesnt undo the damage done. If they patch it up and its great and they add more stuff, people will come back and the perception will change like it did for Driveclub.. and that studio shut down pretty much over that.
veloxStrix
Banned
It's been said over and over again, but if I get through 26 hours of the Witcher and realize I can't finish - I'm getting a refund. If I get over 26 hours into Tetris and realize that there is no multiplayer even though I was told there would be - I'm getting a refund. If I put 60 hours into No Man's Sky, before I realize there are no factions, real story, "living" universe, multiplayer, numerous ship options, etc - I'm getting a refund. Am I going to feel good about it? Yes. About $60 better even.
I'm not supposed to have to wait for reviews to tell me that the developer of a game was full of shit. Sean Murray lied straight to the face of a hero. He looked Stephen Colbert in the eyes and whispered his lies right past the fork of his tongue. You want me to forgive a man who can look Colbert in the eyes and lie to him? Never.
More seriously, a game's value isn't determined by how much time you waste in it. Some people have weird ideas about some dollar per hour value scale that determines whether a game has fulfilled its purpose. I put 60 hours into Fallout 4 and I still thought it was garbage. I didn't get a refund though because they never lied to me.
why is 'fifty hours' an acceptable amount of play time before a product can start crashing all the time without a refund being fair?
I think people are confusing it with a consumable ticket to a film, as if when you buy a game it's only expected to work for an arbitrary running time and then it is used and of no value. if the argument is that 'you've seen everything there is to see, you've had your money's worth!' then I don't agree, it's a product designed to function for as long as the player chooses. If I buy a film on DVD, it works the first time but won't load a second or third viewing a week later, I'd take it back to the shop, and I don't think many film fans would be arguing that I didn't have a case or was a thief just because it worked fine for the first viewing and I'd seen the ending.
I buy games under the general idea that for the first month or so I can refund goods that don't work, not that there is a time limit measurable in hours on use before all complaints are invalid. People bought NMS under various company refund/returns policies, and not one of them was 'after fifty hours, any complaints regarding technical failure are invalid whether you've reached the ending or not'.
Ultimately the amount of people requesting refunds is going to be a small minority. Some people are going to get refunds for stuff I don't really agree with like 'I just don't like it' or 'other people are getting them, I want the money back!'. But 'two weeks after I bought a product, it no longer works properly after fifty hours of a £60 computer game billed as a near endless space adventure'? Cast-iron case for a refund to me.
Edit: Nvm, I think I see where you are coming from. But your argument is absurdly exaggerated and I fundamentally disagree that you shouldn't have to wait for reviews. The onus is on you to make sure you get what you paid for. And IF there's still something wrong with it that you haven't been promised, then refund away. S'all good with me.
This. I didn't want to spoil anything so I went on radio silence after pre ordering the limited edition. I didn't want to spoil the surprises hidden in the game and didn't want to know what waited behind those portals beforehand. I was to afraid of beeing spoiled what lies at the center of the universe (still don't know and now never will). While I don't think the game is a scam it is quite obviously false advertising, something punishable by law in my country. Only difference to you is I feel 80€ better now, because Amazon refunded my limited edition.
I also second this!
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
After 50 hours of gameplay, and with the developer bringing out patches quite frequently to address issues, is it unreasonable to say wait a bit for a patch?
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
As I said, with patches being released quite promptly to address issues, wouldn't it be reasonable to suggest waiting a bit for a patch and keep on playing?
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Exactly, I don't understand this take it up the ass and shrug it off mentality people have these days towards shit that matters. No fuck that I rather not let shit like this become the next horse armor
veloxStrix
Banned
Oh, I agree with waiting on reviews. Before I go see a film, before I buy a game, before I buy an appliance I always read the reviews and then make a choice afterwards. If I felt the reviews - or majority of them - had properly warned people about what they would be getting with NMS I don't think I would have as much empathy with people. In this case though, even the reviewers couldn't know that there were a ton of missing features hidden in those 19 quintillion words. If someone gets 60 hours into a game and gets bored, that's one thing. If someone gets 60 hours into a game, and realizes the game doesn't work or is missing something, I think that's a completely reasonable case.
How many patches were released while they were playing though? How much time did they waste resetting back to the last save when the game crashed? Is it unthinkable that the frustration of crashing simply soured the entire experience for them? It might be reasonable to wait, but it's also reasonable to simply get your money back and give up on the game. There doesn't have to be a correct answer.
Jack The Nipper
Banned
I think these mentalities have all been around for a lot longer than our lives.
I'd say things are generally more and less accepted depending on what they are though. In the end this has been one interesting ride, a big band wagon of fans suddenly jumping off and throwing this train right off the tracks into a huge fire ball down below
With no clear idea of when a patch will fix your specific issue, I'd say it's the customers choice, and I'm sure plenty of players will do exactly that. However, a request for a refund considering that it's a £60 game, a small team and in various countries your ability to get your money back weakens after thirty days, is also a perfectly reasonable option that shouldn't involve being called a thief or implied that you're somehow dishonest.
Same. I was looking forward to playing this based on the amazing E3 trailers, which now appear incredibly deceptive to me. I held off on buying at launch to read reviews and impressions first. I'm glad I did - the last time I bought a game and immediately refunded it was back in 2008 (Spore, which this debacle strongly reminds me of).
I'm pretty disappointed NMS turned out this way. :/ I might still eventually get it, but only when/if the crashes have been fixed and the price has dropped down to, say, $10-$15. It's sure as hell not worth the $80 asking price here in Aus.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
While you think of this specific example and think about specific issues that made some people mad, this is not something you can make an official policy out of it as it is not practical for many stores to allow that kind of use and still allow refunds no questions asked.
This thread makes me wonder if another batch of 'virals' have signed up recently.
http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=772151&page=1
AcademicSaucer
Member
The worst thing of all is that next time Sony puts a video at E3 saying it's gameplay I'm not going to believe it and people shouldn't believe it, it happened with Killzone and now this. Fuck that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAFWhFgZdCE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAFWhFgZdCE
I expect Gaffers to know better having been through Killzone, Witcher 3, and Dark Souls 2. And probably countless other ones that I can't recall.