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[Steve Holt]

Pretty terrible performance

 

[Magic Carpet]

Pretty terrible performance

Speaking of performance, Microsoft should release an update letting those who have given up on the Xbox to crank the clocks to PS5 levels and beyond. Get some actual performance for once. Warrantees are gone anyway.
Then scavenge the SSD and drop kick the box out the door.

 

[Welfare]

So selling 2-3 million elsewhere is pushing it tbh. I say this because the US is the platforms biggest market, and it is selling next to nothing in Japan, and probably half of what it's doing in the US in European markets. That would put it under 30 million by early 2025. It should be anywhere from 29-32 million LTD, not 40.

US has been ~50:50 for XBS since launch. Only recently has that probably been bumped to ~55%.

You're trying to guesstimate the data here and aren't even differentiating b/w shipments and sold through.

The +21M is sold through, Ampere had XBS sell through at +21M end of March 2023. Even then, just the US bringing up the XBS data up to and beyond 25M should be enough to debunk the whole "100M only" thing.

What is the US total right now? That should give us a good idea of the worldwide total. 37m seems way too high.

A little under 17M as of June 2025.

 

[Topher]

The full quote



Steam Deck or any other handheld using AMD semi-custom SOCs aren't included here, everything after the revenue amount was a follow up of Microsoft and Sony's performance. Semi custom declined because of XBS and PS5 inventory, the generation has surpassed 100M, and semi custom sales will return to historical patterns because of PS5/XBS

Why would AMD exclude Steam Deck from the "cumulative unit shipments" number? Pointing to PlayStation and Xbox as the reason for the decline does not mean the total unit shipments for the "gaming segment" is limited to those two platforms. That seems like an assumption.

 

[Welfare]

Why would AMD exclude Steam Deck from the "cumulative unit shipments" number? Pointing to PlayStation and Xbox as the reason for the decline does not mean the total unit shipments for the "gaming segment" is limited to those two platforms. That seems like an assumption.

It's a literally a statement of PS5 and Xbox's accomplishment sandwiched between AMD saying their (PS5 and XBS) inventory has decreased and because of that, AMD expects semi custom sales will return to normal. The 100M is also not a statement of every semi custom SOC AMD has shipped in some unspecified amount of time bracket. When has Steam Deck ever been referred to as part of the current console generation?

Also, if Steam Deck were included, PS5+XBS+Deck hit >100M in Q3 2024.

 

[mayham2199]

Why would AMD exclude Steam Deck from the "cumulative unit shipments" number? Pointing to PlayStation and Xbox as the reason for the decline does not mean the total unit shipments for the "gaming segment" is limited to those two platforms. That seems like an assumption.

This is exactly how I understood the statement as well.

 

[Kacho]

Why would they include Steam Deck in that number and not other PC handhelds that use AMD chips?

 

[GHG]

Why would they include Steam Deck in that number and not other PC handhelds that use AMD chips?

Honestly, it would be even more hilarious if they did.

 

[Mr Moose]

The full quote



Steam Deck or any other handheld using AMD semi-custom SOCs aren't included here, everything after the revenue amount was a follow up of Microsoft and Sony's performance. Semi custom declined because of XBS and PS5 inventory, the generation has surpassed 100M, and semi custom sales will return to historical patterns because of PS5/XBS

I don't think that's what it says. MS and Sony are lower and others plodding along as usual.

 

[demigod]

US has been ~50:50 for XBS since launch. Only recently has that probably been bumped to ~55%.

The +21M is sold through, Ampere had XBS sell through at +21M end of March 2023. Even then, just the US bringing up the XBS data up to and beyond 25M should be enough to debunk the whole "100M only" thing.

A little under 17M as of June 2025.

A little under 17M? Your own numbers which you inflate, pegged it at 15.46M. Now if the US numbers are around that, we can be generous and say its 50/50 instead of 55/45. So whats double of 15.46? Close to 31. So how are you getting 37M from 31?

 

[Topher]

It's a literally a statement of PS5 and Xbox's accomplishment sandwiched between AMD saying their (PS5 and XBS) inventory has decreased and because of that, AMD expects semi custom sales will return to normal. The 100M is also not a statement of every semi custom SOC AMD has shipped in some unspecified amount of time bracket. When has Steam Deck ever been referred to as part of the current console generation?

