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[Dildo Saggins]

No one argues that WWF was better in the ring than WCW during that period. No one ever. At best, you'll get "WCW had excellent mid cards, but shitty main events, while WWF had shitty mid cards, and excellent main events". Everyone everywhere acknowledges that WCW had a much better in ring product and roster during 1996-1999. WWF didn't blow up because of great wrestling, but because of good characters and stories. And then WCW let their mid card go to shit, kept the shitty main events, and went on a steady decline from Summer of 1999 on. Once they lost Eddie/Dean/Saturn/Jericho/Benoit, there was really no reason to watch WCW except for the train wreck aspect. You can't have shitty characters and shitty wrestlers and expect to compete no matter how much money is behind you.

Well the stories bit is kinda part of what I'm talking about. Outside of Austin/Mcmahon/Rock there really wasn't much there. The DX stuff alone makes me cringe everytime it comes up. The Corporate Ministry is one of the dumbest angles in the history of Wrestling (reveal aside). A lot of the angles involved so much bad toilet humor it's really hard to look back at it now and think "this was great". I think South Park had more influence on the WWF at the time than they are probably willing to admit (despite the oddities...ugh).

When you start breaking down the WWF roster, what their gimmicks and storylines were, it looks even worse. Ho' Train? We Want Head? Val Venis? Triple H doing all kinds of things that would land any regular person in jail and on some kind of watchlist upon release?...so many of their storylines relied solely on shock value.

WWF built Stone Cold by having him beat Vince with a bedpan, drive ridiculous vehicles into the arena to do stuff, and have him talk all kinds of obscenities in the ring. Not to shortchange SC tho, he's one of the best, ever. WCW built Goldberg by having him be a bad motherfucker who handled his shit in the ring and that's pretty much it. He was insanely over because of it. They went with the "sport" aspect of wrestling and let this guy do all of his talking in the ring. That was the difference between the 2 companies at the time, imo.

And then you had guys like Jericho and Malenko. Legends. Malenko couldn't cut a promo for his life, but he was so damn awesome in the ring that him and Jericho were able to have an awesome feud, based around....wrestling! Where the hell is that with Brock Lesnar and CM P- oh, wait...

 

[Rhaknar]

It takes 2 days to write "Bryan goes over hunter at mania and over Orton/Batista later in the night in the main event (pins Orton so they can protect their precious Batista)"?

 

[krae_man]

ead

 

[strobogo]

Well the stories bit is kinda part of what I'm talking about. Outside of Austin/Mcmahon/Rock there really wasn't much there. The DX stuff alone makes me cringe everytime it comes up. The Corporate Ministry is one of the dumbest angles in the history of Wrestling (reveal aside). A lot of the angles involved so much bad toilet humor it's really hard to look back at it now and think "this was great". I think South Park had more influence on the WWF at the time than they are probably willing to admit (despite the oddities...ugh).

When you start breaking down the WWF roster, what their gimmicks and storylines were, it looks even worse. Ho' Train? We Want Head? Val Venis? Triple H doing all kinds of things that would land any regular person in jail and on some kind of watchlist upon release?...so many of their storylines relied solely on shock value.

WWF built Stone Cold by having him beat Vince with a bedpan, drive ridiculous vehicles into the arena to do stuff, and have him talk all kinds of obscenities in the ring. Not to shortchange SC tho, he's one of the best, ever. WCW built Goldberg by having him be a bad motherfucker who handled his shit in the ring and that's pretty much it. He was insanely over because of it. They went with the "sport" aspect of wrestling and let this guy do all of his talking in the ring. That was the difference between the 2 companies at the time, imo.

And then you had guys like Jericho and Malenko. Legends. Malenko couldn't cut a promo for his life, but he was so damn awesome in the ring that him and Jericho were able to have an awesome feud, based around....wrestling! Where the hell is that with Brock Lesnar and CM P- oh, wait...