Also, if Steam Deck were included, PS5+XBS+Deck hit >100M in Q3 2024.

When has Steam Deck ever existed outside of the current console generation? It hasn't. I'm not saying you are wrong here, but it is not absolutely clear that you are right either. The question is whether AMD counts Steam Deck as a console. If it does then it would make sense that when reporting for the entire gaming segment that those numbers would be included.

Why would they include Steam Deck in that number and not other PC handhelds that use AMD chips?

If they include Steam Deck then they probably include all of them. Steam Deck is just the one with the most impact.

 

[Baemono]

A little under 17M? Your own numbers which you inflate, pegged it at 15.46M. Now if the US numbers are around that, we can be generous and say its 50/50 instead of 55/45. So whats double of 15.46? Close to 31. So how are you getting 37M from 31?

Yeah my thought exactly. The US is its biggest market, it barely sells in Europe, and ROW cannot be this big to compensate since it's not even available in most countries (heck even most Europe isn't officially supported)

 

[GHG]

The full quote



Steam Deck or any other handheld using AMD semi-custom SOCs aren't included here, everything after the revenue amount was a follow up of Microsoft and Sony's performance. Semi custom declined because of XBS and PS5 inventory, the generation has surpassed 100M, and semi custom sales will return to historical patterns because of PS5/XBS

You might want to try also having a read of their 10k which is supplementary to their earnings slides/notes:

https://ir.amd.com/financial-information/sec-filings/content/0000002488-25-000012/amd-20241228.htm

The Steam Deck is specifically mentioned as being part of the segment alongside the PS5 and Xbox Series consoles.

 

[Pedro Motta]

adamsapple in this thread.

 

[Welfare]

You might want to try also having a read of their 10k which is supplementary to their earnings slides/notes:

https://ir.amd.com/financial-information/sec-filings/content/0000002488-25-000012/amd-20241228.htm

The Steam Deck is specifically mentioned as being part of the segment alongside the PS5 and Xbox Series consoles.

It literally says Steam Deck is a PC and PS5 and Xbox are consoles. 100M did not refer to the entire semi custom lineup, only "console generation".

But thanks for this, I was right. Steam Deck (and other PC handhelds) aren't included in the statement being argued over.

 

[adamsapple]

adamsapple in this thread.

Just happy to see GAF being so intrigued about all things Xbox.

 

[GHG]

It literally says Steam Deck is a PC and PS5 and Xbox are consoles.

And yet there's a completely separate paragraph/section for PC gaming hardware and chips.

Like I said, you should have a read through the whole thing.

This is what the segment includes:

They lumped the Steam Deck with the consoles and then threw all the other portable devices in to this section:

 

[FinalBossWithTheMostPower]

Is that including everything else that's also an Xbox?

 

[GHG]

Is that including everything else that's also an Xbox?

Well "xbox" devices now also fall under the "discrete desktop and notebook gpu's" section, so who knows?

Either way, it's not looking good.

 

[Three]

Just happy to see GAF being so intrigued about all things Xbox.

Typical xbox mindset always hunting that engagement

When has Steam Deck ever been referred to as part of the current console generation?

Kepler I'm sure is an AMD source of info. He probably can see the numbers in the Semi Custom Business Unit that he is referring to. The Aerith APU was a semi custom chip built specifically for Steam Deck. The other handhelds are not custom chips.

 

[Mr Moose]

It literally says Steam Deck is a PC and PS5 and Xbox are consoles. 100M did not refer to the entire semi custom lineup, only "console generation".

But thanks for this, I was right. Steam Deck (and other PC handhelds) aren't included in the statement being argued over.

Semi-custom sales declined

Semi-custom products: Xbox Series, PS5, Steam Deck.

 

[GHG]

Are times that bad that we have people desperately trying to wrestle away the ~5m steam deck sales and make them Xbox sales?

Have some dignity.

 

[PeteBull]

Series X deserved better, I wonder if Microsoft will do a second tier console (series s) next gen as well, we're talking about two different powered consoles launched at once

MS conditioned their consumer base to not buy games anymore thx to gamepass, then they started porting their own staple franchises to enemy competitor platforms, competition is needed in console/gaming industry but its MS who decided against it, so when it comes to my opinion, xbox as a brand deserves everything that is coming its way, and spoilers- its nothing good

 

[Topher]

Other journalists were asking the same questions. Not sure how one can say they are emphatically right about this unless they have info direct from AMD.

AMD’s chips are winning again — and they’ve officially powered 100 million game consoles.

Its Q4 and full-year 2024 earnings boast record revenue for both data center and client divisions — where “client” equals its Ryzen chips with their Intel-beating gaming CPUs and impressive integrated graphics. While AMD’s gaming biz has been cut in half year-over-year as game console sales dip...

www.theverge.com

 

[HJuggernaut]

not bad, how much has the xsx sold?

 

[Mr Moose]

Are times that bad that we have people desperately trying to wrestle away the ~5m steam deck sales and make them Xbox sales?

Have some dignity.

 

[Welfare]

And yet there's a completely separate paragraph/section for PC gaming hardware and chips.

Like I said, you should have a read through the whole thing.

This is what the segment includes:

They lumped the Steam Deck with the consoles and then threw all the other portable devices in to this section:

Ok so when AMD specifies Steam Deck is a PC, I'm supposed to read "console"? Rhetorical question, no, I shouldn't.

What you've provided does not say what you think it says. PS5, XBS and Steam Deck are in AMD's semi custom products. AMD notes they service consoles (PS5, XBS) and PC (Steam Deck) in their gaming segment. In fact they further specify that they service independent consoles and portable gaming devices, meaning those are two separate kinds of devices. You then post another paragraph of products that use discrete GPU's (desktops and notebooks).

Again, nothing being shown here says Steam Deck is part of the console generation PS5 and XBS occupy. AMD themselves don't label it a console, it's specifically the Valve Steam Deck PC. I don't get how this is an argument at this point.

AMD says current console generation surpassed 100M. Steam Deck per AMD is not a console. Nothing provided here says Steam Deck is a console, only that it's part of the semi custom segment which was never in question.

 

[GHG]

Other journalists were asking the same questions. Not sure how one can say they are emphatically right about this unless they have info direct from AMD.

AMD’s chips are winning again — and they’ve officially powered 100 million game consoles.

Its Q4 and full-year 2024 earnings boast record revenue for both data center and client divisions — where “client” equals its Ryzen chips with their Intel-beating gaming CPUs and impressive integrated graphics. While AMD’s gaming biz has been cut in half year-over-year as game console sales dip...

www.theverge.com

Them explicitly stating what falls under "semi-custom sales" makes it clear as day.

Mr Moose 's post above outlines it as well.

Ok so when AMD specifies Steam Deck is a PC, I'm supposed to read "console"? Rhetorical question, no, I shouldn't.

What you've provided does not say what you think it says. PS5, XBS and Steam Deck are in AMD's semi custom products. AMD notes they service consoles (PS5, XBS) and PC (Steam Deck). In fact they further specify that they service independent consoles and portable gaming devices, meaning those are two separate kinds of devices. You then post another paragraph of products that use discrete GPU's (desktops and notebooks).

Again, nothing being shown here says Steam Deck is part of the console generation PS5 and XBS occupy. AMD themselves don't label it a console, it's specifically the Valve Steam Deck PC.

See above it's literally outlined under their "semi-custom products" category. But don't let that stop you fighting tooth and nail over those ~5 million sales.

But I can tell you now that if you think that AMD are lying or being misleading in their 10k then there's a lot more money to be made in uncovering that than there is in attempting to misattribute Xbox sales.

 

[Shadowstar39]

Best Buy has the X for 599.99. That price seems about double what it should be.
The 429.99 for the S just has me hearing donkey noises when I look at it.
Way too expensive.

When did this happen? Are you in the US or elsewhere? I got my series x for free (well it was free wirh Verizon home internet. 2 years ago).

Wasn't the series s $299?

 

[mayham2199]

When did this happen? Are you in the US or elsewhere? I got my series x for free (well it was free wirh Verizon home internet. 2 years ago).

Wasn't the series s $299?

During the tariff fiasco MS raised their prices and never brought them back down.

 

[mckmas8808]

A little under 17M? Your own numbers which you inflate, pegged it at 15.46M. Now if the US numbers are around that, we can be generous and say its 50/50 instead of 55/45. So whats double of 15.46? Close to 31. So how are you getting 37M from 31?