WCW had almost no compelling stories after Starrcade 1997. In 1998, they had Dean vs Jericho, a few weeks of Flair vs Bischoff, and Raven vs DDP vs Benoit. Goldberg had his big rise, won the title, and then had no angle until October. The NWO shit continued, the split was terrible. 1999 had Horsemen vs Rey/Kidman vs Raven/Saturn and the first few months of the hardcore division. Anything after that was enjoyable only on the basis of how stupid it was. Trust me on this, I know. There were some stand outs like Ric Flair being bonkers all during 1999, Kanyon in 2000, but WCW really had no company carrying stories after Starrcade 1997.

 

[ryutaro's mama]

Goldberg's streak was fucking great, man.

That is until they made him job to Kevin Nash @ Starrcade. I remember being so fucking pissed off.

Hogan jobbed to Goldberg on Nitro but Nash was too good to job @ Starrcade.

 

[Dildo Saggins]

WCW had almost no compelling stories after Starrcade 1997. In 1998, they had Dean vs Jericho, a few weeks of Flair vs Bischoff, and Raven vs DDP vs Benoit. Goldberg had his big rise, won the title, and then had no angle until October. The NWO shit continued, the split was terrible. 1999 had Horsemen vs Rey/Kidman vs Raven/Saturn and the first few months of the hardcore division. Anything after that was enjoyable only on the basis of how stupid it was. Trust me on this, I know. There were some stand outs like Ric Flair being bonkers all during 1999, Kanyon in 2000, but WCW really had no company carrying stories after Starrcade 1997.

You're much more of a history buff than I am on this subject, so I'll take your word for it. I'm basing this primarily off of what I've seen the last few months on the on-demand program, and some of the stuff I've watched on Youtube.

I just know that the only reason I have any interest in the Network is for the WCW stuff.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

WCW had almost no compelling stories after Starrcade 1997. In 1998, they had Dean vs Jericho, a few weeks of Flair vs Bischoff, and Raven vs DDP vs Benoit. Goldberg had his big rise, won the title, and then had no angle until October. The NWO shit continued, the split was terrible. 1999 had Horsemen vs Rey/Kidman vs Raven/Saturn and the first few months of the hardcore division. Anything after that was enjoyable only on the basis of how stupid it was. Trust me on this, I know. There were some stand outs like Ric Flair being bonkers all during 1999, Kanyon in 2000, but WCW really had no company carrying stories after Starrcade 1997.

And what an abomination Sting/Hogan was. THAT imo was the start of the downward slide for wcw. What a shit match, finish, ugh the whole thing stunk... Sting looks scrawny, gets his ass beat for 20 mins, gets pinned, somehow it doesnt count, because bret hart, then, they ring the bell and sting won? ...I wonder if hogan paying patrick to count slow rumors were true....

 

[ryutaro's mama]

And what an abomination Sting/Hogan was. THAT imo was the start of the downward slide for wcw. What a shit match, finish, ugh the whole thing stunk...

Speaking of "stunk" remember the Fake Sting was called...STINK?

 

[strobogo]

Goldberg's streak was fucking great, man.

That is until they made him job to Kevin Nash @ Starrcade. I remember being so fucking pissed off.

Hogan jobbed to Goldberg on Nitro but Nash was too good to job @ Starrcade.

Hogan only jobbed with the understanding that he would get his win back clean later at a bigger show and so he could claim he was the reason the Georgia Dome had such a big crowd (even though minimal tickets were sold after the match was announced, which was on the Thunder before that Nitro). When Nash took over as booker, they did a backstage angle where Hogan was going to "retire" to do other shit for a while, making it seem like Nash ran him off. So there was a lot of good will towards Nash. Then he booked himself over Goldberg (which really isn't that big of a deal since Goldberg had to lose eventually), but the way he did it sucked. And there was never a Hogan/Goldberg rematch, but Nash did job clean to Goldberg multiple times on TV and PPV after Starrcade. No one seems to remember those because no one was watching by that point.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Wyatt/Cena worries me. Cena has put many people over in the past, they have a brief main event run, and then fade into obscurity while Cena continues to main event weekly. Miz, Kali, Umaga, R.Truth....etc. I don't want to see Bray wind up the same.