Literally no disrespect to Welfare at all. Dude is great at what he does. But I kinda agree with demigod here. Even if we felt like the Xbox Series estimate was 33 million, that would make more sense than 37m. Especially if the US number is at 15.5 million. No way the world combined Xbox Series sales are at 21.5 million. That would be 58% of all Xbox Series console sales. And that just can't be true.

 

[Mr Moose]

When did this happen? Are you in the US or elsewhere? I got my series x for free (well it was free wirh Verizon home internet. 2 years ago).

Wasn't the series s $299?

Xbox Support

support.xbox.com

United States ($USD)
Product New Price
Xbox Series S 512 $379.99
Xbox Series S 1TB $429.99
Xbox Series X Digital $549.99
Xbox Series X $599.99
Xbox Series X 2TB Galaxy Black Special Edition $729.99

 

[jm89]

So how are you getting 37M from 31?

You didn't account for penguins in antarctica.

 

[Welfare]

Do you guys even know what you're arguing.

Console does not mean every semi-custom device. The entire argument is AMD's 100M milestone for the CONSOLE generation. Not one thing in this thread says Steam Deck is a console. It's crazy how people are fighting over basic English at this point. There is no way to fit a device AMD calls a PC into a statistic for consoles unless you change the quote from AMD to fit your desire.

Fact is that AMD said the current console generation surpassed 100M shipments. Nothing was said about all semi-custom devices, that's something you are adding on. It's fallacious to argue that the statement includes anything more than PS5 and XBS.

 

[reinking]

At the beginning of this generation, I did not have it on my bingo card that people would be arguing over the Xbox Series selling 27-37 million consoles when neither number would put them at half of PS5s sold. I expected this generation to be much closer.

 

[Kacho]

I'm loving the passion tbh

 

[GHG]

Do you guys even know what you're arguing.

Console does not mean every semi-custom device. The entire argument is AMD's 100M milestone for the CONSOLE generation. Not one thing in this thread says Steam Deck is a console. It's crazy how people are fighting over basic English at this point. There is no way to fit a device AMD calls a PC into a statistic for consoles unless you change the quote from AMD to fit your desire.

Fact is that AMD said the current console generation surpassed 100M shipments. Nothing was said about all semi-custom devices, that's something you are adding on. It's fallacious to argue that the statement includes anything more than PS5 and XBS.

Dude, this whole "semi-custom" device thing was the basis of your argument:

Steam Deck or any other handheld using AMD semi-custom SOCs aren't included here, everything after the revenue amount was a follow up of Microsoft and Sony's performance. Semi custom declined because of XBS and PS5 inventory, the generation has surpassed 100M, and semi custom sales will return to historical patterns because of PS5/XBS

And now that you've been shown the following, which shows that AMD does indeed include the Steam Deck in their semi-custom category you want to switch it up and move the goalposts in random directions?:

It would have been far more simple and graceful for you to simply say you're not sure anymore.

 

[Three]

Literally no disrespect to Welfare at all. Dude is great at what he does. But I kinda agree with demigod here. Even if we felt like the Xbox Series estimate was 33 million, that would make more sense than 37m. Especially if the US number is at 15.5 million. No way the world combined Xbox Series sales are at 21.5 million. That would be 58% of all Xbox Series console sales. And that just can't be true.

MS have found a loophole where if they release a new controller every month it increases xbox console sales. Maybe that's why they keep doing it?

I wish they would just give us the damn figures though like everybody else but this is what they want, obfuscation.

Do you guys even know what you're arguing.

Console does not mean every semi-custom device. The entire argument is AMD's 100M milestone for the CONSOLE generation. Not one thing in this thread says Steam Deck is a console. It's crazy how people are fighting over basic English at this point. There is no way to fit a device AMD calls a PC into a statistic for consoles unless you change the quote from AMD to fit your desire.

Fact is that AMD said the current console generation surpassed 100M shipments. Nothing was said about all semi-custom devices, that's something you are adding on. It's fallacious to argue that the statement includes anything more than PS5 and XBS.

You have a very good source telling you what those numbers ment though:

Steam Deck is part of SCBU and counted as a console.

 

[Topher]

Do you guys even know what you're arguing.

Console does not mean every semi-custom device. The entire argument is AMD's 100M milestone for the CONSOLE generation. Not one thing in this thread says Steam Deck is a console. It's crazy how people are fighting over basic English at this point. There is no way to fit a device AMD calls a PC into a statistic for consoles unless you change the quote from AMD to fit your desire.