Put over?

Khali and Umaga put Cena over. Cena broke their undefeated streaks.

The only two wrestlers that have probably ever benefited from feuding with Cena are Edge and CM Punk, and itw as more because of their own efforts than Cena putting them over. I guess Daniel Bryan too... that was basically the first time in 10 years Cena legitimately put someone else over clean.


Edit: I think you mean Cena has been put over. Or that cena has buried others.

 

[Deleted member 8095]

Speaking of "stunk" remember the Fake Sting was called...STINK?

Wasn't he also in WCW vs nWo Revenge or WCW vs nWo world tour?

 

[BigJonsson]

Sounds like a work

 

[Snaku]

And what an abomination Sting/Hogan was. THAT imo was the start of the downward slide for wcw. What a shit match, finish, ugh the whole thing stunk... Sting looks scrawny, gets his ass beat for 20 mins, gets pinned, somehow it doesnt count, because bret hart, then, they ring the bell and sting won? ...I wonder if hogan paying patrick to count slow rumors were true....

Yeah it was truly terrible. It would have been one thing if it were an actual fast count, but it wasn't. But there should have never been a dusty finish to begin with. They had built that match up for over a year, Sting's push was astronomical, and they completely ruined all of that because of Survivor Series? What a fucking joke.

 

[strobogo]

According to Nick Patrick, it was ruined because no on had decided on what the match would be or what the finish would be even the day of the show. Some were pushing for the screw job finish, and some weren't, but it wasn't decided and Nick Patrick was told both, so he counted it normally. The match OBVIOUSLY should have been a squash with Sting destroying Hogan. Even Hogan couldn't deny that was the right call to make.

 

[Anth0ny]

Perfection.

 

[ryutaro's mama]

Then he booked himself over Goldberg (which really isn't that big of a deal since Goldberg had to lose eventually), but the way he did it sucked.

DING DING DING

That's why I hated it. It felt like a botched finish after building Goldberg up they way they did. If they were gonna run a schmooz ending, should have done it in a way where Goldberg stayed over.

Wasn't he also in WCW vs nWo Revenge or WCW vs nWo world tour?

Yep. Revenge I think.

 

[bozeman]

Hogan only jobbed with the understanding that he would get his win back clean later at a bigger show and so he could claim he was the reason the Georgia Dome had such a big crowd (even though minimal tickets were sold after the match was announced, which was on the Thunder before that Nitro). When Nash took over as booker, they did a backstage angle where Hogan was going to "retire" to do other shit for a while, making it seem like Nash ran him off. So there was a lot of good will towards Nash. Then he booked himself over Goldberg (which really isn't that big of a deal since Goldberg had to lose eventually), but the way he did it sucked. And there was never a Hogan/Goldberg rematch, but Nash did job clean to Goldberg multiple times on TV and PPV after Starrcade. No one seems to remember those because no one was watching by that point.

My brother-in-law visited with his family from Georgia about 6 weeks before the Georgia Dome Nitro and he told me that Goldberg vs Hogan was being advertised. They took a dark match main event and put it on Nitro.

 

[Dildo Saggins]

Put over?

Khali and Umaga put Cena over. Cena broke their undefeated streaks.

The only two wrestlers that have probably ever benefited from feuding with Cena are Edge and CM Punk, and itw as more because of their own efforts than Cena putting them over. I guess Daniel Bryan too... that was basically the first time in 10 years Cena legitimately put someone else over clean.


Edit: I think you mean Cena has been put over. Or that cena has buried others.

Cena didn't put Bryan over clean. He blamed it on his bulbous elbow the next night on RAW.

 

[Vilam]

Am I the only one looking forward to the WWE Network launching so that I can go back to right after the Bash At The Beach Hogan swerve, start there and just stop watching today's product all together?

My Monday nights are gonna be spent watching Nitro and Attitude Era RAW going forward.

I don't even care about the new PPVs being included. Today's product is garbage and now that i have the option to go back in time, I am gonna take it.

That's pretty much exactly what I'm planning to do.

 

[DMczaf]

Am I the only one looking forward to the WWE Network launching so that I can go back to right after the Bash At The Beach Hogan swerve, start there and just stop watching today's product all together?

My Monday nights are gonna be spent watching Nitro and Attitude Era RAW going forward.

I don't even care about the new PPVs being included. Today's product is garbage and now that i have the option to go back in time, I am gonna take it.

Can we take it a step further and start playing PS1/N64 games again as well?

Can we watch the 97 Bulls kick the Jazz's ass?

Fuck...I want 1997 back.

 

[UberTag]

It helps that he can't undercut Punk's character or gimmick since Punk lives it. We all know Cena is going to bury Bray by reminding everyone of Husky Harris and how he's not really this Bray character.

It is going to be terrible, just as Bray was coming good.

Mind you there isn't much they can do about it. It is hard to take him as a threat when Cena has already beaten him...and the rest of the Nexus by himself.

Bray must absolutely be shitting himself at the moment, he's the only man in WWE history to get buried by Cena and come back even better than he was before. If Cena kills the Wyatt gimmick he's done for.

Wyatt/Cena worries me. Cena has put many people over in the past, they have a brief main event run, and then fade into obscurity while Cena continues to main event weekly. Miz, Kali, Umaga, R.Truth....etc. I don't want to see Bray wind up the same.

Here's a video that shows the entirety of the upcoming Cena vs. Bray feud in terms of how it will play out.

 

[gutter_trash]

Bring back Tony Schiavone!

you know he was not a nice guy towards Bobby Heenen. Anyone who is mean in real life towards Bobby Heenen is not a nice guy

 

[strobogo]

To be fair to Tony, Bobby was sloppy drunk pretty much his entire WCW run. On and off screen. But I don't condone being mean to Bobby no matter how much I like Tony and wish he was still around.

 

[James Woods]

Bring back Tony Schiavone!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8nbJikFTv8

Beautiful. Fucking Bischoff.

 

[ryutaro's mama]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8nbJikFTv8

Beautiful. Fucking Bischoff.

I guess it beats selling meat.

Schiavone gave zero fucks. He wasn't spoiler tagging anything.

 

[Dildo Saggins]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8nbJikFTv8

Beautiful. Fucking Bischoff.

Obviously in retrospect that proved to be a pretty foolish thing to do, after they got the ratings for that week.

I miss how salty the two companies were towards each other. It was like Sega/Nintendo, except both WCW and WWF were SEGA, and constantly shitting on the other's product.

 

[Vibranium]

Amazing edit of the original gif haha, freaking awesome. Sums up modern-day WWE pretty well.

 

[Zombie James]

The roller coaster ride began on Sunday night when it became apparent to fans that Daniel Bryan would not be part of the Royal Rumble match. The strong negativereaction to Batista winning the Rumble, Daniel Bryan’s continuing popularity growth and the shocking departure of CM Punk from the company are all being cited as reasons for the shakeup.

Shit, I don't even watch WWE regularly anymore and I know Daniel Bryan's popularity is through the roof. They haven't figured this out yet?

 

[ryutaro's mama]

Shit, I don't even watch WWE regularly anymore and I know Daniel Bryan's popularity is through the roof. They haven't figured this out yet?

The "what's best for business" angle is so fucking meta.

 

[Data West]

Shit, I don't even watch WWE regularly anymore and I know Daniel Bryan's popularity is through the roof. They haven't figured this out yet?

He got over on his own. He turned shit to gold, and the fans won't just accept the burial. You've got to understand, this is the hardest you can stick it to McMahon. Cheering the person he actively doesn't want you cheering.

 

[Htown]

Shit, I don't even watch WWE regularly anymore and I know Daniel Bryan's popularity is through the roof. They haven't figured this out yet?

This was my question.

Have they literally been asleep for the last three years?

He got over on his own. He turned shit to gold, and the fans won't just accept the burial. You've got to understand, this is the hardest you can stick it to McMahon. Cheering the person he actively doesn't want you cheering.