Fact is that AMD said the current console generation surpassed 100M shipments. Nothing was said about all semi-custom devices, that's something you are adding on. It's fallacious to argue that the statement includes anything more than PS5 and XBS.

I think everyone knows what the debate is about. No need to get snarky.

AMD's statement can be read as stating the number for the entire gaming segment. Again, even Verge's journalists were asking if those numbers included handhelds. Not fallacious to argue that. You just don't agree with it. That's fine.

 

[demigod]

Do you guys even know what you're arguing.

Console does not mean every semi-custom device. The entire argument is AMD's 100M milestone for the CONSOLE generation. Not one thing in this thread says Steam Deck is a console. It's crazy how people are fighting over basic English at this point. There is no way to fit a device AMD calls a PC into a statistic for consoles unless you change the quote from AMD to fit your desire.

Fact is that AMD said the current console generation surpassed 100M shipments. Nothing was said about all semi-custom devices, that's something you are adding on. It's fallacious to argue that the statement includes anything more than PS5 and XBS.

Your argument with K KeplerL2 was that the steam deck wasn't part of the SCBU and you were wrong even though you still insist you're right in your own little dreamland. Facts are there, Moose pointed it out to you.

 

[Ultra Donny]

So it's dead.

 

[Humdinger]

Yes they are. Every worldwide sales tracker has them over 30M end of last year, Take Two reported 107M PS5's and XBS end of last year, and PS5 was <75M

https://ir.take2games.com/static-files/e8841ad4-15c4-4572-b4c4-0df5548df6ba

Thanks for showing up in the thread, Welfare . You're one of the presences I miss at GAF, post-exodus. Apologies for the bonehead lol's. You deserve more respect than that.

I don't expect you'll be hanging around, given the piling-on, but I do appreciate the drop-in. Cheers.

 

[Welfare]

A little under 17M? Your own numbers which you inflate, pegged it at 15.46M. Now if the US numbers are around that, we can be generous and say its 50/50 instead of 55/45. So whats double of 15.46? Close to 31. So how are you getting 37M from 31?

I have no idea where you got 15.46M. US June 2025 LTD is nearly 17M. End of 2024 was ~16.3M

Literally no disrespect to Welfare at all. Dude is great at what he does. But I kinda agree with demigod here. Even if we felt like the Xbox Series estimate was 33 million, that would make more sense than 37m. Especially if the US number is at 15.5 million. No way the world combined Xbox Series sales are at 21.5 million. That would be 58% of all Xbox Series console sales. And that just can't be true.

So the thing is, different analytic firms have different XBS sell through estimates which muddy things. Omdia had XBS end of 2024 at 32.5M. IDG has it somewhere around 34M. My end of 2024 shipment estimate was <36M. ~37M is my June 2025 estimate. I only care to estimate shipments but seeing what the US sold through this year alone (~700K), worldwide sell through is probably ~1.3M in 2025. Going off that IDG figure, XBS sell through would be somewhere in the 35M's right now. A 37M shipment estimate would not be immediately inaccurate as that's within 2M unsold units, 2M or more being typical for consoles. If you take Omdia's figure then XBS is nearly 34M, making ~37M practically impossible.

 

[damidu]

you can do much worse phil, we believe in you. bring on the next-box

 

[demigod]

I have no idea where you got 15.46M. US June 2025 LTD is nearly 17M. End of 2024 was ~16.3M

Ok, even if thats the number, its still way off from the 37M.

 

[Xbox 360 slim]

Fanboy fight!

 

[BlackTron]

It's hard to believe they have only sold close to 30m systems, even for Xbox. Closer to 37 just feels more believable to me.

 

[reinking]

Fanboy fight!

I think we are beyond that now and have moved on to pride and reputation.

 

[KeplerL2]

Why would they include Steam Deck in that number and not other PC handhelds that use AMD chips?

Van Gogh and all of its variants were developed by SCBU (Semi-Custom Business Unit) and fall under the same reporting as the consoles. Z1/Z2 are repurposed laptop chips (Rembrandt/Phoenix/Strix) and fall under Client segment.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

All you guys arguing Xbox S/X sales +/- a couple million units based on guesstimates and different data on different sites to feel better about yourselves. LOL