I think it's funny that they mute the crowd sound, as though people are going to stop cheering because they don't hear as many people cheering on TV.

 

[Dildo Saggins]

Shit, I don't even watch WWE regularly anymore and I know Daniel Bryan's popularity is through the roof. They haven't figured this out yet?

They didnt/still dont consider him a star with crossover potential. He's clearly not worthy enough to star in such high-grossing and critically-acclaimed films as "The Marine".

 

[strobogo]

Has Cena or Bryan ever been mentioned on the hit CW show Supernatural?



Only one man has. KANE! It's time to push Kane to the moon. He's the only guy with cross over appeal and abs to match.

 

[UberTag]

Has Cena or Bryan ever been mentioned on the hit CW show Supernatural?

Only one man has. KANE! It's time to push Kane to the moon. He's the only guy with cross over appeal and abs to match.

Since when did you start renting out ad space to SoulPlaya in your posts?

 

[strobogo]

Since when did you start renting out ad space to SoulPlaya in your posts?

Since Sunny couldn't get sponsorship for Legit Shook.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

Shit, I don't even watch WWE regularly anymore and I know Daniel Bryan's popularity is through the roof. They haven't figured this out yet?

It's the craziest company out there in that it does not want to give the fans what they want.

 

[Dr Duncan Steel]

Shit, I don't even watch WWE regularly anymore and I know Daniel Bryan's popularity is through the roof. They haven't figured this out yet?

Well there you go VInce.

 

[JehutyRunner]

 

[funkystudent]

WWE's only real tricky problem is what to do with Triple H at mania.

90% of the current problems can be fixed with adding Bryan to the title match at WM but then that leaves Mr COO without some young guy to hold back.


I someone bet this ends up with Cena in the title match though. Just watch. Dude is worse then WCW Hogan and Nash when it comes to protecting his spot.

 

[btrboyev]

Bring back Norman Smiley. WCW kept that guy down for years, even after he found his way and got the fan following.

 

[UberTag]

WWE's only real tricky problem is what to do with Triple H at mania.

90% of the current problems can be fixed with adding Bryan to the title match at WM but then that leaves Mr COO without some young guy to hold back.

The easy solution is to have D.Brine wrestle twice.
The WWE's solution will probably be to make it a 4-way dance where Trips wins the gold and then jobs to D.Brine in Seattle a month later.

 

[PhantomZone]

On paper, it makes this next's week Raw sound really exciting.

I know they typically have creative meetings and the likes, but I think these long-form ones should become quarterly.

What's bizarre is that if you believe the news/rumours websites (some which still exist today) a lot of the planning for WrestleMania's main event and other key matches used to take place in June/July - i remember in the 2000's the main event would be virtually locked in before Survivor Series/November-ish.

 

[elektrixx]

Last minute rewrites usually turn into better shows.

 

[Rentahamster]

Theyve lost the people who knew how to do storylines from top to bottom on the card.

Where'd they go?

 

[Dr Duncan Steel]

The easy solution is to have D.Brine wrestle twice.
The WWE's solution will probably be to make it a 4-way dance where Trips wins the gold and then jobs to D.Brine in Seattle a month later.

So basically Wrestlemania 2000 then. HHH is truly bitchmade if that's what they really come up with.

 

[Alienous]

CM Punk has been a Pepsi Cola spy all along... and he died during a car chase involving Triple H and the ghost of Eddie Guerrero.

Done.

 

[cartoon_soldier]

The creative will discuss how to make fans hate D. Bry and love Cena

 

[UberTag]

The creative will discuss how to make fans hate D. Bry and love Cena

Two days won't be enough to set that plan in motion.
Put on a pot of coffee boys... you're working into the weekend.

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

I want heel Cena to be like Dick Superman, where his version of evil is just causing general mischief and pranks.

 

[GaimeGuy]

I want heel Cena to be like Dick Superman, where his version of evil is just causing general mischief and pranks.

So... Cena Nexus?